-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
CDPR Facing Class-Action Lawsuit for "misrepresentation in order to receive financial benefits” [NYT]
- Thread starter MrS
- Start date
Hawking Radiation
Member
I'm not going to sift through all the marketing and advertising materials provided in the past by CDPR just to prove you wrong because you seem to be allergic to factual information. You're more than welcome to do your own research since I can't be bothered to do your homework for you. Cyberpunk 2077 was advertised to be more than just a typical open-world action/adventure RPG game. If you truly believe otherwise, you're absolutely delusional. You and others alike may argue that players had unrealistic expectations but the truth is that CDPR set up those expectations and plugged away at the hype machine. Do you really believe Keanu Reeves was hired for his exceptional voice acting abilities? The open world in Cyberpunk 2077, however pretty it may be, does not have as much depth as a 16-year old game like GTA: San Andreas. I'll ramble on about a random list of features off the top of my head. Player customization is non-existent past the character creation screen. Car customization doesn't exist. The massive arsenal of weaponry CDPR boasted on about doesn't exist. The AI operates entirely on rails and is not dynamic. Expansive quests with branching paths and meaningful decisions don't exist since nearly 98% of all choices made by the player will lead them to the same destination. The skill system is almost pointless because anyone can breeze through the missions on even the hardest difficulty by simply deactivating cameras and stealthily incapacitating enemies. The enemy AI in this game also makes the Amazon virtual chat AI look like a genius. Progression in the "Street Cred" system is pointless because it just becomes a mediocre grind in order to acquire new items from vendors and acquiring new vehicles via text. Oh that's right, no car dealerships are present in this game because we have to purchase a car via text. Stellar! It's the year 2077 and we're still using OfferUp and Craigslist! Oh wait, what about life paths you say? Darn, guess what? Aside from a 20-30 minute introduction, life paths don't matter in this game. Yeah sure, there may be different dialogue options available to each respective life path, however, most dialogue options will lead players in the same direction and have them arrive at the same destination. And the list can go on and on. But I digress and will leave you and others with an image of changes made from the 2018 gameplay demo:
TL;DR - No, Cyberpunk 2077 was not advertised as just The Witcher 3 with guns. If CDPR had advertised the game for what it really is, then people wouldn't be rightfully shoveling shit on them right now. It's fine, I enjoy parts of the game as well. But trying to convince me that 2 plus 2 equals 10 makes you look like an ignorant asshole.
LordBlodgett
Member
Good luck proving actual deceptive actions that caused financial harm, especially with an open refund policy. They totally screwed the pooch with their launch on the base consoles, but they never actually lied about the game or what it looked like on those base consoles. No judge is going to make hyping your product illegal unless you blatantly lie
Abriael_GN
RSI Employee of the Year
Abriael_GN
RSI Employee of the Year
The developers will as well, considering the bonuses they're going to receive.
kraspkibble
Permabanned.
fucking hell this place. now the developers are gonna make loads of money with this bonus? when this was first announced months ago the narrative was "haa you're an idiot if you think the devs are gonna see any of that!"
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
The reviewers picked up base performance issues after the games came out...
hemo memo
Gold Member
Read the post again. They are selling the Ps4/Xbox versions of the game. They should work optimally for the consoles they are selling the game for. It not a laptop and this is not the PC market. If Sony release a PS1 version of a game to the market tomorrow guess what? It should work on the PS1.
BigLee74
Member
Appreciated, but you still don't have to buy a game without waiting for the reviews...
FranXico
Member
The only reason nothing was mentioned earlier was that an NDA specifically forbid reviewers from talking about the console ports.
FranXico
Member
Why are you defending a game that was announced in 2013 for last gen consoles? The game, as was originally promised, was going to target the PS4 and Xbox One. That promise did not change.
CDPR could have announced the cancellation of those ports at any moment and chose not to.
Sure, they are not the first major dev to push out garbage, but that does not excuse them.
Last edited:
Knitted Knight
Banned
Lost approved developer status which allowed them that free pass of "I'll patch it later" when the game doesn't pass cert but is given the waiver on the faith that the list of issues found in cert will be fixed by the time it arrives to consumers (on a patch). Day 1 patch didn't fix shit, and the shitstorm didn't help. Now Sony can come with the receipt and do whatever the fuck they want - like delisting. Now CDPR gotta deliver on the spot day and date. CDPR simply fucked up.
Folks just mad Sony walked up to CDPR with the Dragon Bone Smasher+5, spent 1 million souls on Strength, equipped the thief ring, and the eternal warrior ring, walked up to them no warning and smashed them to the ground.
Folks been white knighting CDPR on PC for a big while now. That's their Naughty Dog/Santa Monica for lack off. To see Sony smash them like this... it's eating a lot of folks.
Last edited:
B-universe
Banned
It's always absolutely incredible watching as so many can say so much and in such definitive terms without even including a disclaimer or two in small print. If only CDPR had done X , Y would have happened. All it would have taken was A, and B would have followed. It was greed that had them doing C, D and F, they could have perfectly delayed it another G and the game would have been great, all from people who don't know the financial obligations of the company, can' possibly know the potential contractual obligations, and therefore lack the critical information necessary to pass such pronouncements , for which they never ever provide one iota of evidence.
And there's one or two posters frothing at the mouth, at the prospect of a successful company nosediving. From the ivory tower of their moral superiority, these Children of Tomorrow have decreed big business is evil, and therefore anything that happens to big business is a personal victory , while their entire lives testify to the benefits big business has afforded them. But full refunds, the game being removed from stores, disclaimers, nothing is ever sufficient, because certain Children of Tomorrow think life should look like a Kibbutz.
It's possible this lawsuit will have serious consequences. Marketing is likely to change. And the risk of class lawsuit will have to be factored in. I suppose those frothing at the mouth will only rest when the price tag of AAA games naturally goes up, to account for the new risk. Then The Children of Tomorrow will be satisfied, as they have personally scored a decisive blow against the evil ogre of Big Business.
This is how you teach the world how to be morally virtuous and totally non-greedy: play a game for 70 hours, finish the game, ask for a refund, brag about it on a forum, have others publicly show you support.
Yup, moral edification right there.
And there's one or two posters frothing at the mouth, at the prospect of a successful company nosediving. From the ivory tower of their moral superiority, these Children of Tomorrow have decreed big business is evil, and therefore anything that happens to big business is a personal victory , while their entire lives testify to the benefits big business has afforded them. But full refunds, the game being removed from stores, disclaimers, nothing is ever sufficient, because certain Children of Tomorrow think life should look like a Kibbutz.
It's possible this lawsuit will have serious consequences. Marketing is likely to change. And the risk of class lawsuit will have to be factored in. I suppose those frothing at the mouth will only rest when the price tag of AAA games naturally goes up, to account for the new risk. Then The Children of Tomorrow will be satisfied, as they have personally scored a decisive blow against the evil ogre of Big Business.
This is how you teach the world how to be morally virtuous and totally non-greedy: play a game for 70 hours, finish the game, ask for a refund, brag about it on a forum, have others publicly show you support.
Yup, moral edification right there.
This isn't by investors as far as I can tell. This is a class action and consumers would be filing it. It would be very easy to show the financial gain. There is a recording clearly stating that they made what it cost to make the game just in preorders. What's difficult to make stick is the misrepresentation. If they can prove that they showed PC footage when selling console versions of the game for example or footage that was not representative of the final game.Funny to see the dirty vultures of mainstream press covering video games only when there's drama to have.
Also funny to see investor scum wanting CD Projekt's blood when satisfying them is basically the main reason why the whole thing happened.
Not that this is going anywhere, because for such a lawsuit to have any merit, they need to prove that the "misrepresentation" has brought financial benefits, which it obviously has not. These shitty law firms do this every time there's a problematic launch and it never goes anywhere, but hey, it makes for attractive headlines for yellow journalists.
Incidentally, some of you folks with the hate boner against CDP make me wonder if I didn't accidentally click on the purple forum (which I may very well have, since this OP was copied straight from there).
Zog
Banned
They told reviewers that they couldn't use their own footage in reviews and didn't give out any console review codes. Further, I read that they pulled down any console footage that may have appeared online. If true that shows that they went out of their way to hide console footage.
B-universe
Banned
The Children of Tomorrow think compensation is owed? To whom? For what exactly? Why isn't a full refund good enough? Compared to what standard?
And there's the fact PC leaked gameplay footage - Italian edition for example -was deleted way back as well, ages before release date. Is that evidence they were trying to hide PC footage back then? Or is it evidence of an universal no-leaks stance? The Children of Tomorrow brought pitchforks and torches and their usual inability to think straight.
And there's the fact PC leaked gameplay footage - Italian edition for example -was deleted way back as well, ages before release date. Is that evidence they were trying to hide PC footage back then? Or is it evidence of an universal no-leaks stance? The Children of Tomorrow brought pitchforks and torches and their usual inability to think straight.
Last edited:
Zog
Banned
...because fraud is illegal? You don't just get to give the money back and walk away.
Cyberpunkd
Member
This can actually be proven relatively easy - was there a massive stock sale by the management in the days leading to and around December 4th, when the stock was at its highest?
Last edited:
Abriael_GN
RSI Employee of the Year
The article says it's being considered by investors. Class actions by investors are actually pretty common basically because they accuse companies of not making them as much money as they hoped. Investors love to try to pull that stunt when businesses don't go as expected, or more precisely, shitty law firms love to bait investors into doing that.
You don't seem to have a very clear idea of what fraud is.
Last edited:
Zog
Banned
You don't think their deception amount to fraud?
B-universe
Banned
- About pre-order Bonus:
" CD Projekt Red reveals that there won't be any pre-order bonuses for Cyberpunk 2077 " (source)
.
.
.
- About pre-order bonus on PS4
"No we don't do that," "Every person that buys the game gets exactly the same in-game content, no matter if they buy in pre-orders, on release date or two years later." (source)
Cyberpunk 2077 official Twitter account
.
.
.
- About pre-ordering 2077
"Therefore, if you like what you see, we will appreciate you "voting yes" for CP2077 with a pre-order. If you are still hesitating though, we would rather you wait for more materials or reviews. " (source)
CD Projekt RED , 2019
.
.
.
- About pre-ordering the Expansion pass for TW3
“While we’re offering the Expansion Pass now, we want to make one thing clear: don’t buy it if you have any doubts,” “Wait for reviews or play The Witcher and see if you like it first. As always, it’s your call.” (source)
CD Projekt Red co-founder Marcin Iwinski
.
.
.
- About pre-ordering Cyberpunk 2077
"please wait for reviews, check whoever you trust after it launches and get their input. Not every game is for everyone, we don't have the power to change that, haha. No one is forcing you to buy the game day one and no one at CDPR wants you to be disappointed with a game you might not enjoy. "(source)
Miles Tost, level designer at CD Projekt RED
" CD Projekt Red reveals that there won't be any pre-order bonuses for Cyberpunk 2077 " (source)
.
.
.
- About pre-order bonus on PS4
"No we don't do that," "Every person that buys the game gets exactly the same in-game content, no matter if they buy in pre-orders, on release date or two years later." (source)
Cyberpunk 2077 official Twitter account
.
.
.
- About pre-ordering 2077
"Therefore, if you like what you see, we will appreciate you "voting yes" for CP2077 with a pre-order. If you are still hesitating though, we would rather you wait for more materials or reviews. " (source)
CD Projekt RED , 2019
.
.
.
- About pre-ordering the Expansion pass for TW3
“While we’re offering the Expansion Pass now, we want to make one thing clear: don’t buy it if you have any doubts,” “Wait for reviews or play The Witcher and see if you like it first. As always, it’s your call.” (source)
CD Projekt Red co-founder Marcin Iwinski
.
.
.
- About pre-ordering Cyberpunk 2077
"please wait for reviews, check whoever you trust after it launches and get their input. Not every game is for everyone, we don't have the power to change that, haha. No one is forcing you to buy the game day one and no one at CDPR wants you to be disappointed with a game you might not enjoy. "(source)
Miles Tost, level designer at CD Projekt RED
Last edited:
Abriael_GN
RSI Employee of the Year
Only people who abuse big words for effect without actually knowing what they mean would call it "fraud." Fraud is a very specific crime with very specific parameters, and releasing a product that for some is flawed while also working to fix it does not in any shape or form equate to fraud.
Last edited:
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
The way they handled reviews however with the intent to hide console footage does.
I've never seen that happen with any game before.
Jaxcellent
Member
I'm enjoying the game alot on my 4pro, hope you base owners will enjoy it too someday!
NathanDiego
Member
Deserved, they lied about the game to get big investment.
FunkMiller
Member
It’s undeniable that CDPR deliberately obfuscated in order to get people to buy a broken product, so not surprised someone is attempting legal action. Not sure there’s much that will stick however, given that they did release a product called Cyberpunk 2077 at the stated time and on the stated platforms they said they would.
The damage to them is already done in terms of reputation and refunds of sales.
Not sure I want to see them go under... but they deserve a very bloody nose for this.
The damage to them is already done in terms of reputation and refunds of sales.
Not sure I want to see them go under... but they deserve a very bloody nose for this.
Last edited:
Abriael_GN
RSI Employee of the Year
You're not entitled to see footage of any platform, and as a matter of fact, quite often you don't, with games showcased only with their best platform. Fraud would have been showing false footage, which they did not. Again. You don't know what fraud is, but hey, keep using big words improperly if it makes you feel better.
Explosive Zombie
Banned
I'm not going to sift through all the marketing and advertising materials provided in the past by CDPR just to prove you wrong because you seem to be allergic to factual information. You're more than welcome to do your own research since I can't be bothered to do your homework for you. Cyberpunk 2077 was advertised to be more than just a typical open-world action/adventure RPG game. If you truly believe otherwise, you're absolutely delusional. You and others alike may argue that players had unrealistic expectations but the truth is that CDPR set up those expectations and plugged away at the hype machine. Do you really believe Keanu Reeves was hired for his exceptional voice acting abilities? The open world in Cyberpunk 2077, however pretty it may be, does not have as much depth as a 16-year old game like GTA: San Andreas. I'll ramble on about a random list of features off the top of my head. Player customization is non-existent past the character creation screen. Car customization doesn't exist. The massive arsenal of weaponry CDPR boasted on about doesn't exist. The AI operates entirely on rails and is not dynamic. Expansive quests with branching paths and meaningful decisions don't exist since nearly 98% of all choices made by the player will lead them to the same destination. The skill system is almost pointless because anyone can breeze through the missions on even the hardest difficulty by simply deactivating cameras and stealthily incapacitating enemies. The enemy AI in this game also makes the Amazon virtual chat AI look like a genius. Progression in the "Street Cred" system is pointless because it just becomes a mediocre grind in order to acquire new items from vendors and acquiring new vehicles via text. Oh that's right, no car dealerships are present in this game because we have to purchase a car via text. Stellar! It's the year 2077 and we're still using OfferUp and Craigslist! Oh wait, what about life paths you say? Darn, guess what? Aside from a 20-30 minute introduction, life paths don't matter in this game. Yeah sure, there may be different dialogue options available to each respective life path, however, most dialogue options will lead players in the same direction and have them arrive at the same destination. And the list can go on and on. But I digress and will leave you and others with an image of changes made from the 2018 gameplay demo:
TL;DR - No, Cyberpunk 2077 was not advertised as just The Witcher 3 with guns. If CDPR had advertised the game for what it really is, then people wouldn't be rightfully shoveling shit on them right now. It's fine, I enjoy parts of the game as well. But trying to convince me that 2 plus 2 equals 10 makes you look like an ignorant asshole.
Uh... whoa... mind blown. I hadn't really been on the game's hypetrain so I didn't realize the depth of what they had done, wow.
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
You're not entitled to see footage of any platform, and as a matter of fact, quite often you don't, with games showcased only with their best platform. Fraud would have been showing false footage, which they did not. Again. You don't know what fraud is, but hey, keep using big words improperly if it makes you feel better.
Fraud is deception for financial gain. Which they did a lot of. You can continue your game of semantics but it ain't going to work on me. Have a nice day choomba.
saintjules
Member
Not always.
Zog
Banned
Are you purposely ignoring their deception?
martino
Member
i expect people to go monkey deaf and blind on this but not mute sadly.
Cyberpunk 2077 is the biggest disappointment of the decade alongside No Man Sky, but does it deserve it?
Was it done with malicious intent? Heck no. It's just rushed, thus badly optimised and quality controlled, and there's also inherently badly designed game systems, loops, crowds etc...
Was it done with malicious intent? Heck no. It's just rushed, thus badly optimised and quality controlled, and there's also inherently badly designed game systems, loops, crowds etc...
Last edited:
Astorian
Member
Of course it was, they willingly chose to hide the state of the game on consoles.
Zog
Banned
Isn't it crazy how some people are pretending this is ONLY about the bugs?
Hairsplash
Member
wow, any game released that is not finished, (preorders) could be described as “misrepresentation in order to receive financial benefits”
studios be smart, label it as a beta game... when preordering... and then after a year, the GOTY edition, call it the GOTY complete edition LOL... and charge half price, LOL, sarcasm... but sadly true... a cheap game off full price, is bug “free” and works properly... more often than not... remember “no mans sky” cheap now right?... works now right?
studios be smart, label it as a beta game... when preordering... and then after a year, the GOTY edition, call it the GOTY complete edition LOL... and charge half price, LOL, sarcasm... but sadly true... a cheap game off full price, is bug “free” and works properly... more often than not... remember “no mans sky” cheap now right?... works now right?
BadBurger
Is 'That Pure Potato'
I guess the investors have a case.
I mean, if I was a base console player I'd be pissed. The game looks and runs like shit on them, even worse then games many years older, and worse it crashes a lot. This equated to returns and poor image, and probably dashed its chances of ever selling substantial amounts of DLC on the base consoles. So investors are pissed.
I mean, if I was a base console player I'd be pissed. The game looks and runs like shit on them, even worse then games many years older, and worse it crashes a lot. This equated to returns and poor image, and probably dashed its chances of ever selling substantial amounts of DLC on the base consoles. So investors are pissed.