nelsonroyale
Member
I like what is presented in this demo...but I do think SE is relying too much on focus groups...dont try to appeal to everyone and please no one like you did with FFXIII...
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Final Fantasy real time tech demo - Luminous Studio [Up3: Survey/Screens/Video]
- Thread starter jiggle
- Start date
That 06 tech demo was CG for most of it. There is a clear point where it turns real time and other than some hair and clothing physics it looks just like the final product. Maybe 95%.
I disagree that the clash of style fails. Outside of the AK dudes I think it works out wonderfully.
Yeah, and this movie has realtime rendering artifacts throughout. Shadow flickering, temporal aliasing and so on.
Not at all, just have realistic expectations.
gundamkyoukai
Member
It don't matter how powerfully your PC is if devs don't use the power , which is what happens.
Forceatowulf
G***n S**n*bi
Yeah, I've played enough FF games to know the people in here complaining about guns and terrorists are being ridiculous. There's nothing really new here.
I mean, seriously, really think back to the shit you guys played... think hard.
See? Guns and terrorists galore.
I mean, seriously, really think back to the shit you guys played... think hard.
See? Guns and terrorists galore.
AK dudes are basically why it's awful. Some of the rest could still stick out though, but not as badly because middle eastern guerrilla fighters/terrorists are the single most overdone enemy now, and the last place they need to show up is FF.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Yep. SoE had a fantastic soundtrack, and it was cool of them to experiment a little. Soule's take on Terra's Theme is pretty stellar as well.
And shame on me for not even linking Tristram or Easthaven. And a western composer composed Super Sonic Racing to boot.
BlazingDarkness
Member
And yet if there was a guy with a gun arm (think FFVII ) people would criticize it equally as being anime shit or whatever
I am basing my expectations on what we are seeing.
This is achievable easily on next gen and since next gen is delayed a year more, i expect a higher chance of this happening
Final Fantasy fans are literally the most unpleasable people on the planet. No matter what the new game has, it's STILL not as good as your favorite one from your childhood, which was perfect.
You're likely right, actually. You could do better twists on this than shown here, I think.
I think it only needs small tweaks. Give the dudes a weapon (it can still be a gun) that doesn't look as blatantly like an AK, and instead of the turbans give them some ridiculous (this is FF) headpiece that fulfills the same purpose. Fixed.
BlazingDarkness
Member
SE should just do whatever the hell they want with it, as long as it's nothing like FFXIII.
i don't think people care about guns or terrorists as a concept, just how it's used in the video. they can still appeal to the western gamer and do way more fantastical shit than this
Well, I'd be curious to know the process behind making this, because if my thought is a clash of Crystal Dynamics and Square staff then maybe they should avoid that! Though it also wouldn't surprise me if it's the old man watching the sun and the grand master designed by Crystal Dynamics and it's the AK47 guys that came from the Japanese artists, seems we sometimes get that sort of reversal of expectations.
Actually Crystal tools is their production pipeline, not the engine specifically, and they're keeping the pipeline. And in the FF13 postmortem what they admitted is that their problems came from poor project management, not the tech itself.
ZombiePlatypus
Member
This looked really cool but:
A) Why the fuck is shit like this shown behind closed doors when their regular E3 "presence" is a joke?
B) How about they focus on current unreleased/unannounced-but-wanted games like FFVIIremake, FFVersusXIII, & KHIII before showing off neat demos of potential next-gen games that, knowing SE, are probably like 15 years away?
A) Why the fuck is shit like this shown behind closed doors when their regular E3 "presence" is a joke?
B) How about they focus on current unreleased/unannounced-but-wanted games like FFVIIremake, FFVersusXIII, & KHIII before showing off neat demos of potential next-gen games that, knowing SE, are probably like 15 years away?
This looked way way better than the Samaritan demo, which needed 3 580s to run at one point (now on 1 680). I doubt either next gen system has something approaching a 580, let alone 680 in terms of horsepower.
Star Wars 1313 and Watch Dogs is a more accurate representation.
If you think that's "easily" achievable then I don't know what else to say.
Forceatowulf
G***n S**n*bi
I got the sense they were outraged by it's very inclusion.
But If they just don't like the look of them and their weapons that's fine, because I would agree with a needed change.
BlazingDarkness
Member
It's definitely been created to gauge interest, the survey is a good indication of that
I quite like the idea of mixing the SE and the CD staff to create something unique, it's not like uniquely Japanese titles are bringing home the money these days, maybe a dash of western talent will breathe a bit of life into the franchise
Of course the team who created Agnis isn't any indication of future FF games, but it's nice to see SE mixing things up a bit.
Yeah, seriously. We don't need bandits swinging swords in there, but we also don't need guys that look like they meant to go to a Modern Warfare only to wind up in a Final Fantasy instead.
Yeah, Crystal Tools IS partially the basis for this, so I guess it's not a complete waste, especially if this gets shared around throughout Square Enix rather than just kept to FF developers.
You're right to an extent (though if there's communication issues it could be a terrible idea), but in that case it's probably best for a new IP. Serious Japanese involvement with Tomb Raider or Legacy of Kain would likely be just as awful, but something like a modern successor to what Parasite Eve tried to do would be a good idea.
Chuck Norris
Banned
Perhaps they are being forward thinking and getting started on their next gen product and having a next generation engine ready now, rather than sitting on their laurels? I wouldn't complain about a Square Enix that is a bit more forward thinking, nor should you
Risk Breaker
Member
If the engine's solid enough we'd probably actually see the likes of CD and Eidos Montreal use it. Actually, given CD's co-developing it I'd be shocked if they didn't use it at least.
We're not talking about turning FF into Ys, though I think I'd welcome that if they had to go action RPG.
slaughterking
Member
Looks impressive. If SE can create assets and animations like that for a fully-fledged, next-gen RPG I'll be even more impressed.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
Graphics on the PS3 are good enough, we don't need anything more..
How much better can it really get anyways?
How much better can it really get anyways?
Brad Grenz
Member
It's obvious Square-Enix wants to leverage Luminous the way EA is using Frostbite, Capcom is using MT Framework, and Ubisoft is using Anvil. Anything to avoid the Unreal tax, and Japanese companies in particular had a lot of trouble this gen working with western developed middleware.
Forceatowulf
G***n S**n*bi
Well then that's horribly disappointing then. Watch Dogs definitely wowed me, but not because of the great graphics, but the visual style and concept of the entire presentation.
I also didn't think 1313's character models were really that impressive. Some of the best? Definitely. But TLoU character models looked much better top to bottom in my opinion.
If that's the leap we can expect in a year and a half.. that's pretty god damn shitty. I really hope this demo is a much better representation honestly. Because I am not spending 400+ dollars on a new game machine that's only a little better looking than what my PS3 is capable of right now.
toddhunter
Member
Not a whole heap better. There are art ability, time and cost factors limiting games too. But it can get 1080p and 60fps and more open then running along a corridor.
To me this is what next gen will be. Nothing looking amazingly better (but hope to be wrong!) just a lot fewer compromises. I would say most devs will just thanks to the extra power and produce much the same things with better technical stats.
But a few will use that power and the results will be glorious.
BlazingDarkness
Member
Agreed
The Watch Dogs character models in particular are not very impressive, there's a fair few current gen PS3 games that do better
There's still the questions of how much the hardware that can do this (well, close anyway) will cost, how much the GAMES will cost to make, and what effects on design this will have. I honestly think the sweet spot may've been PS2 technology, given that supported visuals that can actually look like human beings and emote plausibly enough, but not being the kind of stuff you'd go overboard and end up taking forever on, not as easily anyway. If however this is pretty much a drop in the bucket compared to what we have now (or potentially CHEAPER due to more sophisticated tools), and the consoles won't be too expensive, then great, bring it on!
True, and it may work out better than MT Framework at least in that it'll be shared better with western developers. It's probably also better if the UE4 IS absent from the Wii U and thes can scale with it better.
A thought: if this really IS what next-gen looks like... I think we'll be definitely seeing drastically diminished returns with the generation follow that. It's always said, but as nice as it looks it's still not the level of jump the PS2 had over the PS1, or even the PS3 over the PS2. It may well be that if hardware keeps being pushed it ends up being a matter of resolution/frame rate afterall.
Got specs? Target specs, at least? You know the kind of power a GTX680 requires, and the amount of heat it produces (let alone two)? You know how much it costs? You know that die-shrinks aren't as easy as many of the people on here make it seem?
As abuC has said (and I in another thread), for next-gen console graphics, look at Watch_Dogs (PC demo) or Star Wars 1313. I expect Watch_Dogs (PC demo) will be the "norm".
Risk Breaker
Member
Are you kidding? If at least games this gen were native res (1080p) and had perfect AA/AF and framerate I could somehow see your point but... upscaling and bad IQ is disgusting.
The whole game will just be a 30-hour real-time movie.
"Gameplay is impossible to do on a next-gen console".
Modern guns if you prefer, you know what i mean.
Modern setting even, i don't want anything relating to our actual world in FF.
Indeed. And even this still has easily visible problems that could be fixed with more power.
Forceatowulf
G***n S**n*bi
He's being factitious.
I'm not even going to lie, I was definitely one of the people that believed that too. But after seeing this.. if this shit is really what I can expect from quality dev teams then count me the fuck in.
S-E in 2016: "Gameplay is too hard on next-gen hardware."
So much better that you'll be laughing at this demo in a few years.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
My post was sarcastic to the tenth degree.
Are there really people still saying that does not look much better than a PS3 title?
Jesus Christ.
Are there really people still saying that does not look much better than a PS3 title?
Jesus Christ.
It's possible to argue that it's not as big of a jump as prior generations... though it's probably fairer to use the FFVII demo or something. In which case it IS a smaller jump, definitely there and impressive but clearly it's now more in effects, with faces having gone about as far as we can before tripping into the uncanny valley as Quantic Dream has.