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[I NEED SCISSORS]

The 360 version looks a tiny bit better judging by the Lens of Truth shots. The colour balancing is more attractive and rich. There is also more fine detail (a sharper image?) on a lot of shots. For example, the ground texture looks better in this shot.

Graphics aside, any differences in audio quality? If PS3 has a DTS or PCM track, that will make it an easy decision, but outside of that I may rent it on 360.

 

[Otacon]

actually planned to blindly buy the game
but after all the framerate talk i finally played the ps3 demo yesterday
this must be the first time i will not buy a game because of a bad framerate
it's not unplayable but i really cannot understand how konami dares to release a final game like this (from what i've read the final game is identical to the demo performence wise)
sure, the game looks good but i really runs like shit
even the rain looks like its stuttering
what a shame
for me its way worse than SOTC and while it didn't have to render any enemies except the colossi it provided you with an open world to explore while castlevania seems like any area is interrupted by a cutscene
and wow, was the horse riding part lame
no idea if a patch could help out (don't think so) but at constant 30fps i would happily purchase
sorry, mercurysteam =(

 

[ntb825]

Honestly, the framerate hasn't bothered me one bit. I would have preferred 60, obviously, but I'm happy with what we got. Even if it is 24 frames.

 

[Otacon]

i REALLY planned to order castlevania & enslaved this week
was only waiting for the DF comparison about which version to get
but after playing the ps3 demo three times i must honesty admit that i just couldn't stand the disappointing performance of this game =/...surprising with kojipro involved
ended up pre-ordering - living in europe - only enslaved

 

[Beth Cyra]

Honestly, the framerate hasn't bothered me one bit. I would have preferred 60, obviously, but I'm happy with what we got. Even if it is 24 frames.

I can see being willing to deal with it, but Happy? Really?

Damn, well given how many people seem to love how the game looks despite it's performance it seems as though they went with the right choice.

 

[Lord Error]

for me its way worse than SOTC and while it didn't have to render any enemies except the colossi it provided you with an open world to explore while castlevania seems like

I'm pretty sure SotC had worse framerate than this, when horse riding at least. It wasn't bad when fighting some of the colossi, but it was pretty bad for some of them too. I guess this game is consistently sub-par at least, so most people can get used to it and forget about it. For me at least, by the end of the demo it wasn't bothersome anymore even though I could notice it every time I looked for it.

Unreal Engine 3. Unless the developer takes care (lol Ninja Theory taking care), the 360 version of UE3 games are always going to come out better. This is certainly the case with Enslaved, and you can see it in the Metacritic - the 360 version is in the mid-80s while the PS3 version is in the high 70s.

Castlevania is using a proprietary engine apparently developed with the PS3 as lead platform. And indeed, in gameplay, CV's demo runs better than Enslaved's on the PS3. The reverse is likely true on the 360.

O/T, but funnily enough, PS3 version of Enslaved now has 1 point more on Metacritic (81 vs 80). Less reviews though. The differences there don't really seem that big either. Biggest one is that PS3 ver. has more tearing.

 

[AsylumBlue]

.

 

[Otacon]

I'm pretty sure SotC had worse framerate than this, when horse riding at least.

yes, might be
but for a game like sotc the fps are not as important as for an action game

 

[Animator]

I am so glad this stuff doesnt bug me as long as the game is enjoyable. I didnt know there were framerate problems until I read this thread. I had a blast with the demo and never noticed anything distracting.

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

Okay, i've finally played the PS3 demo.

The easiest way to sum it up is this - it's playable. I'm not going to say it's 'good' or anything, because technically it isn't, and it's in no shape or form a preferable alternative to locked 30fps or 60fps (no way in hell that was even happening in the first place). But I completely understand where people are coming from when they say they don't mind it - I don't either, because at the very least it's consistent. The motion blur creates an illusion of a higher framerate, and there are no massive dips which can suddenly affect responsiveness. It's just a big lull that, once you get used to, is not too bad.

All this said, the lower framerate is definitely not shocking given how gorgeous the game looks. There are games which obviously should be running better than they are; but then there are games where it's understandable given how amazing they look. Castlevania is undoubtedly the latter - it is easily one of the best looking games on consoles, so Mercury Steam get a pass from me.

 

[Polk]

Why do the guys over at Lens of Truth use component cables instead of HDMI? Any reasoning behind that?

lack of hdmi hardware to capture stream maybe? Or some problems with hdcp.

 

[Blimblim]

Why do the guys over at Lens of Truth use component cables instead of HDMI? Any reasoning behind that?

Most likely because they don't have a debug PS3, so they can't capture with HDMI due to Sony's retarded idea that HDCP should be enabled even for gaming.

 

[Amir0x]

The game makes fast transitions between action and cutscenes that are seamlessly integrated and really well directed to the point that it doesn't take away from the gameplay like in MGS4 for example. The gameplay graphics preserve the details of those in the cutscenes, there is not a single obvious downgrade, if there is any LOD models employed, and postprocessing effects turned off during actual gameplay then it is really well hidden as I have not been able to notice it. The camera does a great job of pointing out the attention to detail that went into the environments, and you won't find any invisible wall if you are really immersed in the experience and trying to complete the quest. I am really impressed with what this team was able to accomplish. I know that it is all smoke and mirrors, but the flaws and limitations of this game are so well hidden that it doesn't feel like a corridor hack n' slash.

If you cannot get over the framerate, I doubt you will enjoy, but I did, and I cannot wait for the moment I am done with work so that I am able to make more progress in the main quest.

I can respect your feelings on the art direction - I've been very impressed with what I've seen and it's one of the first things that got my excited for the game back before I played it. I was mainly making a distinction between technical prowess and artistic prowess - one is not subjective, the other is.

I just won't be able to enjoy the visuals/art direction because the framerate would be so constantly grabbing my attention with its inherent awfulness. It's a shame but maybe one day five years from now there will be an awesome PS3 emulator and I'll buy the game and we'll get our good framerate and it'll be insane.

Side Note: I won't pretend I understand those who say it's one of the best looking games on consoles, however. Framerate is a big part of that determination for any title, and that should basically remove Castlevania from the running pretty easily.

where did you pull 24fps from?
so both ps3 and 360 are 24fps?

The demos are both in this range, and from those who played the final game it is pretty similar.

I probably should have said terrain traversal rather than platforming. You know how in the game you have sections where you do nothing but go from point a to point b. In those sections in UC2 you're usually guided to go one route and that route alone. Sometimes those work nicely as well, like in the ice cave, and sometimes they are there to relax and do some sightseeing. But I enjoyed terrain traversal more in sections where you're free to go anywhere and do anything you want - like how on the train you can go on top of the train, or through it, jump through the window, fool the enemies to follow you, then run inside the train car again and escape from them, or get better aim at them - that sort of thing. Or when you're at that snow storm and play hide and seek with enemies through the crashed train. Basically any ledge in those non-strict platforming sections can still be interacted with your character, and it's done in a very organic way. That's something I really liked about the game.

I was amazed by many segments in the game... the train segment and all of chapter 6, primarily. I loved how the bumps really jostled my character and how the trains turns and twists down the rail forced me to adjust my aim at all times... something I've never experienced in any train level before. Most train levels are just visual fodder, bullshit with backgrounds that sway real fast passed you but are static and don't feel different from any other level

 

[AndyMoogle]

The 360 version looks a tiny bit better judging by the Lens of Truth shots. The colour balancing is more attractive and rich. There is also more fine detail (a sharper image?) on a lot of shots. For example, the ground texture looks better in this shot.

Graphics aside, any differences in audio quality? If PS3 has a DTS or PCM track, that will make it an easy decision, but outside of that I may rent it on 360.

The PS3 version has DTS at least.

 

[dark10x]

I was amazed by many segments in the game... the train segment and all of chapter 6, primarily. I loved how the bumps really jostled my character and how the trains turns and twists down the rail forced me to adjust my aim at all times... something I've never experienced in any train level before. Most train levels are just visual fodder, bullshit with backgrounds that sway real fast passed you but are static and don't feel different from any other level

Yeah, that's definitely the best train level I've ever seen.

It also did a great job showing off their fantastic motion blur. Very very impressive.

The type of blur applied to the scenery wasn't even used in stuff like Crysis. The train level in Warhead, for instance, featured nothing of the sort (motion blur was used on the camera itself and on individual objects, but did not seem to apply to fast moving scenery).

 

[wwm0nkey]

EDIT: NVM

 

[Vustadumas]

Snagged the 360 demo. So, framerate is pretty bad, but for me, doesn't really detract much from the game. Though parrying is rather tough at times. Would I have liked a better framerate? Of course. Will it force me to not play the game? No.

 

[dark10x]

So I want to know where the fuck all of the trailer footage came from. Did they just pre-render all of it? If you go back and watch any one of the trailers showing footage from the game itself, you'll find that it all runs much smoother than what you really get in the game. The visuals are exactly the same, but performance is definitely not.

At the very least, they should have capped the PS3 version at 30 fps. That way, when it actually hits that target, it wouldn't have issues with judder. There are definitely plenty of times when I believe it goes above 30 fps but still looks poor in motion due to the judder. Preventing it from crossing 30 fps would have helped a lot.

Snagged the 360 demo. So, framerate is pretty bad, but for me, doesn't really detract much from the game. Though parrying is rather tough at times. Would I have liked a better framerate? Of course. Will it force me to not play the game? No.

Framerate did not bother me all that much in the demo either, but once you start playing the final game and the camera is swinging around all fast and loose, it feels a whole lot worse.

There's a lot of fast camera work and the stuttery framerate ruins the whole look they were going for.

 

[Windom Earle]

DF holding off on the face off to bait more hits? Keep it classy...

 

[manzo]

From DF Twitter:

Same amount of samples in the motion blur. It's one of the closest games we've looked at in years!

 

[RoninChaos]

Having a blast with it. There is some judder here and there but the game is gorgeous. I feel for some of you who aren't going to try it because of the frame rate. At least rent it.

 

[Enk]

So I want to know where the fuck all of the trailer footage came from. Did they just pre-render all of it? If you go back and watch any one of the trailers showing footage from the game itself, you'll find that it all runs much smoother than what you really get in the game. The visuals are exactly the same, but performance is definitely not.

Unannounced PC version?

Spoiler

God I wish.

 

[DarknessTear]

Beautiful game. Playing it on PS3, runs well so far. DTS audio on PS3 = crystal clear and sounds fucking amazing in so many ways. The music is soooo awesome and full of emotion. I love it.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Beautiful game. Playing it on PS3, runs well so far. DTS audio on PS3 = crystal clear and sounds fucking amazing in so many ways. The music is soooo awesome and full of emotion. I love it.

I know "good" is subjective, but how can you say that? What runs poorly, then?

 

[LowParry]

I know "good" is subjective, but how can you say that? What runs poorly, then?

It's safe to say that in area's of the game, it runs rather good. But not as an entire outlook. Chp. 4 of the game is good example of "good".

 

[Dennis]

So I want to know where the fuck all of the trailer footage came from. Did they just pre-render all of it?

Probably yes. The screenshots released before launch were also obvious PC renders.

 

[cryptic]

Wow. I think I actually hate this game because of the challenges. Some are just ridiculous; at least on hard mode. I'm only on the second part of the second chapter but being unable to complete the challenges and improve myself make's me want to quit. I just turned off the system because of the first challenge at the first part of the second chapter and have no will to continue anytime soon.

 

[DenogginizerOS]

Beautiful game. Playing it on PS3, runs well so far. DTS audio on PS3 = crystal clear and sounds fucking amazing in so many ways. The music is soooo awesome and full of emotion. I love it.

How did you get it to run DTS audio?

 

[Adam Blue]

The frame-rate issue is surprising to me. After playing through Reach and Dead Rising 2, I'm stunned and disappointed at all the frame-rate drops in these games. LoS has proven to me that developers can still keep a consistent frame-rate.

So far (into second chapter), the only frame-rate drops have been cutscenes with heavy weather effects (rain/snow). I'm very impressed with the technical aspects of the game (not the gameplay itself though). No where during combat did the frames drop below 30 (most likely above). I understand certain 360's would load elements of GTA4 differently depending on the hardware. Maybe a similar issue here?

 

[somesayyea]

How did you get it to run DTS audio?

you need to disable dolby digital and it'll default to dts

 

[DenogginizerOS]

you need to disable dolby digital and it'll default to dts

I figured as much. Note to Sony: can you make it so I don't have to disable features in order to utilize others? This game defaults to 720P and Dolby Digital even though my TV and Receiver support 1080P and DTS, respectively.

 

[Amir0x]

The frame-rate issue is surprising to me. After playing through Reach and Dead Rising 2, I'm stunned and disappointed at all the frame-rate drops in these games. LoS has proven to me that developers can still keep a consistent frame-rate.

So far (into second chapter), the only frame-rate drops have been cutscenes with heavy weather effects (rain/snow). I'm very impressed with the technical aspects of the game (not the gameplay itself though). No where during combat did the frames drop below 30 (most likely above).

Do you have the magic version of Lords of Shadow that doesn't exist for a single person on Earth? On both PS3 and 360, it runs at 24~25fps average with dips here and there. Pretty much you betrayed your ability to judge framerates by this post, since you couldn't tell the difference. But that's good for you - you're one of those lucky ones for which abysmal framerates do not impact you.

Send me this copy of your magic Castlevania though so I can enjoy it

Side Note: The horrible framerate of Reach destroyed that game for me. Such a shame. On the first level that you get the Warthog, there is a scene when you're trying to go back and you're facing multiple ghosts and other shit. My framerate dropped to what felt like 10~15fps. I tried the game on my brother-in-laws 360 and the same shit happened.

I love Halo but it's been hard getting through Reach...

 

[alr1ght]

The frame-rate issue is surprising to me. After playing through Reach and Dead Rising 2, I'm stunned and disappointed at all the frame-rate drops in these games. LoS has proven to me that developers can still keep a consistent frame-rate.

So far (into second chapter), the only frame-rate drops have been cutscenes with heavy weather effects (rain/snow). I'm very impressed with the technical aspects of the game (not the gameplay itself though). No where during combat did the frames drop below 30 (most likely above). I understand certain 360's would load elements of GTA4 differently depending on the hardware. Maybe a similar issue here?

What are you talking about? Reach usually ran a steady 30, with infrequent drops. LOS runs below 30 all the time. It seemed especially bad in the bog level.

 

[Amir0x]

What are you talking about? Reach usually ran a steady 30, with infrequent drops. LOS runs below 30 all the time. It seemed especially bad in the bog level.

Reach has much more than "infrequent" drops. Still, I can't say how bad it'll be versus the final version of LoS, but the framerate of Reach has been the single thing preventing me from being able to really get into it. At some scenes, the game dropped to catastrophic lows.

 

[LabouredSubterfuge]

Do you have the magic version of Lords of Shadow that doesn't exist for a single person on Earth? On both PS3 and 360, it runs at 24~25fps average with dips here and there. Pretty much you betrayed your ability to judge framerates by this post, since you couldn't tell the difference. But that's good for you - you're one of those lucky ones for which abysmal framerates do not impact you.

Send me this copy of your magic Castlevania though so I can enjoy it

Go watch the frame rate measurement video again. I'm serious. You keep quoting the mean average frame rate of 24fps from that video without taking care to see how that frame rate average was produced. The average would've been far higher were it not for all the non-gameplay parts that dip below 20. The actual gameplay parts would probably produce a far higher average closer to 27-28fps. I know it sounds like I'm splitting hairs here and I probably am but for the sake of accuracy of what you're saying I suggest you watch the video again.

 

[Dennis]

Reach is close to unplayable now? Its a wonder Amir0x ever get play anything on his consoles.

 

[Adam Blue]

Do you have the magic version of Lords of Shadow that doesn't exist for a single person on Earth? On both PS3 and 360, it runs at 24~25fps average with dips here and there. Pretty much you betrayed your ability to judge framerates by this post, since you couldn't tell the difference. But that's good for you - you're one of those lucky ones for which abysmal framerates do not impact you.

I take frame-rate drops quite seriously. I will try and see if recording gameplay is possible and posting it.

As for 24-25 or 30fps? Give or take, it's in the range and doesn't dip during combat. I would be seriously enraged if frame-rate dips were occurring during combat.

 

[Amir0x]

Go watch the frame rate measurement video again. I'm serious. You keep quoting the mean average frame rate of 24fps from that video without taking care to see how that frame rate average was produced. The average would've been far higher were it not for all the non-gameplay parts that dip below 20. The actual gameplay parts would probably produce a far higher average closer to 27-28fps. I know it sounds like I'm splitting hairs here and I probably am but for the sake of accuracy of what you're saying I suggest you watch the video again.

I don't even need to watch the video, I PLAYED THE DEMO. It was consistently terrible. if you're talking a frame difference of 2 average during gameplay, I don't know you might well go add that up, but the end result is still awful

Reach is close to unplayable now? Its a wonder Amir0x ever get play anything on his consoles.

It is frequently under 30fps; anything that is frequently under 30fps is unacceptable.

Most games are not frequently under 30fps.

 

[alr1ght]

I take frame-rate drops quite seriously. I will try and see if recording gameplay is possible and posting it.

As for 24-25 or 30fps? Give or take, it's in the range and doesn't dip during combat. I would be seriously enraged if frame-rate dips were occurring during combat.

it doesn't dip, it's always bad. Walk through the Bog level and tell that it looks good in motion.

 

[kittoo]

Unannounced PC version?

Spoiler

God I wish.

There wont be a PC version, I too personally wish there was. But Japanese publishers dont give a shit about PCs (other than CAPCOM).

 

[Adam Blue]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DW0HUZPk1o

Not sure of this can count since a video streaming over the net has the potential to lag, but by watching the glowing exp icon and numbers, you can get a good look at how consistent the frame-rate is. I didn't watch the whole video, so I might have missed a particular instance of frames dropping.

I personally saw no drops during the bog level when I played it. But again, I brought up the GTA4 issue with different hardware and I see no responses to that, but it is a variable that cannot be ignored.

 

[Synless]

I don't know why some of you are arguing the framerate. It really does suck. The game is beautiful though so it helps ease the framerate problems it doesn't make up for them, but it helps.

 

[White Man]

This feels like a beta. It also feels like a game that was pushed out the door in order to get out in time. There's no excuse for a game to ship like this, especially when you see how questionably system resources were used. I know we love to diss shitty ground textures and all, but I get the nagging feeling that maybe reprioritizing things would have gotten this to 30. Also I've noticed the LAIR-y problem of things with way too much whatever-mapping resembling wet pieces of shit.

Gameplay is kinda :-/ too. Maybe it's because of the framerate, but it seems there's a bit of lag whenever you do something. It doesn't feel so tight.

For a game where so much work was put into making fine textures and spanking effects, it's kind of a facepalm that it can't hold a decent framerate.

 

[Kittonwy]

Reach has much more than "infrequent" drops. Still, I can't say how bad it'll be versus the final version of LoS, but the framerate of Reach has been the single thing preventing me from being able to really get into it. At some scenes, the game dropped to catastrophic lows.

How come you always have problems enjoying all the best games like Uncharted 2 and Halo Reach?

 

[Kittonwy]

it doesn't dip, it's always bad. Walk through the Bog level and tell that it looks good in motion.

How bad? I'm kinda deciding whether to pick this one up along with Sportz Champeinz. I see a lot of people on my PSN list have this game.

 

[cryptic]

Can anyone give me some tips on how to kill 30 goblins using bombs at the first part of chapter 2 on hard?

 

[Fimbulvetr]

Can anyone give me some tips on how to kill 30 goblins using bombs at the first part of chapter 2 on hard?

OT is this way ----> http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=408544&page=34

 

[x3sphere]

I'm framerate sensitive (so picky, I own an 5970 for my PC) and have no issue playing LoS on PS3 :/ It's sub 30 yes but feels consistent. It does, at times, jump in demanding situations but at least not to the point of diminishing the experience.

Dead Rising 2 (console version) on the other hand is unplayable for me, the framerate chugs massively in some areas, making animation appear choppy. I have NO idea how anyone can deal with the drops in DR2 and I'm honestly shocked Capcom released it in such a state, but that's just me. Thankfully there's a PC version.

A consistent framerate, even if it's rather low, is still bearable to my eyes. I'd prefer a locked 25FPS over something that fluctuates between 30 and 15.

 

[Nemo]

This has DTS?

Going on my to buy list

 

[Ranger X]

actually planned to blindly buy the game
but after all the framerate talk i finally played the ps3 demo yesterday
this must be the first time i will not buy a game because of a bad framerate
it's not unplayable but i really cannot understand how konami dares to release a final game like this (from what i've read the final game is identical to the demo performence wise)
sure, the game looks good but i really runs like shit
even the rain looks like its stuttering
what a shame
for me its way worse than SOTC and while it didn't have to render any enemies except the colossi it provided you with an open world to explore while castlevania seems like any area is interrupted by a cutscene
and wow, was the horse riding part lame
no idea if a patch could help out (don't think so) but at constant 30fps i would happily purchase
sorry, mercurysteam =(

I don't even understand how this game isn't receiving any backslash in the media for the bad framerate. This game crossed the line. Videogames are a 30fps thing, 60fps thing for certain genre. Now it's like the goal of this one here was 24fps + motion blur. VIDEOGAMES AREN'T MOVIES. And movies are choppy, don't bring this shit to my videogames.

Anyhow, I don't understand even the people in this thread not minding it. It's a sad world when you realise that the standard publishers could give themselves for releasing games would be something like 24fps + motion blur.