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[Caayn]

Pretty interesting to see how barebones ports perform on the XB1X hardware. Surprised that DF managed to get their hands on these numbers.

GAF and guys like Digital Foundry will notice the differences but as always, the future will tell if "avarage joe" will care much for it.

I've yet to meet an "average joe" that notices the visual differences between base PS4 and XB1, let alone the mid-gen upgrades.

 

[Maximus P]

I think we're at least 3 years away from A real 4K console. By that time it could be reasonably priced for the Console space.

This.

A true 4K console wouldn't make sense at a business level. The hardware would cost far more than the $499 price tag we've seen here. And I've seen many, including some of the posters that are downplaying the consoles power ridicule that price tag.

 

[Opus Angelorum]

Very impressive that a 900p Xbox One game can jump to native 4K without any optimization.

 

[Synth]

depends on whether not devs are gonna be bothered to put the dev time to add special sauce considering XbX is facing an uphill fight with their price/install base. If its not 4k, it might have more particles etc; but on PS4pro - the dedicated 1st parties will probably really work their code to maximise the use of the pro. I expect visuals to be similar.

The specs will bare out differences. They always do. There's little development involved in resolution adjustments.

The OG Xbox was in a far worse market situation vs PS2, and that certainly didn't result in games looking similar, and there's less work involved in the differences today (especially with nearly everything having a PC version to pull higher quality assets from).

 

[Atolm]

Will they forcé higher resolutions at an OS level? That's what they need to beat PS4 with multi.

 

[OrangeOak]

Such a bummer the CPU is holding this beast back

I think what's most holding it back is Xbox One That is if there won't be Forza Horizon 2 Xbox 360 vs Xbox One situations which I hope there will.

 

[grizzelye]

so lets be honest here. It's really not going to be much better than PS4pro - specs or whatnot, the fact that they have to checkerboard would ultimately mean that games will probably look the same on the pro/xbX

Resolution wise, but the X would be able to use 4k assets.

 

[Frostman]

Will they forcé higher resolutions at an OS level? That's what they need to beat PS4 with multi.

I'm 99% sure that there is system wide Downsampling. So yes, they have covered the biggest problem the Pro has.

Edit: ahhh, misunderstood your post, sorry. All games will require a patch for higher resolutions.

 

[JaggedSac]

Half a page and nothing discussing the new info from the article:

Well, it turns out that compatibility with older games isn't a walk in the park, so pre-existing Xbox One titles default to a different set-up. In effect, half of the render back-end hardware is disabled and pixel and vertex shaders are each hived off to half of the 40 available compute units. It's a somewhat gross generalisation, but you could say that older games effectively get access to 3TF of power compared to the 1.31TF in the older Xbox One, and compared further to the 6TF accessible via the July XDK.

 

[Vashetti]

Will they forcé higher resolutions at an OS level? That's what they need to beat PS4 with multi.

No, that requires patching.

 

[leeh]

Half a page and nothing discussing the new info from the article:

That's interesting. By older titles, I'm going to presume pre-UWP ones? I'd also wager this is why they talked about CPU compatibility for X1 titles, they would of had to emulate them.

 

[naitosan]

My wife just gave me a go to pre order this beast. Woohoo, now FCC, approve this so I can preorder one now.

 

[mhayze]

Why so many checkerboard comments? Did I miss something or did 2/3 of the titles hit true 4K without optimization, and the rest of them get there with optimization (by implication)?

 

[Caayn]

That's interesting. By older titles, I'm going to presume pre-UWP ones? I'd also wager this is why they talked about CPU compatibility for X1 titles, they would of had to emulate them.

It sounds like they mean anything pre-July 2017 XDK when talking about older titles.

 

[leeh]

It sounds like they mean anything pre-July 2017 XDK when talking about older titles.

Ah right, is there anything to point as of why the console couldn't be unlocked like the later ones?

 

[Sulik2]

Its really a shame Microsoft has made a box this well designed, but its not getting its own generation to shine and is still hamstrung by having to support the Xbone on all games.

 

[Vashetti]

Its really a shame Microsoft has made a box this well designed, but its not getting its own generation to shine and is still hamstrung by having to support the Xbone on all games.

The CPU 'upgrade' is not enough for a new generation.

 

[E92 M3]

I just want to preorder already.

 

[gaming_noob]

I wish MS could show some tech demos. Miss having those from past generations.

 

[Christocolus]

The presentation states that the design goal of Xbox One X was to run native 1080p titles with a 4x resolution boost, while during our visit, Microsoft had expanded the objective, saying that it wanted both 900p and 1080p game engines to run at 2160p. The data for most of the nine titles clearly demonstrates that the 4x resolution design goal is clearly met - even without access to new GPU features of the Xbox One X hardware.

Wow. good stuff. great read. thanks!

These results are on the unfinished SDKs which many devs got recently...Interestingly I think Mike Ybarra talked about this a few weeks ago and even Jez Corden mentioned this prior E3. I wonder, what new GPU features will be in the final SDK though?
Can't wait to get one. I hope they get the approval from FCC soon cos pre-orders should have gone live after the conference imo.

 

[Hoo-doo]

After all that fanfare of 'True 4K' and even printing '4K' on the damn GPU it's kind of baffling to see them only half deliver. They also really went cheap on the CPU which is holding this thing back something fierce.
I'm predicting that the majority of third-party AAA games run at checkerboarded resolutions. Which is fine and a huge jump over 900p, but it calls to question all the 4K chest-thumping and marketing they did beforehand.

 

[Yautja_Warrior]

Half a page and nothing discussing the new info from the article:

Well, it turns out that compatibility with older games isn't a walk in the park, so pre-existing Xbox One titles default to a different set-up. In effect, half of the render back-end hardware is disabled and pixel and vertex shaders are each hived off to half of the 40 available compute units. It's a somewhat gross generalisation, but you could say that older games effectively get access to 3TF of power compared to the 1.31TF in the older Xbox One, and compared further to the 6TF accessible via the July XDK.

Yeah it is interesting, clearly Sony being careful with older games on the Pro has some merit, if MS are doing something similar, by not allowing older games to access the full power of the system to ensure all games work.

Obviously like the Pro, it shouldn't make much of a difference to new games, as they all should be made with X support in mind.

 

[Skyline Owl]

Come on, FCC. I want to pre-order this thing. =(

 

[pitchfork]

I just want to preorder already.

Aye, I'm with you there mate

Still holding out on a 4k tv, despite owning an XB1 S. Keeping an eye on Amazon Prime day next week though for any tasty deals

 

[gamz]

Come on, FCC. I want to pre-order this thing. =(

It's gonna be August. Three more weeks.

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

so lets be honest here. It's really not going to be much better than PS4pro - specs or whatnot, the fact that they have to checkerboard would ultimately mean that games will probably look the same on the pro/xbX

People can keep telling themselves that if they want

 

[weekev]

So, when are we getting One X exclusive games to take advantage of this horsepower? It's clearly a beast and Id consider getting one if the games were there.

 

[VariantX]

Such a bummer the CPU is holding this beast back

The story of this console generation. Even a dusty old 2500k would be better.

 

[Netherscourge]

Does the FPS cap at any resolution?

Can we at least get better FPS if we keep it at 1080p?

Since, most people won't even have a 4k monitor or TV at launch?

If MS told me I can play Xbox One X games at minimum 60+ FPS by keeping them at 1080p, I'd be all over it.

But if games are capped at 30 fps regardless of resolution, then what's the point of the hardware boost?

It's like they would just be selling this version for 4K tv owners only.

 

[Vashetti]

So, when are we getting One X exclusive games to take advantage of this horsepower? It's clearly a beast and Id consider getting one if the games were there.

Never. Unless they allow VR titles in the future.

Does the FPS cap at any resolution?

Can we at least get better FPS if we keep it at 1080p?

Since, most people won't even have a 4k monitor or TV at launch?

If MS told me I can play Xbox One X games at minimum 60+ FPS by keeping them at 1080p, I'd be all over it.

But if games are capped at 30 fps regardless or resolution, then what's the point of the hardware boost?

It's like they would just be selling this version for 4K tv owners only.

Gaf (straw)Man in: The Curious Case of the CPU-bound Video Game! Oversimplified collector's edition

This is a work of fiction. Names, characters, places and incidents either are products of the author's imagination or are used fictitiously. Any resemblance to actual events or locales or persons, living or dead, is entirely coincidental.

Frame rate: 30
What is this? A 30 fps video game! Fret not! Gaf man is here to save the day! Clearly they have sacrificed the fluidity of the game for fancy (checkerboarded) 4K. Let us turn down the resolution to 1080p.

Frame rate: 30
Alas! That was not enough! We will have to crank it down further! 720p here we go!

Frame rate: 30
Somehow, this isn't working. I guess we just haven't gone down enough. 480p, here we go!

Frame rate: 30
You know what? Graphics are overrated. Destiny 2 would be far better as an artistic experience that replicates blindness. How about we render nothing at all?

Frame rate: 35
Progress! Gaf man has cracked yet another case!

 

[Raide]

So, when are we getting One X exclusive games to take advantage of this horsepower? It's clearly a beast and Id consider getting one if the games were there.

Another year or so, depending on uptake, I can see them moving away from XB1, in favour of 1X and then make sure the nextbox supports 1X stuff and everything before my

 

[Syrus]

After all that fanfare of 'True 4K' and even printing '4K' on the damn GPU it's kind of baffling to see them only half deliver. They also really went cheap on the CPU which is holding this thing back something fierce.
I'm predicting that the majority of third-party AAA games run at checkerboarded resolutions. Which is fine and a huge jump over 900p, but it calls to question all the 4K chest-thumping and marketing they did beforehand.

Someone didnt read.

 

[gamz]

Does the FPS cap at any resolution?

Can we at least get better FPS if we keep it at 1080p?

Since, most people won't even have a 4k monitor or TV at launch?

If MS told me I can play Xbox One X games at minimum 60+ FPS by keeping them at 1080p, I'd be all over it.

But if games are capped at 30 for regardless or resolution, then what's the point of the hardware boost?

Let's be honest the majority of people buying this will have 4K TVs. I mean 4K is cheap as hell now.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Does the FPS cap at any resolution?

Can we at least get better FPS if we keep it at 1080p?

Since, most people won't even have a 4k monitor or TV at launch?

If MS told me I can play Xbox One X games at minimum 60+ FPS by keeping them at 1080p, I'd be all over it.

But if games are capped at 30 for regardless or resolution, then what's the point of the hardware boost?

For the forseeable future, developers for console games will mostly prioritize visuals over performance.
No amount of hardware power is going to change that, devs will just make the games even prettier.

If you want unlocked performance as a standard feature, you play games on a PC.

 

[valkyre]

Is XBOX ONE going to be the main reason the X is going to be held back?

I mean the difference between them is pretty massive...

 

[Christocolus]

Someone didnt read.

Lol

 

[gamz]

Someone didnt read.

I expect nothing less from him.

 

[Vashetti]

Is XBOX ONE going to be the main reason the X is going to be held back?

I mean the difference between them is pretty massive...

All games must run on XB1, so yes.

 

[sixteen-bit]

This sounds promising!

 

[Interferon]

Better CPU would mean 599 US Dollars.

X1x is already having an uphill batle as it is, a higher pricetag would guarantee an immediate flop.

You (and everyone else) will play fake 4k checkerboarded games and love it.

It's not as simple as that. With a better CPU, a console wouldn't have as big of a bottleneck even with a less powerful GPU (which would drop the price in the 499 range).
With a stronger CPU and a 5TF GPU we'd surely have more 60fps title this gen, and still a 'possible' 4K resoultion as is the case now.

 

[MaximusPayne]

Why so many checkerboard comments? Did I miss something or did 2/3 of the titles hit true 4K without optimization, and the rest of them get there with optimization (by implication)?

This is Gaf. Cherry picking is in the blood.

 

[Raide]

Is XBOX ONE going to be the main reason the X is going to be held back?

I mean the difference between them is pretty massive...

I think it depends on how the options scale. PC games push amazing graphics that can be scaled to work on low budget systems, if you're willing to put up with low graphics and performance.

I would love to see more tweaking options with 1X so people have the choice.

 

[Marvel]

Just wanna pre-order!

 

[Diprosalic]

the more i read about this the more i wish they would've just said "fuck the xbox one, release a new gen next year" :/

 

[valkyre]

I think it depends on how the options scale. PC games push amazing graphics that can be scaled to work on low budget systems, if you're willing to put up with low graphics and performance.

I would love to see more tweaking options with 1X so people have the choice.

Yeah I get what you are saying but just like consoles hold back PC, I am talking more about geometry which is the basis of the game. The number of triangles, of the environment, the characters etc.

X's difference from ONE is really such a big one that it could be pushing far more geometry-rich worlds.

 

[westman]

Better CPU would mean ditching Jaguar and this is not an option because it would mean compatibility issues. I think that is more likely the more important factor than cost.

I can understand that argument for the PS4 Pro, because it has a backwards compatible configuration where a subset of its hardware maps 1:1 to the PS4 and run at a reduced clock speed to match the performance of the PS4 exactly. A CPU with a different hardware microarchitecture would mean different performance characteristics, jeopardizing the ideal of 100% compatiblity in HW.

But I don't think such a mode is possible on the XB1X, since the changes to memory architecture (GDDR5 vs. DDR3 + ESRAM) means that performance characteristics would change no matter what. Compatibility is then dependent on games not having any latent performance-dependent bugs, or if they do, having the OS/sandbox patch up any detected problems (can be done per-title if necessary). Upgrading from Jaguar to something newer would not help, of course, but it would not make a world of difference since you never had that perfect BC in HW to begin with...

 

[Netherscourge]

For the forseeable future, developers for console games will mostly prioritize visuals over performance.
No amount of hardware power is going to change that, devs will just make the games even prettier.

If you want unlocked performance as a standard feature, you play games on a PC.

Yea, looks like that's where I'm at.

 

[Lys Skygge]

Pretty interesting to see how barebones ports perform on the XB1X hardware. Surprised that DF managed to get their hands on these numbers.
I've yet to meet an "average joe" that notices the visual differences between base PS4 and XB1, let alone the mid-gen upgrades.

I wouldn't call myself an average gamer, and even I barley notice a difference between the PS4 and Pro. I doubt many, including myself, will see much of a difference between Pro and X1X.

 

[LelouchZero]

Half a page and nothing discussing the new info from the article:

It's also in the video at 8:12. This is really awesome!

So for comparison, the PS4 Pro's GPU runs at 911MHz with 1152 cores in games that don't have any Pro enhancements and just use Boost mode.

The PS4's GPU runs at 800MHz, the PS4 Pro's GPU runs at 911MHz and the Xbox One's GPU runs at 853MHz and 914MHz in the Xbox One S.

PS4 (1.84TF) vs PS4 Pro Boost Mode (2.094TF) = 13%

Xbox One (1.13TF) vs Xbox One X (3TF) = 165% (2.65x)

PS4 Pro Boost Mode (2.094TF) vs Xbox One X (3TF) = 43.2%

 

[Lupercal]

the more i read about this the more i wish they would've just said "fuck the xbox one, release a new gen next year" :/

Fuck our current install base, let them buy all new shit.