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Spoilers Final Fantasy 7 Remake Spoilers Thread!

Rentahamster

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The best I got was lower body, upper body, almost full horns. Then the SOB regenerated and wiped me :messenger_loudly_crying:

Think I'm gonna farm materia a little more.
The only materia that increases your physical DPS are luck up and the ATB bonus materias. You want to upgrade Cloud's Hardedge for maximum physical damage, and Tifa's Metal Knuckles.

If you're taking too much damage, use Barret, Lifesaver, Big Bertha, and take all the HP perks and the extra healing when critical. Use cure > magnify.

But if you go a level higher, just don't take damage. Counter counter counter counter. If Behemoth starts kicking someone's ass, switch characters and DPS with that character. When Behemoth turns his attention to that character, switch again, and DPS with another character. One of the main keys to maintaining DPS while fighting bosses is to know when to control a character and when not to.

You can't control a character that's getting his ass beat, so switch.

You can't control a character that's in the middle of a skill or casting animation, so switch.
 
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Kamehameha

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The only materia that increases your physical DPS are luck up and the ATB bonus materias. You want to upgrade Cloud's Hardedge for maximum physical damage, and Tifa's Metal Knuckles.

If you're taking too much damage, use Barret, Lifesaver, Big Bertha, and take all the HP perks and the extra healing when critical. Use cure > magnify.

But if you go a level higher, just don't take damage. Counter counter counter counter. If Behemoth starts kicking someone's ass, switch characters and DPS with that character. When Behemoth turns his attention to that character, switch again, and DPS with another character. One of the main keys to maintaining DPS while fighting bosses is to know when to control a character and when not to.

You can't control a character that's getting his ass beat, so switch.

You can't control a character that's in the middle of a skill or casting animation, so switch.
I've been using Buster sword actually. How dumb of me, I completely forgot to combine heal with magnify. I'm just running heal lol.

Gonna try again later, thanks.
 
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Rentahamster

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I've been using Buster sword actually. How dumb of me, I completely forgot to combine heal with magnify. I'm just running heal lol.

Gonna try again later, thanks.
For maximum DPS, Hardedge is best for physical (as long as you upgrade all the attack up), and Mythril Sword is best for magic (as long as you upgrade all the magic up)

The other swords have situational uses, especially if you need to use Reprieve. Materia doesn't matter as much as weapon upgrades for DPS.

Heal + Magnify is good for quick damage recovery. Lifesaver + Steelskin + Big Bertha + Chakra is good because it covers all the party too.
 

Rentahamster

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I certainly think so, that OG goodness means nothing ultimatrely when it all comes crashing down at the end, for me, and many I believe, few sections in isolation are not what good stories are about, the whole needs to come togheter and reinforce each part, good stories have good setups and good payoffs, we have 90% set up, 10% nonsesne and no pay off, sure you can say next parts will, but that last 10% made sure to kill my interest.
Then you're letting your dissatisfaction of a small portion of the game that is specifically designed to get you out of your comfort zone and think about the story disproportionately taint your enjoyment of a story that you already love. I get it. Personally, I feel like the last two seasons of Game of Thrones was so bad in how it threw away many of the things that made the earlier seasons so great, and retroactively ruins the earlier seasons for me. I haven't had the desire to rewatch any of the earlier episodes even though I used to be an avid rewatcher between seasons, so I know what that feels like. Frankly, I really don't think that applies to FF7 Remake. The original staff are expanding on the game that they made. This is their source material that they're fleshing out. It doesn't feel like a George Lucas special edition to me either because they nailed the characterization, personalities, motivations, callbacks, and nostalgia.

There was tons of setups of the beginnings of Cloud's relationship of trust with Tifa and saving each other, which gets paid off in the later chapters. There's Barret's fight against Shinra which takes a heavy toll on him throughout the game, and is payed off with his revenge. Even the side characters have their motivations and backstories shown to the audience, and they all have their times to shine and their own payoffs throughout the game. There were a lot of emotionally compelling scenes that were the payoff to all the character building in earlier chapters. I don't see how you can say that there wasn't any pay offs in this game.

See here for discussion about setups and payoffs. I timestamped it for you.



Introducing new rules for the lifestream and the planet is not the same as expanding the lore, sound more like retcons, to me it achieves the opossite, it damages their consisntency. Weapons were just sleeping creatures woken up to attack and destroy, now it can create magical ghosts that revive people? and somehow defeating them changed another timeline?
and apparently you can use the lifestream to time travel physically or just your concisousnes? I'm sorry, I don't see how that's an interesting expansion of the lore but a confusing mess of new rules for the sake of... "surprise" I guess.
The lifestream stuff is consistent with previous lore. They expanded it by including whispers. Weapons are entities that defend the planet. They are manifested as physical giant creatures because they threat they were designed to face was physical. In Dirge of Cerberus, Omega and Chaos Weapons were different to suit their specific needs. In Remake, the Whispers are specifically designed to fulfill a more metaphysical objective, so it would track that their influence is metaphysical as well. Also, like in OG FF7, and Dirge of Cerberus, the antagonists coopt these Weapons for their own purposes.

Beating them in this game is just like beating them in the OG. You reject the planet's solution by killing it, and replacing it with your own.

True, I don't think they used them well.
I think they did. There's a lot of literary devices used very well. Characters have meaningful relationships that evolve. They have motivations and personality. Events are shown organically when they can and aren't always spoon fed to the player. There are themes. There's allusions, metaphor, conflict, drama, and a narrative structure that flows (albeit not always perfectly because it depends on how the player plays the game).

At the end of the day, if you really think they didn't tell a good story, that's your opinion which you're entitled to have, but I really think you're missing the forest for the trees.

I disagree, the build up to Sephiroth as a villain and the trail of blood, two of the most memorable moments of the orignal are gone, Aerith's fate is probably going to be changed, who knows, Zack's lasting effect on Cloud and Aerith's characters is most certainly going to change, Barret's arc is not nearly as interesting now that we know avanalanche is absolved of all guilt, Avalanache member's and most of the slums survivinng means the consequneces are not as high anymore. One of the few additions I thought were great was witnessing the destruction after the first bombing, but again, that was Shinra not you, so it only serves to establish Shinra as cartoonishly evil instead of the nuanced gray of Avalance.
You disagree? I assume the implication of the first paragraph was that you thought the first 90% was pretty faithful. There were a lot of payoffs in that first 90%. As for the Sephiroth scene, you're giving the details way too much importance over the general function of the plot beats. Sure it was changed, but what did we lose? Not much, I'd say. It was still creepy. You still get Sephiroth built up through a lot more backstory now. Does it really matter if that backstory is introduced earlier rather than later? I don't believe so.

If you didn't watch that first clip I posted, watch it again, where he specifically mentions the events at the top of Shinra HQ.


This is a dude who's played FF7 numerous times on his channel and has done many deep dives into the characters and lore. He thinks it was great. He has a point. It adds scenes between President Shinra and Barret that serve as a payoff for all the built up drama and tensions that came before it.

The "change" to the bombing is also not as drastic as you think. In the original game, Jessie did not intend for the bomb to be that big, so there was subtext that something was amiss. Here again, 4-8 Productions elaborates on that fact.


Shinra is totally cartoonishly evil in the OG, and Avalanche is still a nuanced grey in Remake, even with the more direct retelling of the bombing story. I'm not sure what you're basing your analysis off of, but it's not consistent with what's actually in the story. In Remake, they're still very much conflicted with what they're doing. There's that whole scene with Cloud and Tifa in the bar where she's not sure if she's doing the right thing. There's that whole Barret speech right after the bombing at the start of Chapter 2 where the rest of the team is having second thoughts and he says don't worry about it because I'm the leader and I'll take those mental burdens on for you.

I don't know, interpretaton is open I guess, but the concept of the whispers in itself is so flawed to me that anyhitng they do, including reviving people, even if it serves a greter purpose, seems cheap, especially when you give no time to process it.

That being said, they chickcened out killing anyone in this remake, I don't think they will do anything drastic in that regard in next parts, even blood was replaced with purple goop, to me what they established was that they want to lower the stakes not raise them.
If the concept of whispers is so flawed to you, you should be glad that they killed them. You're letting your opposition to change, cloud the experience. People still died. The presence or absence of blood is pretty meaningless overall. The depictions of violence and brutality are much stronger in Remake due to the higher visual fidelity. The fact that Sephiroth still wants to fuck everything up and now he has the power to do so because we killed the whispers does in fact raise the stakes.

Speaking of lasting effects, the "price of freedom" had a different meaning originally, you have to fight for your freedom even if it kills you, basically Zack's death was the price to pay for Cloud's freedom, that's powerful, and now it means the price for the new game is killing the OG timeline? and if we take the metanarrative into account (which that last part totally is) meaning you free yourself from the responsibility of doing a proper remake? no man, I don't like that one bit.
Yes, that's what Zack's words would mean in the context of that moment. That doesn't mean any additional layers take away from that. I think your assertion that the price for the new game is killing the OG is a bit of a stretch and exaggeration. You're overthinking it. The OG is still very much alive and well. Remake does well to put it on a pedestal and pay lots of homage to it. The OG is the OG. It's still here and always will be. Nothing Remake has done yet ruins the past. While pulling a Game of Thrones or Spiderman 3 is well within the realm of possibility, I'm not going to slam the creators until they actually do that. From my perspective, they're fortunately doing the opposite of that.

When you take the metanarrative into account, the meaning should be that you free yourself from the chains of the path and allow yourself to experience the story you already know like it was the first time again. That is the gift this "wackiness" will give you, if you just let go of your hangups. But hey, everyone's got their own threshold and I can't force you to change your mind if you don't want to.

Other thing that bothers me is the fact that the metanarrative is so blatantly meta it doens't feeel like an organic part of the story. If there's one answer I want is this:

Aerith states that what lies beyond is boundless terrifying freedom.

We know what that means for the devs and the audince, but what does it mean for the characters within the stablished story?
What it means for the story is that now they're not bound by fate. They're free to save the world even harder, or fuck it all up even harder. They sacrificed the "safe" ending for the potential of a "good" ending, while risking the "very bad" ending. It's a good piece of character growth. Those plot ghosts that annoyed you all game are gone now because you killed them and you're going to have to deal with the repercussions of that action, the good along with the bad. She misses the steel sky. There was that whole bit when you first meet her about how she's comforted by being under the plate - her security blanket, but now when confronted with the open sky, which reminds her of Zack's death as well as the Calamity from the Sky, it's also representative of that freedom which is now at the player's mercy.


TLDR: As a lover of literature, good storytelling, good themes, good character development, and honoring source material, I don't see how the devs fucked up. I think they did a good job.
 
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Nymphae

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I wasn't a huge fan of the more stretched out areas of the game, but I do actually like the direction they are taking it narratively and am intrigued by the plot changes.

I've played OG a numerous times, and at the end here I was like....ok what happened with Zack originally again? It's not like they stood over the corpse of FF7 and took a steaming shit on it, they just wanted to do something a little different and I'm cool with that, they're going to hit all of the important beats so seeing people cry about not slavishly sticking to the OG plot seems pretty weak to me.
 

DryPancakes

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Then you're letting your dissatisfaction of a small portion of the game that is specifically designed to get you out of your comfort zone and think about the story disproportionately taint your enjoyment of a story that you already love.
Is not just a small portion, for me it’s the most important portion; I don’t think this is an expansion at all, it’s a retcon, as the first thing I said, I don’t see how any of the new plot elements fit within this universe, that’s where my main problem comes from, it’s not just taking me out my comfort zone, it’s taking me to a completely different place where I have no idea what the rules are, and even if that wasn’t the case, for me the execution ruins any chance of anything new having any value, but I guess you understand my point by your example, imagine if Jon Snow went back in time to plot his scheme from the beginning and Peter Dinklage somehow had knowledge of the future but is being somber and menacing with cryptic philosophical lines, then a portal to a new dimension with the Dragons of Destiny is opened and we now have to fight them to change the course of the story, if you were already disappointed with the current ending, that is how I feel about this remake. Many will argue that FF has always been crazy so giant heartless and parallel timelines are not out of the ordinary, but I would say they are out of the ordinary because the rules stablished in the original story should matter more than any new element being added, if it doesn’t at least respect the original rules then it might as well be a completely new game with new characters and a new story. I do like the characterization, personalities, motivations, etc. I agree with that and it’s pretty good, but to me that doesn’t amount to much when the rest of the story doesn’t come together to support that, the story is so off the rails now that the initial grounded motivation of fighting an evil corporation seems meaningless at this point when we already know we can defeat Destiny itself, and the power scaling is so off the charts next non-omega level boss fights won’t make sense anymore from a narrative stand point. All that to say, if you care about the consistency of the narrative and this universe, it’s a mess, not only consistency of the story but how consistent it is with the characters and they’re place in it. Again, I do understand and like the characters, but to me there’s no narrative or consistency in the universe to support those characters. If this was any other game I would be able to pick and choose what I Iike and ignore the rest, but seeing how this is a remake of a game that was already pretty good in that regard (maybe not better, subjective) I don’t see how I should settle for anything less.

I don’t believe the lifestream is consistent, just because you add a new element doesn’t mean that addition by itself should be justification, you only say they are there to defend the planet, but the mechanics by which they did had a logic to it, not just magic entities, but basically ancient monsters buried on the ground and the sea inactive until they were needed and woken up, I don’t think Dirge of Cerberus is a good example since the compilation also added a bunch of stuff out of nowhere just to have justification for new stories, the compilation was when the inconsistencies and retcons started.

I quote myself again:

you mean to the compilation? the compilation that is regarded as almost all bad? Good job then, you unified it and made FF7 just as terrible.
I kind of agree with the giant heartless being a weapon and the whispers being extension of it, that’s fine, but the mechanics and their reason to exists is what bothers me, if it was called Rubrum Weapon or something I would be more willing to accept it, but I don’t even think the devs thought about it that hard, that seems to be a theory, it makes more sense that way, but even if that’s the case, I still don’t like why it exists or how it works, to me is not consistent with the original idea of the weapons.

but I really think you're missing the forest for the trees.
Maybe, but in this case the trees are the narrative, which yes, it does overshadow the characterization and anything good about it, if you were to take the characters in a vacuum, I agree, it’s pretty good what they did with them, but those characters need to exist in a narrative and a universe, and that’s where it falls apart for me, I cannot take their emotional arc seriously if 5 hours later they’re flipping and flopping in the air and punching destiny in the face, I’m glad you can, but I can’t. I would be able to in another anime game with god as the final boss, but not here.

You disagree? I assume the implication of the first paragraph was that you thought the first 90% was pretty faithful.
I meant, the initial 90% without ghosts, the final 10% includes the ending plus the inclusion of the ghosts throughout the story. I think the pacing and the buildup matters, one of the excuses is that we already know so it wouldn’t be as impactful, I care less if it’s impactful or not and more about if it’s well done and well executed even if I already know where it ends, but I guess we’ll disagree no matter what.

I have also played it several times, I’ve also seen other youtubers who agree and disagree, I’ve watched a lot of videos about it everyone with different points of view, I’ve even watched Max’s 4 levels of whatever theory, I agree with the characterizations and some plot points, Shinra’s comeback to Barret was brilliant, Jesse’s expanded adventures were fun, Roche had potential and might still have, Chadley sucks, Cloud’s interaction with Tifa and Aerith were cute and fun and meaningful, the resolution scenes were great, the ancient propaganda VR room was fantastic, I agree with a lot of that, but ultimately, there’s no narrative to support it IMO, which is a shame, because if those expansions happened but the narrative still followed the og story, it would have been great and imo the best case scenario, not if just followed the original but also if the changes just made more sense; (again IMO) the story has lost its cohesion and all those great moments amounted to nothing.

About the bombing and shinra, it doesn’t matter if the characters feel bad about it, we as the audience know what the truth is, wouldn’t ‘t it be better if we felt as guilty as Jessie and Barret? Or at least we had an indication they might actually be guilty? All emotional tension is gone. That and many other similar instances had no creative meaning, they admitted in the ultimania interview they had to do that because post 9/11 we cannot have a terrorist group as the good guys so gray areas had to go, same with jenova’s purple goop instead of blood was done to get past classification boards, so, no narrative impact there anymore, just avoiding controversy.

It doesn’t matter if the whispers are gone they already did the damage, instead of having them gone now they shouldn’t have existed in the first place. Fixing a problem by getting rid of it in next games doesn’t fix the damage they did to the narrative.

The OG is still very much alive and well. Remake does well to put it on a pedestal and pay lots of homage to it.
Disagree, paying homage and respecting the legacy wouldn’t be changing it with TIME TRAVEL and PARALEL DIMENSIONS, the cheapest plot devices possible, honestly this feel like a slap on the face, we obviously disagree, whatever.

All you said about freedom, is about mostly Aerith and possibly Red, the rest of the characters know nothing about that, and they have no reason to assume they sacrificed the safe ending, Red even says is the bad ending, again, that sounds more like meta knowledge than in-narrative character knowledge, but that’s just a minor gripe, it’s really not that important as opposed to everything else.

TLDR: I also like, good storytelling, good themes, good character development, and honoring source material, that’s why I think introducing parallel timelines, fate and possible time travel in a remake/quasi sequel feels like a retcon more like an expansion.

Ultimately we disagree, for me it’s really more than just subjective though, the word REMAKE brings a lot of implications and expectations, if you’re not going to be faithful to the narrative, at least be faithful to the rules and the themes and change accordingly, but that didn’t happen either, IMO, if you had all the wonderful character enhancements, some new plot developments like Roche and expansions like Avalanche and the Wutai War WITHOUT the need of ghosts, destiny, and without the need to shove Sephiroth in every 20 minutes and no bombastic Heartless battle at the end, again, just move Jenova to the end of the highway, then that would have been fantastic, 9/10 easy, the new plot elements feel unnecessary and badly executed and bring down everything else with it to an honest 4/10. Good graphics and good characters cannot save it. IMO, IMO.
 
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Kamehameha

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Started replaying this on hard and one thing hit me: are we currently in the OG timeline or from the very begining this is a new timeline itself?

Because Red, Aerith and Sephiroth somehow know how events should pan out, thus the original game.
Meaning they're not from this timeline?

Because in the original timeline they didn't knew jackshit.

I swear to good, I love the game and that this is a new take/expansion but after playing all the Kingdom Hearts saga I'm afraid they mess this up, and I'm not in the mood if they pull out of the ass multiple Sephiroth's and shit like that, just like the Xehanort mambo jambo, for the love of good...

Also, didn't the XIII saga also messed up with multiple timelines?
 
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Shouta

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On the bombing run, I actually was on the look out in my playthrough of the original FF7 for that. I grabbed some screenshots about it. The first set is Jessie's comments on the actual strength of the bomb and the second is President Shinra's reaction to Barrett's comments at Reactor 5. I played it in Japanese just so I could make sure I saw what it was. I provided my own translation though it probably isn't super perfect since I'm doing it quick.

What's important is that Jessie definitely was expecting a smaller explosion than what happened with Reactor 1. It turned out to be much larger than that though. As for the President Shinra exchange, this might be me but it seems to indicate he's willingly let the reactor blow-up as a means of dealing with Avalanche since he refers to the explosion as fireworks. Additionally, he comes out from the reactor after them and then just nonchalantly goes to a dinner party afterwards and lets it explodes. When you combine the two it feels like what we saw in Remake, that Shinra was actually blowing up the Reactors to frame Avalanche themselves. it also makes a lot of sense that this would occur too since Shinra drops the Sector 7 plate as well. If they were capable of that, then framing Avalanche for a bombing run seems pretty reasonable.

Jessie's comments:

Jessie: "I can't believe..."
Jessie: "Look at the news, the explosion was that big..."
Jessie: "It must have been the fault of my bomb? But I created it just like the instructions on this computer said to"
Jessie: "Oh no, Could I have made a miscalculation somewhere?"





President Shinra's comments

Barrett: "Whatever! That doesn't matter! This place is about to go KABOOM! How about that!"
Shinra: "Quite true. These are rather expensive fireworks just to deal with vermin like you but..."


The game looks a lot better with a scanline filter than without, lol. Even the ugly map models are a bit more tolerable.

Started replaying this on hard and one thing hit me: are we currently in the OG timeline or from the very begining this is a new timeline itself?
It kind of depends on how you see dimensions/time travel. At least in my interpretation, Remake is its own thing and separate from OG FF7 entirely. It occurred and is done. The aftermath of that leads to Remake. This avoids a lot of casual loop issues with time travel stuff we run into that people have trouble wrapping their mind around.
 
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Sign

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I don't think Shinra helping to blow up the reactor changes anything. The party does not know and actually doubles down for reactor 5 after seeing the destruction of the first. I think this solution actually works really well because it shows just how small time Avalanche is, how in control Shinra is, and does not undercut the "ends justify the means" principles of the group.
 
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Kamehameha

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It kind of depends on how you see dimensions/time travel. At least in my interpretation, Remake is its own thing and separate from OG FF7 entirely. It occurred and is done. The aftermath of that leads to Remake. This avoids a lot of casual loop issues with time travel stuff we run into that people have trouble wrapping their mind around.
But that still leaves the question how Red, Aerith and Sephiroth behave like they don't belong in this new timeline.


On another note, guys help me out here:

How many parry mechanics are there for cloud?

1) Switching from operator to punisher before attack hits you

2) Auto counter while pressing R1 if you're in punisher mode

3) Counterstance ability

4) Parry materia

Am I missing any? I keep reading theres some sort of counter that when execute displays a dope slow-motion effect. Which one is that? Counterstance?
 
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Shouta

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But that still leaves the question how Red, Aerith and Sephiroth behave like they don't belong in this new timeline.
That's in the theories we've posted about. Aerith and Sephiroth might be from OG FF7 or have information being passed to them. Aerith seems to have the ability to pass that information to others as we see when she seems to give both Marlene and Red XIII information. Nothing is set in stone but the hints are there.


On another note, guys help me out here:

How many parry mechanics are there for cloud?

1) Switching from operator to punisher before attack hits you

2) Auto counter while pressing R1 if you're in punisher mode

3) Counterstance ability

4) Parry materia

Am I missing any? I keep reading theres some sort of counter that when execute displays a dope slow-motion effect. Which one is that? Counterstance?
1 and 2 are basically the same thing. Punisher/Attack mode has a counter itself. Counterstance and then Parry are the other ones. All of them have a bit of slow-down I think but not that much as I recall.
 
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Sign

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It doesn't really change much. I just thought it was hinted in the original so I went and looked for it, lol.
I am messing around with OG 7 in english as well, and she definately mentions it there too. A lot of the expanded stuff in remake is pretty well grounded I feel like. For example, I completely forgot Johnny was a character in OG but there he is!
 

Rentahamster

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This is the neat anime short that came bundled with Advent Children. It describes the Nibelheim incident.


There are some changes to it from the OG game, and it's interesting to hear what the creators' response to that was. They're no stranger to annoying the fanbase with changes.


Nevertheless, with the world of Final Fantasy VII occupying such a precious place in the hearts of so many gamers, they were keen to take fan opinions into account. "Obviously as part of a beloved series, part of a popular world, there's immense pressure to produce," says Kitase. "It wasn't about paying tribute to the original, but to create a connection between the original and all the other Compilation titles as well. It was in a unique position, as it takes place in the past, to connect to all of the titles." Indeed, as the earliest game in the Final Fantasy VII timeline, it occupies a position of some importance, which is why they were so keen to make sure that they exceeded the expectations of the fan community.

"In between Advent Children and Crisis Core, there was a short animated feature called Last Order," explains Imaizumi. Last Order, like Crisis Core, was also about Zack and how he related to the crucial events at Nibelheim that were depicted in the original Final Fantasy VII. "When we made that feature, we changed the presentation of that event from the original Final Fantasy VII. And the fan response was - well, there was considerable negative feedback in regard to changing a part of the story that they considered integral to the whole lore. So we listened to that and learned from that. And in fact the Nibelheim incident is presented again in Crisis Core, and we were careful not to make the same decisions that we did in Last Order."
 

wzy

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But that still leaves the question how Red, Aerith and Sephiroth behave like they don't belong in this new timeline.


On another note, guys help me out here:

How many parry mechanics are there for cloud?

1) Switching from operator to punisher before attack hits you

2) Auto counter while pressing R1 if you're in punisher mode

3) Counterstance ability

4) Parry materia

Am I missing any? I keep reading theres some sort of counter that when execute displays a dope slow-motion effect. Which one is that? Counterstance?
Reno fight only: if you dodge directly towards him during his lunging attack you will flip over his shoulders and immediately cause a pressure state. It's a special, one time only animation that I've not seen this mentioned in any guides, videos, or forum discussions and it makes me wonder if there are any other unique interactions out there for different enemies. I know that with Rufus you can use Triple Strike to counter Dark Star but other than that I haven't seen anything else.
 
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Sign

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Did any of you guys notice how bloodthirsty Cloud is? He tries to kill Marco, Johnny, the guards, and Reno. I wonder if it might be foreshadowing considering how deliberate a lot of the things in this game are.
 
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leo-j

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I loved what they did with the ending. This is Perfect Cell all over again but in FF VII. Sephiroth managed to save his essence and traveled to the past and is trying to change fate. Aka cell who kills trunks and goes to the past to become perfect. So basically this is going to mostly follow the time line but w some changes and Aerith dying isn’t certain, neither is Sephiroth.
 

Kamehameha

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I loved what they did with the ending. This is Perfect Cell all over again but in FF VII. Sephiroth managed to save his essence and traveled to the past and is trying to change fate. Aka cell who kills trunks and goes to the past to become perfect. So basically this is going to mostly follow the time line but w some changes and Aerith dying isn’t certain, neither is Sephiroth.
So who will go SSJ2 by the end?

BTW I need help with chapter 7 on hard mode. How many keycards are there for the airbuster? I keep reading 6 but only have found 5. The keycard between B7 and B6 is not there. Do they change places or something?
 

Rentahamster

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So who will go SSJ2 by the end?

BTW I need help with chapter 7 on hard mode. How many keycards are there for the airbuster? I keep reading 6 but only have found 5. The keycard between B7 and B6 is not there. Do they change places or something?
I don't really remember but isn't the point of that section that you can't disable everything so you have to pick your poison?
 

Rentahamster

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No, I can proceed for the boss if I want, but first I wanted to find the card.
Eh, just kill him, he ain't that hard. Maybe you accidentally spent one too many keycards on another component. There's a chance you used them all already. They are kinda conspicuous and hard to miss.
 

TwoDurans

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It never ceases to crack me up when people say that this shouldn't be called "a remake" since they changed the story so much. I think the subtitle flew over their heads a bit.
 

LordKasual

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My old theory about the OG FF7's ending resulting in Holy wiping humanity i feel like got even more ammo from one of Sephiroth's lines during the final fight:

"The planet will consume you"

Did any of you guys notice how bloodthirsty Cloud is? He tries to kill Marco, Johnny, the guards, and Reno. I wonder if it might be foreshadowing considering how deliberate a lot of the things in this game are.
I noticed this too, it makes me think that this cloud's past is somehow a bit different than OG Cloud's.
 
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Rentahamster

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My old theory about the OG FF7's ending resulting in Holy wiping humanity i feel like got even more ammo from one of Sephiroth's lines during the final fight:

"The planet will consume you"
Also there's the part where Red13 gets a premonition of the future, which is a short clip of the after credits of OG FF7, and he remarks that that is the future if they fail - that the ending of OG FF7 was the "bad" ending.

I noticed this too, it makes me think that this cloud's past is somehow a bit different than OG Cloud's.
I dunno about that. I think it might just be extra fleshing out to portray the militant "SOLDIER-ness" of his persona. While there's a bunch of clues that hint that Remake Aerith and Sephiroth might be a little different, I haven't noticed any strong hints that Cloud might be different.
 

LordKasual

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But that still leaves the question how Red, Aerith and Sephiroth behave like they don't belong in this new timeline.
This is explained with my current theory (where the party actually decides to fight the whispers and defy fate because the future they see is the end of humanity)

Aerith -- she's the last living ancient, and can speak to the lifestream. The Whispers are part of the lifestream (like WEAPON). Everyone else is getting visions, but Aerith can actually UNDERSTAND the whispers and so after a while would very obviously know what they were doing and why.

Sephiroth -- Jenova, not part of the planet, but still caught up in whatever is happening in the future/other dimension causing the events of the game.

Red XIII -- The biggest evidence for this, the reason Red XIII probably knows more about what's going on in this timeline is because while Cloud/Barrett/Tifa are getting glimpses of their future (that ends shortly after Meteor), Red XIII is getting glimpses of a future at LEAST 400 years past that event. So to Cloud and friends, those visions seem cryptic, but to Aerith and Red, they are very obviously glimpses of a future they were part of.

- Towards the end of the game, Aerith is behaving less like Aerith and more like.....either OG Aerith, or an avatar of the Lifestream (the same way Sephiroth is an avatar for Jenova), although honestly if we're talking "Future Aerith" then there is essentially no difference between the two because she dies and becomes part of the lifestream during the events of FF7.

- This theory assumes Advent Children is non-canon...... but the Sword/Gun/Fist whispers are NOT time travelling Cloud/Tifa/Barrett.....they are the Lifestream using the likeness of Cloud/Tifa/Barrett to carry out its will. Whether the party dies during Meteor or dies of old age, once they die, they return to the lifestream....so the planet using them as warriors to maintain a specific timeline makes sense. Especially since Cloud and the party are the ones who actually finished off Jenova and released Holy. The "Whispers" are Gaia behaving more like Jenova.


I feel like whatever is happening to the planet has been cleverly alluded to by Sephiroth since the very beginning -- he constantly alludes to the planet "dying" and "everything being lost" if it does.

Before you knew what the Whispers were, you'd assume he was talking about Shinra and the reactors. But he's likely talking about some cosmic event in the future that's ACTUALLY killing the planet.


So in a nutshell:

- The original FF7 is the "Bad Ending" of FF7 for the party (because all of humanity dies)....but it's ultimately the GOOD ending for the planet because not only is Jenova is destroyed, but the second biggest threat to planet (humans) are as well.

- Knowing this, the planet wants to ensure the events of history always result in the same GOOD ending for itself (Shinra, Jenova, and humans cleansed from the face of the earth)

- Aerith can interpret the whispers. You can hear her struggling a bit with these kinds of realizations throughout the game.

- Red XIII is the ONLY FF7 party member to understand ANYTHING that's happening in the future because he's the only one to survive the events of the original.

What we dont know is the role of Sephiroth (Jenova) in all this.

what i think:

- Sephiroth (Jenova) knows that she will inevitably lose as long as the planet gets what it wants and history plays out the way it should.
- However, armed with the knowledge that the future ends badly for humanity as well, Jenova is willing to bargin with Cloud (*who is also technically part Jenova*) in order to successfully alter events enough to have a shot at successfully consuming the lifestream.


Whatever the truth is, it very much seems like Jenova is the catalyst of this "Remaking" of events. Aerith has no idea what the whispers are at the beginning of the game, and it seems like Sephiroth is the one who's showing her.
 
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Rentahamster

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This theory assumes Advent Children is non-canon...... but the Sword/Gun/Fist whispers are NOT time travelling Cloud/Tifa/Barrett.....they are the Lifestream using the likeness of Cloud/Tifa/Barrett to carry out its will.
They are actually using the likenesses of Kadaj, Loz, and Yazoo.
 

LordKasual

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They are actually using the likenesses of Kadaj, Loz, and Yazoo.
What would be the purpose of this though?

The only way this would make sense is if the Lifestream has already been compromised by Jenova.

At which point, it would make no sense for the whispers to use remnants of Jenova to stop the party from doing exactly what Jenova wants actually wants them to.


Unless the "whispers" you fight at the end aren't the "planet" whispers at all and are some other kind of manifestation of Jenova.

Which, again, makes the entire final battle completely pointless because any way you spin it, the parties fighting each other are doing it 100% out of the realm of their own interest.


If Gaia's whispers are trying to keep its DESIRED fate on track, why would it ever keep trying to lead you towards a future where it loses enough for Jenova to take control of time and screw up the one thing they're supposed to be stopping?

If Jenova's "whispers" (remnants) are trying to keep the future on track so that it results in them living, why the hell would the PLANET be aiding them to do so?

If the party sees the outcome of either of these scenarios, why on earth would they (including Aerith) choose to willingly defy it?


the only scenario in which any of the final events of FF7R make any sense is one where Cloud, Aerith, RedXIII, AND Sephiroth have a common reason to defy the will of the Planet.
 
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TwoDurans

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This is explained with my current theory (where the party actually decides to fight the whispers and defy fate because the future they see is the end of humanity)

Aerith -- she's the last living ancient, and can speak to the lifestream. The Whispers are part of the lifestream (like WEAPON). Everyone else is getting visions, but Aerith can actually UNDERSTAND the whispers and so after a while would very obviously know what they were doing and why.

Sephiroth -- Jenova, not part of the planet, but still caught up in whatever is happening in the future/other dimension causing the events of the game.

Red XIII -- The biggest evidence for this, the reason Red XIII probably knows more about what's going on in this timeline is because while Cloud/Barrett/Tifa are getting glimpses of their future (that ends shortly after Meteor), Red XIII is getting glimpses of a future at LEAST 400 years past that event. So to Cloud and friends, those visions seem cryptic, but to Aerith and Red, they are very obviously glimpses of a future they were part of.

- Towards the end of the game, Aerith is behaving less like Aerith and more like.....either OG Aerith, or an avatar of the Lifestream (the same way Sephiroth is an avatar for Jenova), although honestly if we're talking "Future Aerith" then there is essentially no difference between the two because she dies and becomes part of the lifestream during the events of FF7.

- This theory assumes Advent Children is non-canon...... but the Sword/Gun/Fist whispers are NOT time travelling Cloud/Tifa/Barrett.....they are the Lifestream using the likeness of Cloud/Tifa/Barrett to carry out its will. Whether the party dies during Meteor or dies of old age, once they die, they return to the lifestream....so the planet using them as warriors to maintain a specific timeline makes sense. Especially since Cloud and the party are the ones who actually finished off Jenova and released Holy. The "Whispers" are Gaia behaving more like Jenova.


I feel like whatever is happening to the planet has been cleverly alluded to by Sephiroth since the very beginning -- he constantly alludes to the planet "dying" and "everything being lost" if it does.

Before you knew what the Whispers were, you'd assume he was talking about Shinra and the reactors. But he's likely talking about some cosmic event in the future that's ACTUALLY killing the planet.


So in a nutshell:

- The original FF7 is the "Bad Ending" of FF7 for the party (because all of humanity dies)....but it's ultimately the GOOD ending for the planet because not only is Jenova is destroyed, but the second biggest threat to planet (humans) are as well.

- Knowing this, the planet wants to ensure the events of history always result in the same GOOD ending for itself (Shinra, Jenova, and humans cleansed from the face of the earth)

- Aerith can interpret the whispers. You can hear her struggling a bit with these kinds of realizations throughout the game.

- Red XIII is the ONLY FF7 party member to understand ANYTHING that's happening in the future because he's the only one to survive the events of the original.

What we dont know is the role of Sephiroth (Jenova) in all this.

what i think:

- Sephiroth (Jenova) knows that she will inevitably lose as long as the planet gets what it wants and history plays out the way it should.
- However, armed with the knowledge that the future ends badly for humanity as well, Jenova is willing to bargin with Cloud (*who is also technically part Jenova*) in order to successfully alter events enough to have a shot at successfully consuming the lifestream.


Whatever the truth is, it very much seems like Jenova is the catalyst of this "Remaking" of events. Aerith has no idea what the whispers are at the beginning of the game, and it seems like Sephiroth is the one who's showing her.
I agree with everything here except that I think FF7 is the true ending, and everything else (including Advent which is canon) is Sephy's attempt to remake time so that he can still achieve his godlike status he was chasing. Based on what we know so far it does work if you look at Advent as a second attempt that failed, and remake as the third. It sort of has a FF13-2 ring to it where the bad guy has infinite tries since he controls time.
 
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LordKasual

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Also there's the part where Red13 gets a premonition of the future, which is a short clip of the after credits of OG FF7, and he remarks that that is the future if they fail - that the ending of OG FF7 was the "bad" ending.

I dunno about that. I think it might just be extra fleshing out to portray the militant "SOLDIER-ness" of his persona. While there's a bunch of clues that hint that Remake Aerith and Sephiroth might be a little different, I haven't noticed any strong hints that Cloud might be different.
There are a couple of pretty big hints as to how Cloud could actually be quite different from OG Cloud:

1) The amount of diversion from OG FF7 in the time between the Bombing Mission and 7th heaven is actually quite minimal......yet, Cloud was offputting enough to Barrett to actually not want him on the second bombing mission.

This directly resulted in the huge swarm of whispers in Sector 7 the next morning, because Cloud wasn't going on the mission.

**2) In the first Sephiroth flashback after bombing mission, cloud explicitly says to him "You're not real. I killed you with my own- - *GASP*"

In the OG FF7, if you remember, cloud's backstory with Sephiroth cuts off RIGHT before Zack's initial fight with Sephiroth.

Cloud had no clue about the whereabouts of Sephiroth or what actually happened during the Nibelheim incident, and he was very sure he COULDN'T have killed him. But right after the bombing mission in FF7R, he seemed to realize that HE actually killed him, and in the moment he said it, it seemed like he was realizing it at that very moment.


Which is massive, because not only is the one of the few true memories of Cloud, it is THE most important memory he regains from the Lifestream in the OG FF7 when Tifa is trying to fix his mind.
 
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Sign

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My old theory about the OG FF7's ending resulting in Holy wiping humanity i feel like got even more ammo from one of Sephiroth's lines during the final fight:

"The planet will consume you"



I noticed this too, it makes me think that this cloud's past is somehow a bit different than OG Cloud's.
I interpreted it more as Sephiroth has got Cloud on tilt from his shenanigans.

What would be the purpose of this though?

The only way this would make sense is if the Lifestream has already been compromised by Jenova.

At which point, it would make no sense for the whispers to use remnants of Jenova to stop the party from doing exactly what Jenova wants actually wants them to.


Unless the "whispers" you fight at the end aren't the "planet" whispers at all and are some other kind of manifestation of Jenova.

Which, again, makes the entire final battle completely pointless because any way you spin it, the parties fighting each other are doing it 100% out of the realm of their own interest.

If Gaia's whispers are trying to keep its DESIRED fate on track, why would it ever keep trying to lead you towards a future where it loses enough for Jenova to take control of time and screw up the one thing they're supposed to be stopping?

If Jenova's "whispers" (remnants) are trying to keep the future on track so that it results in them living, why the hell would the PLANET be aiding them to do so?

If the party sees the outcome of either of these scenarios, why on earth would they (including Aerith) choose to willingly defy it?


the only scenario in which any of the final events of FF7R make any sense is one where Cloud, Aerith, RedXIII, AND Sephiroth have a common reason to defy the will of the Planet.
At the end of Dirge the planet gets locked away from the greater lifestream all smaller lifestreams eventually join . Geostigma still exists and in some form so does Sephiroth both of which are poisoning the planet's lifestream. There is a very good chance that the Jenova that exists in the future consumed the planet but is trapped there. This is a fail condition for Sephiroth and a sacrifice that the planet is willing to make. The Harbinger and other things we fight are not really the Advent Children, but merely the future that gave birth to them.

Basically:

- Aerith wants a redo since the future leads to humanities extinction. She thinks the planet is wrong and Sephiroth needs to be stopped now.
- The party help because she is best girl and they trust her.
- Sephiroth wants a do over because he doesn't get what he wants which is to use the planet as a vessel to travel to the greater lifestream.
- The Planet may have decided it will be a prison for Sephiroth and is fighting to insure it.
- The time jannies just want people to stop knocking over their magazine racks until the designated time.
- The capital "D" Destiny and all those who come about from it want to continue coming about.
 
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LordKasual

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At the end of Dirge the planet gets locked away from the greater lifestream all smaller lifestreams eventually join . Geostigma still exists and in some form so does Sephiroth both of which are poisoning the planet's lifestream. There is a very good chance that the Jenova that exists in the future consumed the planet but is trapped there. This is a fail condition for Sephiroth and a sacrifice that the planet is willing to make. The Harbinger and other things we fight are not really the Advent Children, but merely the future that gave birth to them.
I was really, really hoping that Dirge was non-canon.

If this is true, then the final scene with the 2 nebula (and Sephiroth constantly talking about the planet dying) start making a bit more sense.

However......that would literally mean that FF7R has become Kingdom Hearts, and understanding the outcome of this game (and the future ones) are contingent everyone having played FF7 (ps1), Crisis Core (psp), Dirge (Ps2), and watched Advent Children ( a movie) as well as likely played all those other obscure compilation games (which includes cellphone)

If Dirge is canon then there is 0 hope for the overarching story of the Remake sequels to make any sort of sense or have decent writing at all, and i'm not even gonna waste my time trying to make sense of it.
 
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TwoDurans

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I was really, really hoping that Dirge was non-canon.

If this is true, then the final scene with the 2 nebula (and Sephiroth constantly talking about the planet dying) start making a bit more sense.

However......that would literally mean that FF7R has become Kingdom Hearts, and understanding the outcome of this game (and the future ones) are contingent everyone having played FF7 (ps1), Crisis Core (psp), Dirge (Ps2), and watched Advent Children ( a movie) as well as likely played all those other obscure compilation games (which includes cellphone)

If Dirge is canon then there is 0 hope for the overarching story of the Remake sequels to make any sort of sense or have decent writing at all, and i'm not even gonna waste my time trying to make sense of it.
Nomuraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
 

Sign

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I was really, really hoping that Dirge was non-canon.

If this is true, then the final scene with the 2 nebula (and Sephiroth constantly talking about the planet dying) start making a bit more sense.

However......that would literally mean that FF7R has become Kingdom Hearts, and understanding the outcome of this game (and the future ones) are contingent everyone having played FF7 (ps1), Crisis Core (psp), Dirge (Ps2), and watched Advent Children ( a movie) as well as likely played all those other obscure compilation games (which includes cellphone)

If Dirge is canon then there is 0 hope for the overarching story of the Remake sequels to make any sort of sense or have decent writing at all, and i'm not even gonna waste my time trying to make sense of it.
Ehhh. Nothing about this game requires knowledge of the other titles to follow. Planet wants what it wants. Sephiroth wants something else. Aerith thinks the Planet is wrong in what it wants. You "defy fate" to do what needs to be done. None of this requires any additional knowledge. 95% of the coming parts will adhere to the original and everything else will be explained when needed, imo.

If you thought this game was decent in writing, and it already was using most stuff from the compilation then I don't know why the quality would change later.

Sephiroth going back kinda turns things like Dirge non-canon anyway. It might give a hint as to Sephiroth's initial motivations, but none of it has happened yet and will not in the remake.
 
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DryPancakes

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I loved what they did with the ending. This is Perfect Cell all over again but in FF VII. Sephiroth managed to save his essence and traveled to the past and is trying to change fate. Aka cell who kills trunks and goes to the past to become perfect. So basically this is going to mostly follow the time line but w some changes and Aerith dying isn’t certain, neither is Sephiroth.
I really have a hard time understanding how this is a good thing or a good idea? Am I really crazy for thinking time travel wether physical or just essence is just BAD storytelling? Is this really what FF7 deserved? TIme travel?
 

Rentahamster

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What would be the purpose of this though?
Unclear. There are hints that the Whisper Harbinger has some connection to Sephiroth/Jenova due to the purple color. Whether it is Sephiroth or the planet in control of Whisper Harbinger is not known at this point.

The only way this would make sense is if the Lifestream has already been compromised by Jenova.
Isn't it though? Sephiroth contains Jenova cells, and both he and Jenova's head fell into the lifestream 5 years ago at Nibellheim.

At which point, it would make no sense for the whispers to use remnants of Jenova to stop the party from doing exactly what Jenova wants actually wants them to.
We don't know if it's actually them, or just a likeness of them used for some reason. There is a possible reason for the Whispers to do that which I'll touch on later.

Unless the "whispers" you fight at the end aren't the "planet" whispers at all and are some other kind of manifestation of Jenova.
Maybe. They might be purely the planet. They might be corrupted by Jenova. They might be controlled by Jenova. It's not clearly stated what's going on.

Which, again, makes the entire final battle completely pointless because any way you spin it, the parties fighting each other are doing it 100% out of the realm of their own interest.
Yeah, they are trying to achieve their objectives, the party, the planet, and Sephiroth, and all have their own interests, but I'm not sure how that makes it pointless. Here is one scenario that makes the actions line up with motivations.

First, consider the OG timeline: Cloud beats Sephiroth (FF7), Cloud beats Sephiroth again (AC). Jenova is quarantined and cut off from the rest of the galaxy (DoC), Humanity is extinct but the planet lives on 500 years later (FF7 ending).

The planet wants this to play out because at the end of the day, the planet still exists. Humanity is dead but the planet don't give a shit.

Jenova/Sephiroth doesn't want this to play out because Jenova ultimately gets quarantined and its desire to travel the stars and assimilate other planets is stopped.

"What I want"


Aerith also doesn't want this to play out but for different reasons. Aerith wants to find a solution that results in Sephiroth's defeat + not having humanity go extinct.

The planet gets what it wants by summoning the whispers to protect the OG timeline because it knows that it wins in the end, with acceptable losses.

Sephiroth/Jenova gets what he wants by either corrupting the whispers, or manipulating cloud into killing them for him. That way he can change destiny to be one where he wins.

Aerith gets what she wants by killing the whispers (to prevent the OG ending where everyone dies anyway) and by stopping Sephiroth so that she might create a new future where both the planet and humans can survive and Jenova is not merely quarantined but destroyed. She is risking the possibility of Sephiroth winning on the chance that they can have a better future.
 

Kev Kev

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I really have a hard time understanding how this is a good thing or a good idea? Am I really crazy for thinking time travel wether physical or just essence is just BAD storytelling? Is this really what FF7 deserved? TIme travel?
no youre no crazy at all. they are one shart away from shitting their pants and completely messing the bed. but im still holding out hope that they can pull things together in the next installments.
 

LordKasual

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no youre no crazy at all. they are one shart away from shitting their pants and completely messing the bed. but im still holding out hope that they can pull things together in the next installments.
Square Enix has this really arrogant / fucking stupid habit of having a "No Entry Left Behind" policy when it comes to their games, whether they're trash or not.

FFXIII? Made on a shit engine with terrible issues? Lets make it a trilogy. FFXIII's story was nonsensical? Cool, both of the sequels are time travel plots.

FFX did well on ps2? Let's make a sequel to that too. Then lets make a dumbass book where tidus kicks a blitzball and gets his head blown off. And then lets try to make it canon with FF7 because why the fuck not

FFXIV is a piece of shit game? Let's not just remake it, but lets make the remaking canon. (this actually works though)

FFXV would be a masterpiece of a game if it were just a fully complete game? Fuck that, lets split the narrative up into an Anime, a full-length CG movie, and FOUR pieces of DLC that are cut directly from the game itself.


With FF7R, it seems as though Square's business division simply cannot let go the brilliant idea of making EVERY piece of FF7 material ever created canon, and thus important, and thus able to be repackaged/revisited to turn a profit.

It's literally what they said their business model was all about.



The writing in the ending of this game takes such a massive heelturn that it's immediately obvious the moment Nomura's writing begins.

"The world isn't gonna end today...........but YOU......"

...what?

And then Aerith starts talking like a dreamy Kingdom Hearts sequel teaser and the ending tops it off with some entirely cryptic nonsensical bullshit that is impossible to decipher because he's talking about plot points that literally don't exist (LITERALLY, as in there is no internal established story for this shit, they just wrote something stupid that appears to mean something because it includes the number 7 in it) and we're left with an ending that can mean everything but can also mean nothing


And this hurts my soul to talk about because i'm in Shinra HQ in my Hard Mode playthrough at this moment, and the work put into this game is fucking phenomenal and it blows my mind how close they got to the original PS1 FF feel with this game. It just really hurts to know that it's probably going to be wasted on another FFXIII-caliber word salad story, and never again on a beginning-to-end contained and complete FF narrative like the original FF7 / FF8 / FF9.


The reason the ending of this game drives me crazy isn't even because of what happens....it's because it very clearly suffers from a VERY different style of writing from 98% of the game.

It completely throws away the methodical, deliberate, gameplay-driven storytelling in this game and replaces it with cryptic craziness and confusion, and dialogue that goes beyond Anime and really can only be described as "Nomura".
 
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Rentahamster

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Square Enix has this really arrogant / fucking stupid habit of having a "No Entry Left Behind" policy when it comes to their games, whether they're trash or not.

FFXIII? Made on a shit engine with terrible issues? Lets make it a trilogy. FFXIII's story was nonsensical? Cool, both of the sequels are time travel plots.

FFX did well on ps2? Let's make a sequel to that too. Then lets make a dumbass book where tidus kicks a blitzball and gets his head blown off. And then lets try to make it canon with FF7 because why the fuck not

FFXIV is a piece of shit game? Let's not just remake it, but lets make the remaking canon. (this actually works though)

FFXV would be a masterpiece of a game if it were just a fully complete game? Fuck that, lets split the narrative up into an Anime, a full-length CG movie, and FOUR pieces of DLC that are cut directly from the game itself.


With FF7R, it seems as though Square's business division simply cannot let go the brilliant idea of making EVERY piece of FF7 material ever created canon, and thus important, and thus able to be repackaged/revisited to turn a profit.

It's literally what they said their business model was all about.



The writing in the ending of this game takes such a massive heelturn that it's immediately obvious the moment Nomura's writing begins.

"The world isn't gonna end today...........but YOU......"

...what?

And then Aerith starts talking like a dreamy Kingdom Hearts sequel teaser and the ending tops it off with some entirely cryptic nonsensical bullshit that is impossible to decipher because he's talking about plot points that literally don't exist (LITERALLY, as in there is no internal established story for this shit, they just wrote something stupid that appears to mean something because it includes the number 7 in it) and we're left with an ending that can mean everything but can also mean nothing


And this hurts my soul to talk about because i'm in Shinra HQ in my Hard Mode playthrough at this moment, and the work put into this game is fucking phenomenal and it blows my mind how close they got to the original PS1 FF feel with this game. It just really hurts to know that it's probably going to be wasted on another FFXIII-caliber word salad story, and never again on a beginning-to-end contained and complete FF narrative like the original FF7 / FF8 / FF9.


The reason the ending of this game drives me crazy isn't even because of what happens....it's because it very clearly suffers from a VERY different style of writing from 98% of the game.

It completely throws away the methodical, deliberate, gameplay-driven storytelling in this game and replaces it with cryptic craziness and confusion, and dialogue that goes beyond Anime and really can only be described as "Nomura".
lol relax dude, the time to hate on a game is when you have it in your hands and it's bad 😁

Don't waste your energy getting worked up over something that could potentially be bad or good. It's not real.

They nailed this game. I have confidence they'll nail the next one. If they don't, then I'll say so, but only after I play it.

It's no use analyzing a game that doesn't exist.
 
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Kamehameha

Member
Mar 2, 2020
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Guys any idea why they made Aerith's adoptive mother practically identical to Cloud's mother?

Been playing the original and noticed she was originally a brunnete. However in the remake they're both blonde and if you compare both models they pretty much the same except Elmyra looks older.

Also I noticed that in the original Marlene makes drinks at the bar, and here she's the sweetest baby girl :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
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