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Cops suing NYPD say police use quotas, and it’s making the subways more dangerous

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E

Enzom21

Member
Original story:
http://www.nbcnewyork.com/investiga...ive-Interview-Pressure-Numbers-374077091.html
Officer Derick Waller told the I-Team, "At the end of the month, these officers who don’t have that arrest or those few summonses, they’re pressured to find something. You might not see anything but you go hunting, like bounty hunting for an arrest, locking up some old guy, some homeless guy, finding someone who’s spitting on the sidewalk, and you bring them in."
Officer Adhyl Polanco added, "The problem is, when you go hunting, when you put any type of numbers on a police officer to perform, we are going to go for the most vulnerable. Of course, we’re going to go for the LGBT community, we’re going to the black community, we’re going to those that have no vote, that have no power.”
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Full story:
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york...-nypd-police-quotas-arrests-article-1.2549579
Police Commissioner Bill Bratton can claim there’s no quotas for cops until he’s NYPD blue in the face — but that doesn’t make it true, current and former officers said Tuesday.

“I've been a cop for eight years and in the last eight years I've unfortunately witnessed this quota destroy lives,” Police Officer Edwin Raymond said.

Raymond is one of 12 minority officers suing the NYPD, alleging the department continues to use numbers-driven police tactics — and stunts the careers of officers who have spoken out against the policy.
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Full story and video at the link:
http://www.nbcnewyork.com/investiga...here-Are-Quotas-I-Team-Wallace-374307721.html

An NYPD lieutenant is the latest active-duty cop to say that the department still uses arrest and summons quotas, despite a 2010 state ban on the practice and a denial from the city's top cop.
The lieutenant, who asked not to be identified for fear of retaliation, told the I-Team that the 10 active-duty cops in a federal class-action lawsuit against the NYPD who came forward this week "were telling the truth" about the illegal practice.

“There is still a quota system within the NYPD,” the lieutenant said.
In an interview with the I-Team that aired Thursday, the 10 officers in the suit said that the NYPD still pursues quotas and punishes officers who don't hit numerical goals. The NYPD has repeatedly denied that quotas exist but that the department expects officers "to do their jobs."

The lieutenant, who is not part of the class-action suit, said cops are under constant pressure to meet quota numbers and that officers who don't hit numbers are refered to as "zeros."
"You know, every time I get called in the captain’s office, it’s 'one of your cops is a zero,'” the lieutenant said.

Top NYPD officials have repeatedly denied the I-Team's requests for comments, but NYPD Commissioner Bill Bratton responded to Raymond's claims in February by calling them "bullshit."
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Youtube version of the interviews:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySCUKsarOCA
Officer Adhyl Polanco:
If we start doing what we are doing in Midtown Manhattan, a call to phone call to the mayor’s office is going to be made. That’s going to be the end of it.
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M

mugurumakensei

Member
Quotas are very real. You don't get fired, but you get desk work and overlooked for promotions.

I know this cause I once worked in a position where I was aware of the inner workings of a police department in my area.

This isn't really unique to New York. This is common in police departments across the U.S.
 
T

TheOfficeMut

Unconfirmed Member
11yokg.jpg
 
entremet

entremet

Member
mugurumakensei said:
Officially, police quotas are illegal in most place.
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But there are no ramification for not following that it seems lol. Basically, just institute an organization wide gag order via intimidation. My cousin is a cop in the NYPD and he has never admitted that a quota was in place. He's obviously drinking the Kool-Aid but I doubt he wants to be known as a whistleblower.
 
A

akira28

Member
Quotas are real, and every time I hear the "official answer" its an insult to the intelligence of the listener.
 
M

mugurumakensei

Member
entremet said:
But there are no ramification for not following that it seems lol. Basically, just institute an organization wide gag order via intimidation. My cousin is a cop in the NYPD and he has never admitted that a quota was in place. He's obviously drinking the Kool-Aid but I doubt he wants to be known as a whistleblower.
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Not enough officers willing to come forward as being a whistle blower means your career prospects are nil once word gets out that you are the whistle blower.
 
P

Piecake

Member
Shaanyboi said:
Most criminal organizations probably have target numbers they want to hit.
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Just like most businesses.

Of course, that comparison doesnt shine a favorable light on Police either because who the fuck wants the people who are supposed to be protecting and serving you be concerned about meeting their arrest and ticket quotas?
 
M

mugurumakensei

Member
Piecake said:
Just like most businesses.

Of course, that comparison doesnt shine a favorable light on Police either because who the fuck wants the people who are supposed to be protecting and serving you be concerned about meeting their arrest and ticket quotas?
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It basically gives an incentive to officers overscrutinize people. As well, it's to the officers' advantage for crime to persist in an area as it's easier to meet your quota.
 
J

Jharp

Member
I've heard pretty rough things about what the NYPD does to people causing internal dissent, especially in a public way.

These guys must have balls of steel.
 
E

Enzom21

Member
Gallbaro said:
In a city of 8 million and police force of 35k, how else do you make sure cops are working without quotas?

Quotas are not the problem, how they set them is.
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No, quotas are always bad. If a beat cop doesn't encounter any criminals during their patrol, don't you think they will look for any petty shit to meet said quotas?
 
T

The Llama

Member
I work with cops in philly and they say NYC uses quotas for promotion and such. I don't think it's really a secret at this point.
 
M

Mammoth Jones

Member
Gallbaro said:
In a city of 8 million and police force of 35k, how else do you make sure cops are working without quotas?

Quotas are not the problem, how they set them is.
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Cops can do their job and not arrest/ticket people. Also they have discretion for many minor offenses.

"Hey I'll give you a chance to turn around and put money in for your subway fare"

Vs

"Just saw you try to hop the turnstiles....ticket time!"
 
G

Gallbaro

Banned
Mammoth Jones said:
Cops can do their job and not arrest/ticket people. Also they have discretion for many minor offenses.

"Hey I'll give you a chance to turn around and put money in for your subway fare"

Vs

"Just saw you try to hop the turnstiles....ticket time!"
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And they do depending on your skin color.

The actual application of statistics (quotas), giving cops relevant statistics whose goals are set by public policy, go along way to making sure bias is removed.

Make no mistake this is the union, not suing on behalf of the disenfranchised, but rather using a media friendly term to try and prevent anyone from having the gall to manage their gangsters.
 
M

Maximo

Member
Gallbaro said:
In a city of 8 million and police force of 35k, how else do you make sure cops are working without quotas?

Quotas are not the problem, how they set them is.
Click to expand...

There was a video of a cop outright admitting himself and other officers often go to the poorer parts of the city to get their quotas, even cops who patrol richer neighborhoods they would go out of the way and book known areas that had the most trouble, if there was no trouble they would make it up and book (often black people) anyway.
 
G

Gallbaro

Banned
Maximo said:
There was a video of a cop outright admitting himself and other officers often go to the poorer parts of the city to get their quotas, even cops who patrol richer neighborhoods they would go out of the way and book known areas that had the most trouble, if there was no trouble they would make it up and book (often black people) anyway.
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Sounds like something that could easily be fixed with public policy and another quota.

% arrest of black people should not exceed their population for the area assigned to that patrolman.

What you are referring to is a failure of public policy and not a failure statistics.
 
D

Dead Man

Member
Gallbaro said:
In a city of 8 million and police force of 35k, how else do you make sure cops are working without quotas?

Quotas are not the problem, how they set them is.
Click to expand...

Using what amounts to KPI's for arrest volumes is not the answer. It's not like a sales job where more sales are almost always better.
 
G

Guevara

Member
Of course they use quotas, it's the lazy way to manage a large organization.

It's hard to measure progress against a general goal like: make NYC safer (which is what should be the goal, obviously)

It's easy to measure an arbitrary bullshit goal like: make 4M arrests/stops per year, divided by 35,000 cops = each cop makes 10 stops per month, or whatever.
 
V

Viewt

Member
Yeah, it's a big problem. The worst part isn't even being sidelined and blocked from promotions. They'll actively send you around to the worst neighborhoods, and let you know that "it may take a while to get back to you if you need backup."

It's fucking crazy how corrupt this practice is. This American Life did a great story on it some years ago.
 
G

Gentleman Jack

Member
Viewt said:
Yeah, it's a big problem. The worst part isn't even being sidelined and blocked from promotions. They'll actively send you around to the worst neighborhoods, and let you know that "it may take a while to get back to you if you need backup."

It's fucking crazy how corrupt this practice is. This American Life did a great story on it some years ago.
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Yes, they really fucked Adrian Schoolcraft over to prevent the story of police quotas and harassment of minorities from gaining credibility. They had him involuntarily institutionalized and destroyed his life rather than admit for one second they were a racist, corrupt organization.

No good cops.
 
Ploid 3.0

Ploid 3.0

Member
kame-sennin said:
In the video, the cop even called the NYPD a mafia.
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That's too nice a word for them. Gangsters, and thugs are more appropriate. They would probably like mafia. (the system of bad cops forcing good at heart cops to go along with their way of doing things)
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
What's the primary departmental goal of quotas? To make it look like you're being useful?
 
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