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George Lucas Making Changes to Star Wars Saga... Again

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L

LulaBrasi

Member
PhoncipleBone said:
Beat me to it. Fool screen, err...I mean full screen, is when they chop the picture to make it fit the 1.33 frame. The Laserdiscs and DVDs of the untouched OT were letterboxed. It preserved the original aspect ratio, but was not encoded for a widescreen display. There are many DVDs out there like this, and some of big movies. True Lies and The Abyss have never had proper anamorphic releases in the US.

BUT there were full screen versions of Star Wars on DVD. I just pretend they do not exist.



What aspect ratio was the LD in, and what was the DVD in? Both were 2.35.
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My apologies for saying aspect ratio.. That is just what i call everything that has to do with the picture. So maybe the aspect ratio is correct on the theatrical dvd's, but the picture i certainly fucked up :D
 
P

PhoncipleBone

Banned
LulaBrasi said:
My apologies for saying aspect ratio.. That is just what i call everything that has to do with the picture. So maybe the aspect ratio is correct on the theatrical dvd's, but the picture i certainly fucked up :D
Click to expand...

It is simply a 1993 master. There was no restoration involved. They simply took the Definitive Edition LD masters and put them on a DVD.

The DVD also had ever so slightly higher resolution than the LD due to the tech. But it is VERY minor.

TheDigitalBits said:
As expected, the films on Disc Two of these sets are presented in non-anamorphic (letterboxed) widescreen in the original 2.35:1 aspect ratio. The DVDs were mastered from the same 1993, standard-definition film transfer as the Definitive Edition laserdisc box set. I will say that these DVDs DO look better than the laserdiscs.
Click to expand...

http://www.thedigitalbits.com/reviews3/spinsheet091406.html#star
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
nVidiot_Whore said:
I mean.. blinking e-woks.. no big deal..

But WHY? lol
Click to expand...

Lucas be trolling.

All these little things that fans would love to see touched up or fixed and they spend time having ewoks blink! lol
 
The Lamonster

The Lamonster

Member
I'm excited for all the little changes. If Ewoks are blinking now I can only imagine what other kinds of fun 'improvements' are scattered around in the six films.

Hopefully that stupid Luke kick is fixed, and all the color issues and sound issues. I also hope they improve some of the existing 1997 CGI like Jabba in ANH.
 
S

Salmonax

Member
DennisK4 said:
Puppet Yoda looks a million times better than CG Yoda.
Click to expand...
So true. Even with the usual fantasy film suspension of disbelief, I didn't buy that CG Yoda was real for a second. He has that typical over-animated quality that CG characters often have where movements are excessively fluid and facial expressions are overacted.

Although I can understand that if your first exposure to puppet Yoda was the EP1 monstrosity, you'd be anti-puppet. No question CG Yoda is an improvement there.
 
M

Medalion

Banned
The Lamonster said:
I'm excited for all the little changes. If Ewoks are blinking now I can only imagine what other kinds of fun 'improvements' are scattered around in the six films.

Hopefully that stupid Luke kick is fixed, and all the color issues and sound issues. I also hope they improve some of the existing 1997 CGI like Jabba in ANH.
Click to expand...
Force Kick will stay, I am almost 100% of that
 
M

Morn

Banned
The Lamonster said:
I'm excited for all the little changes. If Ewoks are blinking now I can only imagine what other kinds of fun 'improvements' are scattered around in the six films.

Hopefully that stupid Luke kick is fixed, and all the color issues and sound issues. I also hope they improve some of the existing 1997 CGI like Jabba in ANH.
Click to expand...

They touched up the 1997 Jabba CG on the 2004 LDs, so they probably did more on the BD.
 
S

S1kkZ

Member
Salmonax said:
They'll just keep polishing that turd of an unnecessary scene endlessly.
Click to expand...
the scene is untouched. the vader "noooo" thing is confirmed, there is a soundfile available (dont know if i can post the link, since it is from a leaked copy).
 
L

LulaBrasi

Member
PhoncipleBone said:
It is simply a 1993 master. There was no restoration involved. They simply took the Definitive Edition LD masters and put them on a DVD.

The DVD also had ever so slightly higher resolution than the LD due to the tech. But it is VERY minor.



http://www.thedigitalbits.com/reviews3/spinsheet091406.html#star
Click to expand...
But how come the LD's are widescreen and the theatrical dvd's are some sort of wierd fullscreen? I am definetly not an expert on the subject, in fact i think you know more about it plus you speak better english than me, so you are a bit easier to understand, but in my mind i am sure Lucas fucked the dvd's up on purpose just to prove to people that his horrific cgi remastered editions where better :D
 
P

PhoncipleBone

Banned
LulaBrasi said:
But how come the LD's are widescreen and the theatrical dvd's are some sort of wierd fullscreen? I am definetly not an expert on the subject, in fact i think you know more about it plus you speak better english than me, so you are a bit easier to understand, but in my mind i am sure Lucas fucked the dvd's up on purpose just to prove to people that his horrific cgi remastered editions where better :D
Click to expand...

Read up: http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articles/anamorphic/index.html

A good visual example: http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articles/anamorphic/anamorphic235demo.html
 
R

richiek

steals Justin Bieber DVDs
Hoo boy. SW fanboys are gonna have an aneurysm after hearing this.

Obi-Wan's Krayt Dragon yell in ANH has been altered again.

http://bayfiles.com/file/RQD/3axPN7/KrayytDragon.mp3

Vader now says NOOO twice when Luke is tortured by Palpatine and goes to attack him.

http://bayfiles.com/file/RTz/P45etn/NooooNoooo.mp3

The info is from MillenniumFalcon.com.
http://www.millenniumfalcon.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=9032

Man, I don't mind the changes but I can imagine the fanboys calling for Lucas' blood.
 
B

Big One

Banned
richiek said:
Hoo boy. SW fanboys are gonna have an aneurysm after hearing this.

Obi-Wan's Krayt Dragon yell in ANH has been altered again.

http://bayfiles.com/file/RQD/3axPN7/KrayytDragon.mp3

Vader now says NOOO twice when Luke is tortured by Palpatine and goes to attack him.

http://bayfiles.com/file/RTz/P45etn/NooooNoooo.mp3

The info is from MillenniumFalcon.com.
http://www.millenniumfalcon.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=9032

Man, I don't mind the changes but I can imagine the fanboys calling for Lucas' blood.
Click to expand...
I'm currently at work and can't hear this. Is this as bad as the Episode 3 NOOOOO?

Goddamn unnecessary editions. I wish Lucas would just call these Star Wars: Director's Cut or some shit.
 
R

richiek

steals Justin Bieber DVDs
Big One said:
I'm currently at work and can't hear this. Is this as bad as the Episode 3 NOOOOO?
Click to expand...

Thankfully, Vader's NOOO is not recycled from ROTS, it's different. More subdued, too. I can see it pissing off SW purists, though.
 
M

Medalion

Banned
Vader saying NOOOO while get Luke is getting shocked... I always felt that just having Vader be silent as he attacked the Emperor coulda used "something" from Vader, but I won't hear the "nooooo" till I buy the blu-rays, I don't want to be turned off and not buy them based on a bad sound file
 
The Elite

The Elite

BOSS
Gary Kurtz would be rolling in his grave if he was dead.

Saw him this weekend. Yeah, he doesn't get this shit either.
 
L

LulaBrasi

Member
S

Sanjuro

Member
Medalion said:
Vader saying NOOOO while get Luke is getting shocked... I always felt that just having Vader be silent as he attacked the Emperor coulda used "something" from Vader, but I won't hear the "nooooo" till I buy the blu-rays, I don't want to be turned off and not buy them based on a bad sound file
Click to expand...
It's not a bad sound file. It is captured directly from the source.
 
P

PhoncipleBone

Banned
LulaBrasi said:
Well that is all fine and dandy, but it doesn't make any difference.. The LD's where pretty much perfect, but somehow they really messed up the dvd's.. No matter how and why and which aspects the movie is in, i am convinced that it shouldn't be that hard to make a perfect transer :)
Click to expand...

Huh? How does that not illustrate why the LDs and DVDs of the OT were different from the altered versions?

It is fine to say that you prefer the LD, but it seems like you are dismissing how things are transferred from one format to another.

And it actually IS that hard to make a perfect transfer. There are so many different things they have to go through to get them made. As for Star Wars, it should be easier since they had to do a restoration for the Special Editions and DVD releases anyways, but the whole process of making an HD master from an original film negative is very intensive.
 
M

Medalion

Banned
Sanjuro Tsubaki said:
It's not a bad sound file. It is captured directly from the source.
Click to expand...
Irregardless, I don't want to find out it is terrible...

If I had known about the big song and dance sequence in ROTJ:SE back in tha day I woulda never saw it
 
S

Sanjuro

Member
Medalion said:
Irregardless, I don't want to find out it is terrible...

If I had known about the big song and dance sequence in ROTJ:SE back in tha day I woulda never saw it
Click to expand...
It's no different from that. If you have watched the originals it's terrible, otherwise you probably won't care. They have made the old films cringe-worthy because it's so damn obvious where they decided to throw crap in.
 
J

JB1981

Member
richiek said:
Hoo boy. SW fanboys are gonna have an aneurysm after hearing this.

Obi-Wan's Krayt Dragon yell in ANH has been altered again.

http://bayfiles.com/file/RQD/3axPN7/KrayytDragon.mp3

Vader now says NOOO twice when Luke is tortured by Palpatine and goes to attack him.

http://bayfiles.com/file/RTz/P45etn/NooooNoooo.mp3

The info is from MillenniumFalcon.com.
http://www.millenniumfalcon.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=9032

Man, I don't mind the changes but I can imagine the fanboys calling for Lucas' blood.
Click to expand...

oh my god awful. i hate george
 
The Lamonster

The Lamonster

Member
Fuck it, let's just change all of Vader's lines to NOOOOOOOO


Why does George Lucas feel the need to poop all over his creations? Can't he just stick to improving things that sucked instead of adding new things that suck?
 
J

Joe Shlabotnik

Banned
LulaBrasi said:
Well that is all fine and dandy, but it doesn't make any difference.. The LD's where pretty much perfect, but somehow they really messed up the dvd's.. No matter how and why and which aspects the movie is in, i am convinced that it shouldn't be that hard to make a perfect transfer :)
Click to expand...

The DVD is a "perfect transfer", technically. It's a direct rip of the LD with no alteration or conversion for widescreen displays at all. The LD is letterboxed, not anamorphic (formatted for widescreen TVs). If you played the actual LD on a widescreen display it would look exactly the same as the DVD, with bars on all four sides because it is not formatted for widescreen televisions.

You are correct, however, in stating that converting these for widescreen TVs is pretty trivial. The cost and time involved would basically be a rounding error for Lucas.

Edit: I'll take PhoncipleBone's word that the process is actually quite complicated as I was just assuming it wasn't due to 99% of DVDs currently being anamorphic. It is of course still well within Lucas' resources to do so.
 
S

Sober

Member
Ushojax said:
The most crucial change for me is that they fix the Anakin ghost at the end. I don't give a fuck that it's Hayden Christensen, but the shoddy eyeline match and creepy stare is a terrible way to end the saga (a bit like ROTJ in general).
Click to expand...
Pretty much this - I'm sure Lucas just shopped his head from some other shot onto the body in ROTJ when he should've at least put the effort into filming him in it so it didn't look so creepy.
 
L

LulaBrasi

Member
PhoncipleBone said:
Huh? How does that not illustrate why the LDs and DVDs of the OT were different from the altered versions?

It is fine to say that you prefer the LD, but it seems like you are dismissing how things are transferred from one format to another.

And it actually IS that hard to make a perfect transfer. There are so many different things they have to go through to get them made. As for Star Wars, it should be easier since they had to do a restoration for the Special Editions and DVD releases anyways, but the whole process of making an HD master from an original film negative is very intensive.
Click to expand...
Oh no sir i am not dismissing anything.. Not on purpose anyway, but i really don't get why a transfer would be so difficult. It seems fairly simple. They have the LD source discs, they are widescreen and look pretty normal on widescreen tv's. Then they transfer the LD's to DVD's and all of a sudden the image looks different??? No matter how they did it, that should not happen.. I am not talking about making the originals into bluray, i just want a transfer that looks like it is an exact copy of the laserdiscs..
 
L

LulaBrasi

Member
Joe Shlabotnik said:
The DVD is a "perfect transfer", technically. It's a direct rip of the LD with no alteration or conversion for widescreen displays at all. The LD is letterboxed, not anamorphic (formatted for widescreen TVs). If you played the actual LD on a widescreen display it would look exactly the same as the DVD, with bars on all four sides because it is not formatted for widescreen televisions.

You are correct, however, in stating that converting these for widescreen TVs is pretty trivial. The cost and time involved would basically be a rounding error for Lucas.

Edit: I'll take PhoncipleBone's word that the process is actually quite complicated as I was just assuming it wasn't due to 99% of DVDs currently being anamorphic. It is of course still well within Lucas' resources to do so.
Click to expand...
Aaaaaah... Now i sorta get it :D i am sorry for my ignorance, but all those technical terms an aspect ratios and other wierd cinematic standards are mindbuggling to me.. I am not good at math, i just know when something looks wrong..

Thanks for trying to explain it :D

Edit - now i am actually thinking of buying those theatrical dvd's because they are the "perfect/correct" transfer.. I don't care about black bars, i just want the bad cgi out of my movie :D
 
W

Warm Machine

Member
DoctorWho said:
Gary Kurtz would be rolling in his grave if he was dead.

Saw him this weekend. Yeah, he doesn't get this shit either.
Click to expand...

Because it is an attempt to keep Star Wars visually relevant. Kids look at EP IV, in the wake of Avatar for example, and think it looks cheap and old.

I agree with some of the changes, I don't agree with all of them but the movies have never looked better and the storytelling has remained nearly untouched since the inception of the films. The only thing that I take issue with in that regard is Han not shooting Greedo first, as it only served to nerf the character.
 
M

Medalion

Banned
Ok I couldn't resist, I heard the NOOOoooo

It doesn't fit the mix of the sound at all... it almost feels like it was stolen from another scene and just randomly pasted into the mix

It's not "bad" in delivery but it makes no sense contextually and in the mix
 
The Lamonster

The Lamonster

Member
Warm Machine said:
Because it is an attempt to keep Star Wars visually relevant. Kids look at EP IV, in the wake of Avatar for example, and think it looks cheap and old.

I agree with some of the changes, I don't agree with all of them but the movies have never looked better and the storytelling has remained nearly untouched since the inception of the films. The only thing that I take issue with in that regard is Han not shooting Greedo first, as it only served to nerf the character.
Click to expand...
Just like this Vader NOOOOO in ANH will do...
 
S

Sanjuro

Member
I just found my Return of the Jedi radio drama...I guess I'll just re-listen to this instead of these new editions. John Lithgow is the only Yoda I'll ever need.
 
G

Gary Whitta

Member
Is it still possible to find the 2006 DVDs that included the original, pre-SE versions of the films? Because that's really all I want. I wish I had bought them at the time!
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
Need more Lucas rape gifs in here

Gary Whitta said:
Is it still possible to find the 2006 DVDs that included the original, pre-SE versions of the films? Because that's really all I want. I wish I had bought them at the time!
Click to expand...

Yup
 
S

Sanjuro

Member
Gary Whitta said:
Is it still possible to find the 2006 DVDs that included the original, pre-SE versions of the films? Because that's really all I want. I wish I had bought them at the time!
Click to expand...
You would need to find a second hand market most likely or a store that has had it sitting on the shelf. The quality is disappointing though. They are strictly Laserdisc rips and lesser quality of even the Hong Kong eBay version my friend lent me back when DVDs were coming into their own.
 
M

megashock5

Member
Warm Machine said:
The only thing that I take issue with in that regard is Han not shooting Greedo first, as it only served to nerf the character.
Click to expand...

That and the musical number. If it weren't for those two things, I really wouldn't have a problem with the SE's. But that whole Jedi Rocks thing is just too much to overlook.
 
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