Most of their games are 60
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Food for thought for those who don't care about 60fps.
- Thread starter nkarafo
- Start date
Most of their games are 60
SneakyStephan
Banned
tell us how we all feel professor
Nabs
Member
FPS is directly related to control. Gaming is just more enjoyable at 60.
Yeah all those cross gen games are selling more on 360 and ps3!....oh...wait.......
I was gaming before the 94-97 period...still don't really care about framerate...yes..switching between 60 and 30 on say TLoU is quite a noticeable experience...
But do my retinas bleed from 30fps games? Nope...
In the race for more pretty graphics framerate was chopped down, this decision has been made since the 3D era began. Those games you mentioned would benefit from 60 FPS more than MGS or a JRPG
I want my AI from HL2 and FEAR back
I want my AI from HL2 and FEAR back
people like their sexy new graphics. i know i do.
nkarafo
Member
Well. generally no, except when the specs get in the way and take me out of the game. I play many 30fps games and i enjoy them but i have a hard time enjoying fast paced games and racing games with the 30fps stuttering, which is very noticeable in my eyes.
GluedOnBeard
Member
My first console was the NES and I have never cared about frame rates as long as the game doesn't experience any slowdown.
As games have progressed over the years I would say the thing that needs the most work is AI. Forget 60fps if computer controlled AI is terrible that is what is going to ruin enjoyment of games. Sports games in particular this applies to.
As games have progressed over the years I would say the thing that needs the most work is AI. Forget 60fps if computer controlled AI is terrible that is what is going to ruin enjoyment of games. Sports games in particular this applies to.
Nah.
You can cultivate your weak feels elsewhere yourself, if you can't handle differing opinions.
Or you could stay and enjoy the debate.
It makes me no never-mind.
nkarafo
Member
I don't get this statement.
Will you die if you drink your piss? Nope.
Then, lets all drink our piss, i guess?
Doctor_Thomas
Member
If there's a technical aspect that makes a game unplayable for someone, then you can't write it off. I am not sensitive at all to frame rate, but I am sensitive to screen tearing. A game could be "fun", which is subjective, but if it's tearing all over the place, it makes it a lot less fun to play because I notice the torn frames and I am taken right out of the game.
A non-issue for one person may make the game unplayable for another.
This is not correct. All of those may affect gameplay, more so than 30 FPS could.
Portugeezer
Member
Games like Zelda OoT, Mario 64, Banjo Kazooie didn't feel limited.
60fps probably would have limited them however.
This is ultimately where I fall. 60 fps is really nice, but if the game is fun without it, I don't really care. Far Cry 3 runs at sub 30 fps on the 360 and I played through that whole game. Chrono Cross is one of my favorite games of all time. It runs at a slow framerate and I pick it up and play it like it was basketball. There's plenty of other things to videogames besides the tech under the hood like art, game design, and story. I'd argue that stagnating in those areas affect the perception of the medium more than any quibbles about framerate and resolution.
cr_blah_blah
Member
Switching between 30/60 on the fly in TLoU should be an eye opening experience for many people. It makes it incredibly obvious why 60 is so much better and noticeable once you put it back to back yourself in a way the numbers alone can't really convey.
thunder_snail
Member
It is a step back.
However, the market has grown since then, and it seems with larger audience, the equilibrium is at 30fps with better graphics.
Also modern games don't rely on pure gameplay as much as older games. So I guess it was inevitable somewhat. Though even to this day, games that rely on gameplay alone are almost always 60fps, which is a good thing.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
How? Tell me how precisely, the only argument I think you could make is large open games and precise headshot. The amount of games that large with that gameplay are few and far between.
If a game has graphical problems people will give a shit. Frame stuttering, pop in, etc will effect a person's enjoyment of the game. So I don't think its fair to say people don't give a shit about this stuff even if they think its fun.
It's an exaggeration...I'm poking fun at the people that think 30fps games are a slideshow
IceDoesntHelp
Banned
Born 1992 didn't play arcade games. I think 60fps only matters for racing, fighting and platformer games. Everything else can stay at 30fps, and I'll be happy.
Solid Samus
Banned
i simply don't like the implication that FPS isn't a valid point of concern to gamers, especially when expressed through the same old loftyass attitude of 'oh I just care about the gameplay because that's what's truly important, the rest of y'all are just spec nerds'
it ain't the part before the comma that gets me
if you don't like 'cultivating weak feels' then maybe you ought to avoid posting things like that last sentence in your op. because that's all the value that sentence even has in the context of debates like this. and you know it
nkarafo
Member
Mario 64 and Banjo were fine because smooth 60fps was not a standard back then. It was extremely rare, if not completely unlikely. Standards were different. OOT was 20fps and it was bothersome, although we could get past it.
The difference now is that, unlike back then, gamers have experienced smooth frame rates on consoles. Therefore, stuttering framerate looks like a step back on even more powerful consoles.
IdreamofHIME
Member
Im a PAL gamer. I never played a game at full speed until about 2003
ElRenoRaven
Member
This sums up my thoughts. I know it's how I feel. As long as a game isn't sub 30fps I don't give a damn as long as it's fun. After all that's why I play games for the fun factor and not the graphics.
The Weeknd
Banned
Don't care about FPS at all. The majority of gamers do not care. The majority want better graphics. You're on a gaming forum, you're vastly not the majority here so idk why you think devs will cater to you when graphics>fps in terms of marketing. And I could care less about 60v30fps they both play great to me and will choose 30 with better graphics every time.
OG_Original Gamer
Member
Born in 75, so I go as far back as Atari 2600 and Pac-man in the arcades. I must say, I agree with the OP. Although through much of the last two gens I haven't really given it much thought. It wasn't until I tried to get into PC gaming that it became jarring, having Crysis 2 go from 60 to 40-30, was disappointing to say the least. Animation was noticeably slower when reloading weapons, firing it was slower. It was like doing 80mph on the highway, then have the engine just cut off on you.
I won't disagree that 60FPS gives a notable improvement to a lot of games, but I still honestly can't bring myself to care that much.
Ultimately, artistic design and gameplay are the two most important aspects of a game. I loved Shadow of the Colossus on the PS2 and I'm pretty sure that ran at around 20FPS or lower consistently. I loved it because of the desolate forbidden lands, the varied designs of the colossi, the sense of mystery surrounding most areas you stumbled into, the Aztec-inspired architecture, and the looming and triumphant sounding music.
I played the PS3 HD remake recently and it's nice to see the game running at a consistent frame rate, but it really doesn't make a huge difference to the overall experience.
There are some genres that frame rate is hugely important to because of the fluidity it provides to actions but not all genres need 60FPS. The ones I can think of are racing games for a proper sense of motion and speed, fighting games for both mechanical and animation-based reasons, arena/twitch shooters such as Quake and Counter Strike and possibly action games like Devil May Cry or Bayonetta.
Give me well designed games that run at a consistently decent frame rate and I'm happy as can be. No massive dips in fps and I don't really care about what it's running at.
Ultimately, artistic design and gameplay are the two most important aspects of a game. I loved Shadow of the Colossus on the PS2 and I'm pretty sure that ran at around 20FPS or lower consistently. I loved it because of the desolate forbidden lands, the varied designs of the colossi, the sense of mystery surrounding most areas you stumbled into, the Aztec-inspired architecture, and the looming and triumphant sounding music.
I played the PS3 HD remake recently and it's nice to see the game running at a consistent frame rate, but it really doesn't make a huge difference to the overall experience.
There are some genres that frame rate is hugely important to because of the fluidity it provides to actions but not all genres need 60FPS. The ones I can think of are racing games for a proper sense of motion and speed, fighting games for both mechanical and animation-based reasons, arena/twitch shooters such as Quake and Counter Strike and possibly action games like Devil May Cry or Bayonetta.
Give me well designed games that run at a consistently decent frame rate and I'm happy as can be. No massive dips in fps and I don't really care about what it's running at.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
I think game get more attention when the have fancier graphics, thatswhy devs choose better graphics over 60FPS.
BUT it looks like some developers might change that.
It sounds like NaughtyDog is going for 60FPS only now. Thing is that NaughtyDog is probably so good that they can pull of 60FPS and still have a game that looks better than everything else.(Uncharted 4)
I personally always prefer 60FPS. 30FPS isn't a dealbreaker for me though.
BUT it looks like some developers might change that.
It sounds like NaughtyDog is going for 60FPS only now. Thing is that NaughtyDog is probably so good that they can pull of 60FPS and still have a game that looks better than everything else.(Uncharted 4)
I personally always prefer 60FPS. 30FPS isn't a dealbreaker for me though.
We've had this thread about a thousand times now and it's getting old. No it isn't. You think most people that play GTA, for example, enjoy it less because it's 30fps or less? Perfectly explains the bad sales, huh? If it's playable most people don't give a fuck. OCD gamers are a different story.
OP, for example, was in a Driveclub thread the other day stating really absurdly stupid shit like, "any racing game that isn't 60fps is far from great." Fuck the actual content then? Just give me a shitty game that runs at 60fps and it'll be better than Driveclub, Forza Horizon, Forza Horizon 2, PGR4, any NFS in the last couple years, Blur, Motorstorm, etc by default.
No, because developers are able to push the hardware further when they don't have to worry about rendering twice as many images every second. The "step back" is immediately replaced by a step forward in another category.
It's not a downgrade, it's a sign of changing priorities.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
Yes, I was gaming in the 90s at home and at the arcades. Never gave a shit about frame rate then, don't now. "Aracde perfect" was a thing, but it was never tied to fps in my mind.
ShinMaruku
Member
I'm a 80s baby so I know the hay day of Arcades. Now normally I would be like "The game just needs to be playable" but at 60 fsp games will react and play better than 30. You play Last of US on PS3 and PS4 and see if you can aim the same way. There is no "Acceptable" I am just 1 person in the market, if my peers can settle for less I will get less. So it's not quite settling.
rbanke
Member
This is how I feel also. Also been gaming since Pong.
I would always prefer 60 but its far from a deal breaker for me. For me Its basically breaks out like this: IQ > Stable Framerate > Graphic Complexity > 60 FPS > Tearing > Lighting quality. Even with that, I've still enjoyed many games that have shit resolution, shimmering jaggies everywhere, what amounts to a Vaseline filter on top of the game (Resistance 3, I'm looking at you). Even my most important visual qualities are wants not needs as far as i'm concerned.
Crimsonclaw111
Member
Good games at 60fps are better than good games at 30fps.
Banana Aeon
Member
Than you better get to explaining, homeboy.
Fighting games, no matter the resolution, are unplayable at 30fps.
Perfect Cha0s
Member
All games benefit from 60 FPS.
Not all games need 60 FPS.
Flashy effects are easier to sell than smooth motion, and a subset of consumers will just slap on their TV's motion interpolation, anyway.
Not all games need 60 FPS.
Flashy effects are easier to sell than smooth motion, and a subset of consumers will just slap on their TV's motion interpolation, anyway.
I'm glad this attitude still manages to thrive here despite all the FPS talk.
Right on guys. That's all that matters.
nkarafo
Member
30fps is smooth.
Anyway, who gives a shit if the game is fun? Every single one of my favourite games is 30. Doesn't matter all that much to me.
Game play IS all that matters.
Fps matter only so far as they serve the game play.
One can make a compelling argument that the aesthetics might matter.
The f[a]ps... not so much.
Most people can't even detect 60 fps.
Mustering concern for 60+ faps beyond what they might do to improve game play is the definition of masturbatory concerns.
Nabs
Member
I don't think you get what I'm saying. I'm not saying 30fps can't be fun, but that 60 provides a more enjoyable experience. I have more fun when I have more control over my character. Platformers, shooters, racers and fighting games are all more fun when I have more control. That's all I'm saying. I'm not comparing games to each other, and I'm not the OP.
nkarafo
Member
Compared to what?
Compared to 60? No, its not.
We already had many 60fps games on inferior hardware, several generations ago. Especially racing games. So there is a comparison you see. Going from smooth 60fps racing games to 30fps ones is somewhat jarring. And its bothersome to think the latter runs on far superior hardware.
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