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Why would anyone really buy a dedicated handheld anymore?

Why ask a question like that when it's clearly happening? I might ask you "how can anyone eat broccoli?", but it's a silly question, because people do eat broccoli, whether I like it or not.

So - some people still buy handhelds. Why? Lots of reasons. Maybe they're for kids who don't have smartphones. Maybe they like certain exclusive games. Maybe they like buttons. Maybe the price is right. Who's to say, except the individual buying?

 

[Fusebox]

I thought gaming on my iPad was the greatest thing since sliced bread. I mean, I LOVED gaming on it. So much so that I convinced two others to get an iPad for that reason. Until I got a Vita.

They're simply not comparable. Other than SE remakes, and the odd big title here and there (GTA, S&S, a few of the boardgames), it can't even compare.

WipEout 2048
Uncharted: GA
Sly 4
Gravity Rush
Persona 4: Golden
Disgaea 4
THE PSP CATALOGUE
THE PS1 CATALOGUE

Soul Sacrifice and Muramasa are coming out soon. There's more gaming in that list than I will *ever* have time for. The iPad is a truly spectacular machine. But I never realized how much I hate touch controls until I went back to buttons.

That's where I'm at now too. I'm almost 100% Vita these days and my Vita backlog is a decent list of really long games so it'll be a while before I go back over to iOS but I still have lots of love for the iPad.

 

[axisofweevils]

I'm not saying that good smartphone games don't exist, it's just that my gaming time is limited.... I've tried plenty of highly rated games on my Android phone since I got one - IMO, none of them can get anywhere near the level of quality I get from the 3DS.

If I have a spare hour, I can't ever imagine choosing to play something on my Galaxy S3 over my 3DS.

 

[captmcblack]

Neither my cellphone or tablet can play Mario 3D Land, or anything that simultaneously looks and plays as well as that game...and that's just one of the innumerable excellent looking/controlling games available on dedicated handheld game systems. I'm sure smartphones and tablets will get the kind of hardware that can drive full-featured games of this sort, and I'm sure a few will be released...but they'll never be THE most important thing on those platforms.

Dedicated handheld game systems are designed to play nothing but polished, fully-featured games - as long as they continue to improve, they'll always be viable.

 

[commish]

Etrian Odyssey is an interesting example because it could easily get a mobile version without losing anything. My most played 3DS game, Fire Emblem, would translate well also. Turn based strategy and hardcore board games are amazing on mobile. There are already full-fledged PC RPGs, and XCOM is coming soon. Same goes for DS/3DS adventure games; Phoenix Wright and Ghost Trick are already on iOS.

I don't know why this is a bad thing.

Because people fear change, basically. The devil!!!

 

[P90]

Buttons.

Yes. Buttons means a win for dedicated handhelds.

 

[commish]

Neither my cellphone or tablet can play Mario 3D Land, or anything that simultaneously looks and plays as well as that game...and that's just one of the innumerable excellent looking/controlling games available on dedicated handheld game systems. I'm sure smartphones and tablets will get the kind of hardware that can drive full-featured games of this sort, and I'm sure a few will be released...but they'll never be THE most important thing on those platforms.

Dedicated handheld game systems are designed to play nothing but polished, fully-featured games - as long as they continue to improve, they'll always be viable.

But... my console can, and I think we can all admit that the vast majority of handheld gaming occurs at home.

 

[Sky Chief]

Shouldn't the thread title be the other way around?

Exactly what I thought

 

[AcceptableGhost]

I do wonder what smartphone games would look like if people accepted handheld game prices for smartphone games.

There would probably be more games actually worth playing. Free-to-play is pretty much a death sentence for making a game worth anyone's time.

 

[Game Guru]

The advantage smartphone gaming has is that it's cheap and relies on a device that everyone carries with them because of necessity. However, it should be noted that you get what you pay for. A smartphone or a tablet is just not a good device for playing video games on, and the good games that are made for the touchscreen in mind can be played on almost any other device just as easily.

This is my personal opinion, but it actually irritates me somewhat that people are claiming that smartphones and tablets are killing everything. I've never really been a fan of portable devices and just use my PC or consoles for any entertainment options. Even when I bought Game Boys, I generally played Game Boy games on the Super Game Boy or Game Boy Player.

However, there are three portable devices that I do own currently... An MP3 Player, a basic cellphone, and an Android tablet. My MP3 Player serves in connection with some MP3 speakers as a modern day boombox of sorts, and is only used away from that role when I am travelling and need music. My cellphone is the same way, serving mainly as my home phone unless I am travelling because you can't find a working payphone these days. My tablet is relatively new for this year and mainly serves for reading ebooks away from my computer.

In reality, when I'm away from my computer or consoles, I actually want to be away from them and out in the sun living life. I'll go portable if there is no other logical choice, but I'll never have the portable mindset. However, I don't hate smartphones and tablets, or even dedicated handhelds. What I want is to have a ton of options, which is why I am irritated at hearing about how one particular option (smartphones and tablets) are killing everything else.

 

[UncleSporky]

But... my console can, and I think we can all admit that the vast majority of handheld gaming occurs at home.

With the parents/wife/kids all vying for the TV, and you can't just close it and it suspends, and you can't just walk to the bedroom and play lying down, and you can't necessarily be at your PC at the same time chatting and watching youtube, etc.

 

[smr00]

well there is this (and other pads like this)

I would rather eat dirt.

And until mobile phones can put out the quality of games that 3DS and Vita does i have absolutely 0 interest in it. Oh, you have a bunch of old school ports? I can play those on a toaster. Wake me up when iphone has a pokemon or zelda level game.

Not saying mobile gaming doesn't have any good games because they do, they just aren't anywhere near handheld level.

 

[Tomat]

Bottom line: If every 3DS and Vita game were released on iOS, "bad touch" controls and all, 3DS and Vita would die. The reverse is not true. Dedicated handhelds will still be around as long as they are giving gamers something that they can't get anywhere else, but if devs start cross-releasing games (and I think that will become more likely as we move away from the old monetization systems of last gen), then it'll be hard to see a successor to 3DS/Vita doing well unless they completely reinvent themselves.

That is not true at all. Bad controls are going to drive people away from a game like they always have. Not everyone, but most people. Also worth noting, Gunman Clive was cross released on Android, iOS, and 3DS. 3DS version outsold the others by a lot.

But... my console can, and I think we can all admit that the vast majority of handheld gaming occurs at home.

Which is irrelevant if someone is looking to take those kind of games with them on the go. Just because you're not in the market doesn't suddenly mean the market doesn't exist.

 

[Soriku]

Bravely Default on 3DS alone is more important to me than all mobile games combined

This.

The best handheld games are still made for dedicated handhelds.

 

[UncleSporky]

This.

The best handheld games are still made for dedicated handhelds.

BUT FOR HOW LONG?!

Spoiler

As long as it takes for all smartphones to get buttons and slide pads standard on every device.

 

[RM8]

But... my console can

No, your home console can NOT play Super Mario 3D Land. 3DS has a ton of great exclusives, handhelds are not simply handheld versions of home consoles, they're separate platforms altogether.

 

[Eusis]

BUT FOR HOW LONG?!

Spoiler

As long as it takes for all smartphones to get buttons and slide pads standard on every device.

I think it also has to get over the stigma of more expensive software. You do both of those, combine with stablizing mobile tech growth and getting good Japanese support, and I imagine most people would be OK with mobile games, lack of physical editions aside.

That's the core of it really, if we were to have mobile gaming AS IT IS NOW completely replace handhelds I think my interest in gaming would drastically reduced and left mainly to the few AAA games that interest me and some stuff from Kickstarter. Maybe Nintendo and Japanese support if it still exists on consoles then.

 

[Raonak]

Buttons, much higher quality software, trophies, PSN integration, crossplay/buy/controller, (future)ps4 remote play. and games mostly not focused on freeium model.
Also the fact that it's a seperate piece of hardware is a bonus for me, that way i don't have to worry about draining my phone's battery.


even when im at home, certain games i perfer to play on consoles, and certain games i like to play on my vita. like recently PSASBR, got both ps3 and vita versions, and i nearly always play it on my vita even when im at home with my ps3.

 

[DigiMish]

I'll update this post when I'm off work. I'm on my shitty smartphone.

I know you haven't clarified it yet, but here's my take:

Supercell, a company with 2 top grossing games (Clash of Clans and Hayday) on the App store right now is generating $1 million... PER DAY (Source: http://www.insidemobileapps.com/2013/01/10/supercell-generating-1m-a-day/).

Apple earns ~30% of that, so 300k per day. That's just from the top 2 apps on the App Store.

There's thousands more apps earning money every single day, and every single day Apple is getting 30% of that.

There's no way that "Revenue for one Pokemon game is higher than all of Apple's DD ecosystems combined."

 

[PFD]

The only negative I find in iOS games is F2P.

Edit: doesn't puzzle & dragons make like 54 million / day?

 

[TheFLYINGManga_Ka]

Ios has some cool stuff, no doubt. But there are so much free to play games, games with so much IAPs, and similar looking games thats all about temple running or whatever, its glimmer is dimming a bit. I don't see the once bright future of gaming anymore.

With that said, there's just no way mobile gaming will ever replace dedicated handhelds. And even if tablets and phones out perform a top of the line laptop they will still lack one major key to handheld gaming, Nintendo.

Cant play Luigi Mansion 2 or Fire Emblem Awakening on my phone two of the best portable games ever made IMO.

 

[Stumpokapow]

There's no way that "Revenue for one Pokemon game is higher than all of Apple's DD ecosystems combined."

Apple's most recent payout announcement was $7 billion to developers, implying $10 billion overall App Store revenue (excluding iTunes Music/Video/Books naturally). That's more than one Pokemon game, obviously, but still limited--but I think trying to do a dollar to dollar comparison is probably unwise given that any smartphone transition by any company would also involve a reduction in the scale of their products to take advantage of the lower price ceiling on software.

 

[Tomat]

If TWEWY is on iOS, why wouldn't Bravely Default be possible?

Seriously, stop picking JRPGs to use against mobile. That and anything else turn based can be done or has been done already on smartphones.

The post above this at least targets legit concerns, especially battery life. Most of you are just being old men yelling at clouds. "CALL ME WHEN SQUARE RPGS ARE POSSIBLE LOL" ...err...

The point is, by and large, those games don't exist on the platform. I'm already not playing games on my phone and have almost zero interest in doing so. Until games of that calibur start popping up, I'm not interested. And even when they do, you've still got to convince me through good controls. And even still after that, the design of the phone and the size of the screen is important to me. It's much more comfortable for me to hold my 3DS and play a game than it is an iPhone game.

 

[Dawg]

Even the best iOS games have IAP. It feels like I'm not getting the full package when I buy an iOS game. Like, buying the game is only the beginning... if you want everything -> IAP

It doesn't help that even the most popular games are... crap? There are a few exceptions like Infinity Blade and Puzzle & Dragons that I enjoy, but most of them are very boring city builders or something. They're all the same and every few weeks/months there's a new cashgrab game where everyone seems to move to. I don't even understand how you can keep playing those games.

There's something cheap about most of those games as well. It's like they don't have a soul, you know? Especially noticeable in those Gameloft games. Pure copies without a soul. iOS/Android gamers don't seem to have high expectations though, since I've seen so many 5/5 user reviews with comments like" Great graphics!", "Very addictive" and "Excellent game!" and when I play said game, it has subpar graphics (worse than 3ds/vita) and it's yet another generic cashgrab game. This leads me to believe most of those people don't game on consoles/pc and are the new generation of gamers who play on their phones and tablets. Don't really hate them, but I bet those are same people used in statistics to show that most gamers are woman or something.

I also believe the success of these mobile games is simple. You start your iPad, you download a free game and you play it. It's that simple. It's the reason many mobile games have millions on downloads. It's accessible on your phone. Got some spare time during school/work break? Download a small game and play it or w/e. Doing the same with a Vita/3DS is kinda harder (not that much, but still) and of course using an iPhone or Android phone in public is way cooler than an actual gaming handheld. (plus people don't know you're playing/downloading a game when you're on the phone)

 

[Foffy]

They can compete simply because despite them having elements that overlap, both markets clearly have an audience to support them.

Now, if we're talking overall game quality, the title of this thread is going in the wrong direction.

 

[rpmurphy]

I don't like to buy digital if I can avoid it. Google's app store is the most consumer-friendly amongst all of the others by miles (it used to be even better), but even then I have my limits. Especially for games that take up gigabytes of space on my phone's internal memory or microSD or are going to cost $20 or more, I'd rather take less risk on the purchase and have more convenience buying physical. So yeah, consider me part of the problem of games being low-budget and with shit monetization schemes on the app store.

 

[RM8]

Google's app store is the most consumer-friendly amongst all of the others by miles

No demos, pretty nasty region lock on games/apps that should be available everywhere. It hasn't been perfect in my experience most definitely.

 

[Fusebox]

dawg, you can call iOS on its library and controls but calling out its graphics as subpar compared to 3DS is pretty ridiculous. If there's one thing iOS does best is sexy graphics at crazy resolutions.

 

[RM8]

Ultra Dario in HD still looks like Ultra Dario, though.

Plus, I can't believe iOS developers haven't managed to make non AWFUL LOOKING on-screen buttons, yuck yuck. And of course, your thumbs covering 30% of the screen.

 

[Minsc]

Even the best iOS games have IAP. It feels like I'm not getting the full package when I buy an iOS game. Like, buying the game is only the beginning... if you want everything -> IAP

I actually don't really feel all that different about buying modern console/PC releases with season passes / tons of DLC. There's plenty of fun iOS games without IAP though, ever try Space Miner? Most recently Ridiculous Fishing scored a 9 with Edge iirc, and that has no IAP either. Obviously there's ton of stuff with IAP, and plenty of awful games/apps to suck money out of people, but as long as there's dozens of legitimate ones to enjoy releasing month after month, I don't find it all that inconvenient to ignore all the ones with broken freemium systems.

 

[rpmurphy]

No demos, pretty nasty region lock on games/apps that should be available everywhere. It hasn't been perfect in my experience most definitely.

Store region-locking aside (this is something that happens pretty much everywhere else too, unfortunately), in terms of apps in general: easy refund process after purchase (they reduced this down to too short of a period though, sadly), not having to manage device activation/deactivation because there is no arbitrary device limit, being able to purchase apps off of their web store and have it automatically pushed to all your devices instead of having to use proprietary hardware or software, and being able to purchase and install apps from sources other than one app store. Others are still playing catch-up here.

 

[Fusebox]

Ultra Dario in HD still looks like Ultra Dario, though.

Plus, I can't believe iOS developers haven't managed to make non AWFUL LOOKING on-screen buttons, yuck yuck. And of course, your thumbs covering 30% of the screen.

Mage Gauntlet is my standard for attempting traditional controls on iOS but otherwise I agree, that's why I prefer games designed with touch in mind.

 

[RM8]

easy refund process after purchase (they reduced this down to too short of a period though, sadly)

It was too late for me to refund the turd that is After Burner Climax

Hey, it's actually an okay store and I like Android a lot. But I can't buy Super Monkey Ball in Mexico, while I can on Windows Phone or iOS. I also can't use Google Play Music or Amazon App Store. That kind of sucks.

 

[bobbytkc]

OP is clearly turning into a casual gamer.

 

[velociraptor]

I despise gaming on smartphones.

You could give me Uncharted 2 and I would still refuse to play it on a shitty touch screen. The terrible control input and tiny screen are a huge deal breaker.

I carry my smartphone for three main purposes: calling, texting, and internet. That's it. Today I felt quite bored so I had a quick browse through the App store for iPhone games. Guess what my initial impressions were? They suck. I would rather play shitty flash games on the computer than even attempt to play any smartphone game. Perhaps there are a few gems in the midst of the shitstorm that is apparant in the App store. Nonetheless, I find gaming on phones more intrusive than anything.

 

[stolin]

I definitely prefer paying $0-$15 for games instead of $30-$50.

I definitely prefer playing games with depth, longevity, challenge, production values, creativity, etc. I will pay any amount I see fit to get that experience... sure that's usually $30-$50. And paying that price I fully got all my entertainment value out of Luigi Mansion 2, Fire Emblem Awakening, Etrian Odyssey, Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate, etc...

Even if I drop my price down to ~$10, I still get amazing games like Pushmo, Crashmo, etc.. I'd rather continue to pay the creators of these games and avoid more layoffs and closures than face a nightmare future with silly phone games..

If that were to ever happen you'll see my in my cave blowing the dust out of my cartridges and cleaning my CD/DVDs until the end of time.. NES, SNES, N64, PSOne, PS2, GBA, NDS, 3DS, etc..

I've been playing games for 3+ decades now and you'll never see me compromise my experience just for a cheap price. My gaming time is too valuable to me.

 

[Thorakai]

Its hard to ever imagine myself ever looking at my phone as a replacement for my 3DS. Most of the games that interest me on iOS started life as a game for dedicated videogame platforms. I think the smartphone environment did itself a big disfavor by starting at the very bottom of the price barrel, people seem a lot less tolerable of releases that deviate farther away from the magical 0.99 cent entry price. I imagine if an environment was cultivated to release $15-$20 games I would be more interested.

 

[Crapitalism]

I download games to my phone play them once for 5 minutes then go back to my NINTENDO 3DS.

Touch screen controls are icky and the experiences are shallow and until that is remedied I believe dedicated gaming handhelds such as the NINTENDO 3DS will be my preferred option.

 

[Dawg]

I actually don't really feel all that different about buying modern console/PC releases with season passes / tons of DLC. There's plenty of fun iOS games without IAP though, ever try Space Miner? Most recently Ridiculous Fishing scored a 9 with Edge iirc, and that has no IAP either. Obviously there's ton of stuff with IAP, and plenty of awful games/apps to suck money out of people, but as long as there's dozens of legitimate ones to enjoy releasing month after month, I don't find it all that inconvenient to ignore all the ones with broken freemium systems.

Well, I check my iPad from time to time, but I hardly find "new games" each month that interest me. Galaxy On Fire 2 was pretty awesome, but it got boring kinda quick. Haven't tried Space Miner, might try it now you've suggested it.

I'm still waiting for that one amazing iOS game. The closest I played was probably Infinity Blade 2, I was kinda hooked on that one. For now, I enjoy Puzzle & Dragons, but I know damn well it's the addictive collecting in that game I enjoy so much and the hope of getting rare monsters, the actual gameplay is fun... but not that special.

 

[ugly]

I think Nintendo need to be bringing out some new IPs; strong first party titles of the same caliber as stuff like Zelda and Mario. I agree with people saying that Vita will be Sony's last dedicated handheld, but that Nintendo will continue - and that has largely to do with the fact that you can't get Nintendo games anywhere else. Personally I'm going to want a 3ds when Zelda drops. Nintendo needs to build on this. If they can expand their standard offerings to include as many original titles as possible that can become franchises, they'll really be able to secure that place they have in the market. If the new Nintendo handheld is the only place you can get The Legend of Zelda, Lester's Chocolate Mansion, Kirby in Dreamland, The Lonely Giant, Super Mario, Fantastic Pinman, Metroid, Fridge Raider and Pikmin then they'll be ok!

 

[dream]

I download games to my phone play them once for 5 minutes then go back to my NINTENDO 3DS.

Touch screen controls are icky and the experiences are shallow and until that is remedied I believe dedicated gaming handhelds such as the NINTENDO 3DS will be my preferred option.

For some reason, you typing "Nintendo" in all caps made me laugh so hard.

 

[UncleSporky]

Its hard to ever imagine myself ever looking at my phone as a replacement for my 3DS. Most of the games that interest me on iOS started life as a game for dedicated videogame platforms. I think the smartphone environment did itself a big disfavor by starting at the very bottom of the price barrel, people seem a lot less tolerable of releases that deviate farther away from the magical 0.99 cent entry price. I imagine if an environment was cultivated to release $15-$20 games I would be more interested.

Nowadays it's the magical FREE entry price with in app purchases. Everything. Alla time.

 

[TedNindo]

Let me know when the best games on a phone aren't run through an emulator.

There are some fun games out. But only a hand full serve as more then just a temporary distraction.

 

[liger05]

10 mins is the max I find myself playing a game on my android. The games do nothing for me. I know there are some core titles but I dont even bother as touchscreen controls sux.

I could never get the experience I get playing Luigi's Mansion 2 on the 3DS on my S3. Never going to happen!!

 

[bobbytkc]

To give you guys a gauge of how good I feel mobile phone games are, I'd rather listen to the radio while I commute than play the games on the android store.

 

[Minsc]

Well, I check my iPad from time to time, but I hardly find "new games" each month that interest me. Galaxy On Fire 2 was pretty awesome, but it got boring kinda quick. Haven't tried Space Miner, might try it now you've suggested it.

I'm still waiting for that one amazing iOS game. The closest I played was probably Infinity Blade 2, I was kinda hooked on that one. For now, I enjoy Puzzle & Dragons, but I know damn well it's the addictive collecting in that game I enjoy so much and the hope of getting rare monsters, the actual gameplay is fun... but not that special.

Touching upon the controls mentioned earlier by velociraptor, certain genres work even better on a touch screen than a controller with buttons. Have you tried SolForge or MtG or any other card games? Granted you have to have backed the kickstarter for SolForge, but it's a lot of fun, and except for some odd quirks, I think MtG DotP 2013 was supposed to be pretty decent. Stuff like Carcassonne also controls perfectly on touch devices. Plenty of other games work great, just some people have no tolerance or willingness to expand what they're familiar with... because if the controls were as bad as some people say they are, games would be downright impossible to play, which in my opinion, is very far from the truth. If hundreds of thousands of people have no problem using the controls, chances are they aren't all wrong.

Adventure games are another category which seem to function fairly well. Addressing TedNindo's post, one of the GOTYs for 2012, The Walking Dead, is also available on phones, and not through emulation. 10000000 is another title (which used to be exclusive) to phones that got mentioned on GOTY lists as well.

The games are out there, and quite numerous, you just can't pick a number out of a hat, so to speak, and expect to find one.

 

[Tomat]

I'd rather play my 3DS with both hands while driving my car to school every day. That's how I feel about smartphone gaming.

Someone is going to take this post seriously, so Im putting this little note here.

 

[railGUN]

I've spent 10 times more time playing games on my iPad than I ever did on my PSP. I don't own a Vita, but I doubt I'd spend more time on it either. I much prefer a bigger screen and more casual games for my handheld gaming needs.

If I want console quality games, I just use my console.

 

[RuGalz]

I'd rather save my phone's battery for... smartphone related tasks. And that games in the iOS/Android ecosystem generally just don't interest me.

And yea, buttons. You can hook up a controller to smartphone but games won't be designed for it. Also it's more work to connect it than when the buttons and controller is already part of the unit.

 

[bobbytkc]

The biggest problem in mobile gaming imo, is that the games target the $0 to 5 dollar price bracket. People like to talk about the walking dead and xcom on ios, but lets get real, these are ports of games that are already made on other platforms. These games would not have existed otherwise purely because of the cost of production. The end result is that the market is flooded by games that looks, and plays like the 2 dollar app that they are