Yep once R4 etc. became rampant in Europe there was visible decline in the sales charts of DS Software. It went from dominating the charts to titles rarely showing up and the retailers even screamed about the effect it was having on their once thriving handheld sales.
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Gateway 3DS: First working 3DS flashcart? [Still region locked]
- Thread starter Mitama
- Start date
Yep once R4 etc. became rampant in Europe there was visible decline in the sales charts of DS Software. It went from dominating the charts to titles rarely showing up and the retailers even screamed about the effect it was having on their once thriving handheld sales.
frankie_baby
Member
Hopefully
How so? They've never been huge players in handheld gaming to begin with.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
But he dosn't have a problem with iOS piracy. Maybe if his games didn't cost 2x more on 3DS could help to evade piracy like it does on iOS....
Not exactly.
There are flashcards that work on 3DS even after firmware updates, and usually the flashcard manufacturer will release an update so the flashcard still works if a recent 3DS update stops it from working.
I know exactly noone who bought a PSP game. Noone. ISOs from internet, every single one.
People have no shame regarding this.
DonMigs85
Member
Yes, and even parents were loading up roms for their kids
So what about piracy on PC, iOS, and all other platforms where piracy exists. Isn't he being a bit hypocritical considering he released his games on those platforms?
I haven't read the whole thread yet, so I don't know if this has been commented yet.
it didn't hurt the ds, but it hurt the software sales in europe severely and it basically killed most small publishers around (or at least made them move to other platforms)
I know many people in real life who owned a ds, bought many games for it. as soon as they got there r4 cards, they stopped buying games altogether. and from what I could gather, that has been the norm all over europe.
less and less games got published. In the end, basically nintendo was the only one left who kept publishing games. (even though there where many games that publishers could've picked up - they didn't, because sales weren't worth it).
With the 3ds, those publishers were returning slowly. but now... with region lock, it will be even worse than before.
it didn't hurt the ds, but it hurt the software sales in europe severely and it basically killed most small publishers around (or at least made them move to other platforms)
I know many people in real life who owned a ds, bought many games for it. as soon as they got there r4 cards, they stopped buying games altogether. and from what I could gather, that has been the norm all over europe.
less and less games got published. In the end, basically nintendo was the only one left who kept publishing games. (even though there where many games that publishers could've picked up - they didn't, because sales weren't worth it).
With the 3ds, those publishers were returning slowly. but now... with region lock, it will be even worse than before.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
I know people who had hundreds of pirated PSX games. And since he did not have internet he just rented them and copied them. Hell even one of them even sold games to other classmates!.
And PSX still was a huge success.
you're missing the point, its not the hardware that suffered its the software that does.
Oh yes. Don´t know how many conversations I caught where parents directly asked in the shop if its already pirated, because they want to use those flashcarts again.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Well, let me change that:"PSX and it's games had still a great success".
Some flashcarts on DS were updatable.
Okay. Show me a piece of ds software that suffered because of piracy.
You know that the one major difference, between those days and now, is that almost everyone has access to the internet?
I know for a fact that if Nintendo introduced a proper account system then piracy would be much less of an issue.
Anyway, still region locked + one game at a time = pointless for me
still waiting on the real deal to circumvent Nintendo's stupid 3DS limitations
I dont want the system to become piracy land again, but a good flashcart would provide me with 0 risk of losing the games I purchase by not having them tied to the system, and the ability to back up my saves without risk of SD corruption
so yeah, as soon as one that does that show up, i'll be getting it
Anyway, still region locked + one game at a time = pointless for me
still waiting on the real deal to circumvent Nintendo's stupid 3DS limitations
I dont want the system to become piracy land again, but a good flashcart would provide me with 0 risk of losing the games I purchase by not having them tied to the system, and the ability to back up my saves without risk of SD corruption
so yeah, as soon as one that does that show up, i'll be getting it
DonMigs85
Member
This is true. Copied games were mostly common only in Asia and South America, and few in the USA had fast internet or CD burners at the time.
The Dreamcast was also badly affected by the rise of CD burners.
people complaining about it's existence should think about outside the US
I can only buy games digitally, retail prices are impossible. If Nintendo wants me to purchase their games without a care then they should provide a system that makes it easier for me to buy the game and just legitimately have it there rather than going through the process of buying it + backing it up with a flashcart because of backwards ancient digital policies
a flashcart would get me to buy more games with much less worry
I can only buy games digitally, retail prices are impossible. If Nintendo wants me to purchase their games without a care then they should provide a system that makes it easier for me to buy the game and just legitimately have it there rather than going through the process of buying it + backing it up with a flashcart because of backwards ancient digital policies
a flashcart would get me to buy more games with much less worry
mohsinkhan
Member
This sucks I really hope Nintendo shuts these guys down.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Still accesing to pirate games in those years were really easy. You can change PSX for PS2 who also had piracy, if you want. My point still stands.
Piracy by itself it isn't as harming as many people think. Other factors matters. There's a reason why platforms that suffers from piracy like PC, iOS and Android are a sucess for developers and people buy the games in those platforms.
Hopefully Nintendo will be able to combat this with firmware. It would be a shame to see the machine plagued with piracy at this stage in its life.
..at the very least...lets hope eshop content and hacking online modes will be kept caged.
Sadly this is the sort of thing that will make bullshit anti-consumer DRM excuses appear justified.
..at the very least...lets hope eshop content and hacking online modes will be kept caged.
Sadly this is the sort of thing that will make bullshit anti-consumer DRM excuses appear justified.
dacuk
Member
Maybe this article could help:
http://kotaku.com/5520462/nintendo-blames-ds-piracy-for-50-sales-drop-in-europe
DonMigs85
Member
If the games on the flashcart mess up or don't work with the Activity Log or Streetpass then I don't think it's worthwhile.
I guess I just like to play games the way the manufacturer intended. Never know if weird bugs might crop up too.
Another thing is that flashcarts tend to drain the battery faster since they contain their own processor
We are the exception rather than the norm. Out of all my friends, I'm the only one that would still buy games. Everyone else is celebrating the fact that they can pirate 3ds games now.
no doubt, but what do you want me to say, I wanna be able to buy games without worrying about 0 support from Nintendo if I break/lose the unit because im in a third world country without customer service. They can't blame me for getting one when they won't provide me with a better legitimate alternative. They can rest easy that i'll still buy all my games, but that's it
given that the 3DS allows me to have multiple games at once in the unit, I think this time around i'd only really use it as a back up tool to make up for their lack of accounts
unless of course it kills the region lock
DonMigs85
Member
It's your gubment's fault for charging such high taxes and import duties
Here in the Philippines retail games now cost the same or even slightly cheaper than in the USA. Back in the N64 days though prices were pretty nuts
It doesn't mean a majority those downloads would have been converted into sales. Of course there's potential, and it sounds what they're talking about, but there's now way to prove that.
Edit: It's all Europe's fault and they still get all the good stuff? Wtf Nintendo.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
One of my friends pirated all his DS software. Now he owns a Vita. All the software he plays is legal. Wanna know the reason? PS+.
He is right. A pirated copy don't equals a loss sale. If there wasn't piracy he wouldn't have bought that game that's all. There's no way to proof otherwise.
That is just Nintendo being completly oblivious of the fact people could buy portable software 10x cheaper than in the DS.
Flawless.
Of course, I too am worried about no account system. I really want to go all digital but with no support is hard to commit and I'm always worried about some of my games. Still I doubt that would encourage some of my friends to buy games. (I think I'll go physical for LM)
Not really, retail games can be bought for $40-42 after a month (starting by the first day they arrive here, so like 2 months after launch) so is not that bad (is still bad). Console prices remain high for a long long time though.
It varies from person to person. I converted one friend from "sometimes buys pirated pc games" to "sometimes buy steam games on discount". The convenience and the low prices were key for that. I'm part of a small comunity of gamers (it all started with a streetpass group) and one of the guys here import games to sell, one time he told us he only play pirated games, and only got a 3ds because that Zelda 3ds was too good to pass up. It was weird, I mean that guy import games and makes a living out of it (not sure if is his only job), but still steals from the industry??
peanutbutterlatte
Member
And I'm sure if the Vita ever gets hacked your reformed friend will stay squeaky clean.
Sakura
Member
Pretty disappointing news.
But it shouldn't be hard for Nintendo to block. I know people reference how you can still use DS flash carts on the 3DS, but that is more because the 3DS is emulating a DS when it runs those, so it is harder to fix security flaws.
As it is, it doesn't break the region lock. It doesn't allow multiple games per flash cart. It doesn't allow homebrew. So even the people who go on about legitimate use for flash carts would have no legitimate use for this.
Also why do people complain about eShop prices for digital games? I don't know about the American or European eShops, but the Japanese one has sales time to time, and reduces prices permanently on some titles.
But it shouldn't be hard for Nintendo to block. I know people reference how you can still use DS flash carts on the 3DS, but that is more because the 3DS is emulating a DS when it runs those, so it is harder to fix security flaws.
As it is, it doesn't break the region lock. It doesn't allow multiple games per flash cart. It doesn't allow homebrew. So even the people who go on about legitimate use for flash carts would have no legitimate use for this.
Also why do people complain about eShop prices for digital games? I don't know about the American or European eShops, but the Japanese one has sales time to time, and reduces prices permanently on some titles.
Terrible news, sounds like this has the potential to really hurt software sales for the 3DS and so early in the lifecycle too. I really hope that Nintendo can kill this, but I suspect it won't be easy.
I saw a lot of very young kids with ds flashcards, and it really struck a chord with me. If tech unsavvy parents can sponsor piracy and load R4's full of ROMs then. I guess we do deserve this bullshit DRM future.
I saw a lot of very young kids with ds flashcards, and it really struck a chord with me. If tech unsavvy parents can sponsor piracy and load R4's full of ROMs then. I guess we do deserve this bullshit DRM future.
Immaculate
Banned
No region lock fix? :/ Count me out
Relaxed Muscle
Member
We talked about it and he says he don't mind playing as long as he considers that software worthwhile the price their asking for it. He also buys Android apps and even some games. And he buys on Steam.
We ordered together games on Zavvi and even bought PS3 games on offer. And he's incredibly happy with PS+. A satisfied costumer isn't going to try to steal you.
Piracy is not the problem. Piracy + no region locking + backwards DRM + premium software pricing is deadly.
There are sales here and there, but people want to pay less for a digital game than a cart any day any time. Their logic is "a digital game is easier to distribute and costs less to the publisher, so it should cost less too me", I agree but I think Nintendo thinks this way "digital and carry it with you all the times, or a cart and resell it or lend it to friends" so that's why the MSRP in the eshop is the same as in retail
It is a problem if there are gamers that can buy games but decide just to pirate them, I have like, 5 examples right now in my facebook feed. As I said, it varies from person to person. Some just don't want to pay for games, but they do it because is the only way for them to play, enable piracy and they are gone.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Piracy is definitely a problem on its own, whether you think it is or not.
The best thing that has happened to the 3DS is something that can further discourage publishers from releasing games on it?
I wonder where the completely insane act ends and begins for you.
Storm Prelude
Member
I don't like it...piracy is just a cancer, if it's start spreading too much will be a lot easier for developers to discouraged to work to new project with a low probability to make success.
Coffee Dog
Banned
Link a study.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
If those people you mention won't buy games even if things like Steam or PS+ exists, then they won't buy games no matter what. That's not losing sales, you can't lose something you didn't gonna have anyway.
DonMigs85
Member
It's probably impossible to get around region locking if the games are fully signed.
Perhaps one workaround is for the flashcart to present itself to the OS as a different game entirely like some older DS flashcarts did, but that would likely render Activity Log and Streetpass features useless.
Perhaps one workaround is for the flashcart to present itself to the OS as a different game entirely like some older DS flashcarts did, but that would likely render Activity Log and Streetpass features useless.
DonMigs85
Member
Then they should find other hobbies to kill time instead of pirating and playing games.
Maybe gardening or stamp collecting
No, as I said, those buy games because they have no other options, (a lot of them where asking if they could pirate MH, ended buying the game), now that there is piracy, some of them will stop buying games altogether, others will only pay for special games (like zelda, but will pirate things like Castlevania) and others like me will continue paying for games.
Edit: Heck I remember when I said that I downloaded MH, like 2 of them asked me how and what R4 I was using >_>, thankfully someone else clarified that I just used the eshop. One of those guys got the game shortly after.