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[gatti-man]

Star Wars at this point is little more than 3 decent but dated, cheesy 70's/80's era blockbuster movies set in a totally untapped universe with awesome potential which has never been utilized or fulfilled. What came after is little more than bad fanfiction itself (including Lucas with his prequel shit). Jedi Knights with lightsabers? Dark side of the force with dark powers? Empires & different warring factions battling throughout endless space? Awesome.

But someone, somewhere (or a whole bunch of them) decided Star Wars had to perpetually be a combination of a kiddie flick, merchandising & political commentary/social engineering. Star Wars basically needs its Christopher Nolan/Dark Knight moment, i.e. when a writer & filmmaker suddenly realizes the fandom aren't all 13 year olds & can actually enjoy a deeper, more engrossing experience, with all the childish bullshit & nostalgia torn out.

That means ditch the cringe opening title sequence, the John Williams "I'll tell you how you must feel right now" bombastic score, the carboard stereotype villains/heroes & give us a freaking exciting science fiction experience set in that fantastic universe, with complex characters, motivations & real suspense (learn from A Song of Ice & Fire as well). Because all it has going for it right now is the actual background lore created in the first 3 movies. The rest is all a shitshow.

When these movies came out (the OT) they were cutting edge and blew people away. Not cheesy at all.

 

[VulcanRaven]

I get that they are guards. It’s more so who are they? How did Luke or Snoke or whoever find them.

They clearly aren’t normal stormtroopers.

Here is some info:

Emperor's Royal Guard

Those were Imperial Guards, Lando. The Emperor's personal protectors—handpicked from the very best of his forces. Out of millions of soldiers, they are unsurpassed.Korin Pers, to Lando Calrissian The Emperor's Royal Guard, also named the Imperial Royal Guard and Imperial Guard, alternatively...

starwars.fandom.com

I actually like how these new stormtroopers look. The red guards in The Last Jedi were cool looking too.

 

[Shifty]

Sith... trooper?

I'm out. Have been for years anyway ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[#Phonepunk#]

But someone, somewhere (or a whole bunch of them) decided Star Wars had to perpetually be a combination of a kiddie flick, merchandising & political commentary/social engineering. Star Wars basically needs its Christopher Nolan/Dark Knight moment, i.e. when a writer & filmmaker suddenly realizes the fandom aren't all 13 year olds & can actually enjoy a deeper, more engrossing experience, with all the childish bullshit & nostalgia torn out.

uggg. no. i would argue this is the opposite of what it needs. tbh Christopher Nolan is not as deep as people think he is. his main contribution has been tone. he gives his films a serious "prestigue tv" style tone. it doesn't keep Batman making a giant flaming bat on a bridge from being any less silly. or Batman carrying a bomb away from the city, literally repeating the plot of the '60s Batman, any less stupid. we don't need An Adult Star Wars we don't need to get rid of "childish bullshit & nostalgia". it would be like doing a Godzilla movie but getting rid of those dumb giant monsters. at that point you aren't making a Godzilla movie.

Star Wars first became a hit because it came out at the end of the '70s, which was full of dire social commentary sci fi. people loved it BECAUSE it was more of a fairy tale. people needed it after a decade of Soylent Green and Logan's Run and Silent Running. this is why the film became a hit. we don't need Gritty Star Wars IMO tho from the looks of the Boba Fett tv show that's what they will give people and the "grown ups" paid to review this swill will give high praise to this non-childish tv show about a space bounty hunter.

 

[ruvikx]

uggg. no. i would argue this is the opposite of what it needs. tbh Christopher Nolan is not as deep as people think he is. his main contribution has been tone. he gives his films a serious "prestigue tv" style tone. it doesn't keep Batman making a giant flaming bat on a bridge from being any less silly. or Batman carrying a bomb away from the city, literally repeating the plot of the '60s Batman, any less stupid. we don't need An Adult Star Wars we don't need to get rid of "childish bullshit & nostalgia". it would be like doing a Godzilla movie but getting rid of those dumb giant monsters. at that point you aren't making a Godzilla movie.

Star Wars first became a hit because it came out at the end of the '70s, which was full of dire social commentary sci fi. people loved it BECAUSE it was more of a fairy tale. people needed it after a decade of Soylent Green and Logan's Run and Silent Running. this is why the film became a hit. we don't need Gritty Star Wars IMO tho from the looks of the Boba Fett tv show that's what they will give people and the "grown ups" paid to review this swill will give high praise to this non-childish tv show about a space bounty hunter.

If this were the case, Star Wars needs to be shelved entirely (i.e. its success based upon the shitty state of the 1970's movie scene, a point upon which I do agree with you) because it no longer has any reason to exist. This by the numbers conveyor belt style filmmaking we see where characters, music & plot are so predictable, so retarded, so designed by committee & so aimed at 5 year olds is the point I jump off the train. The only decent moments in Star Wars since the original trilogy is when it strived for something more impactful & impressive - like the theatre scene between Anakin & Palpatine in Revenge of the Sith.

By the way, I also agree with you regarding Chris Nolan being "not as deep as people think he is" (for example I happen to think his Dunkirk movie was a steaming pile of disrespectful sh*t, likewise Interstellar was pretentious to the point of unintentional hilarity), but the point regarding Star Wars is the fact the actual lore of the universe & worlds the movies inhabit are seriously cool. It's just the entire packaging & exaggerated kiddie aspect I personally find totally revolting. There's a reason many people thought the Ewoks were shit-on-a-stick, i.e. even back in the 80's when Star Wars went from the cool seriousness of Empire Strikes Back to freaking teddy bears (merchandising pretending to be a movie) in Return of the Jedi, it was jarring.

Now we have f*cking Porgs, Spaceballs humor & f*cking Starday Night Live style sketches with a heavy social commentary icing on the sh*tcake which is ironic in & of itself considering as you said, the first movies were popular precisely because they escaped the gloomy preachiness of the rest of the industry in the 1970's.

 

[#Phonepunk#]

i.e. its success based upon the shitty state of the 1970's movie scene, a point upon which I do agree with you

eh, it's success is for a lot of reasons. not just that. i think people think the movie is the characters or the rebel vs. empire or the jedi vs. sith, i think it is bigger than that. i mean, the 70's movie scene in general was pretty dope, you had the rise of Spielberg, Jaws setting the scene for the summer blockbuster (and John William kicking ass), you had Apocalypse Now, which Lucas was working on at one point, and which influenced parts of his space trilogy. you had all those directors weighing in on SW, plus all the wonderful actors, young Harrison Ford, all the brilliant craftspeople, effects, matte painters, model makers, the Henson crew, there is a long list of amazing people, all at or around peaks of their careers, all pooling together, this is where Indiana Jones comes from, this where E.T. comes from. SW is definitely a lightning in the bottle product of it's time. JJ Abrams & Rian Johnson in the 2010s is not George Lucas hanging around Steven Speilberg and Francis Ford Coppola in the 70s. whoever is doing the CGI animation is not the California hacker geniuses who invented computer camera systems and founded ILM. there is a vast difference in talent there. to ignore this is silly. lightning in a bottle, a certain time and place, call it what you will. it will make the OT films forever special.

the point regarding Star Wars is the fact the actual lore of the universe & worlds the movies inhabit are seriously cool. It's just the entire packaging & exaggerated kiddie aspect I personally find totally revolting. There's a reason many people thought the Ewoks were shit-on-a-stick, i.e. even back in the 80's when Star Wars went from the cool seriousness of Empire Strikes Back to freaking teddy bears (merchandising pretending to be a movie) in Return of the Jedi, it was jarring.

eh the lore is ok, the characters and worlds are wonderful. the lore takes itself too seriously at times, but i do enjoy watching them spin a crazy space yarn. ROTJ was definitely an attempt at a kiddy-friendly, audience-targeted movie. it was the first SW movie for SW fans (Empire IMO had a broader audience in mind). they bring back the Death Star, they bring back Lando, go back to Tatooine, go back to Yoda. Ewoks, i have mixed feelings, cos i think that movie is fundamentally compromised, and things like Han Solo's belabored "Here we go again" and the shot where he steps on a twig while sneaking up from behind a guard, things like that are Scooby Doo level of reality to me. Chewie taking the food, are you for real? by the time I get to Ewoks i just think of them playing drums on the stormtrooper heads and later those cool fantasy made for tv films. (Porgs tho, they are a true spawn of satan.)

Empire definitely got it right in that they demonstrate the varied environments have consequences. Dagobah was a very real set where Luke worked for months with live animals such as snakes and lizards, getting bit once while filming. Hoth is dangerous, if Luke stays out all night in the cold he may die, and this is reinforced as we see him knocked unconscious within 5 minutes of the film. 5 minutes into the sequel and the main hero is out cold! that's subversive. it's also thrilling. this is what is missing, genuine thrills. you don't expect that right out the gate. just as there are many things that make SW good, there are many things that make the ST not so.

 

[Stiflers Mom]

eh, it's success is for a lot of reasons. not just that. i think people think the movie is the characters or the rebel vs. empire or the jedi vs. sith, i think it is bigger than that. i mean, the 70's movie scene in general was pretty dope, you had the rise of Spielberg, Jaws setting the scene for the summer blockbuster (and John William kicking ass), you had Apocalypse Now, which Lucas was working on at one point, and which influenced parts of his space trilogy. you had all those directors weighing in on SW, plus all the wonderful actors, young Harrison Ford, all the brilliant craftspeople, effects, matte painters, model makers, the Henson crew, there is a long list of amazing people, all at or around peaks of their careers, all pooling together, this is where Indiana Jones comes from, this where E.T. comes from. SW is definitely a lightning in the bottle product of it's time. JJ Abrams & Rian Johnson in the 2010s is not George Lucas hanging around Steven Speilberg and Francis Ford Coppola in the 70s. whoever is doing the CGI animation is not the California hacker geniuses who invented computer camera systems and founded ILM. there is a vast difference in talent there. to ignore this is silly. lightning in a bottle, a certain time and place, call it what you will. it will make the OT films forever special.

This is SO true.
You can feel that every second in the OT. It was such a special time in cinema with all these people coming together working on stuff.