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[eyesradar]

This thread is awesome.

People bitching about needing PS+ (They don't)
People bitching about it not being on the box (It is)
People bitching about not knowing it was an online focused game. (It's been marketed that way since the beginning)
People bitching in an online forum about not having their console online. (awesome)

My guess is most of the people bitching about this are going to be online playing a game tonight.

Perfect TL;DR

Also please no open world

 

[magawolaz]

I can understand Campaign requiring online because of leaderboards, or cheating, or maybe they even use your times for better matchmaking...

...but why does Scapes require online?
Assets are stored on the disc, rendering is done by the PS4, and pic sharing on the "Discovery Page" is optional.
Like wat

 

[BBQ_of_DOOM]

I can understand Campaign requiring online because of leaderboards, or cheating, or maybe they even use your times for better matchmaking...

...but why does Scapes require online?
Assets are stored on the disc, rendering is done by the PS4, and pic sharing on the "Discovery Page" is optional.
Like wat

That is a great question and one I would love answers to.

 

[The Futurist]

I think a lot of you guys defending this shit are missing the point.

Like myself, I don't think most people really care about it being an online focused game. There's nothing wrong with that.

The problem is that it's not completely an online game. There is still offline functionality and parts of the game that work offline. Why would they force saves and game progress to require a connection?

That's the issue.

 

[mike6467]

They're questioning something thats been understood for months at this point?

I am. I'm glad I checked. I don't follow games for months leading up to release. Gran Turismo has a long legacy and apparently this is a departure from that format, so it's a shock to me. Is that my fault? Sure, I'll go with that, I should inform myself before buying games (which I am...now).

With that said, I research my games a lot more then then the average person, so if it's a shock to me, there's a pretty good chance the average person who sees the game and picks it up just because they remembered the games on the PS1/PS2 is going to be in for a surprise.

Nobody has actually stepped up to present the logic of the decision. "Because they said it would be like this" isn't the same as "This is why it had to be this way".

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

This thread is awesome.

People bitching about needing PS+ (They don't)
People bitching about it not being on the box (It is)
People bitching about not knowing it was an online focused game. (It's been marketed that way since the beginning)
People bitching in an online forum about not having their console online. (awesome)

My guess is most of the people bitching about this are going to be online playing a game tonight.

So edgy. I'm all up for online-only games. I play them daily, so add me to your "playing a game tonight" category. However, I prefer my games with a major singleplayer component and a minor multiplayer component to not shaft me like this. It's basic thugonomics for me. Online saves are great and needed, but hindering offline play to please a very useless governing body that has zero impact on the game is hilarious.

FIA is a waste of space. Almost as wasteful as having the name "Top Gear" associated with the previous GT game.

Thanks to everyone (especially Chubs) for retelling the obvious that was known to some and not known to some. It's great that folks now know and can make their decision accordingly. Online services are paperweight to me, especially when these services die even after you're FUCKING paying $60 a year for it.

 

[Egida]

People bitching about needing PS+ (They don't)

Excuse me, what? Isn't the game online focused? Don't you need PS+ to play online?

People bitching about not knowing it was an online focused game. (It's been marketed that way since the beginning)

This is simply false. The game has been swimming in misinformation for a long time.

 

[Hugstable]

They're questioning something thats been understood for months at this point?

Now that I've been thinking over how quickly Sony shut down Kill Strain and online portion of Gravity Rush 2, I may not even get it in the future in sale. Worried at the possibility that later down the line (2 years or so after launch) that if number drop dramaticially online, Sony would have no issue shutting down the servers.

 

[watdaeff4]

I think a lot of you guys defending this shit are missing the point.

Like myself, I don't think most people really care about it being an online focused game. There's nothing wrong with that.

The problem is that it's not completely an online game. There is still offline functionality and parts of the game that work offline. Why would they force saves and game progress to require a connection?

That's the issue.

Thank you

 

[cakely]

Thanks for the heads up. Thankfully Amazon hadn't shipped my steelbook edition yet so I cancelled the order. What a joke.

Excellent. It's not an outrage thread without an angry cancellation.

 

[BBQ_of_DOOM]

I am. I'm glad I checked. I don't follow games for months leading up to release. Gran Turismo has a long legacy and apparently this is a departure from that format, so it's a shock to me. Is that my fault? Sure, I'll go with that, I should inform myself before buying games (which I am...now).

With that said, I research my games a lot more then then the average person, so if it's a shock to me, there's a pretty good chance the average person who sees the game and picks it up just because they remembered the games on the PS1/PS2 is going to be in for a surprise.

Nobody has actually stepped up to present the logic of the decision. "Because they said it would be like this" isn't the same as "This is why it had to be this way".

Kaz has pivoted the series towards online racing/eSports. For whatever reason, they decided to partner with the FIA to provide a "sanctioning body" for the eSports component (one of the several Sport Mode options). My understanding--based on the ArsTechnica article--is that saves are always online so no cheating/tampering can take place. Whether you buy that is up to you.

Personally, I think it's BS to have a decent amount of the "offline" stuff reliant on online saving. However, I understand why game progression--including license tests, missions, etc.--would be tied to the system, as those likely affect some component of the stated eSports goal.

Moreover, while I don't particularly care for eSports, I do very much enjoy the online component of this game and am willing to "play ball" with some of PD's questionable decisions because the DR/SR system seems to be good. That and the overall fit/finish/polish of the game, from the OST to the menus and how everything is presented.

 

[Ryu Hayabusa]

I think a lot of you guys defending this shit are missing the point.

Like myself, I don't think most people really care about it being an online focused game. There's nothing wrong with that.

The problem is that it's not completely an online game. There is still offline functionality and parts of the game that work offline. Why would they force saves and game progress to require a connection?

That's the issue.

I agree

 

[watdaeff4]

Excellent. It's not an outrage thread without an angry cancellation.

I mean if you want to point that out, it's always the Deluxe more expensive editions that are cancelled also.

Cuz you know that meant they were a serious fan of the game/franchise before and had a lot of hype previously

 

[Uno Venova]

We came a long, sad way from taking the original Box One to task for trying the always online bullshit by gimping features in offline mode.

 

[KillerMan91]

Now that I've been thinking over how quickly Sony shut down Kill Strain and online portion of Gravity Rush 2, I may not even get it in the future in sale. Worried at the possibility that later down the line (2 years or so after launch) that if number drop dramaticially online, Sony would have no issue shutting down the servers.

You are comparing Sonys best selling franchise (GT) to beyond niche game like Gravity Rush 2. GT Sport will have its servers up until at least the next GT.

 

[Kalentan]

. Why would they force saves and game progress to require a connection?

That's the issue.

I means that's simple. If the game is online focused they don't want people to be able to edit the save files to cheat stuff. It happens all the the time with offline genes and would have happened here.

 

[BBQ_of_DOOM]

I mean if you want to point that out, it's always the Deluxe more expensive editions that are cancelled also.

Cuz you know that meant they were a serious fan of the game/franchise before and had a lot of hype previously

Big fan of canceling orders that have yet to ship and have yet to charge, like they didn't even exist.

 

[Fredrik]

- Gameplay is fantastic. No ifs, ands, or buts. Playing with a DS4 or a wheel, gameplay is absolutely sublime
- The game itself is gorgeous. Hands down nicest looking game I've ever played, and yes, I'm putting it over HZD
- Fun factor. I've enjoyed the hell out of this. MP or SP, there's a feeling of accomplishment in watching yourself progress throughout the game
- Replayability. I can see this becoming the de-facto racing sim for PS4. With DLC, this game could become the best racing game this generation.

We're letting the marginally bad outweigh the absolutely awesome.

Why does that matter in a thread about a limited offline mode? It can be the best game ever made and an always online requirement would still be awful and worth talking loudly about to stop more devs from trying this and future games in the same serie to not have this requirement.
Why not talk about how great the game is in the OT? Why spend time defending the online requirement for offline gamers?

I'm always online, I buy most of my game digitally, I'm not affected by this (except for the online focus which I don't like). But I still want this to be talked about in every possible media outlet because I think it's a bad thing for the industry that needs to go away.

If we start defending bad things just because they're applied on otherwise great games then the bad things will soon be the norm since great games sell more and more people will start getting used to the bad stuff.

We basically need to collectively draw a line and scream to the industry "You shall not pass!" just like we did with the XB1 DRM.

 

[Japanmanx3]

I can't tell who's being deliberately stupid or actually surprised anymore, so instead of talking in circles let's clear up everything:


What is Gran Turismo Sport?

It is a game that is focused on online racing, a major departure from the series. Specifically it is FIA licensed, meaning it is one of the only racers that can be used to gain a FIA license.

The game contains "Sport Mode" where you rise up in ranks as you play online with others, as well as hundreds of smaller events that teaches you basic driving skills (Driving School), some of the nuances of each track (Circuit Experience), and pit you in specific situations (Missions).

You can also play an Arcade mode that let's you play freely on all the tracks and cars in the game, and take photos in Scape mode.


What Online/Offline Functionality is There?

Online, PS Plus Sub: All features are playable.
Online, no PS Plus Sub: All features except for Sports mode (online racing) are available.
Offline: Only Arcade mode is available. No progression is saved in this mode.


Why are saves cloud only?

To prevent data tampering and online cheating, and for the game to be officially certified by the FIA.


Why isn't there an offline save option?

The entire point of the game is to ready you for online racing. The work involved for separating components of the game to save offline probably wasn't worth it, because all progression goes towards matching you up with the proper opponents online.


So I can't save single player progress without online?!

There is a single player component, but it's nothing like the other GT games in terms of progression. You should not buy this game if your only focus is to play the single player content. That is not what this game is built or designed for.


Should I play this game if I don't want to play online?

The entire focus of this game is an online racing series. To put it another way: you can buy Battlefield for the single player, but...that's not the best idea. This is an online focused game.


They should have made this obvious from the get go!

They did. They mentioned it from the original announcement all the way to this crazy "burn the series to the ground" hype trailer, GT Sport was always all about online racing.


They should put the online requirements on the back of the box!

They put it on the front of the box.




What happens in four to eight years when the servers get shut off?

The same thing that happens to all online-focused games: they become unplayable.


Are you seriously ok with an online focused game forcing you to be online at all times?

That's a stupid question.


What happens if the servers go down due to maintenance?

That's a legit question, and I'm sure we'll find out when it happens. Polyphony added more user support to their servers due to the overload when the beta/demo hit, so we'll have to wait and see.


And what about the lootbox and microtransactions?

They have already confirmed no lootboxes or microtransactions will ever appear in this game.

Quoting for new page. This should be in the OP honestly.

So your disc-based game will become useless when Sony decide to pull the plug on the servers?

Ever heard of M.A.G?

 

[cakely]

I mean if you want to point that out, it's always the Deluxe more expensive editions that are cancelled also.

Cuz you know that meant they were a serious fan of the game/franchise before and had a lot of hype previously

They were the biggest fans of the franchise but after hearing the news? Cancelled.

 

[Bits N Pieces]

Excellent. It's not an outrage thread without an angry cancellation.

Wrong. It's not an outrage thread until someone says..... Excellent. It's not an outrage thread without an angry cancellation

 

[mike6467]

Kaz has pivoted the series towards online racing/eSports. For whatever reason, they decided to partner with the FIA to provide a "sanctioning body" for the eSports component (one of the several Sport Mode options). My understanding--based on the ArsTechnica article--is that saves are always online so no cheating/tampering can take place. Whether you buy that is up to you.

Personally, I think it's BS to have a decent amount of the "offline" stuff reliant on online saving. However, I understand why game progression--including license tests, missions, etc.--would be tied to the system, as those likely affect some component of the stated eSports goal.

Moreover, while I don't particularly care for eSports, I do very much enjoy the online component of this game and am willing to "play ball" with some of PD's questionable decisions because the DR/SR system seems to be good. That and the overall fit/finish/polish of the game, from the OST to the menus and how everything is presented.

Thank you! This was the explanation I was looking for. I've got a friend buying it soon so I'll give it a try there and see how intrusive/offensive it feels. The esports mentions really rub me the wrong way, but I guess we'll see. I wanted a new GT for awhile now. I just hope the series I fell for still exists.

I think there's a gap in perception between the development team and the marketing team. The developers - aside from some boneheaded comment by Yamauchi about the more accurate name for it being 'Gran Turismo 7 Sport' - have made a game entirely about online competition, and the single-player stuff is only there for practice. The marketers - with the exception of that E3 trailer - are pitching it simply as 'the next Gran Turismo game' and aren't focusing on how it's so different and how eSporty it is.

Apparently I had no idea what this game was.

 

[SolarMystic]

Remember when online components to games came alongside the single player?

 

[NullPointer]

Almost like an online focused game...

Online-focused and online-only are two different things.

And yeah, considering you can't save any progress it should just be considered online-only. Without saving progression you can't unlock cars and tracks, even for Arcade mode.

Threads like this are good so that nobody here can be surprised by this stuff. And there are still questions on how exactly this works, and what happens to you when you're in the middle of an event in Arcade mode or making a custom livery if the servers go down.

 

[Bony Manifesto]

The problem is that it's not completely an online game. There is still offline functionality and parts of the game that work offline. Why would they force saves and game progress to require a connection?

I think there's a gap in perception between the development team and the marketing team. The developers - aside from some boneheaded comment by Yamauchi about the more accurate name for it being 'Gran Turismo 7 Sport' - have made a game entirely about online competition, and the single-player stuff is only there for practice. The marketers - with the exception of that E3 trailer - are pitching it simply as 'the next Gran Turismo game' and aren't focusing on how stripped-down and eSporty it is.

 

[qko]

We came a long, sad way from taking the original Box One to task for trying the always online bullshit by gimping features in offline mode.

Seems to me the console warriors didn't really care if always online was going to be a thing or not, they just wanted to find a reason to point at the 'bone and crap on it. Console Warriors were always going to be OK with always online if their console had it. The apologists trying to excuse mandatory online saves for single player mode is inexcusable.

 

[BBQ_of_DOOM]

Thank you! This was the explanation I was looking for. I've got a friend buying it soon so I'll give it a try there and see how intrusive/offensive it feels. The esports mentions really rub me the wrong way, but I guess we'll see. I wanted a new GT for awhile now. I just hope the series I fell for still exists.

You're welcome. It's all based on what I've read/seen, but I've also played the demo and the full game and am enjoying (despite being a bit miffed at some things).

I will warn you: it is addicting, especially if you like photo mode.

 

[CouchMaster]

Does it have crossplay!?

Crossplay with what?

 

[paperspace]

⁣

 

[Vuci]

I think a lot of you guys defending this shit are missing the point.

Like myself, I don't think most people really care about it being an online focused game. There's nothing wrong with that.

The problem is that it's not completely an online game. There is still offline functionality and parts of the game that work offline. Why would they force saves and game progress to require a connection?

That's the issue.

So you are saying there would be no need for a backlash if there was no single player content at all?

The core component is still meant as an online experience. And I'm personally happy they considered making saving online-only since I don't want any cheaters to ruin the time trials. (Assuming that is the reason)

So it'll be completely useless when they shut down the servers in 4 years, I presume.

Now this is a valid concern and criticism, especially with how soon Sony has been shutting down servers.

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[BlitzerRadic]

I think a lot of you guys defending this shit are missing the point.

Like myself, I don't think most people really care about it being an online focused game. There's nothing wrong with that.

The problem is that it's not completely an online game. There is still offline functionality and parts of the game that work offline. Why would they force saves and game progress to require a connection?

That's the issue.

Correct me if I'm mistaken, its because there is no "online" and "offline" save file. If you could save offline stuff locally, you can mod the save file and give yourself an advantage in multiplayer.

 

[ResidentDante]

I means that’s simple. If the game isn’t online focused they don’t want people to be able to edit the save files to cheat stuff. It happens all the the time with offline genes and would have happened here.

But can you even race time trails offline? Who cares if someone cheats their way to cars in offline mode. Am I missing something crucial you can do offline that effects leaderboards etc.?

People are already cheating to get easy money and cars in FM7, but it doesn’t effect the multiplayer races or time trial leaderboards.

 

[DieH@rd]

We came a long, sad way from taking the original Box One to task for trying the always online bullshit by gimping features in offline mode.

MS proudly announced that Xbox One will STOP WORKING without 24hr net ping, every game installation required online connection, retail disc could be shared only once after which third user had to pay, only participating retailers had abbility to buy back and "reactivate" used discs, and kinect had to be plugged in (in a weaker and more expensive console than a competitor).

That shit deserved to be attacked, and it still deserves.

On the other hand, GTSport was announced as online & esport-oriented title, same as many others on the market.

 

[c0de]

Crossplay with what?

Offline players and online players without PS+.

 

[Jackpot]

It's an online focused game......

People so desperate defend "their" game they'll completely overlook and excuse the hobbling of a game by pretending every piece of content must be 100% online.

 

[UpUpDownDown]

People so desperate defend "their" game they'll completely overlook and excuse the hobbling of a game by pretending every piece of content must be 100% online.

So?

Preorder cancelled??

XD

 

[potatohead]

Excuse me, what? Isn't the game online focused? Don't you need PS+ to play online?


This is simply false. The game has been swimming in misinformation for a long time.

Haha no it hasn't what's the misinformation that they didn't announce everything from the outset? Every game does that.

 

[inner-G]

You mean like how people didn't give a shit about Forza 7 being always online on PC but then this happens and everyone is back at hating the same thing?

Both are BS on multiple levels (UWP), but I’d say the removal of the single-player campaign from GT is the biggest affront. Layering these other things on top of that makes it seem worse at face value.

 

[Plinko]

Wow. I had absolutely no idea this game was focused on online racing at the expense of single-player, and I'm usually up to date on most of this stuff. Hopefully the marketing does a better job of explaining this.

 

[Ovid]

Says so on the box. Was also known from the Blog and GTplanet articles from a month ago, but I can see people not being up to date.

I had no idea it was an online focused game. That sucks.

Anyways, as long as the user is informed then I don't have a problem with it. It's just like Warhawk and BF1943 on PS3. Those were online-only games.

 

[c0de]

Correct me if I'm mistaken, its because there is no "online" and "offline" save file. If you could save offline stuff locally, you can mod the save file and give yourself an advantage in multiplayer.

Offline save editing is possible but far from an easy thing to do and can be blocked by Sony. This should not be a reason for anything.
Or which games have widespread problems with cheers cheaters online?

 

[MajorPoopStorm]

Preorder cancelled!!! Oh wait, this game is already in my mailbox.

 

[BBQ_of_DOOM]

But can you even race time trails offline? Who cares if someone cheats their way to cars in offline mode. Am I missing something crucial you can do offline that effects leaderboards etc.?

People are already cheating to get easy money and cars in FM7, but it doesn’t effect the multiplayer races or time trial leaderboards.

FM7 isn't seeking to establish the racing genre as a viable eSport. GTS is, and that's why they are seemingly so strict on saves.

 

[Synth]

You mean like how people didn't give a shit about Forza 7 being always online on PC but then this happens and everyone is back at hating the same thing?

Is it actually always online, or have you just not set your PC up for offline use with Xbox games?

 

[magawolaz]

But can you even race time trails offline? Who cares if someone cheats their way to cars in offline mode. Am I missing something crucial you can do offline that effects leaderboards etc.?

People are already cheating to get easy money and cars in FM7, but it doesn’t effect the multiplayer races or time trial leaderboards.

You can do Time trials offline, yes. I guess it won't save the mileage count though.

 

[Uno Venova]

MS proudly announced that Xbox One will STOP WORKING without 24hr net ping, every game installation required online connection, retail disc could be shared only once after which third user had to pay, only participating retailers had abbility to buy back and "reactivate" used discs, and kinect had to be plugged in (in a weaker and more expensive console than a competitor).

That shit deserved to be attacked, and it still deserves.

On the other hand, GTSport was announced as online & esport-oriented title, same as many others on the market.

And this games single player features are gimped, why wouldn't it be attacked under the same principle?

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[qko]

You mean like how people didn't give a shit about Forza 7 being always online on PC but then this happens and everyone is back at hating the same thing?

I'm positive there were far bigger issues people had with Forza 7 than always online on PC.

Also, to point at a crappy practice that's been going on in the PC world for years is not an excuse to start doing it for consoles. Maybe if Sony wants to emulate PC gaming they could start with cross-play with XBox consoles first.

 

[NullPointer]

Wow. I had absolutely no idea this game was focused on online racing at the expense of single-player, and I'm usually up to date on most of this stuff. Hopefully the marketing does a better job of explaining this.

Communication on these details of GTS have been vague at best up until now.