MisterXDTV
Member
It doesn't take a genius to understand that MS expected the TWO consoles combined to sell a lot more more units than Xbox One by itself....
Otherwise, why did they do it?
Are we denying this???
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Circana (NPD) Hardware Sales for 2022 - NSW 5830k | PS5 5660k | XBS 4480k
- Thread starter Thick Thighs Save Lives
- Start date
- Sales-Age
It doesn't take a genius to understand that MS expected the TWO consoles combined to sell a lot more more units than Xbox One by itself....
Otherwise, why did they do it?
Are we denying this???
Robb
Gold Member
And this would not be the case for Sony had they released the Ps4 and Ps4 Pro at the same time?
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MisterXDTV
Member
Who cares? Sony never did it...
Microsoft did it: they wanted to beat Sony at power AND price....
Their strategy is failing spectacularly not Sony's
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Robb
Gold Member
I don’t know. I’m just trying to figure out your SKU-argument.Who cares? Sony never did it...
Microsoft did it: they wanted to beat Sony at power AND price....
Their strategy is failing spectacularly
MisterXDTV
Member
OK, tell me another example in console's history where the same company put out TWO different consoles at the same time with significant price AND power difference....
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Robb
Gold Member
But that’s the thing I don’t understand. Why does “at the same time” matter?
Unknown?
Member
Even if that's the way you see it, it's still 2v1 because it's the only one that has a "pro" version. When the PS4 Pro came out, Sony had an advantage because Xbox didn't have the One X yet.
MisterXDTV
Member
Because in this topic we are counting sales for consoles released in the same time-frame?
Robb
Gold Member
I’m not so sure about that. Are you saying that if Sony had released the Ps5 Pro early 2022 it would not have been included in this aggregate?
I’m fairly sure that’s not the case.
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Dream-Knife
Banned
Woopah
Member
It's two models at two different price points vs. Sony's two models at different price points vs. Nintendo's three models at different price points.
Consoles having different models at different price points is normal.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
This has always been MS' biggest issue. They can't sell their console anywhere else outside of NA and the UK.
MisterXDTV
Member
Why are you insisting on something that NEVER happened in the first place?
Xbox One launched and it was 1 CONSOLE, this time they launched 2 completely different consoles...
So can I say it's 2 vs 1 or not?
For you it's the same. I'm sorry it isn't
VitoNotVito
Member
Oh it does matter because PS4 Pro was usually an upgrade/another unit to existing PS4. Rarely people bought Pro SKU as their first (and only) box
Bumblebeetuna
Member
Weird, the narrative online would have lead me to believe X|S has been getting slaughtered here for years.
MasterCornholio
Member
Well it's worse than last gen if that's what you mean.
Robb
Gold Member
Because I think you’re wrong. If Sony had released new hardware it would be counted in this aggregate as another SKU. Hence we’re not comparing “consoles released in the same time-frame”, we’re just comparing total sales over the year of all SKU’s.
Luminoth-4545
Member
With these numbers we have the complete yearly Switch numbers
2017: 4.88 million
2018: 5.64 million
2019: 6.48 million
2020: 8.98 million
2021: 7.61 million
2022: 5.83 million
Total: 39.42 million
Yearly NPD winners from 1994
1994: GEN - 3.27 million
1995: SNES - 2.32 million
1996: PS1 - 1.99 million
1997: PS1 - 5.05 million
1998: PS1 - 7.11 million
1999: GBC - 7.21 million
2000: GBC - 6.84 million
2001: PS2 - 6.18 million
2002: PS2 - 8.39 million
2003: GBA - 7.78 million
2004: GBA - 7.08 million
2005: PS2 - 5.51 million
2006: NDS - 5.32 million
2007: NDS - 8.43 million
2008: Wii - 10.17 million
2009: NDS - 11.19 million
2010: NDS - 8.58 million
2011: XB360 - 7.24 mllion
2012: XB360 - 5.31 million
2013: 3DS - 3.81 million
2014: PS4 - 4.68 million
2015: PS4 - 5.72 million
2016: PS4 - 5.10 million
2017: PS4 - 5.45 million
2018: NSW - 5.64 million
2019: NSW - 6.48 million
2020: NSW - 8.98 million
2021: NSW - 7.61 million
2022: NSW - 5.83 million
PS5 is definately going to take 2023 but can it beat the Playstation yearly record of 8.39 million by PS2? Maybe, it will need to have a new slim model and a huge November and December.
2017: 4.88 million
2018: 5.64 million
2019: 6.48 million
2020: 8.98 million
2021: 7.61 million
2022: 5.83 million
Total: 39.42 million
Yearly NPD winners from 1994
1994: GEN - 3.27 million
1995: SNES - 2.32 million
1996: PS1 - 1.99 million
1997: PS1 - 5.05 million
1998: PS1 - 7.11 million
1999: GBC - 7.21 million
2000: GBC - 6.84 million
2001: PS2 - 6.18 million
2002: PS2 - 8.39 million
2003: GBA - 7.78 million
2004: GBA - 7.08 million
2005: PS2 - 5.51 million
2006: NDS - 5.32 million
2007: NDS - 8.43 million
2008: Wii - 10.17 million
2009: NDS - 11.19 million
2010: NDS - 8.58 million
2011: XB360 - 7.24 mllion
2012: XB360 - 5.31 million
2013: 3DS - 3.81 million
2014: PS4 - 4.68 million
2015: PS4 - 5.72 million
2016: PS4 - 5.10 million
2017: PS4 - 5.45 million
2018: NSW - 5.64 million
2019: NSW - 6.48 million
2020: NSW - 8.98 million
2021: NSW - 7.61 million
2022: NSW - 5.83 million
PS5 is definately going to take 2023 but can it beat the Playstation yearly record of 8.39 million by PS2? Maybe, it will need to have a new slim model and a huge November and December.
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Unknown?
Member
Nope, not the same at all. They have different specs. You wouldn't say a notebook is just a lower priced gaming PC. Like I said, the PS4 is another good example of having two different speced consoles on the market being a benefit over the competition only having one spec.
Woopah
Member
Precisely. When NPD reports sales the timing of model releases is irrelevant.
Different SKUS are designed to help sales. Sony and MS both offered two different prices at launch to try and get higher sales.
Sony launched the PS4 Pro for the same reason Nintendo launched the GBA SP, the new 3DS or the Switch OLED.
All of those were different models, not different consoles, regardless of whether they were the same spec or not.
MisterXDTV
Member
Still, you are not answering: how exactly isn't it fair to say that launch-aligned Xbox Series vs Xbox One is 2 consoles vs 1??
Robb
Gold Member
So you’re saying Ps4 and Ps4 Pro would’ve been counted as “different consoles” had they released simultaneously?
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Woopah
Member
It would be fair to say that the Xbox Series and PS5 launched with two models available, whereas the PS4, Xbox One and Switch launched with one models available.
Unknown?
Member
The point is Microsoft is the only one with two differently speced units. Until Sony releases a Pro, they won't have the same parity. Just as they enjoyed the benefit of being the only ones with a higher speced model in 2016.
Sony just released a model with less bells and whistles like the 20gb PS3 but it played the same games. Series S does not play games the same as how series X plays them.
MisterXDTV
Member
Too bad this very topic revolves around supply constraints
Guess what:
Series S was NEVER supply limited because it's a MUCH WEAKER console than any PS5 model ever released
This alone tells you everything you need to know:
It's a damn different console
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Woopah
Member
The advantage of the S for Microsoft is its lower price, not its lower specs.
Just like how Sony benefits from the lower price of the PS5 Digital .
MisterXDTV
Member
LOL, the weaker specs ARE THE REASON WHY it was priced lower than any PS5
And the reason why Microsoft could sell a console with no supply constraints in 2021 and 2022
ByWatterson
Member
It appears that Microsoft is holding its own, until you realize they're getting slaughtered in every other territory.
Woopah
Member
And the PS4 was weaker than the PS4 Pro and the 3DS was weaker than the new 3DS.
They were two different models of the same console, just like Series A and Series X.
It would be fair to say that the Xbox Series lower price model was easier to produce in 2022 than PS4's lower price model.
MisterXDTV
Member
Woopah
Member
I'm being very clear. Products can have different specs and be different models of the same console. That's all I'm saying.
Look at the numbers from this very thread. Circana reports the Xbox Series console numbers just like they report the PS5 and Switch console numbers, with all the models combined.
If the Series S and Series X were seperate consoles, Circana would have the numbers seperate.
But they don't, showing that they are the same console.
Does that help you understand?
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ReBurn
Gold Member
You forgot the main reason. It gives console warriors ammo.
MisterXDTV
Member
It's Microsoft that WANTS to combine the sales to make the numbers look better....
Series X vs PS5 would be a bloodbath
They are never giving us that split
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Tsaki
Member
It still tracks behind the worst Xbox in history and the gap with PS5 becomes larger the further away from the 2020 launch we go.
VitoNotVito
Member
No. Where did you get this "logic" from?
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Very surprising sales for Xbox. Color me impressed.
Since then its been a bloodbath. Also, the PS5 is vastly more popular worldwide which is why they are already at 40 million units while the xbox is probably around 21-25 million despite being neck and neck in North America.
NPD 2022
PS5 US NPD HW:
Jan-22: 369K
Feb-22: 128K
Mar-22: 282K
Apr-22: 234K
May-22: 119K
Jun-22: 277K
Jul-22: 301K
Aug-22: 341K
Sep-22: 494K
Oct-22: 456K
Nov-22: 1328K
LTD as of Nov-22: 10592K
XBX US NPD HW:
Jan-22: 307K
Feb-22: 261K
Mar-22: 489K
Apr-22: 267K
May-22: 177K
Jun-22: 260K
Jul-22: 247K
Aug-22: 251K
Sep-22: 288K
Oct-22: 261K
Nov-22: 730K
LTD as of Nov-22: 8736K
2:1. Started doing that sometime around September last year when they finally fixed the stock shortage. Before that Satya Nadella had boasted about Xbox beating the PS5 3 quarters in a row in North America.
Since then its been a bloodbath. Also, the PS5 is vastly more popular worldwide which is why they are already at 40 million units while the xbox is probably around 21-25 million despite being neck and neck in North America.
NPD 2022
PS5 US NPD HW:
Jan-22: 369K
Feb-22: 128K
Mar-22: 282K
Apr-22: 234K
May-22: 119K
Jun-22: 277K
Jul-22: 301K
Aug-22: 341K
Sep-22: 494K
Oct-22: 456K
Nov-22: 1328K
LTD as of Nov-22: 10592K
XBX US NPD HW:
Jan-22: 307K
Feb-22: 261K
Mar-22: 489K
Apr-22: 267K
May-22: 177K
Jun-22: 260K
Jul-22: 247K
Aug-22: 251K
Sep-22: 288K
Oct-22: 261K
Nov-22: 730K
LTD as of Nov-22: 8736K
Woopah
Member
It has nothing to do with Microsoft's wants.
It's Microsoft that WANTS to combine the sales to make the numbers look better....
Series X vs PS5 would be a bloodbath
They are never giving us that split
NPD/Circana has always reported the combined numbers of different models. The numbers in this thread represent the combined Xbox Series models, just like they represent the combined Xbox One, PS4, PS5 and Switch models.
You won't get a PS5 vs. Series X split just like you won't get a PS5 vs. Switch OLED split or a Switch. vs. PS5 Digital split.
That's not how they do things, and neither does GfK or GSD.
Robb
Gold Member
That was the topic I was arguing with the other user.
Luminoth-4545
Member
With these numbers we have the full lifetime NPD sales of PS4 and XBO.
Playstation 4
2013: PS4 - 2.00 million
2014: PS4 - 4.68 million
2015: PS4 - 5.72 million
2016: PS4 - 5.10 million
2017: PS4 - 5.42 million
2018: PS4 - 5.29 million
2019: PS4 - 3.83 million
2020: PS4 - 2.07 million
2021: PS4 - 0.60 million
2022: PS4 - 0.05 million
Total: PS4 - 34.76 million
Xbox One
2013: XBO - 1.82 million
2014: XBO - 4.37 million
2015: XBO - 4.93 million
2016: XBO - 4.73 million
2017: XBO - 4.28 million
2018: XBO - 4.36 million
2019: XBO - 3.04 million
2020: XBO - 1.46 million
2021: XBO - 0.01 million
Total: XBO - 29.00 million
Playstaion 4 v Playstation 5
2013: PS4 - 2.00 million 2020: PS5 - 1.96 million
2014: PS4 - 4.68 million 2021: PS5 - 4.28 million
2015: PS4 - 5.72 million 2022: PS5 - 5.66 million
2016: PS4 - 5.10 million 2023: PS5 - ???
Xbox One v Xbox Series
2013: XBO - 1.82 million 2020: XBS - 1.49 million
2014: XBO - 4.37 million 2021: XBS - 3.73 million
2015: XBO - 4.93 million 2022: XBS - 4.48 million
2016: XBO - 4.73 million 2023: XBS - ???
For 2023 versus 2016 the PS5 will be massively up on PS4's 5.10 million and XBS will struggle to match XBO's 4.73 million.
Playstation 4
2013: PS4 - 2.00 million
2014: PS4 - 4.68 million
2015: PS4 - 5.72 million
2016: PS4 - 5.10 million
2017: PS4 - 5.42 million
2018: PS4 - 5.29 million
2019: PS4 - 3.83 million
2020: PS4 - 2.07 million
2021: PS4 - 0.60 million
2022: PS4 - 0.05 million
Total: PS4 - 34.76 million
Xbox One
2013: XBO - 1.82 million
2014: XBO - 4.37 million
2015: XBO - 4.93 million
2016: XBO - 4.73 million
2017: XBO - 4.28 million
2018: XBO - 4.36 million
2019: XBO - 3.04 million
2020: XBO - 1.46 million
2021: XBO - 0.01 million
Total: XBO - 29.00 million
Playstaion 4 v Playstation 5
2013: PS4 - 2.00 million 2020: PS5 - 1.96 million
2014: PS4 - 4.68 million 2021: PS5 - 4.28 million
2015: PS4 - 5.72 million 2022: PS5 - 5.66 million
2016: PS4 - 5.10 million 2023: PS5 - ???
Xbox One v Xbox Series
2013: XBO - 1.82 million 2020: XBS - 1.49 million
2014: XBO - 4.37 million 2021: XBS - 3.73 million
2015: XBO - 4.93 million 2022: XBS - 4.48 million
2016: XBO - 4.73 million 2023: XBS - ???
For 2023 versus 2016 the PS5 will be massively up on PS4's 5.10 million and XBS will struggle to match XBO's 4.73 million.
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MisterXDTV
Member
Great result with two consoles combined and the cheaper one selling for like $200
Tsaki
Member
Did it actually have a $200 firesale, or is that a $250 + extra controller?Great result with two consoles combined and the cheaper one selling for like $200
MisterXDTV
Member
I remember a $250 with a $50 gift card included at some point
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Woopah
Member
It will be fascinating to see what happens in 2024.
Potentially that could be PS5's peak year (unless 2023 is) and if we don't start seeing the ABK/Zeninax acquisitions having an effect then Xbox Series sales could decline even more, leading to an even wider gap.
Unfortunately ms only hope is games and they better have some unannounced games ready , another doom/quake and gears of war should be ready soon ishin, but they'll need more
El Pistolero
Banned
Yes, you are, this is the NPD numbers.
MasterCornholio
Member
Not sure what the arguing is about.
Series X + Series S + Series S 1TB vs PS5 + PS5 DE
That's basically what's available for consumers to buy at this moment. Sales are not going to be broken down between all those different models. If the PS5 outsells the Series that means it sells more than all the systems they offer to consumers. It's as simple as that.
Series X + Series S + Series S 1TB vs PS5 + PS5 DE
That's basically what's available for consumers to buy at this moment. Sales are not going to be broken down between all those different models. If the PS5 outsells the Series that means it sells more than all the systems they offer to consumers. It's as simple as that.
Woopah
Member
Thank you! I don't understand why this is a point of argument.
squarealex
Member
I'm not gonna lie, that's a good number for Xbox with 0 Xbox Games Studios outside Halo Infinite / Forza Horizon 3.7
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