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DF Retro: Doom - Every Console Port Tested!
- Thread starter LordOfLore
- Start date
EmCeeGramr
Member
Been waiting so long for this and it's worth it, even if it's stuff I mostly know by heart already. Hard to believe that my first version of Doom was the SNES one of all things.
Speaking of which, there's actually footage of SNES Doom online deathmatch via XBAND - for some reason, it disables the sound effects, leaving only music.
Speaking of which, there's actually footage of SNES Doom online deathmatch via XBAND - for some reason, it disables the sound effects, leaving only music.
forknknife
Banned
Great video. Reminded me that I should play Doom 64. Has it ever been available on virtual console?
mugurumakensei
Member
https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/2734705?hl=en
From this, it seems like you can edit automatic captions.
It seems it works the same as editing normal captions.
forknknife
Banned
EmCeeGramr
Member
I don't think it's ever been available anywhere. I assume Midway going under has something to do with it, but who knows?
mattwhite924
Member
I've been looking forward to this episode ever since John first hinted at it. I'm fascinated with Doom ports, and I've been slowly buying up as many of them as I can.
So here's some minor interesting things that weren't mentioned in the episode.
Doom 1 and 2 on the 360 play music slightly slower than they should. It took me a while to notice this, but comparing it to the PS3 and DOS versions makes it clear that it was the odd one out.
The Activision versions of Doom on 360 do still have the red cross on health packs. Just a minor detail, and you can't even play that version unless you happen to still have it installed, but it's something. It would also lock up the 360 if you tried to exit the game from the menu, so you'd have to exit from the guide instead.
The 32X version contains the BFG9000, and mentions it in the instructions, however you can't actually get it in the game, since they don't include any of the levels where it's available. To get it you have to use cheat codes.
The original Xbox version allows for button combinations to activate cheats. Unfortunately they used combinations that are fairly easy to accidentally activate while playing normally. You have to consciously avoid activating them if you want to play without cheats.
The PS1 version's lighting is amazing, however it does make some parts of levels near impossible to see. I've tried it on multiple TVs, both CRT and LCD, and messed with brightness, and still can't make out much.
This is more of an opinion, but the iPad version is terrible. The controls are the worst part. There's several options, but none of them feel natural. It filters the textures and sprites, which I think hurts the look of the game. I also don't think it's been updated in a while. I've got a feeling it won't work once they disable 32bit apps.
So here's some minor interesting things that weren't mentioned in the episode.
Doom 1 and 2 on the 360 play music slightly slower than they should. It took me a while to notice this, but comparing it to the PS3 and DOS versions makes it clear that it was the odd one out.
The Activision versions of Doom on 360 do still have the red cross on health packs. Just a minor detail, and you can't even play that version unless you happen to still have it installed, but it's something. It would also lock up the 360 if you tried to exit the game from the menu, so you'd have to exit from the guide instead.
The 32X version contains the BFG9000, and mentions it in the instructions, however you can't actually get it in the game, since they don't include any of the levels where it's available. To get it you have to use cheat codes.
The original Xbox version allows for button combinations to activate cheats. Unfortunately they used combinations that are fairly easy to accidentally activate while playing normally. You have to consciously avoid activating them if you want to play without cheats.
The PS1 version's lighting is amazing, however it does make some parts of levels near impossible to see. I've tried it on multiple TVs, both CRT and LCD, and messed with brightness, and still can't make out much.
This is more of an opinion, but the iPad version is terrible. The controls are the worst part. There's several options, but none of them feel natural. It filters the textures and sprites, which I think hurts the look of the game. I also don't think it's been updated in a while. I've got a feeling it won't work once they disable 32bit apps.
Thank you John for this fascinating video!
One thing that you didn't mention that surprised me is the differences of the PS3/360 version regarding the soundtrack. (Especially since you made many audio comparisons between versions during the video.)
I specifically remember that because me and a friend respectively bought BFG Edition at launch for each console and played it on the same night, I couldn't not hear the difference in pitch/rythm that his 360 version had while my PS3 version was actually accurate.
One thing that you didn't mention that surprised me is the differences of the PS3/360 version regarding the soundtrack. (Especially since you made many audio comparisons between versions during the video.)
I specifically remember that because me and a friend respectively bought BFG Edition at launch for each console and played it on the same night, I couldn't not hear the difference in pitch/rythm that his 360 version had while my PS3 version was actually accurate.
Sad Affleck
Member
God, those framerates. Abysmal.
Boards of Canada
Member
YouTube's auto-captions are literally the worst.
Early on you said that the vertical autoaim is due to the game being 2D at heart, but I think there's more to it than that, and it was intentionally put in the game. When the autoaim is triggered, and when enemies attack you projectiles do actually angle up and down, and you can dodge them by going under(or over?) them. So the game can't just be interpreting everything as the same height, since it must be aware of the players and enemies height values, along with the projectiles.
It does seem to intuitively make sense, since Doom is really a 2D game right? (not exactly) And so it must consequently treat everything as 2D... But I actually think the autoaim is an important component of the game's combat. Maybe it was put in to compensate for the joysticks and keyboard only setups people used for games in the early 90s, but I think helps the pace of combat significantly.
It does seem to intuitively make sense, since Doom is really a 2D game right? (not exactly) And so it must consequently treat everything as 2D... But I actually think the autoaim is an important component of the game's combat. Maybe it was put in to compensate for the joysticks and keyboard only setups people used for games in the early 90s, but I think helps the pace of combat significantly.
GrantDaNasty
Member
I figure he said "ghouls" and Youtube's captioning AI did not catch it, as it is a bit muted.
I think it was more just a byproduct of the engine limitations. As the DOOM engine does not support Perspective Correction, and all textures will become warped if the viewangle is shifted up or down.
Enemy projectiles were probably easier to allow angling for, but to keep the textures from warping, the player cannot move their viewpoint vertically and all aiming will hit any object in the center of your screen if not behind an existing object such as a wall or misc. object.
nkarafo
Member
Here's another one:
Jaguar version tries to justify it's unstable multiplayer LAN connection in the manual. It claims the game is taking place in Hell so there is interference during high data transfers.
Ruud_Luiten
Member
Jaguar is amazing!!! <3
Yep the more you examine it the harder it becomes to fix it lol
GrantDaNasty
Member
If someone has a scan of the manual specifying this, I would be so grateful, cause that is incredible.
Edit: just looked it up, this is incredible.
https://atariage.com/manual_page.ph...oftwareLabelID=1078&maxPages=30¤tPage=9
Ah.. maybe you're right. I forgot vertical mouselook doesn't work well in the engine. Did any commercial doom engine games ever have it though (regardless of distortion) ?
Well, either way does that mean that the game works that way inherently? Or would they still have to add logic for the vertical autoaim? I tried looking through the source earlier to see if I could find the relevant function for it, but wasn't able to.
nkarafo
Member
Page 10
http://www.gamesdatabase.org/Media/SYSTEM/Atari_Jaguar//Manual/formated/Doom_-_Atari.pdf
Edit: Oh you found a pic, nice.
Diablohead
Member
It's great as a remix of doom, the ps1 version feels slower to play as in take your time and not hold sprint everywhere edition, the atmosphere does that.
Cute Dragon Here
Member
Great video, and it's actually pretty interesting to be able to see an actual video comparison between all the ports.
Have to say that the video did get a bit nauseous to watch, though, especially with the ports that are high-detail and very low-frame rate (so the 3DO, 32X, and Saturn ports - oddly enough, the SNES port didn't have the same effect)
One does wonder if the SNES port might have run faster if it were based on the Jaguar version...
Have to say that the video did get a bit nauseous to watch, though, especially with the ports that are high-detail and very low-frame rate (so the 3DO, 32X, and Saturn ports - oddly enough, the SNES port didn't have the same effect)
One does wonder if the SNES port might have run faster if it were based on the Jaguar version...
PensivePen
Member
Nice breakdown. I like the CRT shots, but they really could be at a much better angle for showing them off.
I really love the remixes in the 3DO version, they have a really different mood to them than the music in any other version of the game even though they're based on the original compositions.
I also have a real soft spot for the bonus episode No Rest for the Living, which was exclusive to the XBLA version of Doom 2 up until the release of Doom 3 BFG edition.
I really love the remixes in the 3DO version, they have a really different mood to them than the music in any other version of the game even though they're based on the original compositions.
I also have a real soft spot for the bonus episode No Rest for the Living, which was exclusive to the XBLA version of Doom 2 up until the release of Doom 3 BFG edition.
Agent X
Gold Member
Great job, John! You really knocked this out of the park.
There was evidently a great deal of attention that went into making these videos. I'm impressed that you produced it in three days. The quality of the video capture, along with your commentary, makes for a definitive comparison of all the console versions.
You've also done a commendable job of describing aspects of each version's development, along with their high points and low points. It makes you appreciate the work that went on behind the scenes, even if the end result didn't meet expectations.
I put a great deal of time into the Jaguar and PlayStation versions, both of which I got a soon as they were released. I didn't have an IBM PC compatible computer at the time (the Amiga was my computer of choice during that period), so these versions were certainly welcome. I still play both of them occasionally. I'd love to see the PlayStation version released on PSN as a downloadable game.
There was evidently a great deal of attention that went into making these videos. I'm impressed that you produced it in three days. The quality of the video capture, along with your commentary, makes for a definitive comparison of all the console versions.
You've also done a commendable job of describing aspects of each version's development, along with their high points and low points. It makes you appreciate the work that went on behind the scenes, even if the end result didn't meet expectations.
I put a great deal of time into the Jaguar and PlayStation versions, both of which I got a soon as they were released. I didn't have an IBM PC compatible computer at the time (the Amiga was my computer of choice during that period), so these versions were certainly welcome. I still play both of them occasionally. I'd love to see the PlayStation version released on PSN as a downloadable game.
jipewithin
Member
Great video
BFIB
Member
This was friggin' amazing. I cannot even begin to describe my appreciation for this channel.
My DOOM story. I was 13, went over to a friends house (who had a PC, the only person I knew that had one), and he showed me DOOM. I was in awe, and its all I thought about. I wanted to play it so badly, that when I saw in GamePro that DOOM was porting to the SNES, I scoured over anything and everything I could find. I saved every cent I could, and bought it on release day. The port may have been shit in hindsight, but for me, I had DOOM. Also, that red cartridge was the GOAT.
My DOOM story. I was 13, went over to a friends house (who had a PC, the only person I knew that had one), and he showed me DOOM. I was in awe, and its all I thought about. I wanted to play it so badly, that when I saw in GamePro that DOOM was porting to the SNES, I scoured over anything and everything I could find. I saved every cent I could, and bought it on release day. The port may have been shit in hindsight, but for me, I had DOOM. Also, that red cartridge was the GOAT.
This was a great fucking video (excuse my language).
Thanks for the fantastic work Mr. Linneman.
I have the Saturn copy of Doom and can only play for like 20 minutes at a time because it gives me headaches. That fast shotgun, though. I've been considering getting a copy of the PSX version, but I don't think I'd ever play it. I still play through the Xbox 360 version quite often on my Xbox One, though (along with Zandronum and Chocolate Doom source ports on PC). The first Activision release of Doom on 360 had the cross on the medkits which was changed for the Bethesda release, but they changed it for Doom 2 (or maybe it was the other way around?)
Thanks for the fantastic work Mr. Linneman.
I have the Saturn copy of Doom and can only play for like 20 minutes at a time because it gives me headaches. That fast shotgun, though. I've been considering getting a copy of the PSX version, but I don't think I'd ever play it. I still play through the Xbox 360 version quite often on my Xbox One, though (along with Zandronum and Chocolate Doom source ports on PC). The first Activision release of Doom on 360 had the cross on the medkits which was changed for the Bethesda release, but they changed it for Doom 2 (or maybe it was the other way around?)
I was wondering if he was going to "cheat" and add in Doom 64 since that's a different game.
mugurumakensei
Member
It's assumed it's in legal limbo due to midway's involvement and dissolution.
I'm not sure about Doom engine specifically, but it was done in similar renderers. Marathon basically just vertically scrolls the projection to fake vertical look. Imagine rendering the game with a very high vertical FoV, and cropping a slice from it depending on the camera "tilt." The caveat is basically that vertex locations get distorted as "tilt" increases.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
I had noticed how poorly Doom 2 levels ran on PS1. I always just chalked it up to some vague notion of "well those levels were more wide open" but its great to now know there was a specific reason why Doom 1 levels performed better. Had no idea how important the Jaguar version was.
That would be one heck of an Easter egg.
This got me searching for more info on homebrew, etc, and I just found out someone ported DOOM 64 to the 32X lol
EDIT: I shouldn't say ported, but remade it using the 32X's engine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9a2bOXHzIAw
EDIT: I shouldn't say ported, but remade it using the 32X's engine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9a2bOXHzIAw
Yes, you're right. The reason is that since PS3 lacks HDCP support, I had to hook it up differently and couldn't capture the sound so I didn't have anything to use for comparison. I managed to get that footage inserted at 10pm last night before finishing up the video! There's a lot of extra things I would like to have covered but, hey.
I owned SNES DOOM, really enjoyed it. I also had the PC version but our PC was a 386SX (with 5MB RAM!) and we had to use a special boot sequence to leave enough extended memory available to play it. Didn't have a sound blaster so we just had PC Speaker.
Needless to say, I have a pretty high tolerance for low framerates.
Thanks to DF for doing this!
Needless to say, I have a pretty high tolerance for low framerates.
Thanks to DF for doing this!
mikezilla2
Member
goldenpp72
Member
Is there a reason Doom 64 is so dark? I remember quitting my playthrough for it and see it's the same here. Great video though!