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God Of War 4 art leaks (Norse setting, Kratos w/ beard) [Up2: Polygon says real]

Which part of God of War 4 are you most excited about?


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Well, that might be because God of War is a very badly written series. I mean, the "no warring among Gods" rule doesn't even make sense within the first game. Ares violated that rule by attacking Athena's city. But he didn't suffer any consequences except the gods indirect retaliation of launching Kratos at him. Il

So if they have no higher power they need to answer to and the gods are self governing, and Ares has broken the cardinal rule, then I don't see why they can't just decide to amend their own rule of nonviolence in the name of self defense. It's like they have some kind of incomprehensible rule of pacificism among each other.

But whatever. Let's be nice to the series and just assume that there was a difference between beings who are born gods and beings who are made gods. Kratos is the latter and his Godhood can be taken away of he does it of his own will. Which is how zues got his out of him. He maybe couldn't do that with Ares. Or maybe Ares just wasn't so hopelessly stupid as to pour his Godhood out of his body at the behest of someone he knows to be his enemy.

Man, Kratos is dumb.

I always intended that rule as the gods cannot fight each other like "personally". So Ares is abusing that rule an thus attacking Athena's city without fear of direct repercussions from the gods themselfs and that's why they send a demigod to fight him.
I think Kratos is the new god of war to all intent and purposes after he ascended to mount Olympus, no matter his origins. And i think the godhood of Ares could be taken away too, but he was probably aware of these tricks.
To be fair Kratos didn't knew that Zeus was his enemy, he thought Athena was the enemie. So he trusted Zeus that took advantage of the situation and betrayed him.

Maybe Kratos isn't the smartest of all, but he is being manipulated by the greek gods who are known for they're tricks. What i mean is that he isn't being tricked by the first person that crosses the street.
 
OléGunner;200304462 said:
Don't think this will happen.

GoW is all about striking the perfect balance between combat, platforming and puzzle solving.
Pulling too much in the puzzle direction would piss off a lot of fans including me.

I do want grand environmental puzzles though with a lot of moving pieces.
The Steeds of Time bridge puzzle from GoW II is still one of my favourites in the series.

That's the problem with recent GOW games. I feel like the metroidvania-ish style and puzzle mix was off balance for GoW3 and GoWA. The non combat stuff felt way too "onrails" and filler-ish too me
 

Corpsepyre

Banned
Veelk, why do you like talking about this game so much if you're not a fan? What do you hope to gain by writing so much on a title you're not into? You're in just about every GoW related thread, talking about how dumb it is.
 
I don't know, I used to think that GOW2 was the best but when I played the collection it felt pretty tedious towards the end, didn't feel that with 3 or Ascension. don't get me wrong, Ascension is the worst in the series behind Chains of Olympus but the puzzles in 2 with enemies constantly attacking you and reseting the puzzles were frustrating in higher difficulties. GOW3 turns into a somehow boring game after Cronos (except tha insane battle inside the labirynt) but at least you can push through it without cursing at stuff like I metioned of 2.
 
I don't know, I used to think that GOW2 was the best but when I played the collection it felt pretty tedious towards the end, didn't feel that with 3 or Ascension. don't get me wrong, Ascension is the worst in the series behind Chains of Olympus but the puzzles in 2 with enemies constantly attacking you and reseting the puzzles were frustrating in higher difficulties. GOW3 turns into a somehow boring game after Cronos (except tha insane battle inside the labirynt) but at least you can push through it without cursing at stuff like I metioned of 2.

Like I said in my previous post:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=200185876&postcount=983
 

Veelk

Banned
I always intended that rule as the gods cannot fight each other like "personally". So Ares is abusing that rule an thus attacking Athena's city without fear of direct repercussions from the gods themselfs and that's why they send a demigod to fight him.
I think Kratos is the new god of war to all intent and purposes after he ascended to mount Olympus, no matter his origins. And i think the godhood of Ares could be taken away too, but he was probably aware of these tricks.
To be fair Kratos didn't knew that Zeus was his enemy, he thought Athena was the enemie. So he trusted Zeus that took advantage of the situation and betrayed him.

As far as the direct war thing goes, that's what I assumed as well, but if that's the case, can't Athena just lay waste to Sparta in a similar manner? That way, she can stop the fighting atleast on the human level. She can eliminate his armies, and then just fly down to defend Athens herself. Without any armies, ares would have to attack Athena directly to destroy her city, and if there are any meaningful consequences to that, ares would suffer them. She can basically instigate a cold war at any time.

Now, the rule is specifically stated to be "don't wage war". But this is exactly what ares does when he attacks Athens. He mobilizes an army to attack a city state under the dominion of another being. That is war. However, Athena should be able to just kick his ass. A single battle between two individuals is not a war except in the romantic sense. So unless they are just being dramatic with the wording (which you'd think they'd take advantage of. "I'm not waging a war on Ares, father, I'm just kicking him. In the dick"), it doesn't make much sense.

And no, Kratos suspects Zeus from the start. He says something to the effect of "you've always cockblocked me before, why stop now?" and Zeus answers "Cuz reasons. For Olympus." and the Kratos shrugs "Seems legit."

I agree that this is a betrayal of trust, but again, Kratos is really dumb here. One for trusting a known enemy under such flimsy reasoning and another for not doing his fucking homework and finding out what the gods are and are not capable of.
 

EhoaVash

Member
My only experience with this series was ascension. It ...was really just boring :/ and kratos was such a boring character

Also rolling/ dodging with right thumb stick felt like ass man. Pls make it so it's a button instead

But doo I love Norse mythology. Will keep a eye on this one. If it's more if the ascension like shit, will skip
 
That's the problem with recent GOW games. I feel like the metroidvania-ish style and puzzle mix was off balance for GoW3 and GoWA. The non combat stuff felt way too "onrails" and filler-ish too me

I always liked the non combat parts as a palette cleanser in between ripping out minotaur guts and cyclop eyes.

Let's the heart rate settle a bit haha
Edit: jut meant in general for the games there.

My only experience with this series was ascension. It ...was really just boring :/ and kratos was such a boring character

Also rolling/ dodging with right thumb stick felt like ass man. Pls make it so it's a button instead

But doo I love Norse mythology. Will keep a eye on this one. If it's more if the ascension like shit, will skip

I mean you played the lowest quality game in the series if I'm honest :/
And yeah if you don't like Kratos when it looks like he'll be back then I dunno..

I think the team at SSM will have way more room to play with scale on PS4 so it could be more exciting than Ascension I hope!
 
As far as the direct war thing goes, that's what I assumed as well, but if that's the case, can't Athena just lay waste to Sparta in a similar manner? That way, she can stop the fighting atleast on the human level. She can eliminate his armies, and then just fly down to defend Athens herself. Without any armies, ares would have to attack Athena directly to destroy her city, and if there are any meaningful consequences to that, ares would suffer them. She can basically instigate a cold war at any time.

Now, the rule is specifically stated to be "don't wage war". This is exactly what ares does when he attacks Athens. However, Athena should be able to just kick his ass. A single battle between two individuals is not a war. So,so unless they are just being dramatic with the wording, it doesn't make much sense.

And no, Kratos suspects Zeus from the start. He says something to the effect of "you've always cockblocked me before, why stop now?" and Zeus answers "Cuz reasons. For Olympus." and the Kratos shrugs "Seems legit."

I agree that this is a betrayal of trust, but again, Kratos is really dumb here. One for trusting a known enemy under such flimsy reasoning and another for not doing his fucking homework and finding out what the gods are and are not capable of.

I think it could be more of a fact of how they wanted to portray the gods in the first game... like probably they didn't want Athena to be the same as Ares?

No, it was "Why do you help me now", it doesn't say that he opposed him at any time. Indeed he is surprised when Zeus reveal himself at the beginning of the game, while he thought it was Athena. They weren't really enemies until that moment.
 
OléGunner;200314766 said:
I always liked the non combat parts as a palette cleanser in between ripping out minotaur guts and cyclop eyes.

Let's the heart rate settle a bit haha
Edit: jut meant in general for the games there.



I mean you played the lowest quality game in the series if I'm honest :/
And yeah if you don't like Kratos when it looks like he'll be back then I dunno..

I think the team at SSM will have way more room to play with scale on PS4 so it could be more exciting than Ascension I hope!

From these two concept arts: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=200175134&postcount=872

there is a good vision of scale represeneted in the giant plants which constitute the living environment. Even the ground is living giant leaves that may have cracks or fall apart which will force Kratos to jump and be careful.
 

Veelk

Banned
I think it could be more of a fact of how they wanted to portray the gods in the first game... like probably they didn't want Athena to be the same as Ares?

They did it because they wanted to raise the stakes. A city about to fall is more dramatic than a city that might be in danger of falling someday if Athena falls asleep or something. But they didn't write it in a coherent way. The fates are the only known active power higher than the gods, and they do nothing in the first game.

No, it was "Why do you help me now", it doesn't say that he opposed him at any time. Indeed he is surprised when Zeus reveal himself at the beginning of the game, while he thought it was Athena. They weren't really enemies until that moment.

Except he knows that all the gods disapprove of his war mongering since Athena told him and she disapproves of it too and it was an ongoing problem. So fine, here's this mysterious god, all of a sudden helping you wage the war that they've been against this whole time, and now they tell you the only way to win is to divorce yourself from all your power.

And keep in mind that he already considers Athena to have "tricked" him in the last game, where he again jumped into an arrangement without getting the terms clear, and never got those nightmares removed. Even if he thought the eagle was Athena, even if they're not enemies, she's already a known "trickster"

So yeah, he's dumb.
 
I always intended that rule as the gods cannot fight each other like "personally". So Ares is abusing that rule an thus attacking Athena's city without fear of direct repercussions from the gods themselfs and that's why they send a demigod to fight him.
I mean, stuff like this is lifted straight from the classic stories and myths. In the Odyssey, Athena and Hermes helps Odysseus against Poseidon's wishes. Poseidon wants revenge upon him because Odysseus blinded his son.

The whole no direct conflict between gods, but using underhanded tricks and helping mortals to subvert other gods in secret, was like the whole thing in Greek myth
 
Yup. When the worst game in your franchise is God of War 3, you are doing pretty good.

I am glad they are keeping Kratos. Stig really did him dirty in GoW3 and shit on all the build up Barlog put into place.

Except for the fact that Barlog was the one that left... And under Barlog's direction was the gaping plothole of Kratos using the threads of time to go back to the time before Zeus betrayed him rather than the time before he made his blood oath with Aries/killed his family.

Hack and slash games might be popular beyond GoW (although I think saying 'a dime a dozen' is a huge exaggeration), but IMO few if any have the same near-perfect balance of combat, puzzles, exploration and platforming. This is why for me GoW works so well - because it has a lot more variety than its peers. I hope that doesn't change with GoWIV.

Yup. It has that adventure game feel to it, rather than being a straight up action game. And I can not state enough how superb the level design is, which is something most action games seem to have as an afterthought.
 

A-V-B

Member
The best God in the entire series was without wuestion Persephone. Is there a Norse equivalent to that lol

There is Hel, Queen of the Underworld, but in terms of being a kidnapped fertility maiden, there's also Idunn, who maintains the youth of the Gods with her apple tree.
 

Veelk

Banned
I mean, stuff like this is lifted straight from the classic stories and myths. In the Odyssey, Athena and Hermes helps Odysseus against Poseidon's wishes. Poseidon wants revenge upon him because Odysseus blinded his son.

The whole no direct conflict between gods, but using underhanded tricks and helping mortals to subvert other gods in secret, was like the whole thing in Greek myth

I can't speak as to why they don't fight in mythology, but in that scenario, they're just not abiding to posiedons wishes. He's not happy about it, but it wasn't a direct call to action against gods.

In GoW, they have Ares waging direct war on Athena (or her city, which you'd think would amount to the same thing) and rather than the gods not waging war on each other for no real cause, they made it into some kind of rule they have to abide by, but then showed no consequences for ares breaking that rule.

Besides, as inspired as GOW is by Greek myth, it is not, in itself, Greek mythology. It has to justify it's own internal narrative components.
 
I haven't read the whole thread but someone's addressed the fact that this isn't going to be a Kratos who is rebooted right? He's wearing the golden fleece he got from Jason in GOW II.
 
I haven't read the whole thread but someone's addressed the fact that this isn't going to be a Kratos who is rebooted right? He's wearing the golden fleece he got from Jason in GOW II.

That is not the golden fleece... It miss some parts and it look like it is made of leather

00c4effa16198e96fcb11ca591e1b05a.jpg


awxccTl.png
 

Drencrom

Member
I'm just so glad they went with Norse Mythology, it makes so much more sense than Egyptian Mythology for a franchise like GoW. Eitherway, I'm very confident that Cory Barlog will knock it out of the park once again, can't wait for the reveal and a better look of the game this E3!
 
I enjoy this series. I think it's fun. Story wise, I believe the first to be the most streamlined and coherent. From the moment Kratos jumps off the ledge the story goes on a singular path to bring you back to that moment. His actions, intentions and thone of the gods make sense and seem reasonable.

I hope that putting him in a new setting will give them a chance to go back to that. Personally, I would have liked to see Egyptian mythology. It's probably closer to Greek mythology and I would have loved to see Egyptian cities, pyramids and temples with GOW graphics. Outside of odin, loki and thor I'm not as familiar with Norse mythology as I am with Greek and egyptian. Also, I fear that they'll render the landscapes too similar, even though they are different parts of the continent. But those are just my personal preferences. I'm actually looking forward to this game more than any other
 

Gono

Banned
I don't know, I used to think that GOW2 was the best but when I played the collection it felt pretty tedious towards the end, didn't feel that with 3 or Ascension. don't get me wrong, Ascension is the worst in the series behind Chains of Olympus but the puzzles in 2 with enemies constantly attacking you and reseting the puzzles were frustrating in higher difficulties. GOW3 turns into a somehow boring game after Cronos (except tha insane battle inside the labirynt) but at least you can push through it without cursing at stuff like I metioned of 2.

With all the raving reviews and GOAT!! comments about GoW2, truly thought i was the only one that found its second half really tedious, to the point of almost no caring about the game.
Chains of Olympus and Ascension are mediocre, but they go at a steady pace, without frustrating and boring pointless hordes of annoying enemies and puzzles.
 
With all the raving reviews and GOAT!! comments about GoW2, truly thought i was the only one that found its second half really tedious, to the point of almost no caring about the game.
Chains of Olympus and Ascension are mediocre, but they go at a steady pace, without frustrating and boring pointless hordes of annoying enemies and puzzles.

The only part of 2 I didn't really like was the end... Just a bunch of mediocre boss fights, a hallway of doom, and crappy puzzles. I guess the final stretch of the first game kinda sucked too though with Hades, and an underwhelming three part Aries battle. Come to think of it, Ascension was the only game in the series that had a spectacular final stretch imo.
 

DrunkDan

Member
I would be astonished if the leaked character model and axe are the final designs.

As for the story scenario, here's my theory:

In Norse mythology, mankind's greatest warriors are taken to Valhalla upon death by the Valkyries where they hone their battle skills and feast until the coming of Ragnarok (the final battle). Maybe, after the end of God of War III, Kratos was sought out by the Valkyries since he was a warrior capable of battling gods themselves in hopes that he can stave off Ragnarok. Why would Kratos go along with this? Maybe in an effort to atone for everything he did (IE: Fucking up the Greek world). And thus the story begins.

I could buy into something like this.
 
I would be astonished if the leaked character model and axe are the final designs.

As for the story scenario, here's my theory:

In Norse mythology, mankind's greatest warriors are taken to Valhalla upon death by the Valkyries where they hone their battle skills and feast until the coming of Ragnarok (the final battle). Maybe, after the end of God of War III, Kratos was sought out by the Valkyries since he was a warrior capable of battling gods themselves in hopes that he can stave off Ragnarok. Why would Kratos go along with this? Maybe in an effort to atone for everything he did (IE: Fucking up the Greek world). And thus the story begins.
I would like this.
 
I would be astonished if the leaked character model and axe are the final designs.

As for the story scenario, here's my theory:

In Norse mythology, mankind's greatest warriors are taken to Valhalla upon death by the Valkyries where they hone their battle skills and feast until the coming of Ragnarok (the final battle). Maybe, after the end of God of War III, Kratos was sought out by the Valkyries since he was a warrior capable of battling gods themselves in hopes that he can stave off Ragnarok. Why would Kratos go along with this? Maybe in an effort to atone for everything he did (IE: Fucking up the Greek world). And thus the story begins.

I honestly think we are all wrong in assuming that this Kratos would be the Ghost of Sparda. Everything about this tells me this is a reboot in every sense of the word. It's Kratos in visual design, but its a very different character altogether.
 
And no, Kratos suspects Zeus from the start. He says something to the effect of "you've always cockblocked me before, why stop now?" and Zeus answers "Cuz reasons. For Olympus." and the Kratos shrugs "Seems legit." .

LOL
I would love you to be the lead script writer on GoW4.
 

Sanctuary

Member
Hopefully they will finally make the true successor to GoW 2. Series fell on its face after that.

God of War 3 concluded Kartos's story to me, and was a fitting end to his character arc. They better have some really good explanation onto how this Norse mythos fits with the GOW, and why Kratos is back for this to work. That is, if they want to use to invest in the narrative of the game like past trilogy of games.

There was no investing into the story of GoW 3. It became a parody less than halfway through.
 

I-hate-u

Member
God of War 3 concluded Kartos's story to me, and was a fitting end to his character arc. They better have some really good explanation onto how this Norse mythos fits with the GOW, and why Kratos is back for this to work. That is, if they want to use to invest in the narrative of the game like past trilogy of games.

Hopefully they will finally make the true successor to GoW 2. Series fell on its face after that.

Cory is at the helm this time around. But I wouldn't bad mouth 3. All games are special for different reasons.

GOW1: Best Kratos characterization of the series.
GOW2: Best scale and adventure of the series.
GOW3: Best rollercoaster ride, and most epic title of the series.
 
God of War 3 concluded Kartos's story to me, and was a fitting end to his character arc. They better have some really good explanation onto how this Norse mythos fits with the GOW, and why Kratos is back for this to work. That is, if they want to use to invest in the narrative of the game like past trilogy of games.

Or this is a reboot GoW. Like Tomb Raider 2013. Or Zelda. Similar Kratos in terms of visual design, but in altogether different setting. Why is no one else in this topic seeing that?
 

Sanctuary

Member
Or this is a reboot GoW. Like Tomb Raider 2013. Or Zelda. Similar Kratos in terms of visual design, but in altogether different setting. Why is no one else in this topic seeing that?

It wouldn't be called God of War 4 if that were the case.

GOW1: Best Kratos characterization of the series.
GOW2: Best scale and adventure of the series.
GOW3: Best rollercoaster ride, and most epic title of the series.

The only truly memorable things about God of War 3 were the graphics at the time, and the first twenty minutes. I'm not sure any game has been able to top that yet. But then it was completely downhill (from the top of the rollercoaster) from there. The story has always been "okay" and sometimes interesting, but it was just plain bad in the third game. I do agree with your assessment of the first two games however.

edit: I take that back. The most interesting thing about TLOU was the first twenty minutes too.
 

I-hate-u

Member
Hopefully they will finally make the true successor to GoW 2. Series fell on its face after that.



There was no investing into the story of GoW 3. It became a parody less than halfway through.

I agree that story is weak in 3, and the game ruined Athena's character that was so great in 1&2. But, still, it was the best ending to the trilogy we could have gotten after the insane buildup of GOW2 ending.
 

Carlisle

Member
Or this is a reboot GoW. Like Tomb Raider 2013. Or Zelda. Similar Kratos in terms of visual design, but in altogether different setting. Why is no one else in this topic seeing that?

Yeah that's kinda what I think they're going for. I'm a little surprised they didn't do a reboot with a different mythology for each game in the series before this. It woulda been a great hook. 6 games set in Greece is some serious overkill and I'm looking forward to something different.

But would they give him a different name too or is this just GoW if it was in Sweden? 'Kratos' sounds like ancient Greece. Even these early designs have that pale ghost-of-sparta-white look going on, which was explained in his GoW backstory. So is this the same guy with that same story? Or is this a whole new thing?

Can we get behind Sven, the Specter of Stockholm?
 

Sanctuary

Member
So you basically want God of War turning into Assassin's Creed as far as the setting swaps go?

Since this isn't officially announced in ANY capacity, we have no idea what it is called. We're the ones calling it God of War 4.

It still doesn't make a whole lot of sense to reboot it in such a way that it completely changes the identity of the character, and the only reason to even call it "God of War" is because they want to keep similar gameplay without making a new franchise. Completely retconning the basic lore isn't exactly the same as what happened with the Tomb Raider or Zelda either.

I would be astonished if the leaked character model and axe are the final designs.

As for the story scenario, here's my theory:

In Norse mythology, mankind's greatest warriors are taken to Valhalla upon death by the Valkyries where they hone their battle skills and feast until the coming of Ragnarok (the final battle). Maybe, after the end of God of War III, Kratos was sought out by the Valkyries since he was a warrior capable of battling gods themselves in hopes that he can stave off Ragnarok. Why would Kratos go along with this? Maybe in an effort to atone for everything he did (IE: Fucking up the Greek world). And thus the story begins.

God of War 3 still takes place in Greek mythology. The Norse gods don't exist in that, so I don't know why this would ever have any reason to happen. I guess you could go the way of the "many worlds" theory and somehow the gods of another existence noticed Kratos. But that's a bit much.
 
Yeah that's kinda what I think they're going for. I'm a little surprised they didn't do a reboot with a different mythology for each game in the series before this. It woulda been a great hook. 6 games set in Greece is some serious overkill and I'm looking forward to something different.

But would they give him a different name too or is this just GoW if it was in Sweden? 'Kratos' sounds like ancient Greece. Even these early designs have that pale ghost-of-sparta-white look going on, which was explained in his GoW backstory. So is this the same guy with that same story? Or is this a whole new thing?

Can we get behind Sven, the Specter of Stockholm?

Kratos doesn't necessarily sound inherently Greek. Heck, what if this guy's last name is more in-line with a nordic setting/background? We just know Kratos as Kratos. Could be a whole new character entirely that just shares the name & parts of the character's visual design, which would go a long way to tell the audience "its still God of War, just not the God of War you already knew".
 
So you basically want God of War turning into Assassin's Creed as far as the setting swaps go?

It makes for a far more interesting dynamic, especially if we're getting a different main character who is being characterized in that new setting, than "Kratos, ghost of Sparda, visits Valhalla".
 
The thread has God of War in the title. If you've played any game in the franchise you know who that is. It's not Kratos that you don't want. It's God of War.

I played the first way back and some of the second and third then gave up. Honestly all I remember is how much I couldn't stomach him anymore. Aside from the fun action and QTEs that I didn't mind at all, Kratos's awfulness is the strongest lasting impression the series left for me.

If after enough player impressions this new entry is generally deemed to have a main character that's chill and not insufferable then I'll happily check it out and support it. As it stands though, gonna steer clear and spend my money on supporting other games and projects.
 
It still doesn't make a whole lot of sense to reboot it in such a way that it completely changes the identity of the character, and the only reason to even call it "God of War" is because they want to keep similar gameplay without making a new franchise. Completely retconning the basic lore isn't exactly the same as what happened with the Tomb Raider or Zelda either.

Hang on - Tomb Raider got its lore basically completely retconned in TR 2013 & RoTR. Changing the identity of the character in reboots works just fine. And who said it'll have similar gameplay? Again, we have not even SEEN THIS IN ACTION YET. We've seen concept art. We know that they want to keep aspects of Kratos' visual design. Thats all we know about this.
 
It wouldn't be called God of War 4 if that were the case.



The only truly memorable things about God of War 3 were the graphics at the time, and the first twenty minutes. I'm not sure any game has been able to top that yet. But then it was completely downhill (from the top of the rollercoaster) from there. The story has always been "okay" and sometimes interesting, but it was just plain bad in the third game. I do agree with your assessment of the first two games however.

edit: I take that back. The most interesting thing about TLOU was the first twenty minutes too.

The Zeus fight at the end didn't enthrall you? That shit was epic!
 
The only truly memorable things about God of War 3 were the graphics at the time, and the first twenty minutes. I'm not sure any game has been able to top that yet. But then it was completely downhill (from the top of the rollercoaster) from there. The story has always been "okay" and sometimes interesting, but it was just plain bad in the third game. I do agree with your assessment of the first two games however.

edit: I take that back. The most interesting thing about TLOU was the first twenty minutes too.

Get outta here. GOW III had plenty of fantastic moments, including several of the greatest boss battles of all time. Honestly, the Poseidon fight was boring to me next to Hades, Hercules, and Chronos.
 
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