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I can't get over how bad Metal Gear Solid is
- Thread starter FutureZombie
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What the...?
Somebody needs a nap and a Snickers...
The plot thickens, will this end up with people finding out that OP is actually that medic Kojima used?
DoktorEvil
Banned
That's patently false?
MGS 3, 4, and GZ/TPP have shown marked improvements in stealth mechanics with each iteration.
GZ is the best I've ever felt a Metal Gear game control in 3d space.
WrenchNinja
Member
So if the tapes arent important, then you agree that all Paz and Chico are are shock value by themselves with the single tape you have to listen to and the two cutscenes you end up watching? Cause by themselves there's no depth there.
No, I've listened to them.
I don't know, it sound more like evidence that fans tend to like jumping through hoops for their ringmaster.
NeOak
Member
OP hasn't played Chaos Theory.
Had he used CT as reference, maybe. But using Blacklist? Nope.
Pinko Marx
Banned
You can judge it all you want, but I don't think you're judging it within the right frame. It is a prologue that is only there to set-up the larger story.
You're asking for more than what the game set out to do. Theres no ambiguity that GZ is a teaser, everyone knew that going in basically. I'm just confused as to why you're asking for more exposition as what serves as nothing more than a chapter 0. If you watch a 30 minute screening of a 2 hour movie, are you going to complain about lack of closure on plot threads? Because thats essentially what you're doing.
Now if MGSV comes out and Paz's story isn't completed or is half-assed then I'll be right there with you throwing tomotoes at Kojima. But as it stands the man released the equivalent of PP's Tanker Chapter or Virtuous Mission.
Well him being wrong is OUR opinion so #DEALWITHIT.
Besides most of the points he makes are blatantly dumb and aren't valid in a 16 year old game.
The Smoking Bun
Banned
Fiction comes in a large variety too. Metal Gear is like Jack Reacher, light action stuff with occasional deep themes. It never claimed to be War & Peace or anything more high brow.
Agreed, a rookie mistake Kojima made. Chico and Paz needed more personality & development otherwise they just look like sacrificial lambs for the player to feel bad.
Doubt it...
OnTopic: While I can understand not liking something popular... nah I'm not even going to try, I dont understand this OP. Like, you need to give tons of examples of games doing all of things right so that we can see how your mind works.
A final bit of exposition can reframe her actions but it doesn't retroactively make her an interesting character.
Well I played the original MGS first time last year and I think it's the best PS1 game of all time.
Old games have always their problems. Is it camera, graphics or controls. In MGS case:
Fixed camera angles have aged better than free moving camera from ps1 era. It also gives very cinematic feel to already very cinematic game.
Graphics are blocky but they still work quite well. I never thought "man, this game is ugly." GUI elements look very stylish even today. I love the codec screen and the character portraits.
Controls are the biggest problem especially when playing the game again after I had played MGS2 and MGS3. But I didn't feel frustrated too many times.
The story, voice acting, soundtrack (doesn't get enough praise) are all very good in my opinion. Okay if this would be a 1999 movie it wouldn't be said to be best one the ever. But as a game story it makes you wanna continue and finish the game.
And there's the great boss battles, and likable cast etc. Just one of the best games ever.
Old games have always their problems. Is it camera, graphics or controls. In MGS case:
Fixed camera angles have aged better than free moving camera from ps1 era. It also gives very cinematic feel to already very cinematic game.
Graphics are blocky but they still work quite well. I never thought "man, this game is ugly." GUI elements look very stylish even today. I love the codec screen and the character portraits.
Controls are the biggest problem especially when playing the game again after I had played MGS2 and MGS3. But I didn't feel frustrated too many times.
The story, voice acting, soundtrack (doesn't get enough praise) are all very good in my opinion. Okay if this would be a 1999 movie it wouldn't be said to be best one the ever. But as a game story it makes you wanna continue and finish the game.
And there's the great boss battles, and likable cast etc. Just one of the best games ever.
WrenchNinja
Member
Probably cause they charged money for it.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
ITT: Your favorite game does not stand the test of time, and how to deal with the fact.
Remember when your dad lectured you on how good it was back in the day? Other side of the mirror GAF.
Remember when your dad lectured you on how good it was back in the day? Other side of the mirror GAF.
Love Deterrence
Member
Look, man. The problem isn't OP's opinion. Plenty of people don't like Metal Gear Solid. The problem is the hyperbole. "I can't get over how bad Metal Gear Solid is" like, what? Yes, you can. Play another game-- I don't know, maybe something you actually like. Every Metal Gear-related thread is like this. (New MGS5 trailer is out, more than half the posts are about how "shit" MGS4 was, for example. Again, it's not opinions-- it's the hyperbole.) I mean, look at this post from the MGSV:TPP is the final Metal Gear game from Hideo Kojima. How does this make you feel? thread:
Imagine if Sn4ke_911 went into an Neil Druckmann thread and said something favorable regarding MGS. Pretty safe to say that he wouldn't be greeted with "Oh, no, Uncharted fans are coming..." Now, be a part of that fanbase who has to tolerate the constant barrage of cheapshots and misinformation spread - even by mods - and tell me why people shouldn't be calling OP out.
Imagine if Sn4ke_911 went into an Neil Druckmann thread and said something favorable regarding MGS. Pretty safe to say that he wouldn't be greeted with "Oh, no, Uncharted fans are coming..." Now, be a part of that fanbase who has to tolerate the constant barrage of cheapshots and misinformation spread - even by mods - and tell me why people shouldn't be calling OP out.
superNESjoe
Member
Completely ignoring that I said I liked it. I don't think he is as brilliant as his rabid fans say he is.
This is something I can get behind. It's an interesting thing to think about. I don't think this is 100% the case, but it's something for me to consider.
Can you tell me where you bought the game already or where you have played it? Because I also can't wait until September 1st...
Wait... Or are you just making stuff up and didn't play the final game yet? But... nah no way that can be true.
Pinko Marx
Banned
The final plot twist retroactively changes who she is in the narrative of MGS3. You might not like her, but retroactively her role was completely reversed, and that reversal elevated her to a whole new level in my eyes.
NeOak
Member
Whenever I read OP's replies, it's like reading something written by someone that doesn't like Goldeneye in N64 because it doesn't have regenerating shields and he can't press 'A' to pay respects.
Seriously, the comparison with Blacklist which is the casual distilled entry compared to Chaos Theory settled it. Especially since the OP HASN'T PLAYED FUCKING CHAOS THEORY.
Stop going back to old games OP. They are too hard for you to understand. And no, you're not old. You're casual.
Seriously, the comparison with Blacklist which is the casual distilled entry compared to Chaos Theory settled it. Especially since the OP HASN'T PLAYED FUCKING CHAOS THEORY.
Stop going back to old games OP. They are too hard for you to understand. And no, you're not old. You're casual.
Pinko Marx
Banned
Well bruh... You could have not bought it. You could have waited for a sale. You coulda consumed it in the myriad of different ways the internet allows one to consume media nowadays. I don't know what to tell you there.
stargateheaven
Member
There are so many great ideas in MGS1, it's amazing.
I didn't know someone who hates this game could exist!
I didn't know someone who hates this game could exist!
ReturnOfTheRAT
Member
OP is pretty much wrong. I watch Drew Scanlon play it from start to finish last year and it reminded me of how special a game it is.
Man the OP just got crapped on during that first page. Not every game is for everybody. I'm not a fan of Metal Gear at all, and unlike the OP, I did play it at the time of its release. I found just about every aspect to either difficult to deal with (the controls, for example) or just unenjoyable (the stealth, the story). Like those who can't seem to understand why someone wouldn't like it, my feelings make it hard for me to reconcile that so many people do. It's disappointing because there are so many elements that sounded cool that I wanted to experience for myself, but it just didn't click for me in the slightest. Specifically the first game, mind you. I didn't dabble in the series after that.
Dude, I'm not the one making fun of it. Surely you saw the post I quoted?
DoktorEvil
Banned
It does actually. She rationalized her actions for defecting before her last breath and thus gave BB the motivation to question what his role is as an agent of the US Government.
She created the Big Boss that the fans now know.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
No, I don't agree and that wasn't what I was saying. Not listening to the tapes does not inhibit one from understanding what is actually happening as you play, which is what I understand is key narrative information:
Snake infiltrates a base, rescues two prisoners, return to homebase to find it under attack, Snake rescues his friend and escapes, one of the prisoners has a bomb inside them and Snake removes it, turns out there is another and the helicopter explodes.
Something like that. If one of those were removed, we probably wouldn't understand what was going on. That is my understanding of Key Narrative Information. What your talking about is character building which is kept to radio conversations, overheard chatter and tapes.
Ah, insults. Cool. We're done then, I take it?
I don't know, man. Sure its aged a bit, but I think MGS is pretty damn fantastic. I'm not a fan of cutscene-heavy games by any stretch, but I give it a pass because it was something different from everything else when I played it at release and now it can ride that wave of nostalgia.
why would people listen to him?
Yeah Ground Zeroes was a perfect $5 appetizer for TPP. Any gaffer who shelled out more than $15 despite all the reviews we had doesn't deserve to complain, it's entirely on themWell bruh... You could have not bought it. You could have waited for a sale. You coulda consumed it in the myriad of different ways the internet allows one to consume media nowadays. I don't know what to tell you there.
MGS1 is nearly the perfect game IMO.
I can think back, however, to the first time I played it which was either a demo or a loaned copy, and just being completely horrible at it. I died so many times in just the first room or the snowy area afterwards. Eventually though, it clicked somehow and I can go play those sections blindfolded. So I can see how new players may not get it.
I can think back, however, to the first time I played it which was either a demo or a loaned copy, and just being completely horrible at it. I died so many times in just the first room or the snowy area afterwards. Eventually though, it clicked somehow and I can go play those sections blindfolded. So I can see how new players may not get it.
B_Boss
Member
I wish folks would give themselves time to play MG 1&2 (MSX). Just amazing games as well and stop starting with MGS1....you also shot yourself in the foot expressing point no.4 yet you begin your journey into MG with MGS1 lol...I'm going to assume OP meant to post this topic on April 1st...
I'll concede MGS as a series is probably overrated, but the games are solid (bad pun), and I can see why the series gets so much praise. MGS1 was pretty epic for its time, the controls aren't that bad at all.
Also calling Snake one of the worst character designs ever? I get that people have outlying opinions but cmon man. Id really love to hear what your top 5 characters are then...
Also calling Snake one of the worst character designs ever? I get that people have outlying opinions but cmon man. Id really love to hear what your top 5 characters are then...
The Smoking Bun
Banned
I was talking about their portrayals in Peace Walker & Ground Zeroes. Chico never shuts up about monsters and Paz's face heel turn comes from almost nowhere but perhaps that was the point, she was that good at lying. The game could have used some Mass Effect style face to face interaction. In Ground Zeroes they are (understandably) reduced to emotional and physical wrecks, hence we don't really get a re-introduction.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Sorry. I didn't see the GIF in the quote of what you quoted. I thought the response you were quoting was in reference to something else. So that's a my bad, I should have went a link further in the chain.
fallingdove
Member
No it isn't. Stop peddling this nonsense.
WrenchNinja
Member
I don't really think me waiting for a sale or watching it on YouTube is really going to change the fact that this was a product that was sold
Riposte
Member
Why don't people use 100ppp? Abominations.
NeOak
Member
It sucks on mobile.
splinter cell blackdicks is the epitome of stealth gameplay
I like Splinter Cell Blacklist but come on bruh, even Spelunky is a better stealth game than that.
I haven't played this game, but why is this constantly brought up? Does the game limit your stealth options? If it doesn't, why does it get flak for giving you the going Rambo options?
bananafactory
Banned
20 pages? This thread is still going? Good God
In many ways Ground Zeroes is
the best game in the series so far, with the only contender going to be TPP
a) this is 100% a different game with no rape at all
b) that's not how it happens or how the collectible cassette tapes work
I do think the stealth in the first two Solid games is pretty lackluster and agree that Blacklist and Dishonored does it way better. The Blacklist gifs people post are so dumb and misinformed.
However, Ground Zeroes stealth is way way better than Blacklist and about on par with the original Thief trilogy, in my opinion. I've only played MGS1, MGS2, and Ground Zeroes though, so I have no opinion on the other Metal Gear games.
However, Ground Zeroes stealth is way way better than Blacklist and about on par with the original Thief trilogy, in my opinion. I've only played MGS1, MGS2, and Ground Zeroes though, so I have no opinion on the other Metal Gear games.
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