In Albert's defense he had not run those numbers by the fellow at that point in time.
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Digital Foundry: the complete Xbox One architects interview
- Thread starter Chobel
- Start date
its not just "theoretical power". Now imagine the same most talented dev with best budgets on great power.
Developers are the ones who pushed sony to 8 GB of GDDR. Handicapp a developer with lack of power is Not a good thing no matter how you spin it.
Then perhaps he should not have made a "factual" statement regarding console comparison, or at least corrected himself, as he is yet to do so, I asked him multiple times i the thread about this matter, even pointing out the fact the PS4 does not have 10gb/s coherent bandwidth.
Cerny's already talked to Gamasutra and has given the opportunity to Leadbetter for an interview. He probably feels that is enough.
Is this true? Why hasn't Leadbetter taken it?
What would MS fellow know about ps4? why is albert posting info as an official MS representative without checking his fact?
bottom line is he Lies , make shit up and spins. I cant stand him. I made multiple post about him making shit up , contradict himself and then contradict his own people info.
I pay no mind to the guy anymore. The less people do, the better.
Muppet of a Man
Member
It's actually quite ironic because supposedly the way that the 40 GB/s of coherent bandwidth has been allocated in PS4 (i.e., 20 GB/s read/write for CPU + 10 GB/s read for GPU + 10 GB/s write for GPU) is more effectively distributed than the shared 30 GB/s read/write CPU + read GPU on X1. The additional buses/lanes on the PS4 help to cut down on memory client contention and enable snooping or circumventing caches.
dragonelite
Member
nvm
He did take it. Sorry should have worded that better.
7850/7870 both have 156gb/s and 32 ROP's but at a higher clock than PS4.
EDIT: nvm, I see you edited.
mrlovepump
Neo Member
Working for an organization I would expect its the usual incompetence that comes from that. Everybody knows their 2% of the picture and has no bloody clue what else is going off. Most of the time your information on "someone else bit" is about 20 revisions out of date.
Ricerocket
Member
Went into great detail about the esram. They outright squash the rumor of latency even making a difference at all.
Confirms 2 ACE / 16 queues (most thought 8 queues total)
Shape uses up 8 of the 15 coprocessors which is mainly reserved for Kinect processing
Overall not really any customization to cpu/gpu. Interesting read overall.
Confirms 2 ACE / 16 queues (most thought 8 queues total)
Shape uses up 8 of the 15 coprocessors which is mainly reserved for Kinect processing
Overall not really any customization to cpu/gpu. Interesting read overall.
killatopak
Member
Yup, I still remember all those posts of Albert Penello which was told to be wrong by numerous technologically respectable GAFers and was formally debunked by Ars Technica.
Didn't he say it was all told to him by the Fellow before he posted it?
SoundofSilence
Member
And MS will spend the rest of the generation outspending Sony in marketing to try to demonstrate that it isn't.
4 to 1! Where did they get that from. Pretty sure the last solid figures from Nintendo showed a 61% / 39% split in 360 favour. That's pretty decent anyway without resorting to outright lies - even allowing for 16 months longer on market for 360 it's a good result.
I don't frequent Eurogamer really so didn't have any view on them one way or the other - DF I've read a few times and given the remit I just expected a little more equality of time spent analyzing each console.
Probably the same way he did after countless other of his terrible theories, hopes and dreams were shot down lol.
Sorry I can't resist, it's just too funny. I'm using an ad blocker though, so he shouldn't get any money from me
They would have mentioned it by now if it had.
phosphor112
Banned
But dat latency!
How many times have several of us said:
A) CPU does have access to eSRAM but it's slow
B) Latency isn't a GPU issue.
This'll finally shut them up. Unless it's misterx
How many times have several of us said:
A) CPU does have access to eSRAM but it's slow
B) Latency isn't a GPU issue.
This'll finally shut them up. Unless it's misterx
Lol what's funny is that it seems like he has a hard reset button in that he will acknowledge that he might be wrong but then the very next day or heck the very next topic he will reboot and start harping on the same points again.
killatopak
Member
Wait wait wait. Is it 40GB/s or 30GB/s? How is coherent bandwidth handled?
Case 1: 30GB/s - 10GB/s reads 20GB/s writes.
Case 2: 30GB/s - 30GB/s reads 30GB/s writes.
If case 1 then PS4 essentially wins with an overall 40GB/s coherent bandwidth.
If case 2 then PS4's coherent bandwidth is essentially the same as Xbox One's.
Technical GAF, which one is it?
Either way, PS4 doesn't lose anything and may just be better again than Xbox One.
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
killatopak
Member
Definitely not A). We only just confirmed that it's slow today. We didn't know what that thin line connecting the CPU and ESRAM back at the Hot Chips presentation was back then.
B) though is done to death and was always said by SenjutsuSage to be something that gives the Xbox One an advantage. I'm not sure if it was about the GPU or CPU though.
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
The only place the Xbox One is handicapped by lack of power is in the minds of Sony fanboys. The devs themselves think it's a powerful system.
travisbickle
Member
I don't know why they are promoting balance, it just sounds like they will average out on the stats we have on paper, well below the PS4. No secret sauce to boost it.
Nervous Sausage
Member
Yep, those Gamecube ports of Half Life 2, Morrowind and Doom 3 definitely outclassed the Xbox versions... Oh wait. Haha, sorry for coming across as a dick but the Xbox was in a different league compared to the PS2 and Gamecube (Wii too). It will be interesting to see how big the difference is between the PS4 and the Xbox One.
RedNumberFive
Banned
Well it certainly handicaps multi-platform games that are going to have to target the lowest common denominator. In this case, the Xbone.
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
We don't know that. It's pure speculation on your part.
Is that true though? Having a big GPU advantage, without a big CPU advantage would imply they're basically equal in terms of the type of simulations they can run, the PS4 can just draw the prettier frame, but that shouldn't be a LCD factor, right? You can always just throw the additional GPU performance at framerate/IQ, etc.
Eurogamer has been running Nintendolife far longer than Outside Xbox and they also run PushSquare, a Playstation-centric site.
Muppet of a Man
Member
According to the leaked diagram, there are 3 buses/lanes for the CPU: one that is 20 GB/s read/write between CPU and memory only, one that is 10 GB/s read and 10 GB/s write that snoops the CPU's L1/L2 caches on its way to the GPU (i.e., Onion), and one that is 10 GB/s read and 10 GB/s write that bypasses the GPU's caches (i.e., Onion+--shares bandwidth with Onion). So, 20 + 10 + 10 = 40 GB/s total.
http://www.edge-online.com/news/pow...erences-between-ps4-and-xbox-one-performance/
Our contacts have told us that memory reads on PS4 are 40-50 per cent quicker than Xbox One, and its ALU (Arithmetic Logic Unit) is around 50 per cent faster. One basic example we were given suggested that without optimisation for either console, a platform-agnostic development build can run at around 30FPS in 1920×1080 on PS4, but itll run at 20-something FPS in 1600×900 on Xbox One. Xbox One is weaker and its a pain to use its ESRAM, concluded one developer.
Microsoft is aware of the problem and, having recently upped the clock speed of Xbox One, is working hard to close the gap on PS4, though one developer we spoke to downplayed the move. The clock speed update is not significant, it does not change things that much, he said. Of course, something is better than nothing.
i guess everyone , including developers are sony fanboys .
slicedmass
Banned
I wanna know at what point they really thought the kinect was a giant selling point or game changer? I guess the wii's sales gave them that idea? Did they not realize their launch price is double that of the wii? Such shit decisions by them should really sway people away from the console (DRM/kinect/powerless). I was pushing so hard for the xbox before the reveal as I wanted to remain in its eco-system as I feel they would have probably had a major lead in online play (wont be a major difference like this gen) which I do the most, but once E3 came I said fuck dat shit and pre-ordered ps4 the next day on June 11th.
What a pretentious and short sighted claim. BOTH consoles are underpowered to a lot of people, including Sony fans. The Xbox One just gets more flack because it's even more underpowered than the PS4 (by a good margin), and most surprisingly, $100 more expensive as well. 50% more performance for $100 less is why this is such big news, and why Microsoft, Leadbetter and Co have been trying so hard to downplay those differences.
velociraptor
Junior Member
Do they? I'm really not sure.
You're never going to see developers badmouthing publicly something they're working on because they would just damage their own investement in the platform and their relationship with the platform holder.
But at this point we have seen many reports of developers complaining about difficulty to program the esdram, unfinished tools and low performance.
Even Penello acknowledged that developers are getting less frames per second on XboxOne compared to PS4 for the same code.
And if they were so happy MS wouldn't have bothered with their upclocks in first place.
RedNumberFive
Banned
So it looks like we'll have to rely on first party titles to target the higher end specs of the PS4. It's ashame that 3rd party titles are going to have to scale things back to take Microsoft's cable box into account.
Zatoichi's Cane
Member
and what, develops won't do the same with the PS4? From all I've read the visual gap will only increase as the generation matures and devs figure out how to really use the PS4's power.
Outside of The Division, are there any PS4/XBO games that aren't on PS360? XBO is the least of a developer's worries with the PS3 still in play.
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
I remember that thread. An unsubstantiated hearsay claim on twitter that a fanboy misguidedly turned into a thread that was locked by a mod.
Have you got any verified quotes from any devs that have stated that the Xbox One is handicapped?
Now, you're reaching mate. While fanboy angle works both ways, objectively, it has been claimed that it is less straight forward to program for than PS4 and that it is less powerful as well by devs. As aforementioned, in vacuum, Xbone is a very capable piece of hardware, however, being a $100 more in a real world environment compared to a technically more powerful competitor does not do it any favour.
Night Angel
Member
Anonymous sources no longer a legitimate source for news. You heard it here first, folks.
The XB1 is a capable machine. It will have games. They will look good.
The PS4 is a more capable machine. It well have games. They will likely look better.
I've never been able to run a game on worse specs for better performance, so why would I assume it will be done now? I'm not getting an XB1 for multiplats or graphics, I'm getting it for exclusives. MS should never have tried to downplay the PS4's advantage; all it did was make them look weak.
There is a power disparity. It is not in anyone's mind, it is real.
No developer would ever go on record and do that because they'd be fired. Unless they're Gabe Newell or whatever.
Teletraan1
Banned
We will see. I think we will get some resolution differences at launch. They dont have a lot of time to optimize so we will see them play with different resolutions between versions.
phosphor112
Banned
I've been saying A for forever now. I'm going to hunt through the hundreds, potentially thousands of my posts for it, but it's there.
People were saying the CPU had access to the eSRAM and I'd show them using the diagram that, even though it does, it's in fact very slow because it not only has to go through the memory interface, but the gpu interface, then into the memory itself.
EDIT: Google saved the day.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=77514837&postcount=350
Here it is. As I said, the CPU can't DIRECTLY access the eSRAM. That's why it's so slow.