Halo 5 beta clips leak (sprint, ADS is *not* COD-style) (more clips and info added)

Nov 24, 2013
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Isn't it too early to worry that much about it?
The Beta (Almost one year earlier), will prove them right or wrong on their decisions. Once people get their hands on the Beta and try these--supposedly added changes, the crowd will let them know if development is moving or NOT in the right direction.
I want to believe that 343i will be open and flexible to listen to the fans and make the necessary adjustments.
I think sprint and 3D sights are here to stay, unfortunately.
 

Calm Killer

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I keep seeing this complaint but I have an ungodly amount of hours poured into FPS games over the years with ADS aiming and not once has the gun being in the way been in been a cause of death.
So you have a different outlook over the other people here. Doesn't mean its right or wrong, its just not what people want. It doesn't belong in a Halo game. That is opinion. We are the people that buy Halo. You might enjoy it which is fine. You would probably represent the 20k people that still play halo 4. We represent the 5 million that still want to play halo 2 style.
 

Gravemind IV

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I don't think you or your friends are invested in Halo enough to see why the games aren't really the same at all.

After CE, Halo 2 removed health and fall damage, increased melee damage, decreased grenade power, decreased fuse time on grenades, upped bullet magnetism and aim assist, switched from projectile weapons to hitscan, removed physics on power ups, added vehicle boarding, made all vehicles destructible, added a ranking system, changed movement and jump height, replaced CE Pistol with BR, added playable elites, added dual wielding, accidentally added button combos after cutting them, and featured a radically different design philosophy behind its maps (ladders/teleporters vs lifts/man cannons for example). Then there was matchmaking!

After Halo 2, Halo 3 increased melee lunge and mutual kill window, added aim acceleration, decreased grenade power, decreased grenade fuse time, decreased aim assist, switched back to projectile weapons, decreased effectiveness of dual wielding, lowered grenade limit from 8 to 4 and introduced 2 new grenades, added support weapons, added equipment, changed the ranking system, a different power weapon spawn system, redesigned objectives (assault), slowed down movement speed, made the jump floatier, decreased the field of view, redesigned some weapons (BR, Needler, Carbine, Sniper), had different elite models, removed button combos, redesigned power ups, introduced the Banshee bomb to multiplayer, introduced new vehicles such as the Hornet and Chopper, and also featured a different philosophy behind its maps (linear aggression). Then there was Theater, File Sharing and Forge.

After Halo 3, Reach reintroduced health and fall damage, brought back hitscan weapons, took away melee bleedthrough (opponents always take two melees to die regardless of prior damage so long as they had shields), introduced loadouts, made elites their own unique character model and introduced the dynamic "Invasion" game mode, removed dual wielding, increased aim assist and bullet magnetism, removed 2 grenade types, further slowed down movement and jump height, increased motion blur, nearly removed the ranking system, cooldown when dropping objectives, added armor abilities, added reticle bloom, changed radar to show player elevation, replaced BR with DMR, separated vehicle health from player health, overhauled vehicle controls such as the Banshee, replaced Hornet with Falcon, removed power ups from most maps, increased blast radius on grenades, increased hitboxes for headshots, decreased rate of fire on sniper, replaced some weapons with "older" counterparts, like Focus Rifle and Plasma Repeater, increased field of view, and most of its maps were asymmetric. And let's not forget the significant changes to Firefight or Forge.

After Reach (oh boy), Halo 4 removed health but kept fall damage, added personal ordnance drops (killstreaks), default sprint with increased duration, dumbed down the Covenant AI, introduced Promethean enemies and weapons, more armor abilities with some returning and others being replaced, decreased motion blur, added kill cams, instant respawn, custom loadouts, perks, replaced falcon with mantis, redesigned or replaced some weapons or abilities, added new grenade type, redesigned gametypes (CTF, Flood, Oddball), replaced Invasion with Dominion (domination/conquest), increased bullet magnetism and aim assist, removed the ranking system from in-game, removed camo power up and redesigned overshield, redesigned or rebalanced other weapons (beam rifle), redesigned all the audio effects, reintroduced melee bleedthrough, changed radar to show vehicles, and the maps were HUGE. Also, Spartan Ops.



Am sure there are many things I've missed (or mistaken). The point is that most of these are significant changes. The game has "evolved" every single time, and many fans would argue it's gotten worse. The one true fact is that they've never been the same, which is actually part of the problem. It's why some changes (often unnecessary ones) for the sake of "modernization" would be a mistake.

For once, I'd like to see a Halo game that doesn't fix what isn't broken or feel the need to copy everybody else. Outdated? Perhaps, but the people who didn't buy Halo because it was "the same" clearly wouldn't show up if ADS suddenly appeared. I see no reason for Halo to compromise its identity to try and win them over either. It didn't work the last time
Man, among the things that have been discussed to death. This was one of the things that I did not like at all. Sure it helped improve pinpointing where your enemies were, but not showing elevation always somewhat obscured positions which meant that people actually had to go and check and that was great.
 

fallingdove

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I think sprint and 3D sights are here to stay, unfortunately.
Sadly, I think you are right. I am really disappointed to see ADS and sprint in Halo 5. So disappointed that it definitely won't be a day 1 purchase for me. I am just tired of playing samey first person shooters. I was hoping that Halo 5 was going to breathe some fresh air into a stale genre. 343 really has been a huge bust in my eyes given the talent that they procured.

Oh well, when my FPS fatigue passes after the diversely packed 2015 maybe I will check it out.
 
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So you have a different outlook over the other people here. Doesn't mean its right or wrong, its just not what people want. It doesn't belong in a Halo game. That is opinion. We are the people that buy Halo. You might enjoy it which is fine. You would probably represent the 20k people that still play halo 4. We represent the 5 million that still want to play halo 2 style.
My first time playing H4 will be in the MCC. Halo 3 is my favorite multiplayer game. I just don't see how the gun model makes it hard to see.
 

lpchrys

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I'll wait until I actually play the game or see more than a few seconds of blurry gameplay before passing judgement on anything. You guys cry to much.
 
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I'll wait until I actually play the game or see more than a few seconds of blurry gameplay before passing judgement on anything. You guys cry to much.
It's definitely being blown out of proportion. From the looks of it, ads will be purely a cosmetic change to zooming. No problems there.

In which case the only valid complaint people here are whining about is sprinting, but that's hardly a huge issue. Halo 4 wasn't a good Halo game, but that was not because of the inclusion of sprint, as some are making it out to be. There were design issues with that game.

Halo 4s biggest problems are already addressed with Halo 5. No outs, equal starts, no armor abilities other than built in ones, fighting over power weapons. Those were the real issues. Sprint can exist fine.
 

jem0208

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Sadly, I think you are right. I am really disappointed to see ADS and sprint in Halo 5. So disappointed that it definitely won't be a day 1 purchase for me. I am just tired of playing samey first person shooters. I was hoping that Halo 5 was going to breathe some fresh air into a stale genre. 343 really has been a huge bust in my eyes given the talent that they procured.

Oh well, when my FPS fatigue passes after the diversely packed 2015 maybe I will check it out.
You do know it's purely cosmetic ADS right?
 

DagnastyEp

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I really hope MS and 343 are monitoring the feedback regarding this.

I think it's still to early to make any solid judgments about Halo 5; official footage will go up today (hopefully with some exposition on design and gameplay mechanics), and then we'll all be able to play the beta in 6 weeks.

That being said, if there is straight up ADS, no matter how it's implemented, I will be disappointed in 343. They really should just know better. It seemed like they were really catering to fans with the MCC, not sure how they would think this would be a good idea for Halo 5.

I've been playing shooters with ADS since it was first introduced as a mechanic, and while I'm able to enjoy many of those games, I've never liked ADS. I hate how much of the screen is blocked by the gun. I can't stand using guns that don't have scopes in games with ADS - when it's just the gun sights.

I'm anxiously awaiting the official footage to hit later today. As another posted said, I'm sure I'll still get Halo 5 and enjoy it, but my hype (as of now) has been deflated a bit.
 

twobear

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Oct 25, 2011
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2. To get into what I mean by it being inherently functionally different despite it being purportedly "wholly cosmetic". See below:


a. Notice how much more screen space is clear of objects in the halo 2 shot. That is FOV, not just the arc of degrees fromcamera origin. "The field of View" in halo 5 with ADS up is smaller because a massive gun sight is taking up almost half the screen.

b.The gun kick and the muzzle flash in the middle of the screen also is a function difference. The previous halo games just had the tracer rounds and impact effects at the location with perhaps a tiny tiny bit of screen shake (which did not change te reticle position). Almost nothing got between you and your target or expressly changed tyour ability to view the stuff in front of you. Here there is a gun that is moving, a muzzle flaring, etc...
i thought the whole point here was that the reticule and aiming functions are built into the spartan's helmet, which is why you don't see the gun when you zoom in
 

Exploratory

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Just saw the footage. It's good. You know if this was a different forum a Halo 5 leak is FANTASTIC news but somehow GAF turns it into a shitstorm.

I don't want to believe in the SonyGAF conspiracy but you guys make it impossible not to.
Wtf are you talking about? This post makes so little sense it's got to be a joke...
 

Dictator93

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i thought the whole point here was that the reticule and aiming functions are built into the spartan's helmet, which is why you don't see the gun when you zoom in
That is another non-gameplay reason for no ADS. Which IMO, makes sense for a future cyborg.
 

Poodlestrike

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i thought the whole point here was that the reticule and aiming functions are built into the spartan's helmet, which is why you don't see the gun when you zoom in
Yeah, but that's a red dot sight, which probably wouldn't be compatible with the helmet uplink. Why it's a red dot sight is another issue entirely, but it works for that gun.
 
Dec 11, 2012
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You do know it's purely cosmetic ADS right?
Cosmetic ADS that goes against lore and takes up more screen realestate, along with being more visually overloaded than past games with the same functionality.

We had a perfect system in place, ADS was a camera uplinked to Spartan helmet, which was why you never saw the gun. The gun doesn't move, and it's five hundred years in the future, yet we are reverting back to a fucking red dot sight...
 

Tawpgun

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It's good that its cosmetic only but even then it still reeks of change for the sake of change.

A big ol middle finger to the lore and to everyone who likes Halo for its uniqueness in the shooter market. The gun taking up half the screen is kinda annoying.

That bein said can't wait for more footage tonight
 

DagnastyEp

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You do know it's purely cosmetic ADS right?
I really wonder how the controls will be mapped with the addition of ADS. I really like using the left trigger for grenades, and R3 for scoping. I'm hoping that it would be implemented in the same way, or allow for user configurable controls.
 

Primethius

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I still have doubts that its "purely cosmetic" but I'll take 343's word for now. I just don't understand why they would waste a button (presumably) to a feature that functions the same as an already existing function in Halo games.

I'll reserve full judgment until tonight but I wish they had removed sprint. I'm okay with abilities like a dash sideways and or shoulder tackle, but sprint just ruins everything at such a fundamental level.

With that said, at least the tweets are saying all the right stuff.
 

Tawpgun

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I really wonder how the controls will be mapped with the addition of ADS. I really like using the left trigger for grenades, and R3 for scoping. I'm hoping that it would be implemented in the same way, or allow for user configurable controls.
If they gave a CoD layout in Halo 4 they will have it in Halo 5 and have classic Halo layout.

What remains to be seen is what control scheme will be default.
 

Wollveren

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Oct 6, 2014
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You are correct, it's just that 343i seem to not care much about things like that.
Thats not the case, what people are failing to realise is this is NOT THE SAME BR we have had in the previous games, and that is fine. 343 have realised it's difficult to balance the game with weapons like BR and DMR, both which are good at short to long...

The way I see it, they changed the scope from the BR so there is nothing to uplink to the HUD... The DMR on the other hand may have that uplink thing going on.
 
Dec 11, 2012
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Maybe these new Spartans don't have helmet link lol
ONI budget cuts.

Thats not the case, what people are failing to realise is this is NOT THE SAME BR we have had in the previous games, and that is fine. 343 have realised it's difficult to balance the game with weapons like BR and DMR, both which are good at short to long...

The way I see it, they changed the scope from the BR so there is nothing to uplink to the HUD... The DMR on the other hand may have that uplink thing going on.
But that's stupid.
 

Diablohead

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Thats not the case, what people are failing to realise is this is NOT THE SAME BR we have had in the previous games, and that is fine. 343 have realised it's difficult to balance the game with weapons like BR and DMR, both which are good at short to long...

The way I see it, they changed the scope from the BR so there is nothing to uplink to the HUD... The DMR on the other hand may have that uplink thing going on.
It's a shit excuse to have ADS though even if that was the case, they have added it in just because every other shooter has done it, halo does not need call of duty ADS of any kind.
 

Biker19

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lol, enjoy MCC while you can. Brace yourself for the playlist cut next Fall to make people buy Halo 5. I could see them cutting most of the playlists out and only leave in Halo 2 anniversary mp or some shit.
If they do that, then 343i &/or Microsoft will be getting even more flack. I don't think that they'll want to risk it.

Best to just let things stay the way that they are.
 

rokkerkory

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1. Do not take dev's twitter words for fact. The "feel of 60 fps," ubisoft dev statements, whatever, they are all filtered and directed words to generate hype and or reduce damage.

2. To get into what I mean by it being inherently functionally different despite it being purportedly "wholly cosmetic". See below:


a. Notice how much more screen space is clear of objects in the halo 2 shot. That is FOV, not just the arc of degrees fromcamera origin. "The field of View" in halo 5 with ADS up is smaller because a massive gun sight is taking up almost half the screen.

b.The gun kick and the muzzle flash in the middle of the screen also is a function difference. The previous halo games just had the tracer rounds and impact effects at the location with perhaps a tiny tiny bit of screen shake (which did not change te reticle position). Almost nothing got between you and your target or expressly changed tyour ability to view the stuff in front of you. Here there is a gun that is moving, a muzzle flaring, etc...

c. The reticle not changing doesn't matter. The rest of the screen is now getting in the way of your shooting and peripheral vision. In previous games, this way just a slightly greyer darker edge of the screen. Now it is a big 3d model with flashy effects.

and why? Because other games use iron sights and ADS. All of those functional and usability changes for the sake of attracting people who have no idea what makes halo gameplay halo gameplay in the first place. They claim it is comsteic, but these cosmetics (regardless of whether or not actual bullet spread changes in ADS) change how the game functions and the player can realistically function.

Love halo 2 zoom cod zoom is meh
 

Wollveren

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Oct 6, 2014
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It's a shit excuse to have ADS though even if that was the case, they have added it in just because every other shooter has done it, halo does not need call of duty ADS of any kind.
No they didn't add it in just to copy other shooters and stop saying that as if you know it's a fact... They could have well added that function in as I said before to make the BR more viable versus the DMR in difference scenarios. It makes total sense, the new scope won't zoom in as much.

This way DMR rules mid to long, BR rules close to mid.
 
Nov 24, 2013
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I really wonder how the controls will be mapped with the addition of ADS. I really like using the left trigger for grenades, and R3 for scoping. I'm hoping that it would be implemented in the same way, or allow for user configurable controls.
The zoom in Halo does not need to be used as urgently as it does in CoD or similar shooters so zoom doesn't need to be mapped to the left trigger. Toggle-to-zoom should also still be the default.
 

Dictator93

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No they didn't add it in just to copy other shooters and stop saying that as if you know it's a fact... They could have well added that function in as I said before to make the BR more viable versus the DMR in difference scenarios. It makes total sense, the new scope won't zoom in as much.

This way DMR rules mid to long, BR rules close to mid.
why not just have it zoom less?
 

ExVicis

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As a person who greatly enjoyed every Halo until reach and really found Halo 4 a step-down I don't want ADS. It looks terrible to me and I don't think it adds anything positive to playing the game. In my opinion Arena shooters shouldn't have that at all period. Feels less like Halo for it being in and cosmetic or not it kind of ruins the feel of a fast paced Arena Shooter.
 

Wollveren

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why not just have it zoom less?
Why not have the function? BR has always been known to have some sort of zooming functionality, limiting it to a minor bump up in zoom still keeps it similar and effective at certain ranges, whilst still being competitive with the DMR.
 

Dictator93

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Why not have the function? BR has always been known to have some sort of zooming functionality, limiting it to a minor bump up in zoom still keeps it similar and effective at certain ranges, whilst still being competitive with the DMR.
What does this mean exactly?

My point was, is, that if you want to differentiate the BR and DMR (completely resonable) why add in ADS to the game... when you could just change the BR cahracteristics within the defined gameplay means (lessening the zoom amount, getting rid of the zoom, having it have a slightly wider distance spread). Or better yet, create a new, and unique to Halo way of differentiating them.
 

JHall

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343i needs to learn that sprint ruins map control and flow. Halo's kill times are far too slow to have sprint and all the other bullshit. Increase the movement speed and give us a quick, responsive strafe.

As for the cosmetic ADS change, it reeks of catering to players that will drop the game once the new shiny toy comes out just like Halo 4.
 
Dec 11, 2012
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Why not have the function? BR has always been known to have some sort of zooming functionality, limiting it to a minor bump up in zoom still keeps it similar and effective at certain ranges, whilst still being competitive with the DMR.
Don't you think a simpler solution to the BR/DMR issue would be to reduce the rate of fire on the DMR instead of introducing a whole knew aiming system...
 

Wollveren

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Oct 6, 2014
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What does this mean exactly?

My point was, is, that if you want to differentiate the BR and DMR (completely resonable) why add in ADS to the game... when you could just change the BR cahracteristics within the defined gameplay means (lessening the zoom amount, getting rid of the zoom, having it have a slightly wider distance spread). Or better yet, create a new, and unique to Halo way of differentiating them.
Do you mean that instead of that ADS graphic/animation it would be the same as before, the whole screen enters zoom, just less of a zoom? I guess that is a fair point tbh. I doubt they'll ever get rid of the zoom, and they shouldn't.

Its just DMR and BR has always been a problem, they're so similar in terms how long it takes to kill someone. So I think it's best to wait and see what they do.

Don't you think a simpler solution to the BR/DMR issue would be to reduce the rate of fire on the DMR instead of introducing a whole knew aiming system...
Haven't they already tried it in H4? I remember something about them trying to balance it by changing some attributes, but I think changes like those are not enough, because if you reduce the fire rate on the DMR, its suddenly less effective at long range. Zoom is the best way to balance medium to long range, without really weakening the weapon.
 
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I don't understand the uproar about all this. Would these same people be freaking out if they remade GoldenEye but added dual analogue stick support? Mechanics typically change for the better and adding sprint and ADS in my opinion makes for a better more modern experience. I watched the IGN video of them playing a round on the new Coagulation map (Blood lines I think it was called now) and the entire time I was like "Oh my god why is walking everywhere?" forgetting that there was no sprint way back when. I respect the nostalgic side of the game and I am glad they have kept the old school Halos the way they were but I think adding modern mechanics and finding a good balance between new and old would put Halo 5 in a much better place.