Graphics Horse
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Half the fun is going for nul points.
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Brexit |OT| UK Referendum on EU Membership - 23 June 2016
- Thread starter QuicheFontaine
- Start date
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QuicheFontaine
Member
Eurovision is a mug's game. If you win, you have to pay for the next one. That's why we send shit act after shit act every single year.
No it's not, but I want to feel better. Why doesn't anyone love us? ;_;
We even have to host it loads of times when we lose, because the BBC is rich enough to take over when smaller countries can't manage it.
Bloody Europeans #out
QuicheFontaine
Member
Leave should genuinely print this on its pamphlets. A red mist of rage is already decending to cloud my judgement.
IMF: Brexit could cause severe regional and global damage
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36024492
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36024492
I think the important part is "could", lot's of things "could" happen.
QuicheFontaine
Member
I think there is no doubt that it will cause short-term damage and disruption. The real issue is after thing settle down will the UK be in a better place.
It would almost guarantee a Scotland exit from the UK if they bring it to another referendum.
Imagine border controls along the northern border.
The puzzling thing about the whole thing is that: not a single side is able to tell us what are the positives and the negatives of their sides and what are their opinion of the other side in a more objective view.
This whole mess is just based on emotions with no serious consideration on what it means to us, the population at large, and how it will affect our Economy, living standard, taxation, NHS, etc...
This whole mess is just based on emotions with no serious consideration on what it means to us, the population at large, and how it will affect our Economy, living standard, taxation, NHS, etc...
Sounds like another day in the Houses of Parliament.
Why change the habit of the world's oldest democracy LAWLZ
That's the problem, most of it is a big unknown. Obviously, staying is going to keep things largely the same, while the out campaign promise more secure borders and less"stupid" laws from the EU so we can control ourselves. I think generally speaking, us leaving is very bad economically and for our industries at the very least in the short-term. It would just depend on how long that term is and how we would recover.
I feel like the burden of proof is on the out campaign because they're the ones wanting a radical change and I would love to hear a well reasoned argument as to how things would be better, not the usual rhetoric of migrants and EU governments, but an actual detail of how we recover as a country after the initial leaving shock hurts our economy. I may not agree with the campaign still, but if they were able to present that plan, I'd at least respect it a lot more.
Turnbl
Member
I don't really follow politics that closely, but having this as a referendum seems a little odd considering the complexity, importance and ultimately unknown consequences of the decision. Does anybody know why it was part of the manifesto considering they are against it as a party?
I think the public in general won't know enough and those who do, will just be guessing at consequences anyway... which will probably lead to a default decision for most of 'stay the same'. It's all a little strange, I just don't think it's a decision that we the public should be making.
I think the public in general won't know enough and those who do, will just be guessing at consequences anyway... which will probably lead to a default decision for most of 'stay the same'. It's all a little strange, I just don't think it's a decision that we the public should be making.
Succinct Verbosity
Member
Conservatives were leaking votes to UKIP. That's basically the only reason.
QuicheFontaine
Member
Basically, yeah. I don't think Dave ever thought he'd have to make good on his promise - he specified "if we get a majority". He probably thought it would be the first thing he'd quietly trade away in a coalition negotiation.
As for whether or not the public should decide this, it's ultimately a question of "who do you want to be governed by"? I don't think there's anyone better than "the governed" to put that question to tbh.
I would agree if the populous were well informed, but the media has put out so many blatant lies about the EU over the last decade it's hard to think the public can make this decision properly.
Democracy doesn't work without a working press, and ours is frankly shit, especially about this issue.
But hey ho here we are.
industrian
will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
Has the UK media talked in any great detail about how much the value of the £ has collapsed due to the referendum? The pound fell almost immediately after the referendum was called and is continuing to haemorrhage in value. I've essentially been given a £50-100 pay cut because of it.
Not that I've seen, then again I have been at home for the last month so I haven't been reading the papers.
Mac@NeoGAF
Banned
Bullshit, they ain't got the balls, 70% of Scottish trade is within the UK.
Once they realise what the financial implications and terms of entry to the EU would be, they'll soon wake up to the fact that they won't have any choice but to stay.
It's about time we called their bluff once and for all on this matter anyway.
Who's we? This Englishman for one hopes we do get to end this shit-stain of a state we laughingly call the "UK". We English need to shake off the mental trappings of Empire we still cling to and reducing ourselves by shedding Scotland and the rest is the method to do so. That it's also the best outcome for Scotland is a bonus.
Jimbob Smalls
Banned
Shows democracy works I suppose.
Sometimes.
The Chinese have been devaluing their currency for a long time as it brings competitive benefits when exporting.
Can be a pain in the ass when importing, granted.
It should normalise once the uncertainty is gone in June.
It depends on which way the vote goes. If the UK stays it will go back to 74p to a euro but if the UK leaves it could hit 90p to parity with the Euro.
I am quoting what I heard from the radio the other day.
That's an impressive skill.
But yeah, the 90p conversion would likely be just day 1 too. Depending on how we recover or not, we might limbo under the Euro within the year.
The thing that galls me is that so much of the problem we face now are the result of decades of governments over-blaming the EU for national issues and under-crediting it for others. That leaflet should have been a yearly distribution, instead we've let media barons control the debate.
QuicheFontaine
Member
For those saying that Corbyn was staying essentially neutral on the issue:
Though I do wonder who's going to a speech at 10 o'clock in the morning on a weekday at such short notice.
I'll update the OP after this speech. I had heard Corbyn was anti-EU back in the 70's, but as that great philosopher Rocky Balboa taught us - everybody can change.
industrian
will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
There's a slight difference between one country enforcing a low currency value and another country's currency getting devalued because of lack of confidence.
And by normalise you mean "go through the fucking floor if we vote to leave" then yes.
Jimbob Smalls
Banned
Should help with the massive trade deficit we have with the EU then!
There's pluses and minuses in having either a strong or weak currency, depending on your situation either could impact you positively or negatively.
My company whom I work for has two main suppliers who provide very similar products to us. One of them is UK based the other French. The UK supplier has been struggling to maintain competitive pricing purely down to the strength of the pound recently before the drop.
In these types of cases of which I'm sure there's plenty, the drop will be welcomed.
Not really it has the same net effect. If we leave, we want it to go through the floor to some extent for the short term. Should boost export demand in a time when we'll have to move pretty quickly to a free trade economy.
Foreign holidays will be more expensive but in the short term there'll be bigger fish to fry. There's no doubt, leaving will cause pain for some but benefit others, but same could be said for staying.
QuicheFontaine
Member
Just received an email - the petition was successful! Parliament will debate STOP CAMERON spending British taxpayers money on Pro-EU Referendum leaflets on 9 May 2016.
It's the reason that the ECB have been unsuccessfully trying their hand at quantitative easing for the last two years. Devaluing the currency could bring in more investment and sales from non-Euro countries, particularly the United States and parts of Asia, all for the goal of inflation. I'm not sure if it helped exporters, but from a business that imports a lot of goods from the UK, it was a lethal time for us. Those suppliers were definitely feeling the pinch, as eventually many began charging us in Euro with very generous pricing compared to the market exchange rate. Of course, it's currently flipped the other way, but this referendum will have a big impact on the future. Neither situation is ideal, frankly. If Remain wins, the pound will strengthen and I'll lose out again. If Leave wins, the benefits of whatever devaluation of the pound that follows might, after the following two years of negotiations are up, be damaged by the introduction of an import tax.
Still, overall, I'd rather the UK Remain. For everybody's sake. Sovereignty's idealistic value is incorporeal, unlike so much that is threatened by this.
I mean, the horse has rather bolted in this instance, hasn't it?
QuicheFontaine
Member
Jimbob Smalls
Banned
I don't see the potential of an import tax being a big risk, those wouldn't suit anybody.
Jimbob Smalls
Banned
I will save them both until I am low on toilet roll I think.
QuicheFontaine
Member
It's glossy ;_;
JonathanEx
Member
Vote Leave to be the official campaign for, well, voting to leave. http://www.theguardian.com/politics...l-brexit-campaign-eu-referendum-boris-johnson
This is the Boris/Gove backed one. Sadly not the Farage one because that would just be entertaining.
Obviously, the others are now looking in to a legal challenge about such designation.
This is the Boris/Gove backed one. Sadly not the Farage one because that would just be entertaining.
Obviously, the others are now looking in to a legal challenge about such designation.
dapperbandit
Banned
Jimbob Smalls
Banned
I'm up and down the motorway a lot. Well practised in that type of bog roll.
industrian
will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
I'm not talking about effect, I'm talking about cause.
The world essentially giving us a vote of no confidence for even considering leaving the world's largest free trade block is a lot more telling than if the UK government was actually to intervene with currency values.
But you're right. I'll be talking with my employers soon regarding my contract, and getting my salary off its current fixed rate and onto a variable rate is on the agenda. Then I'll start secretly hoping that we vote to leave so I'll get progressively richer every month.
Jimbob Smalls
Banned
Currencies rise and fall all the time. If they fall exports get a boost, if they rise they get a nerf.
With imports vice versa. Short term in the current political climate currency falling is on balance, preferable. Obviously,not for everyone.
Other than that, I don't really understand what your point was.
Chittagong
Gold Member
Many people in the UK like myself have been happy to see the GBP take a nosedive. Gives us the chance to deploy USD to buy cheap GBP, while keeping fingers crossed that UK indeed stays in the EU and the currency rebounds.
QuicheFontaine
Member
Ok, so now that Vote Leave has been awarded as the official Leave campaign, apparently Leave.EU is going to apply for judicial review of the Electoral Commission's decision?
Apparently this could delay the referendum until 23 October?? Am I hearing this right? What sort of shitshow is this where they leave it so late to allocate official campaigns that an appeal can push back the actual date of the referendum? It's bonkers!
I don't know why there were so many competing Leave campaigns in the first place. It's been a really poor showing from that side, with lots of in-fighting when they really should be presenting a united front. Astonishingly, Farage appears to be the most reasonable of the bunch in all this:
Was that so hard?
Apparently this could delay the referendum until 23 October?? Am I hearing this right? What sort of shitshow is this where they leave it so late to allocate official campaigns that an appeal can push back the actual date of the referendum? It's bonkers!
I don't know why there were so many competing Leave campaigns in the first place. It's been a really poor showing from that side, with lots of in-fighting when they really should be presenting a united front. Astonishingly, Farage appears to be the most reasonable of the bunch in all this:
Was that so hard?
anonymous_abc
Member
Postponing the referendum further would be quite the disaster and probably unwanted by most sides. It would be fun to watch the circus continue though...
As if this entire business isn't bad enough already...
QuicheFontaine
Member
I've seen some commentators say it's "unlikely", but if it's a legal remedy that's available then it would appear to be at least possible. That absolutely blows my mind.
I definitely agree that neither side would want this to drag on over the summer, but I think David Cameron would particularly hate it. There's a reason he set the date as soon as physically possible (exactly six weeks after the Scottish/council/Mayoral/PCC elections in May).
Bananajama
Banned
I hated that leave leaflet they posted out and the reason they cited.
Reason "85% of the British Public want more information so as to make an informed decision"
Result "A leaflet stating why we should stay in the EU"
Christ.
Yes I know the Government support it.
But a bit of impartiality wouldn't have gone amiss seeing as we have an official in/out team
Reason "85% of the British Public want more information so as to make an informed decision"
Result "A leaflet stating why we should stay in the EU"
Christ.
Yes I know the Government support it.
But a bit of impartiality wouldn't have gone amiss seeing as we have an official in/out team
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