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[StuBurns]

Seems decent on both, disappointing to see it not locked on PS4 though.

I don't get the article complaints, it's pretty clear, if you want IQ, get one, if you want performance get the other, the raw data is there if you want to ignore the advice and make your own decision.

And the Jak games were 60...

 

[Kinthalis]

I definitley noticed the better shadows, foiliage and IQ on PC after playing the game on the Xbone.

While 60 FPs is really nice, and I prefer it, I also didn't mind 30 FPS on the consoles for this particular title.

Still, It looks like a year after release consoles are already running games on the medium-high equivalent PC settings and at 30 FPS. Was that the same case last gen?

 

[twobear]

Is upscaling really much worse on LCD than Plasma? I guess that explains why 900p isn't the total shitshow on my Panny Plasma that everyone on GAF claims it should be?

 

[Qassim]

sounds like noone has the senses needed then

go read the OT

count on one hand the amount of framerate mentions you will read about, if you read anything about framerate at all outside of the cutscene stuff

This is a tech analysis which uses captured data to back up its claims. Your anecdotal evidence is irrelevant.

 

[kitch9]

LOL! This is getting ridiculous, so we're gonna ignore framerate counter in the videos and just accuse dark10s of lying?

They imply that you should make a purchasing decision based on that framerate counter and not how it actually affects the end user through the controller and visually.

Personally I find scaling artifacts and the blurring it generates to be very noticable but they seem to make light of this whilst highlighting fps issues that can only be spotted with help from a machine.

It stands out a mile that BF4 isn't native on the PS4.

 

[onanie]

A good six or seven, I'd say. I played it pretty hardcore when I received it and made it to the same area as the XO version.

What happens with performance in the next 20 hours of the game?

 

[virtualS]

This has to be a joke. What is happening to GAF lately.
It drops 1-2 frames for SECONDS in SOME places/actions. This is a 40 hour game. Probably all framedrops added up are like 5 minutes.
I really can't believe anyone in the world would be annoyed by this so much, that they prefer 40 hours of 900p with less details (if they own both consoles).

Exactly.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

PS4 version definitely has some minor framerate drops here and there (I tend to mostly notice it running around outside of Skyhold), but it's such a minor thing.

 

[bryehn]

Not surprised about the performance on X1, game play is smooth and the game isn't exactly a looker. That cutscene stuttering though

Still, I've already sunk 10 hours in over two days of play. It's a pretty great game overall and should chew up a lot of my winter gaming time.

 

[Synth]

I mean, it's not just a different gaming site that is having a different experience to yours. Several other posters have not noticed this very regular frame-rate dips, outside of cutscenes.

There were plenty of people on GAF that also told me they didn't notice frame drops in Bayonetta 2, so they don't exist. If those other posters would like to go run some analysis on the game like dark10x has, and come back and present it, then I may take their claims seriously. Just because you don't notice something does not mean other people won't. It just means they fall squarely into the very clearly defined group of people who "don't mind minor frame-rate dips and feel that image quality is most important". Luckily the article already has them covered.

 

[IAmRandom31]

This is a tech analysis which uses captured data to back up its claims. Your anecdotal evidence is irrelevant.

right

everyone actually playing the game for dozens of hours not mentioning massive tearing across 1/4th of the screen along with frequent framerate dips is just everyone else being dillusional or incapable of noticing things like this on their own without technical equipment lol

but as Dark said, it IS noticeable.

I dunno how I am missing all these tears and drops. I must have one of them magical TV's

And you can't go back and say ... oh well its very infrequent. Nah you just told someone to go buy the X1 version because it is better because it is " solid 30fps ". Hinting, or outright saying, that the framerate on the PS4 version is actually bad enough to warrant skipping the version for another. Which in my eyes is utter BS. Being someone who is actually playing the game, and has been since it launched. And all those other people in the OT ... those hundreds of others who have been talking about the game since it hit without ever mentioning massive tears across the top of the screen or these gameplay ruining framerate drops.

 

[kitch9]

Is upscaling really much worse on LCD than Plasma? I guess that explains why 900p isn't the total shitshow on my Panny Plasma that everyone on GAF claims it should be?

The tv won't be doing the scaling, the console will.

 

[BigTnaples]

The resolution difference is huge, and constant. While the FPS difference is small and rare.

By the numbers.
PS4 version for me all the way.

 

[HighResTomato]

1080p/900p

locked 30fps
30fps with regular frame drops. (it's not a 1fps drop like some would like to claim, nevertheless it drops frames.)

That simple.

 

[twobear]

The tv won't be doing the scaling, the console will.

Oh.

 

[dark10x]

Is upscaling really much worse on LCD than Plasma? I guess that explains why 900p isn't the total shitshow on my Panny Plasma that everyone on GAF claims it should be?

Here's the thing, while the game is still being upscaled by the console, plasmas do feature different sub-pixel structures due to the use of phosphors. Sub-pixels in a plasma are slightly softer due to the nature of phosphors while LCD elements are completely rigid in comparison. I believe this plays a role in the final image. From a normal viewing distance plasmas are still very sharp but, when viewed from very close proximity, you can clearly see that the individual phosphors are a bit softer than LCD sub-pixels and use a different structure.

Then you add in better motion resolution and superior black levels and you just have a better display for games and movies.

Now, for desktop work, plasmas suck but that was never their intended use. That's why OLED displays are so exciting as it brings the best of both worlds and improves upon them.

So I agree that 900p looks less bad on a good plasma due to the nature of the display. Viewing the same content on one of my LCD monitors (or a TV) produces inferior results for sure.

 

[cheezcake]

Seems decent on both, disappointing to see it not locked on PS4 though.

I don't get the article complaints, it's pretty clear, if you want IQ, get one, if you want performance get the other, the raw data is there if you want to ignore the advice and make your own decision.

And the Jak games were 60...

It really is clear as day. It's ironic that if most of the people claiming bias had their way only then would the article actually become biased.

 

[Chobel]

I like the hat.

Thanks! Get it from here http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=937561

damn...

Do they have killer sales?

I dunno, sorry. I usually buy Origin games day one.

 

[prag16]

Ugh. The tearing in the PS4 version would bother me. It's not THAT horrible in this case, but still distracting. HATE tearing. A little more IQ don't mean shit imo if it causes some chugging with tearing.

 

[kitch9]

The resolution difference is huge, and constant. While the FPS difference is small and rare.

By the numbers.
PS4 version for me all the way.

Exactly, one version is 900p all the time, one drops frames for much less than 1 percent of the time.

Ultimately both versions drop frames.

 

[cheezcake]

Here's the thing, while the game is still being upscaled by the console, plasmas do feature different sub-pixel structures due to the use of phosphors. Sub-pixels in a plasma are slightly softer due to the nature of phosphors while LCD elements are completely rigid in comparison. I believe this plays a role in the final image. From a normal viewing distance plasmas are still very sharp but, when viewed from very close proximity, you can clearly see that the individual phosphors are a bit softer than LCD sub-pixels and use a different structure.

Then you add in better motion resolution and superior black levels and you just have a better display for games and movies.

Now, for desktop work, plasmas suck but that was never their intended use. That's why OLED displays are so exciting as it brings the best of both worlds and improves upon them.

How are projectors in this regard? pretty curious

 

[QaaQer]

Is upscaling really much worse on LCD than Plasma? I guess that explains why 900p isn't the total shitshow on my Panny Plasma that everyone on GAF claims it should be?

I really notice it when going from my Sony lcd to my Panasonic plasma wrt DVDs and sub1080 mkvs.

How are projectors in this regard? pretty curious

I'd also like to know, I've heard burn in is a real problem though.

 

[Qassim]

Jesus christ people, are we reading the same article?

If you don't mind minor frame-rate dips and feel that image quality is most important, it's easy to recommend the PS4 version. However, those looking for the most stable experience should instead opt for the Xbox One version. It's clear that neither console version is quite perfect but the level of graphical accomplishment and performance are an enormous improvement over every other BioWare console title we've played.

This seems like a completely reasonable thing to say. It isn't saying the Xbox One version is absolutely the best, it's saying if you value a more stable frame rate (for instance if you have higher sensitivities to frame rate dips), then they should go for the XB1 version.

If you're not as sensitive or you value higher image quality, and the article is clearly leaving that possibility open, then go for the PS4 version.

The way people are talking in here is as if the article is refusing to believe anyone would prefer the PS4 version or that other people have different priorities. When in fact the conclusion is based around the idea that some people have different preferences.

 

[dark10x]

How are projectors in this regard? pretty curious

Well, LCD based projectors suffer the same flaws as any LCD and DLPs appear similarly rigid. Plus, black levels are obviously not going to be on par with a plasma or OLED.

 

[lukeskymac]

I wouldn't use an LCD-TV. If my plasma died I'd buy an OLED. The market is awful - thanks for rubbing salt in the wounds.

If I were sitting at a desk in front of a 1080p LCD I'd probably go for the PS4 version. It's still a solid release.

What you're ignoring here, though, is that, if I had to choose which one to buy, I'd buy the PC version. Plain and simple.

Slightly OT here, but in how many years do you guys suppose we'll see Quantum Dot displays make it to the market? I'm planning on going full-on insane next time I redo my system from near-scratch. Going 4K, absolute contrast, NV-Link GPU, DDR4, full-SSD all at once should be fun.

 

[Daingurse]

Seems to be a pretty good showing for all platforms. I'm playing on PC, and I must say that the environments really impress me. Really looks like a next-gen DA:Origins aesthetically too.

 

[Hitokiri03]

If you look at all the recently released games, the Xone version did not performed that bad against the PS4 version, and even had some advantages.

I'm surprised.

 

[Portugeezer]

How I feel it goes down with sony:
Dev: we optimized the game to run at 1080p like you requested. However,if you would hear me out as to why I would recommend 900p...
Sony: no we need 1080p on all our games.
Dev: I understand but the game would perform bette.....
SONY: *throws money at them* go away you puppet.

How it really goes down:

Devs: We don't want to make this game sub 1080p (on PS4) or resolutiongaters will be down our throats.

That being said, I don't think we should assume when a game had dips below 30 it's due to the resolution or the CPU clock speed, could just be that they were focussed on 5 version of a game.

 

[dark10x]

Slightly OT here, but in how many years do you guys suppose we'll see Quantum Dot displays make it to the market? I'm planning on going full-on insane next time I redo my system from near-scratch. Going 4K, absolute contrast, NV-Link GPU, DDR4, full-SSD all at once should be fun.

I'm not sure what to think about QD displays, to be honest. I have yet to see an example in person, but from what I understand, they still require a backlight which could lead to many of the same issues that LCDs suffer from.

OLED works so well due to the fact that it does NOT rely on any sort of backlighting - the elements themselves produce the light. It can deliver absolute black without resorting to trickery.

QD could be useful on the PC side of things, though, but I'd still like to see an OLED monitor.

 

[BumRush]

Uhh, that's not at all the case. There are lots of minor frame-rate dips throughout the experience.


The small graph above the FPS graph is frame-time.

I believe you...just a ton of people saying the opposite here! I'll play for myself though (p.s. I'm guessing the PS4 version is certainly "playable", yes?)

 

[Derpyduck]

right

everyone actually playing the game for dozens of hours not mentioning massive tearing across 1/4th of the screen along with frequent framerate dips is just everyone else being dillusional or incapable of noticing things like this on their own without technical equipment lol

but as Dark said, it IS noticeable.

I dunno how I am missing all these tears and drops. I must have one of them magical TV's

And you can't go back and say ... oh well its very infrequent. Nah you just told someone to go buy the X1 version because it is better because it is " solid 30fps ". Hinting, or outright saying, that the framerate on the PS4 version is actually bad enough to warrant skipping the version for another. Which in my eyes is utter BS. Being someone who is actually playing the game, and has been since it launched. And all those other people in the OT ... those hundreds of others who have been talking about the game since it hit without ever mentioning massive tears across the top of the screen or these gameplay ruining framerate drops.

So essentially your contribution to the thread is saying, "Nuh uhhhhhhh!".

 

[dark10x]

I believe you...just a ton of people saying the opposite here! I'll play for myself though (p.s. I'm guessing the PS4 version is certainly "playable", yes?)

Yes, absolutely. It's still a great release and more stable than ANY Bioware console game to date.

It's just that you'll have to contend with minor dips throughout the experience. I'd say a good 40% of the battles I've fought suffered some minor drops while certain areas trigger slowdown just while running around. It's not too bad, but it is there and a bit disappointing.

Definitely give it a shot. The game is AWESOME.

And you can't go back and say ... oh well its very infrequent.

I'd argue that it's perhaps a bit MORE frequent than the text implies. It's very playable but those dips crop up more than I'd like. XO really just never drops, though, in comparison. That's all I'm saying.

Both are great releases but, as I'm very sensitive to frame-rate dips, I'd give the edge to the XO version - but for those less sensitive to those issues the PS4 version is still very good.

 

[iceatcs]

Ouch, Xbox one drop even at 900p, maybe try with 800p in next time.

 

[Always-honest]

Game is pretty damn smooth at the moment for me. People will spin if as some great advantage performance wise but whatever "hit" it takes for being at 1080p is minor enough to justify being at a higher res. Also this isn't a trend the trend before used to be better graphics and performance it's also been shown that the GTAV performance findings skewed in PS4's favor in video even if the articles written portion didn't reflect that.

Yeah same for me, but i think some are more sensitive to framerate.

 

[ninjablade]

If you look at all the recently released games, the Xone version did not performed that bad against the PS4 version, and even had some advantages.

I'm surprised.

i'm surprised as well, i thought the ps4 would be kicking XB1 ass, due to the GPU power advantage and the much faster ram. i remember reading that the ram speed would make a huge difference, and to be fair it did in the beginning, but it seems developers have mastered the XB1 ram issues so far.

 

[StuBurns]

How it really goes down:

Devs: We don't want to make this game sub 1080p (on PS4) or resolutiongaters will be down our throats.

That being said, I don't think we should assume when a game had dips below 30 it's due to the resolution or the CPU clock speed, could just be that they were focussed on 5 version of a game.

Or they just think 1080p with minor FR issues is better.

 

[travisbickle]

Ugh. The tearing in the PS4 version would bother me. It's not THAT horrible in this case, but still distracting. HATE tearing. A little more IQ don't mean shit imo if it causes some chugging with tearing.

I can't see the tearing on the video, and I usually spot that more than frame rate drops. Any part you can point to that has a lot of tearing?

 

[Portugeezer]

Or they just think 1080p with minor FR issues is better.

That would also make sense, 30fps ~ 95% of the time is fine but not the best.

Even at 900p XB1 dips below 30, so it's not like the thought process would be to make it 800p, or 720p, to make it a solid 30.

 

[QaaQer]

i'm surprised as well, i thought the ps4 would be kicking XB1 ass, due to the GPU power advantage and the much faster ram. i remember reading that the ram speed would make a huge difference, and to be fair it did in the beginning, but it seems developers have mastered the XB1 ram issues so far.

I'd really like to know the inside story. Matt said that devs could get more out of the ps4 cpu than the x1's even with the uptick. But that was pre-kinnect removal which apparently freed up some more resources.

It wouldn't surprise me if that move was made by MS for exactly this scenario, where the x1 actually does something better than the ps4 and gives owners a reason to feel good about their decision. If so, it's a very smart move on their part.

 

[lukeskymac]

I'm not sure what to think about QD displays, to be honest. I have yet to see an example in person, but from what I understand, they still require a backlight which could lead to many of the same issues that LCDs suffer from.

OLED works so well due to the fact that it does NOT rely on any sort of backlighting - the elements themselves produce the light. It can deliver absolute black without resorting to trickery.

QD could be useful on the PC side of things, though, but I'd still like to see an OLED monitor.

Nope, they actually function exactly like OLEDs (as in, no backlight, every subpixel produces its own light). The twist is that the material used isn't organic, so it won't have OLED's color issues over time (damn you blue OLEDs!). It's also potentially cheaper/easier to assemble than OLED - but that's something that's only going to be sorted out with time.

 

[Conduit]

The resolution difference is huge, and constant. While the FPS difference is small and rare.

This, this, this, this!

 

[dark10x]

I can't see the tearing on the video, and I usually spot that more than frame rate drops. Any part you can point to that has a lot of tearing?

Look at the graph. When you see the red/blue lines appear in the top half of it that indicates tearing. For each torn frame, then, there will be an appropriate red dash within the image itself highlighting where the torn frame was detected.

 

[HORRORSHØW]

i'm on the ps4 and noticed drops, usually when there are multiple animals around. i've also noticed pop-in, which i find more distracting. haven't noticed tearing. it's definitely playable and not a hindrance while gaming. game looks great though. could not go with a blurrier resolution.

 

[RetroStu]

The occasional drop in frames does not make up for the loss in resolution. It's that simple.

What if you have a 720p TV?, surely the X1 version would be the one to get then.

I don't mean that sarcastically but no one ever seems to mention that. With tv's usually having a 6+ year 'life', i'm sure there are a ton of people out there with 720p tv's.

 

[omonimo]

Ouch, Xbox one drop even at 900p, maybe try with 800p in next time.

That's false. fps it's better on xbone (surprising) and very stable.

 

[dark10x]

Nope, they actually function exactly like OLEDs (as in, no backlight, every subpixel produces its own light). The twist is that the material used isn't organic, so it won't have OLED's color issues over time (damn you blue OLEDs!). It's also potentially cheaper/easier to assemble than OLED - but that's something that's only going to be sorted out with time.

Well if that's true you just made my day. Another technology potentially able to knock LCD off its throne would be awesome.

 

[onanie]

There were plenty of people on GAF that also told me they didn't notice frame drops in Bayonetta 2, so they don't exist. If those other posters would like to go run some analysis on the game like dark10x has, and come back and present it, then I may take their claims seriously. Just because you don't notice something does not mean other people won't. It just means they fall squarely into the very clearly defined group of people who "don't mind minor frame-rate dips and feel that image quality is most important". Luckily the article already has them covered.

The human eye can be persuaded to see something, even if it is only detectable by a machine. Of those who have the game on PS4, most say it is minor and some say they have not noticed any, contrary to dark10x alone. Even if frame drops were verified by a machine, no one else has noticed it frequently, which speaks volumes about the real magnitude of the problem.

 

[omonimo]

The human eye can be persuaded to see something, even if it is only detectable by a machine. Of those who have the game on PS4, most say it is minor and some say they have not noticed any, contrary to dark10x alone. Even if frame drops were verified by a machine, no one else has noticed it frequently, which speaks volumes about the real magnitude of the problem.

It's not persuaded. People more sensible could be annoyed about the variable fps. We are not all the same.

 

[StuBurns]

The human eye can be persuaded to see something, even if it is only detectable by a machine. Of those who have the game on PS4, most say it is minor and some say they have not noticed any, contrary to dark10x alone. Even if frame drops were verified by a machine, no one else has noticed it frequently, which speaks volumes about the real magnitude of the problem.

He didn't claim it was some huge issue though. He simply said if you care more about performance, the XBO version is better in that regard.

 

[big_z]

seems like a solid game no matter where you play it (last gen excluded).

the biggest win here is the anisotropic filtering, good on bioware. people will argue about resolution when it doesn't really matter that much if everything is blurry 5 feet away from your character because the filtering sucks.