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[cjtiger300]

Sorry for the derail again, this shit should go off on it's own thread. I just fucking hate the '30fps is ok' crew coming out of the woodwork every time gripes with a game's framerates come up. Most of the arguments 'for' 30fps (why the fuck are there ever arguments for 30fps) are backed up by a lot of 'I think, I feel, I'm ok with' and not a lot of 'Here's some actual reasons 30fps is superior!' (hint: It's not, ever. 30fps means you're accepting reduced framerate and responsiveness in exchange for more graphical effects, possibly at the cost of _other_ visual features).

Sorry but 30 Fps was just fine in Uncharted 2 (by fine I mean fantastic by the way). The game ran butter smooth!!

 

[Beth Cyra]

What would make someone cancel a pre-order over some frame rate issues?

What happened to wanting to play video games?

Frame rate effects not only the look of the game but also the feel and how it plays.

I have had a problem with LoS for a long time becuase it's combat reminds me of the shallow combat from GoW, last thing I want is that type of combat that feels even worse when I could just as easily put in Devil May Cry 4 that is 3 year old and the combat is 10x more enjoyable to perform and watch.

 

[Phloxy]

Well, I will defend the combat. The combat is real good, and gets pretty tough as the game goes on. Much deeper than God of Wars combat in every way.

And making health regen a strategic aspect of battle is one of the smartest blends of the new school regen all the time mixed with old school game play where you knew you had to fight really well because you are low and that is all you got.

Look this is how it boils down.
So for the people who could care less about the frame rate problems that are their, no denying it. Pick it up and enjoy based off controller preference and achievement/trophy etc.

People on the fence about it now just wait for a price drop.

And people like Amirox need to stay far away from this game because it will offend you on either platform every step of the way. No digital foundry anything will help, the game is slow, never is 30 and it will be a shock to your eyes if you play it.

 

[Beth Cyra]

Well, I will defend the combat. The combat is real good, and gets pretty tough as the game goes on. Much deeper than God of Wars combat in every way.

And making health regen a strategic aspect of battle is one of the smartest blends of the new school regen all the time mixed with old school game play where you knew you had to fight really well because you are low and that is all you got.

Look this is how it boils down.
So for the people who could care less about the frame rate problems that are their, no denying it. Pick it up and enjoy based off controller preference and achievement/trophy etc.

People on the fence about it now just wait for a price drop.

And people like Amirox need to stay far away from this game because it will offend you on either platform every step of the way. No digital foundry anything will help, the game is slow, never is 30 and it will be a shock to your eyes if you play it.

Ouch, that last part hurts, but it is nice that the final game does well on the combat.

I will still pick it up but I am guessing I am not going to be enjoying it nearly as much as other people.

 

[Phloxy]

And Castlevania fanboys stop pm'in me calling me a pirate. I bought the 360 version and played it alongside my buddies PS3 version for the first three chapters. Pm me for my gamer-tag if you want proof, shit is annoying.

No miraculous retail copy that is bought on a Tuesday will work better than the one I bought Friday.

 

[brandonh83]

And Castlevania fanboys stop pm'in me calling me a pirate.

:lol seriously? mom and pops stores have had it for like three or four days... or longer.

 

[Phloxy]

Yeah I know. But fanboy goggles will make any game seem super fast and fluid, let them enjoy it I guess.

 

[polyh3dron]

And Castlevania fanboys stop pm'in me calling me a pirate. I bought the 360 version and played it alongside my buddies PS3 version for the first three chapters. Pm me for my gamer-tag if you want proof, shit is annoying.

They're really PMing you saying that? :lol

If you guys love Capcom so much why don't you marry it!

 

[LowParry]

And Castlevania fanboys stop pm'in me calling me a pirate. I bought the 360 version and played it alongside my buddies PS3 version for the first three chapters. Pm me for my gamer-tag if you want proof, shit is annoying.

No miraculous retail copy that is bought on a Tuesday will work better than the one I bought Friday.

I demand quotes!

 

[Spike]

What would make someone cancel a pre-order over some frame rate issues?

What happened to wanting to play video games?

I bought the game for my brother. I am trying to watch him play it, but my eyes always bugger up and my head starts hurting.

Is that a good enough reason for you?

 

[EricHasNoPull]

It doesn't have to be a question. It could also be the statement "I'm not sure if you're serious."

That reads very much like a question though, Unless you are getting poetic with me with some monologue sh*t, anyone that starts a sentence with "I am not sure...." begs for the third party (the people in the person's present to confirm something for him/her).

If I picked up an Apple in a busy supermarket and "told" the random shopper next to me "I am not sure if this is an Apple".

besides thinking that I am a weirdo and mentally challenged ... It's likely that, the person will confirm and say "yes, yes sir that IS in fact an Apple" hence why it's always a question, it always ASKS the person to confirm something. "I'm no sure if you are serious? Are you serious?" There is more than one way to ask the same question.

Anyway back to topic can we get some sort of photos/video some media comparison of this game on both consoles?

 

[corrosivefrost]

One thing I've never understood about "Not Sure If Serious?" Gifs is the fact that almost every Gif I've seen of this "meme" or whatever, none of them have the Question mark at the end of the sentence. Why is that?

Isn't the person asking a question with bad grammar?

It's asking "I'm not sure if you are serious?" or "Not sure if serious?"

I mean bad grammar or not; How lazy you have to be to not include the "?" at the end?

The whole thing is a question being asked isn't it? Without it it just doesn't work, not to me it doesn't.

Anyway sorry for being so random and off topic, just wondering that's all.

As I've always read it, it's not "Are you serious?", it's "[I'm] not sure if [you are] serious."

 

[EricHasNoPull]

As I've always read it, it's not "Are you serious?", it's "[I'm] not sure if [you are] serious."

my post above yours explains how it is almost always IS a question. But I donno I could be wrong I guess...

F'k it ... I still think it's a bloody question and it should always be delivered with a question mark at the end of it.....damn it!!

 

[hey_it's_that_dog]

It's not a goddamn question, it's a statement, albeit an inquisitive one. (Maybe "inquisitive" is misleading. If that doesn't work for you, call it "expressing uncertainty.")

Here's another example: I wonder where you got the idea that it was a question.

"I'm not sure..." and "I wonder..." are statements. Adding a question mark would mean the speaker was unsure about their own state of mind. Essentially, "am I sure?" and "do I wonder?"

 

[TheKaeptain]

And Castlevania fanboys stop pm'in me calling me a pirate. I bought the 360 version and played it alongside my buddies PS3 version for the first three chapters. Pm me for my gamer-tag if you want proof, shit is annoying.

No miraculous retail copy that is bought on a Tuesday will work better than the one I bought Friday.

HAHAHA Please post some of the pm's

 

[EricHasNoPull]

Here's another example: I wonder where you got the idea that it was a question.

(to answer your question...)
I'm pretty sure I got this idea by remembering what my grade one English teacher thought me.


Hmm I wonder if my grade one teacher was wrong by teaching me this.

Now... try NOT to answer to the above "statement" genius :lol ...Sorry I don't mean to sound like an ass.

 

[Tears For Fears]

They're really PMing you saying that? :lol

If you guys love Capcom so much why don't you marry it!

What?

 

[-tetsuo-]

I need to ask why it can't be accepted that a 30fps game/scene CAN be used for atmospheric purposes by you so called "fps experts". Also... where does your knowledge come from and where do you apply it? Expert animators who are part of a 60fps or bust dev team? Seriously... what makes you think you have this all knowing knowledge in this department? Serious question, not trying to be a douche.

The day a dev team can replicate a moody atmosphere, showcase a giant beast that looks and feels like it has weight and appear cinematic all while running at 60fps.... I'd change my mind. Until then, 30 does this better for me. I may be remembering wrong but I think even DMC4 had a few 30fps scenes to purhaps lend a bit of *gasp* cinematic quality and weight to the onscreen action.

Amnesia has a perfect mood and keeps an incredible atmosphere. It also runs at 60 fps on my computer.

 

[Plywood]

Sorry but 30 Fps was just fine in Uncharted 2 (by fine I mean fantastic by the way). The game ran butter smooth!!

and if it ran at 60 fps you wouldve came bricks!!1

Also 30 fps is not butter smooth.

 

[vg260]

The day a dev team can replicate a moody atmosphere, showcase a giant beast that looks and feels like it has weight and appear cinematic all while running at 60fps.... I'd change my mind. Until then, 30 does this better for me. I may be remembering wrong but I think even DMC4 had a few 30fps scenes to purhaps lend a bit of *gasp* cinematic quality and weight to the onscreen action.

If you saw the same moody, atmospheric game running at 60 fps with all the effects it would definitely look noticeably better. The thing is, it's rare that this rarely happens because devs have to sacrifice those 30 fps for this atmosphere, so people don't know what they're missing.

Only example that comes to mind is Batman AA. It had a very atmospheric feel and look. It looked great on the 360 and PS3 @ 30 fps, but it was sooo much better looking running at 60fps on a PC. Couldn't go back to the PS3/360 versions after it.

I guess another good example would be those people who refused to make the jump to HD, claiming their SD sets looked just fine. They just never saw how much better it could look. I think the idea that a 30 to 60fps jump would ruin a game's atmosphere is absolutely ridiculous.

 

[robertsan21]

This thread sucks, not one single picture comparing the two games.

oh and 30fps is not okey, we need top notch graphics with 60fps.

sony better make the next playstation with the capacity of producing superior graphics with 60fps, I do not want a tradedown to get 60fps.

that should never be allowed.

 

[vg260]

This thread sucks, not one single picture comparing the two games.

oh and 30fps is not okey, we need top notch graphics with 60fps.

sony better make the next playstation with the capacity of producing superior graphics with 60fps, I do not want a tradedown to get 60fps.

that should never be allowed.

I think the 30/60 fps graphic features/smoothness tradeoff will always exist. All I can realistically hope for next gen is 1080p as a base resolution instead of 720p. I think that's realistic seeing how current PC can easily handle 1080p for today's games without a huge dropoff from 720p. I WILL be pissed if 1080p is not the standard.

I'm still not sure what to think about the alleged 360 frame drops. I'd switch to the PS3 version, but I pre-ordered the 360 on Amazon when they had the $20 promo credit, but that's gone now. :/

 

[burgerdog]

What?

Some poor sap always falls for it.

 

[SonOfABeep]

30fps will always be the standard because the average person can't tell there's anything wrong with a game running at 30fps.

The average person can tell a game has worse textures, lighting, or animation, or other sacrifices made to run at 60fps. Developers/publishers will always want to squeeze more effects and graphics vs locking at 60fps. It's always going to sell more.

 

[∀ Narayan]

Some poor sap always falls for it.

Folks need to stop "confusing" the two. It's pretty annoying.

 

[EricHasNoPull]

and if it ran at 60 fps you wouldve came bricks!!1

Also 30 fps is not butter smooth.

I confirm, Uncharted 2 running 30fps on 120hz option active on (my) 120hz capable Tv was IN FACT "butter smooth" ...No where near the "butter smoothness" of a true 60fps game of course, but it was smoother than your run of the mill 30fps game.

Ok maybe "I can't believe it's not butter" (Margarine) smooth, but not "Butter Smooth."

(The 120hz works great on some games, not so great on others, U2 was the former)

Anyway I guess a Tv's features and capabilities is not relevant to a game's features and capabilities. I get it. But just sayin.

 

[vg260]

I asked this is the other thread, but maybe it's better here since it's technically a comparison.

How are the shoulder buttons mapped on the PS3 vs the 360?

I hate using the L2 trigger on the PS3 heavily. Block/evade was L2 in the PS3 demo. so if it's the trigger on the 360 controller, I'll be satisfied with that version, because it's way more comfortable. I do have the snap-on PS3 triggers, but it's still my least favorite thing about the controller. Are the buttons configurable?

 

[Phloxy]

Yes, that is also why I got the 360 version. The combat relies on the blocking, countering and evading, those are all done with the left trigger on both. The way it is built is so much smoother and easier using the 360 controller. That is what sold me on that version, and it's been a blast.

 

[TheKaeptain]

This thread sucks, not one single picture comparing the two games.

oh and 30fps is not okey, we need top notch graphics with 60fps.

sony better make the next playstation with the capacity of producing superior graphics with 60fps, I do not want a tradedown to get 60fps.

that should never be allowed.

Why is is Sony's fault?

 

[AgentOtaku]

I asked this is the other thread, but maybe it's better here since it's technically a comparison.

How are the shoulder buttons mapped on the PS3 vs the 360?

I hate using the L2 trigger on the PS3 heavily. Block/evade was L2 in the PS3 demo. so if it's the trigger on the 360 controller, I'll be satisfied with that version, because it's way more comfortable. I do have the snap-on PS3 triggers, but it's still my least favorite thing about the controller. Are the buttons configurable?

+1

wanted to know this as well, thanks

 

[vg260]

Yes, that is also why I got the 360 version. The combat relies on the blocking, countering and evading, those are all done with the left trigger on both. The way it is built is so much smoother and easier using the 360 controller. That is what sold me on that version, and it's been a blast.

Good to know. Thanks.

 

[manzo]

This thread sucks, not one single picture comparing the two games.

oh and 30fps is not okey, we need top notch graphics with 60fps.

sony better make the next playstation with the capacity of producing superior graphics with 60fps, I do not want a tradedown to get 60fps.

that should never be allowed.

Since the capture boys haven't gotten their hands on both copies. DF is working on it, so we should have a comparison this week.

 

[robertsan21]

Why is is Sony's fault?

The tradeoff happens when there is hardwear limitation.
Right?

Otverwise i dont see why we are not getting 60fps and top notch graphics.

 

[Zeliard]

I never was one to appreciate PC games back in the day (still don't play them but mostly because I don't have a PC nor do I ever intend to get one to run any games) because I always felt the the super smooth, crisp and sharp edges felt lifeless.

:lol :lol :lol

 

[godhandiscen]

Not a single post helping to the purpose of this thread yet... DAMN!

 

[manzo]

Digital Foundtry twitter:

-snip- Hope to have the Face-Off done for tomorrow PM.

 

[dark10x]

Digital Foundtry twitter:

-snip- Hope to have the Face-Off done for tomorrow PM.

As they are in the UK, hopefully it will be up before I run out to buy the game.

 

[Ricker]

Demo is finally up on the 360 anyway in North America.

 

[2San]

The tradeoff happens when there is hardwear limitation.
Right?

Otverwise i dont see why we are not getting 60fps and top notch graphics.

Even if the PS3 hardware was better developers would just crank out even better graphics and make it run at 30 fps. Wasn't the PS3 sold with a loss? Even then the thing was pretty expensive.

 

[S1kkZ]

just played trough the 360 demo. biggest difference is the contrast. the picture of my ps3 demo is much brighter but i have trouble seeing the werewolfs in the rain fight. the 360 demo has better/deeper contrast. it looks darker but you dont loose picture information (details lost in the "black"). i can see the enemies much better in the 360 demo.

thats the only difference so far.

 

[Feindflug]

It def doesn't hit 30 unless you are in a tiny room with nothing in it, but as soon as one enemy shows up it gets slower. and that is both versions. So yeah, don't go in expecting more, I reached Chapter 3 in both, and it never changed. Cept like I said the 360 version having that weird freeze frame when you kill enemies in some stages, really weird and annoying.

What? I thought the freezing issues were fixed in the retail version...from what I've seen in the GS vids the freezes are so annoying.

Anyone else can tell us if they have freezing issues in the 360 version?

 

[dark10x]

The tradeoff happens when there is hardwear limitation.
Right?

Otverwise i dont see why we are not getting 60fps and top notch graphics.

Definitely not this.

The PS2 features more 3D 60 fps titles than any other home console to date. There were so many games running at 60 fps on this platform that it actually made the jump to this current generation a bit more difficult.

How often do we have top shelf games running at 60 fps on modern consoles? PS2 had this in spades. Even more impressive was the fact that second and third tier games also often shared this high framerate.

The XBOX was a more powerful machine, but featured fewer games running at this high framerate.

 

[Blimblim]

Many (especially the early ones) PS2 titles ran at 60 fps because they had no choice but to use field rendering (in order to have more available memory mostly), which pretty much mandates 60 fps unless you want some very ugly results. Given a choice there would have been more 30 fps titles I'm sure.

 

[Windom Earle]

Sorry but 30 Fps was just fine in Uncharted 2 (by fine I mean fantastic by the way). The game ran butter smooth!!

This. Locked 30fps combined with motion blur feels perfect to me outside of racing or fps games!

 

[dark10x]

Many (especially the early ones) PS2 titles ran at 60 fps because they had no choice but to use field rendering (in order to have more available memory mostly), which pretty much mandates 60 fps unless you want some very ugly results. Given a choice there would have been more 30 fps titles I'm sure.

Oh I know, but I feel that actually worked out in the systems favor. The hardware favored higher framerates. We lost some image quality, but it was worth it.

Still, it doesn't change the fact that some top quality titles with incredibly high-end visuals at the time did not use field rendering. MGS2, for instance, used a full 640x448 frame buffer despite its impressive visual quality.

 

[The Bookerman]

I need to ask why it can't be accepted that a 30fps game/scene CAN be used for atmospheric purposes by you so called "fps experts". Also... where does your knowledge come from and where do you apply it? Expert animators who are part of a 60fps or bust dev team? Seriously... what makes you think you have this all knowing knowledge in this department? Serious question, not trying to be a douche.

The day a dev team can replicate a moody atmosphere, showcase a giant beast that looks and feels like it has weight and appear cinematic all while running at 60fps.... I'd change my mind. Until then, 30 does this better for me. I may be remembering wrong but I think even DMC4 had a few 30fps scenes to purhaps lend a bit of *gasp* cinematic quality and weight to the onscreen action.

Every animation I've done for games have been in 30fps....
Whenever I look at a 60fps rendered animation, it looks like somebody smeared butter all over it.

 

[V_Arnold]

This. Locked 30fps combined with motion blur feels perfect to me outside of racing or fps games!

..and even there, Halo Reach with blur+30fps = WIN!
Too bad that that game has scenes where a slowdown occurs.

 

[subversus]

Whenever I look at a 60fps rendered animation, it looks like somebody smeared butter all over it.

????

what do you mean?

 

[dark10x]

The day a dev team can replicate a moody atmosphere, showcase a giant beast that looks and feels like it has weight and appear cinematic all while running at 60fps

There are plenty examples of this on the PC.

Even back in the day, older games like System Shock 2 and Thief had no problems running at 60 fps on PCs of that day yet were extremely atmospheric (more so than many modern games even). A high framerate does not compromise the "atmosphere" of an experience.

 

[Graphics Horse]

:lol :lol :lol

It's different these days but a lot of games did seem to get uglier the more you increased the resolution to me. Placing textures onto giant slabs of geometry has mixed results, and low resolution could hide some art problems and the boxy nature of the geometry.