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Personally, I think Mii's would be better off as ATs. Imagine the amount of stat crunching and variables that would have to be read in order to balance them so that someone doesn't come in and create their own monstrosity that would make Metaknight in Brawl look like a joke.

Besides, we haven't even really seen the best of the potential established newcomers yet.
 
Andrex said:
Mii's are an abomination in Animal Crossing and even Mario Kart so I don't hold much hope for them blending into the slightly-more-serious-and-graphically-pleasing Smash Bros.
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Miis are most certainly not an abomination in Mario Kart!
 
Rash said:
Miis are most certainly not an abomination in Mario Kart!
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They certainly are in the Message Board message. They're kinda neat in the mall level but otherwise, blech.
 
Andrex said:
Toon Link is much better than regular Link, so I think he's the one that should be "uncloned"...
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Its not toon link's fault that TP Link is nearly the worst player in brawl. They should focus on staples and things unique in the wind waker series, like a grappling hook instead of the hookshot, deku leafe for his up b, bombchu, different final smash etc, or even things from the other toon games like Minish Cap or Four Swords adventure.

Uncloning adult link would suck, because its been many people's main since the first game.


Edit: I'm one of the few who thinks TP is far superior to WW in gameplay (thought not character) but I still want to see toon link uncloned.
 
Andrex said:
Am I the only one who voted for Midna and MMX? You people suck.
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I thought we had to divvy our votes into at least 5 point increments, for a maximum of 6 votes total. I wonder if I should redo mine too if we're allowed down to single point suggestions.

InvincibleAgent said:
Obviously Link needs to be buffed, but it should be Toon Link that gets uncloned. Link had the moves first.
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I would actually like to see the Links split a little further, maybe the Zeldas while we're at it. Call them Link of Time, Link of Twilight, Link of the Wind, and give them some split movesets. This also lets them still keep Zelda of Time so they have Shiek, but they can do something different with a Zelda of Twilight and Tetra/Zelda of the Wind.

It's a bit of a mouthful, but it's lame to have a Twilight Princess Link playing almost identically like the Ocarina of Time Link, and to have Twilight Princess Zelda gain a Shiek transformation just because they didn't want to lose that character.
 
AzureJericho said:
Personally, I think Mii's would be better off as ATs. Imagine the amount of stat crunching and variables that would have to be read in order to balance them so that someone doesn't come in and create their own monstrosity that would make Metaknight in Brawl look like a joke.
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Dude, that's not how Miis will work. I'm sure if Miis were going to be implemented, every Mii, no matter how small or how fat, would have the same moveset, same weight, etc. The Miis would basically play with the weight stats of Mario and Wii Sports, Fit, and Music inspired B and A moves.

Also, to the guy who said he's shocked at the small amount of votes for them, let it be known that they are currently the 8th most voted for on the suggestion list. I'm not gonna post the current results until tomorrow but the votes today really shook alot of stuff up.

Kulock said:
I thought we had to divvy our votes into at least 5 point increments, for a maximum of 6 votes total. I wonder if I should redo mine too if we're allowed down to single point suggestions.
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Don't redo yours, the 5 point increments are definitely preferred. The single digits are only for people who can't, can't, can't make up their mind.

Kulock said:
I would actually like to see the Links split a little further, maybe the Zeldas while we're at it. Call them Link of Time, Link of Twilight, Link of the Wind, and give them some split movesets.
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Or you know, you could call them the Hero of Time and the Hero of Winds like in the real games, :lol
 
MisterHero said:
I think now that there are flying characters, Armored Samus should be able to fly with the Screw Attack
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Pit and Snake are broken enough proof that's a bad idea.
 
Wii Will Rock U said:
Can the screw attack make her fly? I only thought it gives her more jumps...
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That's what the Space Jump Boots do. She can fly with the Screw Attack in the 2D Metroids.

now that I think about it, the Screw Attack badge in Brawl accomplishes for the most part. :lol but seriously, Samus should have it all the time

I actually have a lot of suggestions for tweaking all the characters, but as this thread is more about voting things I'll try to keep my posts to a minimum. :P

Andrex said:
Pit and Snake are broken enough proof that's a bad idea.
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that's why they need more competition.

besides I was thinking more of Metaknight/Kirby. Both Pit and Snake are easy to screw over if you know what to do.

Jigglypuff/Charizard/Dedede/etc. are fine.
 
Wii Will Rock U said:
Or you know, you could call them the Hero of Time and the Hero of Winds like in the real games, :lol
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I thought of that, but it's a little arrogant when other characters may have similar gimmicks, and then what do you call Ocarina Zelda? Princess of Time? Do you say Zelda, Princess of Time in full? What about if they split up the Ganondorfs? That's why I stuck with the [Name] of [Theme] arrangement.
 
Kulock said:
I thought of that, but it's a little arrogant when other characters may have similar gimmicks, and then what do you call Ocarina Zelda? Princess of Time? Do you say Zelda, Princess of Time in full? What about if they split up the Ganondorfs? That's why I stuck with the [Name] of [Theme] arrangement.
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I want Wind Waker Ganondorf more than anything. Whether he is an alternate costume or SOMETHING. But sweet Jesus, WW Ganondorf would be so great.

MisterHero said:
That's what the Space Jump Boots do. She can fly with the Screw Attack in the 2D Metroids. Now that I think about it, the Screw Attack badge in Brawl accomplishes for the most part. :lol but seriously, Samus should have it all the time. I actually have a lot of suggestions for tweaking all the characters, but as this thread is more about voting things I'll try to keep my posts to a minimum. :P.
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Speaking of which, have you actually voted yet? You've made suggestions but have yet to give your solid numbered votes.
 
Kulock said:
I thought of that, but it's a little arrogant when other characters may have similar gimmicks, and then what do you call Ocarina Zelda? Princess of Time? Do you say Zelda, Princess of Time in full? What about if they split up the Ganondorfs? That's why I stuck with the [Name] of [Theme] arrangement.
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It's all the same Ganondorf. As far as we know at least.
 
leroidys said:
It's all the same Ganondorf. As far as we know at least.
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He must be skitzo then because he certainly does not keep a constant personality each game. No dude, like I said earlier, Wind Waker Ganondorf is SO much cooler than TP Ganondorf in terms of backstory, intention, and design though Ocarina Ganondorf still wipes the floor with all of them. We're supposed to believe he is ALWAYS the same Ganon, but he acts different in almost every game that it becomes rather hard to believe it.
 
if we go by the split timeline theory then there are 2 Ganondorfs

there's also Aghanim, 2 Phantom Ganons, and Pig Ganon (using a Trident)

Maybe they can get System Prefixes?

Example:
Ocarina - Ganondorf 64
WW - Ganondorf GC
TP - Ganondorf Wii

Another Hypothetical suggestion:
Likewise, if a character has been in a previous game, they can use their stats/moves (like in Street Fighter Hyper Anniversary)
64-ism
GC-ism
Brawl-ism
4-ism

but this might be too complicated :lol
 
MisterHero said:
if we go by the split timeline theory then there are 2 Ganondorfs

there's also Aghanim, 2 Phantom Ganons, and Pig Ganon (using a Trident)

Maybe they can get System Prefixes?

Example:
Ocarina - Ganondorf 64
WW - Ganondorf GC
TP - Ganondorf Wii

Another Hypothetical suggestion:
Likewise, if a character has been in a previous game, they can use their stats/moves (like in Street Fighter Hyper Anniversary)
64-ism
GC-ism
Brawl-ism
4-ism

but this might be too complicated :lol
Click to expand...

Yeah...back to the voting :lol ...if you still haven't voted, do so ASAP! I'll post the updated vote results tomorrow morning.
 
Wii Will Rock U said:
He must be skitzo then because he certainly does not keep a constant personality each game. No dude, like I said earlier, Wind Waker Ganondorf is SO much cooler than TP Ganondorf in terms of backstory, intention, and design though Ocarina Ganondorf still wipes the floor with all of them. We're supposed to believe he is ALWAYS the same Ganon, but he acts different in almost every game that it becomes rather hard to believe it.
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The games seem to be set across hundreds of years, I don't think that its that unlikely he would act differently in the games. Also, they are going for a cohesive overarching story, and it would be pretty hard to do that with tons of different Ganondorfs.

Edit: agreed that WW Ganon is awesome.
 
WARNING: ZELDA NERD TIME

Wii Will Rock U said:
He must be skitzo then because he certainly does not keep a constant personality each game. No dude, like I said earlier, Wind Waker Ganondorf is SO much cooler than TP Ganondorf in terms of backstory, intention, and design though Ocarina Ganondorf still wipes the floor with all of them. We're supposed to believe he is ALWAYS the same Ganon, but he acts different in almost every game that it becomes rather hard to believe it.
Click to expand...

At the end of Wind Waker, Ganon specifically refers to the Ocarina of Time time period (When he talks about his people and what they endured)

Leroidys is right in that the newer games are much further along in the timeline and that it is the same Ganon throughout the entire series (while we have multiple Links and Zeldas), but Wind Waker and Twilight Princess are specifically in two different realities or timelines or whatever. (Just clarifying here for the fun of it) In Ocarina of Time, Zelda returning Link to a child at the end created two separate timelines - Link disappearing as an Adult (after Ganon was sealed in the sacred realm) causes the timeline to lead to The Wind Waker, and Link becoming a kid again (and causing Ganondorf to be thrown into jail by the King) leads to Twilight Princess.

And yeah, Wind Waker Ganon is my favorite!

Okay, carry one! :D
 
As promised, here is the voting tally as of 7:34 this morning:

Smash Bros. Character Voting Tally:

Mike Jones- 58
Megaman- 51
Isaac- 45
Toon Link (Uncloned)- 39
Tails- 32
King K. Rool- 31
Lucario- 30
Ashley- 30
Mii- 26
Masked Man- 26
Crono- 25
Lucas- 24
Ridley- 21
Mr. Stevenson- 20
Knuckles- 17
Lyn- 16
Missingno- 15
Viewtiful Joe- 15
Micaiah- 15
Vaati- 15
Ryu- 15
Little Mac- 14
Midna- 12
Megaman X- 12
Lark- 12
Simon Belmont- 11
Krystal- 11
Ice Hockey Trio- 10
Neku- 10
Paula- 10
Takamaru- 10
Phoenix Wright- 8
K.K. Slider- 6
Saki- 6
Female/Rival Pokemon Trainer- 6
Black Shadow- 6
Travis Touchdown- 6
Terra- 6
Will- 5
Skull Kid- 5
Rundas- 5
Jill- 5
Captain Syrup- 5
Daisy- 5
Felix- 5
Kumatora- 5
Mallow- 5
Paula- 5
Sami- 5
Mona- 5
Sam & Max- 5
De Blob- 5
Samurai Goroh- 5
Hector- 4
Tingle- 4
Protoman- 4
Sylux- 3
R.O.B.- 2
Roy- 2
Mewtwo- 1
Bomberman- 1
Dr. Mario- 1
Waluigi- 1
Dixie Kong- 1
Ray MK III- 1
Grey Fox- 1
Porky- 1
Black Knight- 1
Bowser Jr./ Shadow Mario- 1
Falco- 1
Ike- 1
Wolf- 1



A couple observations:

-Mike Jones has overtaken Megaman as the 1 most wanted character. That's good news for all of you guys who voted for him because you said hyou doubted he had a fanbase. Clearly he does. As for veteran fighters, Toon Link (uncloned) is the #1 most wanted veteran to return at this point with Lucario and Lucas trailing close behind.

-With a single vote, Masked Man has bumped Crono out of the top 10

-Missingno and Mr. Stevenson came out of the middle of nowhere to land spots in the top 20. I think it's pretty freaking cool that a glitch from Pokemon and a detective with a machine gun have a great chance of staying on this list.

Keep the votes up people, this is seriously getting interesting. I can't wait to see the voting tally by Friday (the deadline)
 
Tailzo said:
Interesting. Keep up the good work, there's a lot of characters here I didn't even know about.
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Thanks for the compliment Tailzo, I appreciate it. It takes a lot of work to go through all these posts and tally the stuff but its worth it. :)
 
More votes needed!

The entire bottom of the list can change dramatically just with one person voting. Hell, I alone put Rundas into the race (<3 Rundas).

By the way, this Friday does all voting for characters end, or is this just some preliminary round?
 
Rash said:
More votes needed!

The entire bottom of the list can change dramatically just with one person voting. Hell, I alone put Rundas into the race (<3 Rundas).

By the way, this Friday does all voting for characters end, or is this just some preliminary round?
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Excellent question Rash, basically, what will happening on Friday is this. A new suggestion list featuring all the characters who got votes as well as the seeds will be posted in the OP and all the characters who are currently on the suggestion list that did not receive any votes will be cut from that list.

Then, Friday afternoon, voting will begin on the characters who survived the prelim and are still on the suggestion list. Everyone will be given another 30 points to spread across how they choose among the characters on the list. The goal, by the end of this round will be to make a final roster of 55 combatants that should be featured in SSB4. That roster will then become the official playable character list and voting may then presume on stages. :)

Does that answer your question?
 
Nice work! I REALLY hope we don't have to wait another 5 years for the next SSB to come out. My gaming life will probably be over by then.
 
leroidys said:
Nice work! I REALLY hope we don't have to wait another 5 years for the next SSB to come out.
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You will not have to wait that long, I am sure. That's why we need to get this voting done ASAP so we can figure out what would be the best possible product.

Keep voting people!
 
Keep voting for this guy!!!

Who_Is_Mike_Jones.jpg


Mike Jonesssss - 25 points
Doc Lewis - 5 points
 
Hypnotoad said:
-Akari Hayami (1080 Snowboarding, Wave Race: Blue Storm, 1080 Avanlance) 20 Points
-Kumatora (Mother 3) 10 Points
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You, good sir, are the first to actually vote for a Wave Race character. Major props to you.

And to Andrex, think of it this way, at least your two characters are safe this round!
 
Hey everyone, the voting results haven't changed all that much but there have been a few shuffles since I last posted. Here is the most current and updated list:

Smash Bros. Character Vote Results (2/10/09- 9:36 AM):

Mike Jones- 83
Megaman- 51
Isaac- 45
Toon Link (Uncloned)- 39
Masked Man- 37
Tails- 32
King K. Rool- 31
Lucario- 30
Ashley- 30
Mii- 26
Crono- 25
Lucas- 24
Ridley- 21
Mr. Stevenson- 20
Akari Hayami- 20
Knuckles- 17
Lyn- 16
Missingno- 15
Viewtiful Joe- 15
Micaiah- 15
Vaati- 15
Ryu- 15
Kumatora- 15
Little Mac- 14
Midna- 12
Megaman X- 12
Lark- 12
Simon Belmont- 11
Krystal- 11
Ice Hockey Trio- 10
Neku- 10
Paula- 10
Takamaru- 10
Phoenix Wright- 8
K.K. Slider- 6
Saki- 6
Female/Rival Pokemon Trainer- 6
Black Shadow- 6
Travis Touchdown- 6
Terra- 6
Will- 5
Skull Kid- 5
Rundas- 5
Jill- 5
Captain Syrup- 5
Daisy- 5
Felix- 5
Mallow- 5
Paula- 5
Doc Lewis- 5
Sami- 5
Mona- 5
Sam & Max- 5
De Blob- 5
Samurai Goroh- 5
Hector- 4
Tingle- 4
Protoman- 4
Sylux- 3
R.O.B.- 2
Roy- 2
Mewtwo- 1
Bomberman- 1
Dr. Mario- 1
Waluigi- 1
Dixie Kong- 1
Ray MK III- 1
Grey Fox- 1
Porky- 1
Black Knight- 1
Bowser Jr./ Shadow Mario- 1
Falco- 1
Ike- 1
Wolf- 1

Observations:

-Mike Jones has far and away taken the most requested spot with Mega Man more than a full 30 points behind him in second place.

-Akari Hayami from Wave Race and 1080 has seemingly out of nowhere nabbed a top 20 spot and has overtaken such favorites as Lyn, Midna, Little Mac, and Missingno.

-Doc Lewis from Punch-Out has been saved from cut due to a five point vote! :O

-Every character cut from Melee, except for Pichu, has gotten a vote to return. Clearly a mistake in judgement was made when those characters were cut from Brawl.

KEEP UP THE VOTING!
 
C'mon, Akari needs to be in the top 10! 1080/Wave Race is the biggest franchise remaining without character represantation.
 
She represents both game series, Ryoto is Wave Race-only. But seeing how women are ignored in Smash, they'd probably include him.

All the more reason to vote for Akari!
 
fair enough. yeah, smash bros does lack female characters.

If I were to vote for female characters Ashley, Paula, Captain Syrup, Dixie would be nice additions. Animal Crossing also lacks playable representation so maybe the Animal Crossing Girl could be in it

also, Robin from Pilotwings 64. "oooooh yeeeah"
 
Or Advance Wars, the AT was nice. From the ones you mentioned, i'd say Ashley is a good choice, since Wario Ware is ever expanding.
 
Wii Will Rock U said:
There already is in Brawl. -_-
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Maybe I didn't make myself clear enough. I meant something that lets you choose which characters are selected from when you choose random. As far as I remember, in Brawl, if I choose random, there's always a chance that I could end up with some character I don't like, but with a random character switch, I could prevent this from happening. Or am I missing something?
 
MisterHero said:
fair enough. yeah, smash bros does lack female characters.

If I were to vote for female characters Ashley, Paula, Captain Syrup, Dixie would be nice additions. Animal Crossing also lacks playable representation so maybe the Animal Crossing Girl could be in it

also, Robin from Pilotwings 64. "oooooh yeeeah"
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All of the girls you mentioned save for the AC girl and Robin (even though she is on the suggestion list) have been voted for already. Things are looking up!
 
Um, hey, you kinda not only missed two votes for Masked Man, but somehow negated one of the points he got in the first two votes (5 and 22 respectively).

The correct total is "37".

Also, another preemptive suggestion for stages is a Castle stage from Yoshi's Island. No more freaking flat cheery stages.
 
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