Bioware fans only like Baldur's Gate 2. At least the real ones do, anyway.NewLib said:I didnt realize this many people did not like KOTOR. Seriously, I still think its the best console RPG since the PSX Generation.
Timber said:Bioware fans only like Baldur's Gate 2. At least the real ones do, anyway.
Chris Remo said:The amount of BG2 love in this thread is making me want to check it out. I wonder if it's available through some straightforward legitimate means.
Chris Remo said:The amount of BG2 love in this thread is making me want to check it out. I wonder if it's available through some straightforward legitimate means.
Timber said:Bioware fans only like Baldur's Gate 2. At least the real ones do, anyway.
Timber said:Bioware fans only like Baldur's Gate 2. At least the real ones do, anyway.
NewLib said:I didnt realize this many people did not like KOTOR. Seriously, I still think its the best console RPG since the PSX Generation.
Timber said:Bioware fans only like Baldur's Gate 2. At least the real ones do, anyway.
Sure, but going PC only (still not confirmed by the way) would certainly make the decision to return some complexities easier.HK-47 said:People think thats this being PC only will automatically bring Bioware back up to BG II standards are mistaken though.
I still love KoToR. It even made watching battles fun. BG atmosphere and characters throw KOTOR in the gutter though.NewLib said:I didnt realize this many people did not like KOTOR. Seriously, I still think its the best console RPG since the PSX Generation.
Desi said:I still love KoToR. It even made watching battles fun. BG atmosphere and characters throw KOTOR in the gutter though.
NewLib said:I didnt realize this many people did not like KOTOR. Seriously, I still think its the best console RPG since the PSX Generation.
Chris Remo said:The amount of BG2 love in this thread is making me want to check it out. I wonder if it's available through some straightforward legitimate means.
I don't know why so many people hated the beginning dungeon in BG2--I really enjoyed it. It was like a microcosm of the whole game, with some combat, puzzles, cool conversations/riddles, exploration, story, and character development. For an introduction to a game as huge as BG2, isn't that a good approach?NewLib said:Also, Baldur's Gate II isnt perfect for the sheer fact I have to use a mod because Chateau Irenicus is easily the worst part of the game and its unavoidable right from the start.
Yeah but when you restart the game for your nth time it can get very, very annoying.Chairman Yang said:I don't know why so many people hated the beginning dungeon in BG2--I really enjoyed it. It was like a microcosm of the whole game, with some combat, puzzles, cool conversations/riddles, exploration, story, and character development. For an introduction to a game as huge as BG2, isn't that a good approach?
NewLib said:I didnt realize this many people did not like KOTOR. Seriously, I still think its the best console RPG since the PSX Generation.
Unison said:Post BG2, BioWare has made underwhelming game after underwhelming game, yet I can't wait to see what they do next.
Hoping for the best....
Honestly, it was always hard for me to get into that style of gameplay, and there's nothing inherently appealing about the setting for me. I've played hardly anything from the genre. I'm happy to give it another shot, though. I'm ordering BG2 from Amazon today.Teknopathetic said:"The amount of BG2 love in this thread is making me want to check it out. I wonder if it's available through some straightforward legitimate means."
You...you haven't played BG2?
Oh my.
Teknopathetic said:"Okay here is where I throw down the gauntlets. BG2 gameplay and atmosphere top notch. KOTOR has better characters. Irenicus is a better villain than Malak, but your party members in KOTOR are better. Yes, Carth sucks but so does Aerie, Anomen, Valygar, and Nalia. KOTOR story is also better."
There isn't a single memorable KOTOR character besides HK47. BG2 has Minsc, Viconia, Jan, Edwin, and Korgan. Mazzie's even a better character than the KOTOR cast.
I tend to agree...but if you don't like the setting...do yourself a favor and play planescape torment if you haven't. It was great for me because it's not the typical dungeons and dragons setting. It's absolutely one of the most incredible games I've ever played, and I barely even know how D&D works.Chris Remo said:Honestly, it was always hard for me to get into that style of gameplay, and there's nothing inherently appealing about the setting for me. I've played hardly anything from the genre. I'm happy to give it another shot, though. I'm ordering BG2 from Amazon today.
Teknopathetic said:"Okay here is where I throw down the gauntlets. BG2 gameplay and atmosphere top notch. KOTOR has better characters. Irenicus is a better villain than Malak, but your party members in KOTOR are better. Yes, Carth sucks but so does Aerie, Anomen, Valygar, and Nalia. KOTOR story is also better."
There isn't a single memorable KOTOR character besides HK47. BG2 has Minsc, Viconia, Jan, Edwin, and Korgan. Mazzie's even a better character than the KOTOR cast.
WHOAguitarninja said:...Don't forget the minsc's miniature giant space hamster.
Indeed.clutha said:I believe you speak of "Boo!!!"
I just finished replaying BG2 and now you made me want to do it again...Fragamemnon said:In contrast, when playing BG2 we'd deal with things like well-timed short duration buffs, setting traps, item swaps to stack saving throws, spell sequences, spell penetration values, crowd control, sneak attack positioning, friend fire from area damage, timing cone effects properly, instant death spells, and even crazy shit like time stop-and-pop sequencer unloading. We'd have talking swords, items with five or six modifiers, class and racial specific items, and we'd spend long periods min-maxing our gear for successs. And it was awesome.
Yeah yeah, console gaming plebs. Such a pedestrian game, you know?Fragamemnon said:blabla
zoku88 said:Will GAF kill me if I haven't played BG2...
and have no plans to do so...
?
High fantasy settings as in anything involving orcs, dwarves, elves, dragons really. If there's any thematic content in Dragon Age that puts it in another subgenre of fantasy then okay sure. I'm really not well versed when it comes to the delicacies of these descriptions But it's the kind of stuff that was overdone in the 90s because of CRPGs having their roots in the pen & paper stuff. I really prefer it now when developers stray away from that and come up with novel settings. The Elder Scrolls is an offender when it comes this this. I'd rather it didn't have goblins and elves, and I'd rather Dragon Age did not have that titleTeknopathetic said:DA isn't high fantasy. http://www.dragonagecentral.com/single/1210125300
Timber said:Yeah yeah, console gaming plebs. Such a pedestrian game, you know?
Obviously an action-RPG doesn't have the depth of a straight RPG like Baldur's Gate. Bioware never said it would yet people were still expecting it and now they're all disappointed. It's so utterly predictable at this point. And Bioware's combat and item systems in their post-D&D games have been less comprehensive because, well I just gave it away there. It's not D&D anymore, they don't have volumes upon of volumes of rulesets to rely on. But whatever... fucking console kiddies!
Teknopathetic said:"Okay here is where I throw down the gauntlets. BG2 gameplay and atmosphere top notch. KOTOR has better characters. Irenicus is a better villain than Malak, but your party members in KOTOR are better. Yes, Carth sucks but so does Aerie, Anomen, Valygar, and Nalia. KOTOR story is also better."
There isn't a single memorable KOTOR character besides HK47. BG2 has Minsc, Viconia, Jan, Edwin, and Korgan. Mazzie's even a better character than the KOTOR cast.
funkmasterb said:You're all going to be fucking blown away.
Teknopathetic said:"Okay here is where I throw down the gauntlets. BG2 gameplay and atmosphere top notch. KOTOR has better characters. Irenicus is a better villain than Malak, but your party members in KOTOR are better. Yes, Carth sucks but so does Aerie, Anomen, Valygar, and Nalia. KOTOR story is also better."
There isn't a single memorable KOTOR character besides HK47. BG2 has Minsc, Viconia, Jan, Edwin, and Korgan. Mazzie's even a better character than the KOTOR cast.
If Dragon Age is as George R. R. Martin-esque as the developers seem to be aiming for, then "high fantasy" would be a horribly inaccurate label for the game. Yes, the thematic content will make the setting different. Things like elves, dragons, etc. won't change that--as long as they're uniquely executed.Timber said:High fantasy settings as in anything involving orcs, dwarves, elves, dragons really. If there's any thematic content in Dragon Age that puts it in another subgenre of fantasy then okay sure. I'm really not well versed when it comes to the delicacies of these descriptions But it's the kind of stuff that was overdone in the 90s because of CRPGs having their roots in the pen & paper stuff. I really prefer it now when developers stray away from that and come up with novel settings. The Elder Scrolls is an offender when it comes this this. I'd rather it didn't have goblins and elves, and I'd rather Dragon Age did not have that title
Largely been left behind. :lol Such dramatisation always from you folks. Just earlier someone said Oblivion felt like a betrayal.Fragamemnon said:What's to prevent them from making detailed, quantitative rules and stats to govern combat in a way that keeps with action spirit of the game? Other games have done it, it's not impossible, and especially not for a company like Bioware. Why were the class abilities so little, and so completely lacking in synergy with both other abilities and the gear in the game? Why did a lion's share of the game's itemization consist of <blah_item> <roman_numeral> with incremental improvement?
It's not about not working with D&D for their more recent games. It's been about both reducing the number of gameplay decisions the player makes and the importance of those decisions, resulting a simpler game-for the fucking console kiddies, as you say-rather than their older PC fanbase, who has largely been left behind as they made their last two big games (KOTOR and ME).
NewLib said:Yes, Carth sucks but so does Aerie, Anomen, Valygar, and Nalia.
Chairman Yang said:If Dragon Age is as George R. R. Martin-esque as the developers seem to be aiming for, then "high fantasy" would be a horribly inaccurate label for the game. Yes, the thematic content will make the setting different. Things like elves, dragons, etc. won't change that--as long as they're uniquely executed.
Ventrue said:I'd like to point out that, once you realise how annoying Anomen is, he's actually completely hilarious. He's seriously the world's worst Paladin. When Keldorn wants to kill Viconia, Anomen claims that she is evil, but that he didn't realise just how hot the Drow were, so maybe she should live.
Dina said:The 'best' party of BG2 (the evil one, Viconia, Edwin, Korgan, Yoshino/Imoen and someone else) is also the one with the least amount of nutjobs. Running BG2 with Anomen, Minsc, Aerie, Imoen en Jan is so much better.
Yess... it's so cute when he touches the baby's nose 8)Ventrue said:Despite its bad gameplay and forgettable characters, I still love JE for some of the cutscenes, like the big twist.
NewLib said:Im sorry no party with Edwin in could be lacking in nutjobs.
Timber said:Yess... it's so cute when he touches the baby's nose 8)
Although I really disliked the final twist. Holy crap saw that one coming a mile away. They tried to do the KotOR trick again, dumbed it down for console kiddehs, and fucked it up royally.
really though, the twist in kotor when you learn the identity of the 'villian' is so epic. in jade empire the bad guy turns out to be, drumroll, your old creepy bearded mentor with a suspicious past. you don't say! and they pull that shit at the end of the game so they dont give you any time to develop any interest in it because the game is over!