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[Jack The Nipper]

Street Fighter V plays very differently to Street Fighter II though. If they didn't have these changes to gameplay, Halo 5 would have been as irrelevant to the market as H2A.

You have to ask yourself what makes Halo, Halo. And while yes, I'd have liked older aiming, and no sprint, it's not realistic anymore to ignore it. So, much like Street Fighter, they kept the on map weapons, no load outs, equals starts, map control, power weapon control, respawn times and even after death cam on body. But they switched up movement options. Hell they even have a medal in H5 for grenading the power weapon to you, called Combat Evolved.

I mean again, the drops and decline of Halo 5 have less to do with the changes to gameplay itself as opposed to things like no Firefight, Spartan Ops, more maps and gametypes. I feel Warzone should have had one more mode in addition to normal and Assault as well as maybe 5-6 maps at launch. Arena definitely needs more maps, needs classic gametypes. Right now, for me, it's like okay 2 matches of warzone, that's it, a match of breakout, maybe SWAT, some BTB. I don't like doing team arena or slayer without someone else to play or coordinate with do to quitters and no mics so I've been avoiding that. If there was Firefight, something else, challenges that give a lot of points or more REQ packs, I'd have greater reason to play. Infinite Ammo and Grenade skull would've definitely made me play more Campaign missions again and again especially legendary etc.

Respect your opinion but I still disagree sir. I do think it's the feel and design. Of course for the people that do like halo 5 it has bad maps and no sauce in the noodles to keep playing.

Halo 3 had a lot of things but halo 2 and halo 3 were fine with base gameplay and game types. Bungie always added things to come both good and bad but more good than bad. Forge was great some people complain and hate bubbles but there are times we all find a little fun on them. Regens are hated but we will still use them conjunction.

I think an interesting point is..

Bungie designs science fiction with a bit of a medieval feel.

What I mean by this is they have enough a much more grounded and game feel. With grav lifrs and sort of archaic style movement. It just ends up feeling a lot more grounded.

Where 343 and other developers go for much more of the Japanese future style.

It's interesting to consider though when you look at how basic and simple some of the bungie things really are.

When you see the cut scenes in halo 5 you really get a feel for what 343 feels and wants in a spartan suit, it just so happens I don't care about the game in that design. I really like the base hardcore gameplay of og halo.

 

[Tecnniqe]

well MCC had quite the few problems, which didn't help its case all that much, but the games were great in the year they released, but yes, they do feel a bit 'dated' now, sadly.
It's probably because of the more common things as sprint/dash and more movement options in general.

For me I rate CE, 3, ODST and 5 all as great games, the rest I couldn't really get into all that much.
Good list tho.

Also I don't see Destiny as the same type of game as Halo, as its focused on loot and more MMO style in general compared to Halos more straight up shooting and objectives.

 

[im_dany]

As much as I loved it I think Halo 3 is over-rated.

Halo 2 was much, MUCH better in everything: campaign was better, writing was better, multiplayer balancement was better, map design was better.
Halo 3 had forge and theater but that's because Xbox couldn't support those, and I'm pretty sure modders implemented some kind of forge in Halo 2 (they did with COD games too).

Halo 5 is the pinnacle of Halo gameplay: it's rewarding, every weapon has its utility (unlike Halo 3's AR for example), it's very fluid (almost as Titanfall) and it's not either too fast or too slow (Halo 3 is TOOOOO slow). Halo 2 is a close second but considering it came out 11 years earlier I find it an incredible feat for Bungie, it was not easy to make something as great as Halo 2 MP in 2004.

Everytime I see someone saying "Halo 5 is bad, look at player stats" I think they're clueless how players actually "works".
When Halo 2 released, there was nothing like that on Xbox (and on any console). When Halo 3 released, there was only Gears of War (which is a TPS) and COD2 (which launched 2 years earlier and pretty barebones on features).

Halo 5 released on Xbox One and players could launch 2 COD games (now 3), one Battlefield (and Battlefront too now), Gears of War UE, Titanfall, Garden Warfare. Except for the last one (which is the most fun shooter on next-gen IMHO) that's a massive competition even for a franchise like Halo, and especially considering Xbox One for many players around the world is regarded as a less worthwhile console.
Then add that there aren't social playlists except for Warzone, which is a 20+ minute game, and that explains why many people with 5 free minutes are not going to play Halo 5 but, instead, a game like COD of Battlefront which doesn't punish you for quitting games and don't need constant playtime to be good at.


Anyway, after Halo 3 and Halo Reach, I don't understand why so many Halo players still love Bungie so much. I know Halo 4 was pretty bad for an Halo game (but still better than many other games) but they managed to change everything and make a great (if not the greatest) Halo experience.

 

[gollumsluvslave]

Lots of Truth

Yup, nailed on the nose!

 

[jizzlobber]

It never reaches those highs either.

Hell, the opening of fucking Tsavo Highway has more oomph to it than most of H5. Nothing is even happening in the beginning of that levejust the atmosphere and music are enough to make it feel like you just narrowly survived the previous level.

This is interesting because that scene with the covenant ship going overhead on tsavo highway was used to promote the game at e3... Was epic at the time.

Then in halo 5 you have a massive battle in the sky and a massive covy ship slowly crashes into city you're in... I remember thinking back to that tsavo highway scene, seems so pathetic compared to what I just witnessed.

To me, Halo 5 is easily the most epic yet, I felt constantly overwhelmed.

 

[krang]

This is interesting because that scene with the covenant ship going overhead on tsavo highway was used to promote the game at e3... Was epic at the time.

Then in halo 5 you have a massive battle in the sky and a massive covy ship slowly crashes into city you're in... I remember thinking back to that tsavo highway scene, seems so pathetic compared to what I just witnessed.

To me, Halo 5 is easily the most epic yet, I felt constantly overwhelmed.

And yet both pale in comparison to Halo 4's shot of the Infinity dropping through the clouds. Halo 4 definitely had its moments.

 

[Monocle]

This is interesting because that scene with the covenant ship going overhead on tsavo highway was used to promote the game at e3... Was epic at the time.

Then in halo 5 you have a massive battle in the sky and a massive covy ship slowly crashes into city you're in... I remember thinking back to that tsavo highway scene, seems so pathetic compared to what I just witnessed.

To me, Halo 5 is easily the most epic yet, I felt constantly overwhelmed.

And yet both pale in comparison to Halo 4's shot of the Infinity dropping through the clouds. Halo 4 definitely had its moments.

For comparison's sake, can you guys link to the Halo 5 and Halo 4 moments you're referring to? Or post the mission names? I want to make sure I'm thinking of the right scenes.

 

[krang]

For comparison's sake, can you guys link to the Halo 5 and Halo 4 moments you're referring to? Or post the mission names? I want to make sure I'm thinking of the right scenes.

One of my favourite cut scenes from the franchise.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BrZkDRu9UM

 

[nOoblet16]

H5 had the best campaign gameplay in the series by far.

Story is debatable though.

That would be Hallo Reach

 

[jem0208]

That would be Hallo Reach

Definitely not.

Shit movement and a weak ass weapon sandbox say no.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Halo 3 was and is still the best Halo by far. I don't know where this backlash came from. Game was the complete Halo package.

 

[MajorTom]

I went back and played Halo 3 again a couple of weeks ago.
I found it super hard to play because everything is so slow.
Movement is so slow that it feels like you are walking everywhere.
And the shooting felt really bad, it's hard to believe that Bungie went on to develop Destiny!

I am yet to play Halo 5 but i thought 4 was the weakest in the series, hence why I haven't played 5 yet.

 

[Mooreberg]

Halo 3 would be my favorite campaign in the series if the final two levels were on par with the rest of the game. "The Ark" is still my second favorite campaign mission after Assault on the Control Room. Only routine problem I had with the MP was the game relying too much on Sand Trap variants for big team games, and the lack of replacement for quitters.

Halo 2 is the campaign that never did it for me, even after playing it again in MCC. Too many gondola sequences, Brutes as dumb as a pile of bricks, and Earth sequences that are still pitiful compared to the E3 2003 demo. Cannot say much about MP since I was all about CSS, UT2004, and Enemy territory at the time.

343's problem is what Halo is competing with right now. Most people like the way COD works, and have for eight years now. Everybody else that has moved on from MP focused shooters has games like Destiny and Farcry to play. Halo is kinda stuck in the middle. It is not the MP shooter of choice anymore, and the breadth of campaign/coop content is not there compared to other games. If you are not into the MP, it is a weekend expedition to rental town.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

I disagree with the op

Played halo 3 yesterday and know others that still do. It doesn't feel dated.

bungie completely screwed the series up with reach though so I don't remember them too fondly (it doesn't help that I didn't enjoy destiny much) - 343 still have a long way to go to prove themselves but seem to be handling halo better than i think bungie would be atm - that said bungie is a very different company to the bungie that put halo 1,2 and 3 out

 

[Black Mantis]

Good OP. I totally agree that the Bungie vs 343 arguments need to stop. I'm a fan of what 343 have done with the franchise, for me the games play great and with Halo 5, I felt they got the level design back to a good place after Halo 4.

Story-wise, I'm excited about the direction they're heading in, only thing I'm still waiting in, is the return of The Flood.

 

[hooijdonk17]

Halo 3 was and is still the best Halo by far. I don't know where this backlash came from. Game was the complete Halo package.

This man speaks the truth.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

Halo 3 was and is still the best Halo by far. I don't know where this backlash came from. Game was the complete Halo package.

This man oozes with class

That avatar

But a more complete map editor is important.

 

[gollumsluvslave]

As mentioned earlier, I really agree with a LOT of what the OP has stated, but didn't have time to make some clearer points on my thoughts.

I have to start by saying that Halo CE is pretty much my GOAT game, I've replayed that campaign a ridiculous amount of times, and it was my first console multiplayer fix both via LAN play and XBC. Halo CE to me IS 'Halo' and I've judged every game since against CE and they have all failed to dethrone it.

CE just got so many things right, and for some reason for me personally, even the 'flaws' (generally regarded as the Library, cookie cutter level design) in the game became things that I associated with 'Halo'. IMO Halo CE is just greater than the sum of it's parts.

When looking at the games in the series, I feel they can be judged/graded in 3 separate and distinct ways

1. Campaign (including co-op)
2. PVP Multiplayer
3. Overall Package (Forge, Firefight, Spartan Ops, Theatre etc)

The reason I feel these should be separated out is actually more to do with what each new game has introduced, and how this evolution has changed how I (and others) perceive each games value.

For me, as the years have gone by (I'm 41 now) I am less and less concerned with the PVP multiplayer side; i've never been particularly competetive (maybe except back when UT99 came out ) and back with Halo CE the multiplayer we had either via LAN or over XBC was nowhere near as erious as it has evolved to be these days, in fact I very quickly lost interest in PVP multiplayer in Halo 2, I didn't have enough time and wasn't competetive enough, would much rather play through the campaign co-op.

So for me the Campaign has always been the most important factor in Halo games, and I feel lucky enough to say that I've at least enjoyed and replayed ALL the Halo campaigns (actually still to replay Halo 5, but starting a co-op replay tonight!).

So yes, I will repeat - ALL THE HALO CAMPAIGNS ARE AT LEAST GOOD! I find it hard to fathom where people say that ANY of the Halo campaigns are garbage, I've enjoyed them all, some more than others and some have bigger annoyances but they are all without exception decent, solid games.

Halo 2 is my least favourite campaign, and I also lost interest in Halo PVP multiplayer as well during Halo 2 (I can blame work circumstances and lack of time maybe on the multi side).

Halo 2 -
I can sum these up succintly - IMO Halo 2 is the Halo that didn't nail the 30 seconds of fun as much as the others, it broke the Weapons-Grenades-Melee triangle with dual wield, it introduced Brutes (IMO unequivocally the WORST enemies in ALL Halo games - yes including the Prometheans!), and the plot and narrative execution were poor at best, but I'd actually say I thought Bungie made a pigs ear of the story in Halo 2.
It also did not evoke that sense of 'Alien Wonder and Isolation' that Halo CE had in spades and to me is the hallmark and biggest theme in a Halo campaign (to me at least). I distinctly got the feeling in Halo 2 that a lot of stuff was experimental, and Bungie were throwing stuff at the wall to 'see what sticks'. It felt hugely different from CE to me, so much so there was a bit of dissonance.

Halo 3 - What a Package!
Halo 3 I think had a better campaign than Halo 2, but was quite uneven. It had really good high points - The Ark being the main one, but it also had the lowest of all the lows in Cortana. I played a good bit more multiplayer in Halo 3 because it seemed to me to be much more social and less competetive in nature with lots of game variants and content.

Halo 3 also introduced Campaign Scoring which I loved and got quite addicted to. add to that Forge and the huge amount of contente, and IMO Halo 3 is hard to beat as the best Overall Package, it had so much value.

ODST - Excellent Experiment
Next came Halo 3: ODST which for me is the biggest surprise in the whole series - whilst it was obvious Bungie were experimenting a LOT so much worked really well - the narrative execution was great, the noir feel and soundtrack were sublime, and the gameplay did not suffer for being an ODST and not a Spartan. It's currently my favourite campaign behind CE - I even didn't mind the Brutes much in ODST! The interesting thing is it still felt like Halo to me, even though it was very experimental. Like yet unlike!

Halo Reach - Ruh oh
I really did not like Reach when it came out, everything felt out of whack, the squad-based campaign just didn't grab me at all, and I really did not like the armour abilities direction. I think I really struggled first time round because of the dissonance between the Fall of Reach novel and the massive retcon that the game was. That said, after replaying recently I've warmed to it a bit, and actually quite enjoyed the campaign - it takes a bit of heating up, but the later missions are good, and the narrative execution is really good, even if I struggle to embrace the narrative vis a vis the book.

Halo 4 - A Mixed Bag
The first Halo game for 343i was quite frustrating for me, as they did a lot right with the campaign, but also got a lot wrong as well. I appreciate that a lot of the negativity for Halo 4 was around the multiplayer side, but as I didn't even touch the multiplayer in 4 I can't comment on that much.

Things I liked in the campaign - a LOT reminded me of CE - that feeling of 'Alien Wonder' I felt Halo 4 had it in abundance, Requiem, the Didact, Prometheans etc, I really enjoyed my first playthrough in the main, but a lot of the missteps were much more apparent in my 2nd (Legendary) playthrough:-
- Disappearing Weapons (limits of 360 tech?) this bugged me a lot
- More linear corridors and less open spaces; some of this actually reminded me of CE, but I think there was too much and nothing that really approached Silent Cartographer or Two Betrayals in size and scope.
- QTEs - only 2 but 2 too many (rectified in Halo 5 thankfully)
- Ham-fisted exposition and reliance on narrative devices outside the game (Waypoint)
- Promethean weapons really just were re-skinned UNSC weapons.
- Too much 'press this button' type missions; I think this is part of poor/lazy narrative excecution.

But for all these missteps I LOVED that 343 were actually tackling the Forerunners, and Didact and so forth. I think on the whole they had a thankless task to fill Bungie's shoes and were never going to please all the people all the time.

I still enjoyed Halo 4 campaign more than Halo 2 or Reach and probably on par with Halo 3.

I was PISSED tho at the removal of Campaign Scoring and Firefight. Spartan Ops was not a good replacement for Firefight.

Halo 5 - Moving in the Right Direction
First thing I can say about Halo 5 is that MOST of the little annoyances I had with Halo 4 campaign, 343i knocked out the park and addressed, no QTEs, no 'leave game and see video' type narrative exposition, no disappearing weapons, and much more organic mission and encounter design. So that is pretty damned good progress IMO. Again, I've not really touched the multiplayer side, but I did enjoy the couple of games I played - it FELT great. Going to be playing co-op tonight.

343 still could do a LOT better on the narrative execution side, whilst I don't have a problem with the overall plot in Halo 5 I think the way they executed it wasn't great. Some inexplicable stuff like Jul getting offed in the first mission, but then going on to have a big battle in Sanghelios; I'd love for someone at 343i to tell me their rationale behind that, and I will give so many rebuttals as to why it was a terrible decision. It really put me off the campaign very early, but fortunately a lot of other stuff pulled it back.
Swords of Sanghelios was a GREAT mission, loved it.

60FPS did make a huge difference, and Prometheans have been refined a LOT and offer much better feedback and are less spongy as a result. Knights are great to fight now. Hunters are fearsome in Halo 5, love that.

That said, I'm still not keen on 343is over-reliance on the 'waves of enemies' type encounter design, it does not feel very organic and reminds me a lot of very early FPS design. I think the Prometheans as enemies get as much of a bad rap due to the 'wave' encounters as much as anything else.

Additionally, I wasn't sold on the whole squad-based mechanic for a full campaign again. I missed the lone-wolf feel of Halo CE a good bit in Halo 5, and that was not just because of Osiris.

So I really enjoyed Halo 5, but still think 343 can do a LOT to improve things in Halo 6.

I should also note that I've yet to play through MCC (only bought a Xbone when Halo 5 came out), so I don't have any bias to or against 343 as a result of that (but the whole handling of it was shocking).

I will need to play through Halo 5 again on Legendary to really make things a fair comparison, and I really want to see some more content for people that are less competetive - give me Campaign Scoring, Firefight (or some other kind of PVE gametype) and give me some social playlists, especially directed at lone-wolf types who just want to jump in and play some free for all. I'd play much more Halo 5 multi if King of the Hill, Oddball and some of the other less 'serious' gametypes were reinstated.

What makes Halo a unique series IMO is the sheer diversity of what it means to different people - Halo 2 is my least favourite campaign, but it's probably some peoples favourite and thats fine, subjective tastes and all.

A lot of that comes from that fact that NONE of the Halo games have been a soulless retread, whether it's Bungie or 343 they have at least TRIED to grow and evolve and not just churn out the same game in different packaging and graphics, and I think thats a good thing, even if it pisses some people off.

 

[PooBone]

Halo 1 was the best, hands down. The best campaign, the best levels, the best combat encounters, the best weapon/grenade/melee sandbox.

Halo 2 was the start of the downfall. I liked Halo 3 alright. I even enjoyed Halo 5. But nothing comes close to Combat Evolved.

DESTINY on the other hand, I have no desire to go back to. It's a game with literally no narrative, designed that way from start to nearly finish. No thanks.

 

[Striker]

You are close but not quite there.

I've written this many a time and it gets ignored just as often so im not going to write the same WOT i've been used to writing so many times.

Halo 1 and halo 2 are not as vastly different as you think, the same formula is there, as with Halo 3. Halo 3 being the worst out of the bunch. Halo 3 was successful riding on the back of the popularity of halo 2. Halo 3 caused the biggest divide in the competitive scene. Although there was an initial drop off from halo1 to halo 2.

While I don't care about any competitive or MLG nature of these Halo games, I do agree with much of you said. The game, to me, started declining at Halo 3 when Bungie started going away from the great asymmetric map design they did in Halo 2, started neutering the gametypes they had down so well a game prior, and the vehicle-infantry combat just went haywire. When you look at introduction to things like the Spartan Laser, which destroyed vehicle combat; granted, they added it because they probably felt the lock-on Rockets in H2 were cheap, and players needed a challenge, but at thee same time - something significantly strong enough to combat the over-powered Warthog and new beast of the Banshee complete with the fuel rod blast. I thought it was super effective in its support role in Halo 2. Another is equipment, notably the bubble shield and regen which stalls gameplay and causes everything to engage to a cheese fest. Getting shot? Throw down a bubble shield because, boy, I'm not dying yet! Come on in, before you four shot me with your Battle Rifle, I'll double melee you because it's super easy. I never understood why they buffed the melee damage so high after Halo 2. It was perfect at that spot. It forced people to use weapons and rely on melee for assassinations and final blows. It brought in the AR melee fest where it permitted users to shred six bullets into an enemy followed by a single melee, death. Only the grav lift I thought added to the gameplay. Everything else felt cheap or added nothing to the gameplay (flare).

I'm not sure what happened in the map design but they went from near 20 great maps specifically built for gametypes like 2-flag, Neutral Assault, 1-flag, 3 Plots, or One Bomb to maybe a handful of creations from Halo 3 and Halo Reach. There's nothing like 1-flag Terminal in those games. Nothing in those games tops Neutral Bomb on Warlock, 2-flag Sanctuary, or One Bomb in Ivory Tower, Headlong, and Zanzibar. Those games were intense and were the most fun I ever would endure in the series. Unfortunately, nothing came close to those days in the later games.

 

[krang]

Reach really does divide opinion, huh.

My favourite campaign of the series, and a variable MP saved entirely by the Falcon in BTB. Firefight was also awesome.

 

[Sephzilla]

Maps never quite matched up to Halo 2. That isn't nostalgia talked either. They had some good moments but Halo 2 maps will always be gold tier.

I honestly think this is one of the big things that holds 343 Halo back a little. Their map design is just straight up nowhere near as good as Bungie's during the Halo 1 or Halo 2 days, and good maps are a very big part of multiplayer. Nothing 343 has put out even comes close to Hang Em High, Headlong, or any of those greats.

 

[hooijdonk17]

Reach really does divide opinion, huh.

My favourite campaign of the series, and a variable MP saved entirely by the Falcon in BTB. Firefight was also awesome.

Yeah.. As far as campaigns go for me it's 3>Reach=ODST=1>2>>4. Haven't played 5.

 

[Apollo Cree]

My two complaints are that most maps feel soulless and that content in previous titles aren't in future titles which Bungie didn't do (aside from equipment). Mainly custom game options and to a lesser degree, the flood gametype is gone, Firefight is gone, and Spartan Ops is gone.

They have been doing lots of great things though. Multiplayer feels great and the campaign was lots of fun. I also like their commitment to keeping the community from fracturing through a year of maps.

 

[Ol No Bones]

I'm not a SP guy for Halo since the story has sucked since CE. That said I love Halo MP. I finally feel comfortable saying that Halo 5 is the best Halo MP foundationally. It plays incredibly well. My big gripe is that they need more weapons and modes. Oddball, juggernaut etc need to return and with seemingly improved forge custom games could be incredible. This game just needs more maps and modes. Warzone is cool but the AI encounters get very stale and I dont see why every map need to be a similar base, armory, middle, armory base design. We need more diversity in that mode. I believe 343 will do a great job I just hope this game will have a thriving community by the time stuff arrives.

 

[VincentMatts]

The thing is, Bungie got us used to some things by releasing such feature packed games, a particular art style, music, sound, etc. Its hard to just pretend that it never happened just cause a new studio is at the helm. I always use star wars as an example in these cases, if SW released a main movie with a different art style, different music, different enemies, guns, etc you would get just as much criticisms if not more. Halo, like it or not, is a franchise with its roots already deeply planted. You cant just pick up and start over when people have expectations already set in their minds.

That being said, i think 343 did a lot of good learning from 4 to 5. The music in 5 sounds a lot more like halo then 4 did, their story telling (although some might not enjoy the story itself) i think is 100 times better than Bungie ever did. Even in 4. The MP has changed radically from 4 to 5 and its now to me the best playing Halo yet, including Bungies games.

But ultimately, theres an expectation thats already there and that has been there since before 343. Since CE. You cant just forget about it and not expect criticisms. And if we go back to SW for a minute, look how Disney and JJ have handled the franchise. Yeah, the movie aint out yet but it looks to be exactly what everyone wanted since the originals and George had nothing to do with it. So its clearly doable.

Bungie always said they made games that they wanted to play. Thats probably the reason Halo Reach was how it was. It might not have been a perfect Halo game, but it was a very fun game to me. 343 need to realize (as Bungie did with Reach) that they cant do anything they want with main Halo games. If they want to get creative, make ODST. But theres an expectation to main Halo games, a legacy that needs to be respected and although Halo 5 isnt perfect, theyre on the right track imo.

I still have faith in 343. Bungie are gigantic shoes to fill in regards to Halo and that should be all the motivation they need to give us the Halo weve always wanted.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

I agree with the last post, don't just do what you imagine Spartans can do. It doesn't work in a game world


Bungie had said we don't want to hurt anyone's baby in regard to reach and not wanting to change the formula too much. But they did.

And to me it felt more like a test for destiny in a few spots.

 

[super-heated plasma]

The thing is, Bungie got us used to some things by releasing such feature packed games, a particular art style, music, sound, etc. Its hard to just pretend that it never happened just cause a new studio is at the helm. I always use star wars as an example in these cases, if SW released a main movie with a different art style, different music, different enemies, guns, etc you would get just as much criticisms if not more.

There were Star Wars movies like that. They are called the prequels.

 

[VincentMatts]

There were Star Wars movies like that. They are called the prequels.

Yes and people hated them, which is exactly what im saying.

 

[E92 M3]

Definitely not.

Shit movement and a weak ass weapon sandbox say no.

LOL...the Reach campaign is one of the best Halo campaigns ever. Also had likeable characters and a fantastic ending.

 

[Fuchsdh]

There were Star Wars movies like that. They are called the prequels.

Thus far the Star Wars films are probably the most artistically cohesive film series I've ever seen. The transition from clone troopers -> storm troopers makes sense from a design standpoint, blasters sound like blasters, and despite the prequels taking place earlier with the benefit of CG, they don't feel like they're a much later creation. Having the same composer for all the films certainly helps.

This is a separate issue from the matters of actual film quality, but the audiovisual presentation of Star Wars has always been consistent, and always been top-notch.

 

[Warm Machine]

I just finished mission 13 in Halo 5. I can't take anyone seriously who thinks Halo 5 isn't good, looks bad, or believes 343 doesn't know what they are doing.

 

[inoperativ]

As much as I dislike the direction Reach went in, it still had an amazing campaign and an incredible set of features with some weapons I hope will be re-introduced in Halo 5 through the updates. Halo 1-3 are all some of my favorite games of all time though, and Reach and 4 both failed to live up to that standard. I felt 4's worst sin was putting graphical fidelity over large scale environments and encounters, and failing to make the Prometheans as fun to fight as the flood.

5 has fixed most of my problems with 4 and I consider it on the same level as 1-3, although I am still unhappy with the amount of content the game currently has. So I guess by now I am quite happy with 343i and have more faith in them than I would have in Destiny-era Bungie to continue the series after a very rough start. Having said that, Bungie was my favorite developer for 15 years or so from the Marathon series to Reach, and I don't have anywhere near the same level of attachment to 343i as I had to Bungie back then.

 

[BradC00]

I kind of agree with nipper on sprint and clamber. if you go back and watch older MLG tournaments, you can see how maps that are built with sprint and clamber would mess up the flow of the game (to someone who played halo ce to halo 3)

I'm not very good at halo, but some of the jumps in 5 seem like they are only possible while sprinting to gain the right amount of momentum. this isn't bad by itself, but when you consider that you can't do these jumps to the side or backwards anymore (because you can't sprint backwards or forwards).

the same issue with clamber. some jumps require clamber, which means you can't do them backwards. you can do it to the side (sometimes) since you can clamber on objects that are to your left or right, but then you can't shoot.

I don't necessarily think it ruins the game, tho.

Other problems with sprint = maps are spread out. just look at the midship remake (I can't remember what it's called, truth or regret), the map is at least 3 times bigger then halo 3's version.

you can run away from a fight easier (this + thrust sometimes makes it frustrating to get a kill shot)

I love halo 5, but I never really got into 2 or 3 because I was stationed overseas and missed that train (was playing wow mostly), but I can see where people who loved those games think 343 is ruining halo. personally, I thought h2a was refreshing because it was different then cod, or bf (which is why I also like Gears), but they kind of screwed the pooch and pretty much shit away all the "ill give them 1 more chance" crowd with the problems they had at launch. also with how they released h5 with it being super barebones compared to other games that have come out in this same generation (bf4, 3 CoDs) it's not surprise that people are pissed.

hopefully 343 starts dumping out new maps and forge is awesome and they start putting in extra stuff before people just go "fuck it, back to cod" and never look back. hopefully its not too late.

 

[Monocle]

I just finished mission 13 in Halo 5. I can't take anyone seriously who thinks Halo 5 isn't good, looks bad, or believes 343 doesn't know what they are doing.

Right? It's a strong campaign.

As mentioned earlier, I really agree with a LOT of what the OP has stated, but didn't have time to make some clearer points on my thoughts.
<snip>

Great post, I agree with so much of this. I don't take such a favorable view of Halo 4, but I definitely think Halo CE and ODST have the best campaigns in the series, with 3 and 5 hovering around third place.

Halo 3 has great highs, but the campaign is so uneven that Halo 5's consistent quality might just dethrone it for me.

 

[Trup1aya]

I definately think nostalgia is clouding people's opinion of 343s work in comparison to Bungie's.

1: There is only one Bad Halo game. And that is Halo 4. It's not a bad game, it's better than most console FPS, but I was a bad Halo game.

2: We need to recognize that Bungie DRAMATICALLY altered the Halo formula several times during there time with the franchise. The most dramatic shifts happened between Halo CE and Halo 2, then again between Halo 3 and Reach. If we can agree to over look Halo 4 entirely, than Halo 5's formula really doesn't mark a drastic shift to the series mechanics. In fact, it's less radical than the jump to Halo 2.

3: Bungie made a ton of design choices that were bad for the franchise. H2, there was dual weilding, and no utility weapon with a high skill ceiling, H3 there was bloom and equipment. in Reach there were AAs and Loadouts. I think they get a pass some reason because there was so little competition in the FPS space. People were gonna play Halo regardless.

4: Halo 5 really is the best balanced Halo to date. By far. They deserve a ton of credit for that. They've also managed to incorporate mobility in a way that doesn't destroy the Halo trifecta and is balanced in ways that would have made 2001 Bungie proud. Kudos! My main complaint is that there is so little content. This is something that NEVER happened on Bungie's watch. If 343i had Bungie's insistence on underpromise G and over delivering, I don't think we'd be having this conversation.

 

[paragonpro]

3 and combat evolved are my two favorites for many reasons..that being said halo 4 has an absolutley incredible story and amazing characterization that sort of puts halo 5 to shame...im not kidding I shed a tear at the end of 4

 

[Jack The Nipper]

I just finished mission 13 in Halo 5. I can't take anyone seriously who thinks Halo 5 isn't good, looks bad, or believes 343 doesn't know what they are doing.

The missions got worse and worse. Try restarting the start of some of those later leveks. Then hit sprint run through them. It's literally just a path with a few right or left turns.

I forgot which mission starts it but the green plant one.

 

[Monocle]

The missions got worse and worse. Try restarting the start of some of those later leveks. Then hit sprint run through them. It's literally just a path with a few right or left turns.

I forgot which mission starts it but the green plant one.

You can speedrun any Halo level, lol. That says nothing about the quality of the level design or the encounters.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

You can speedrun any Halo level, lol. That says nothing about the quality of the level design or the encounters.

It's how bad they are that makes me not even want to play them. Just clusters of shit prometheans and bullet sponge enemies . A second play through just made me say fuck it, I'm a spartan running back baby.

This is.the point


So, oh yes it does say a lot about the design and counters. Going to make me a nice video to some nice NFL music of me doing some neon deion up in that.

It doesn't seem as bad the first time cause you aren't aware of what's coming. But halo 3 has less of these I want to be a running back moments. But there are a few.

 

[Gnome Scat]

Essentially Halo 5 is 343i's Halo 2, so we've got a long way to go until we can draw up a good comparison.