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F1 fans - is Hamilton better than Schumacher?

Who's better?

  • Hamilton

    Votes: 36 28.8%
  • Schumacher

    Votes: 74 59.2%
  • One of the pre-90s greats who F1 hipsters somewhat rightly idolize. Gooo Fangio!

    Votes: 15 12.0%

  • Total voters
    125
Oct 8, 2004
8,984
106
1,535
Hamilton is very, very good, but he walked in to a stupidly dominant car and continued to be in stupidly dominant cars for most of his career whereas Michael was only in a stupidly dominant car for about 5-6 years of his of his career, gave up a number of wins to keep Barrichello placated, and did better when he was in non-stupidly dominant cars, that I have to say Schumacher was better overall, although I wouldn't tap either as the best (Senna, of course.)
 

StonedRider

Member
Jan 9, 2015
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Riga, Latvia
Not sure if this was posted yet but more wood for the Schumi fire:




85% success against his team mates vs Hams 68%

Weird stats, why wins only? So if somebody finished second and his teammate last, it does not count like win over teammate here? No, thanks.
 

Gp1

Member
Sep 17, 2019
832
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Weird stats, why wins only? So if somebody finished second and his teammate last, it does not count like win over teammate here? No, thanks.

I would make that list only with WDC.

I was at Donington in 1993. It was fucking spine chilling for a young teenage boy at only his second GP, watching Ayrton work some kind of sorcery in that rain.

That first lap was the greatest of all time.

And the trophy...


 
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StonedRider

Member
Jan 9, 2015
387
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Riga, Latvia
If you can't win a race you won't be champion.

In theory you would. But it's not the point. The point is this stats are trying to compare different drivers by their wins vs teammates wins, not by wins over teammate.

What if a driver has one accidental victory, but his teammate finishes all races on the podium and earns much more points? Who is better here? Obviously, driver who consistently finishes above his teammate is better. Number of victories alone does not make you champion. Keke Rosberg had won championship with less number of victories than his five closest rivals.
 

Paasei

Member
May 15, 2014
1,363
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I'd argue Verstappen and Leclerc are better in terms of driving.

Totally not biased as a Dutch guy, though!
Only a little....
 
Sep 9, 2006
7,966
59
1,540
Brampton, Ontario
Not sure if this was posted yet but more wood for the Schumi fire:




85% success against his team mates vs Hams 68%

Umm... you do know that none of Schumacher’s teammates were allowed to race him, right?
We have physical proof in races. It happened multiple times.

Hamilton has had 3 World Champions as his teammate.

What happened to Schumacher when he went up against Rosberg?
Look at the stats and post again.
 
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suedester

Banned
Dec 5, 2008
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Well, thanks for counteri-booting
Look, if you think so little of the man with the most wins and poles in the history of the sport then there’s not much I’ll be able to do to convince otherwise. I’ll just sensible chuckle and judge from a distance.
 

notseqi

Member
Jun 15, 2020
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Ho/Hum
Look, if you think so little of the man with the most wins and poles in the history of the sport then there’s not much I’ll be able to do to convince otherwise. I’ll just sensible chuckle and judge from a distance.
That's what we are talking about. Would be cool to not skip from the thread title to an immediate reply.

But hot-taking hot-takes is the way to go, eh?
 

suedester

Banned
Dec 5, 2008
1,355
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Try having something to say instead of just the screeching across multiple posts.
That's what we are talking about. Would be cool to not skip from the thread title to an immediate reply.

But hot-taking hot-takes is the way to go, eh?
People are talking absolute shit in this thread, it’s frankly embarrassing. My engagement ends here.
 

Gp1

Member
Sep 17, 2019
832
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435
This kind of thing shows why late 80's and 90's F1 where so much better than now

 
Sep 9, 2006
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Brampton, Ontario
Some of you might be too young to remember but in 1993 Alain Prost veto’d Ayrton Senna from joining the Williams team.
Because he knew that if Ayrton was in the car, he would win the 93championship.
Senna had no business leading the 93 championship for as long as he did.

Most World Champions want themselves to be the AlphaDog in their team. 1A and 1B doesn’t work.

Bottom Line, Hamilton has had much tougher teammates than Schumacher ever had. The lack of competition in the 2nd car is a notable reason for Schumacher (and any World Champion’s success).
 
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Marlenus

Member
Jul 29, 2013
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No idea.

What I do know is that without a Hamilton, Schumacher, Senna etc tier driver chances are Merc would have lost to Ferrari in 2017 and 2018.

The Merc is utterly dominant in the hands of Hamilton. Not so much if Bottas was the lead driver. Without Verstappen's extra DNFs they would be neck and neck.
 

ToadMan

Gold Member
Dec 2, 2018
1,918
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ITT people criticising Hamilton for various non sport related things - BLM? Green credentials? His attire?

I guess it’s not possible to criticise his ability in his sport, so try and claim something about a person none of us here know personally.

Ignoring that he is one of the few drivers who has won WDCs with more than one team and unlike Schumacher, Hamilton moved from a team still winning races to one that was midfield - even in the hands of Schumacher.

There are more WDCs on the grid in Hamilton’s era than ever, and he has driven against 3 of them in the same team as himself. Compare with patsies put alongside Schumacher in his Fezzer.

Hamilton is perhaps one of two drivers on the current grid (the other being Verstappen) who, no matter which position he finds himself in mid race, has the ability to do something spectacular.

Hamilton is faster, easier on his tyres and more consistently capable of driving on the edge of grip in his Merc. Bottas is clearly fast over one lap - over a race distance, not so much. Points are awarded on Sunday, not that it matters Hamilton is class of the field on both.

Additionally no matter what rule changes have been thrown his way to try and slow the Merc down, he has still won races and WDCs and indeed extended his lead.

Schumacher is a great too - however looking at those Ferrari wins - a dominant team, dominant budget, tyre manufacturer focused on his car, uncompetitive team mates, clear team Orders, Traction control and other gadgets since outlawed.

Schumacher had every possible advantage slanted to him for his Ferrari wins. Hamilton has had no such luxury.

Having said all that, I actually wouldn’t choose between those two at their respective peaks. It will depend on how far Hamilton goes now whom history judges the GoAT.

But Hamilton will be a legendary figure in sports and they’ll make major studio movies about him - Schumacher, probably not.

A mixed race kid from a relatively poor background gets into the sport and not only succeeds “the hard way” but dominates, and he dominated in a way even the likes of Senna couldn’t.

He deserves every plaudit and fans of F1 should be happy that we are witnessing a piece of history being made in the sport we follow.
 
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