peanutbutterlatte
Member
Yeah, and Luigi's Mansion hasn't had a title in 12 years. Mario and Luigi in 3. They're hardly milking it with those.
If you played 3D Land and aren't hungry for a sequel... well, you and I have nothing in common.
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I kinda hope the Mario popularity crashes soon
- Thread starter Majine
- Start date
Yeah, and Luigi's Mansion hasn't had a title in 12 years. Mario and Luigi in 3. They're hardly milking it with those.
If you played 3D Land and aren't hungry for a sequel... well, you and I have nothing in common.
This has been Nintendo's M.O. since the beginning. Do you remember what happened (if you're old enough) to Nintendo when they ditched Mario in the arcade scene? We got DK3 yo! You want that shit to happen again? (Again, if you're old enough) When the NES first launched they were playing the same game with Mario showing up in not only the pack-in game but cameo'd in golf, pinball and punch-out among others.
Nintendo knows where it's bread is buttered. Your notion is as preposterous as proposing Disney axe Mickey.
Nintendo knows where it's bread is buttered. Your notion is as preposterous as proposing Disney axe Mickey.
revolverjgw
Member
If anything the 3D Mario games should sell 5 times more than they do. But I do wish they'd stop whoring him out in dozens of other games and put those resources into creating some new core IPs.
FieryBalrog
Member
People legitimately complain about bro shooters all the time. Don't even try to act like that shit doesn't get flack.
He said shooters, not bro shooters. Now, here's the difference.
In one, the gameplay mechanics are all using the same base. Over. And. Over.
In the other, the gameplay mechanics get thrown out the window every time and get reinvented to suit what the game is, and the IP on top is simply icing to lure the consumer in.
Take a guess which is which.
The modern 3D Mario games could almost be a different IP than the NSMB series... the spinoffs also have very distinct audiovisual feel due to different teams handling the game.
It's not just about Mario himself, but the whole exosystem created over the 30 years now. It's one the richest and more iconic ones out there. Just like the Mario RPG's demonstrate, you can easily chop off segments and make them feel distinct enough from the main series (the platformers).
Sure I'd like to see more new IP's from Nintendo, but in this economy and their delicate state (two new platforms launched) they will play it as safe as possible for a few years.
Also why would I want one of the best IP's every created to die off. It's not like the games have declined in quality or innovation (Galaxy, 3D Land).
It's not just about Mario himself, but the whole exosystem created over the 30 years now. It's one the richest and more iconic ones out there. Just like the Mario RPG's demonstrate, you can easily chop off segments and make them feel distinct enough from the main series (the platformers).
Sure I'd like to see more new IP's from Nintendo, but in this economy and their delicate state (two new platforms launched) they will play it as safe as possible for a few years.
Also why would I want one of the best IP's every created to die off. It's not like the games have declined in quality or innovation (Galaxy, 3D Land).
That's like telling somebody, "I wish you would get sick and stay home all the time because I see you too much."
Or telling Nintendo, "Give up Mario because you put him on every single thing you release! I don't care that he's the reason why you've made millions. I only care about seeing all these stupid Mario games on the shelf."
Or telling Nintendo, "Give up Mario because you put him on every single thing you release! I don't care that he's the reason why you've made millions. I only care about seeing all these stupid Mario games on the shelf."
I think they do it voluntarily. People are like that you know. They attach themselves to silly mascots and IP's
they're giving quite a few of their characters a rest right now which seems to be one of the top complaints people have about them
no F-Zero. no Earthbound. no Star Fox. Nintendo is dead to me.
Why all the Mario hate in the year of Luigi?
they're giving quite a few of their characters a rest right now which seems to be one of the top complaints people have about them
no F-Zero. no Earthbound. no Star Fox. Nintendo is dead to me.
There's a reason why none of those games have had new entries recently.
Yeah, Nintendo doesn't know how to properly handle those IP's...(?)
TalesOfWin
Banned
well the mario who saved gaming was groundbreaking. Now all mario games play the same. Why do we need four different NSMB games that use the same assets and music? Wha, Whaaa.
People want more/like f-zero?
Since wipeout is dead tho, nintendo could probably use this to let it shine.
f-zero is a racer in a market saturated with racers - everything that could've been done probably has by third-parties
earthbound would need Itoi to work on it and he's living his life outside of game development. besides, nintendo has filled the 'funny rpg' gameplay niche with its own mario & luigi and paper mario series.
star fox has no really good reason. i think it's just needed a really large-scale, expensive development team to work on it and the IP just hasn't shown that it has been worth it with sales.
There is no demand for old-school arcade racers like F-Zero and Wipeout anymore. Starfox is in a dead genre as well.
Nintendo would probably greenlight Mother 4 if possible but that series is entirely up to whatever Itoi wants to do.
why the hate guys? as i've been saying to every thread like this that popped out for the last 24 hours. if you don't like mario then don't play it, nobody is forcing you to do so. there is a console made by MS and Sony that have much different games than nintendo does. you have every right to choose that. they are putting mario in every genre possible because it hooks people to buy it. which equals more consumers buying it. which equals money for nintendo to make more games. you have to think that there are people that enjoys these kind of games. you're not only the person on earth nintendo needs to cater to. the problem with you guys you want nintendo to be the perfect game company but they were never that. this is the strategy they think is working right now so they keep doing it. you blame nintendo for its hardware, software, sales, graphics, 3rd party and every possible critique out there because you disdain them for being different than the cinematic, qte-ridden, fpsesss games out there right now.
you can say that to every publisher and developer out there. :/
you can say that to every publisher and developer out there. :/
Why not a solid futuristic racing game that isn't part of the F-Zero series? Or a solid RPG set in a normal setting that isn't part of the Mother series? Or a solid space flight game that isn't part of the Star Fox series? Oh, that's right: No one would buy them. That's the problem. If Nintendo fans cared about getting games that're solid as opposed to getting games with recognizable characters and names that aren't necessarily as solid as third-party offerings or new first- and second-party IP's, then things would be much better for everyone.
I'm certainly not insinuating that there aren't some amazing Nintendo games that fall into the "recognizable characters and names" category, but there are several times more games that people simply "have to buy" because "it's Mario" or whatever. What's worse is that they'll whine about how they're not getting new games in whatever series when there are actually alternatives that already exist on other consoles or even in other forms on their current hardware. Want a new 2D Metroid game? How about playing Shadow Complex on Xbox 360? Want a new Pikmin game? How about playing the Overlord games? Oh, you want a new Zelda game, you say? Why not try the Darksiders games?
Bjoern the Smexy
Member
The Mario franchise has at least one or two titles each year.
This WOULD be problematic if they were basically all the same game.
Which they aren't.
Yeah, we got two NSMB titles last year, but I guess this an exception to the rule.
Generally every new released Mario title is a different genre.
We got several different sports series (Baseball, Tennis, Golf, Kart), two platformer series (NSMB and the regular Super Mario franchise), a minigame series (Mario Party), two RPG series (Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi), some Spinoffs (Luigi's Mansion, Super Princess Peach, the whole Yoshi series, ...), etc.etc.
There is so much variety among the Mario franchise. There are lots of different genres so it's not really a problem.
The market isn't oversaturated with same-ish games all the time, although many of them feature Mario or a Mario franchise character as their main character.
So, to answer in a short sentence to the topic:
No, the Mario franchise still has a long life to live.
This WOULD be problematic if they were basically all the same game.
Which they aren't.
Yeah, we got two NSMB titles last year, but I guess this an exception to the rule.
Generally every new released Mario title is a different genre.
We got several different sports series (Baseball, Tennis, Golf, Kart), two platformer series (NSMB and the regular Super Mario franchise), a minigame series (Mario Party), two RPG series (Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi), some Spinoffs (Luigi's Mansion, Super Princess Peach, the whole Yoshi series, ...), etc.etc.
There is so much variety among the Mario franchise. There are lots of different genres so it's not really a problem.
The market isn't oversaturated with same-ish games all the time, although many of them feature Mario or a Mario franchise character as their main character.
So, to answer in a short sentence to the topic:
No, the Mario franchise still has a long life to live.
OnimaruXLR
Member
Y'know, I would never defend the NSMB games for being super awesome, but people really like to blow them out of proportion. There's been one per platform starting with the DS. There have been seven Call of Duties, five Assassins Creeds, and four Halos--all within one hardware cycle. And while those games certainly seem past their prime as far as critical praise goes, they don't inspire the same kind of bile that NSMB seems to. To say nothing of the annual updates that sports games get.
The double standard people hold Nintendo to is weiiird. But at least when they converge their home console and their portable device into one unit next gen, you'll probably hear less people whining about games like Mario Kart and NSMB doing double duty.
The double standard people hold Nintendo to is weiiird. But at least when they converge their home console and their portable device into one unit next gen, you'll probably hear less people whining about games like Mario Kart and NSMB doing double duty.
BudokaiMR2
Member
No please leave one of the few old gaming franchises to not be wrecked completely alone.
Nintendo and Mario in particular does more to bring new people to gaming than either Sony or Microsoft in my opinion.
Hell my wife has absolutely zero interest in gaming but Mario never fails to draw her in and put a smile on her face.
Nintendo and Mario in particular does more to bring new people to gaming than either Sony or Microsoft in my opinion.
Hell my wife has absolutely zero interest in gaming but Mario never fails to draw her in and put a smile on her face.
Oh you tried the fanboy argument here. Well that like goes nowhere.
Because people don't buy Mario games just because, hey it's a fucking mario game! They buy them because, they they are the best platforming games ever made. If the games sucked, you'd have a point.
Want a new Starcraft? Well, why not check out King Arthur for PC? Why all the fuss about a new Half Life when there's Medal of Honor on the Xbox 360?
Ban Puncher
Member
zerokoolpsx
Member
Not happening OP. Mario is the biggest franchise that Nintendo has. It's like saying no to $$$$.
You missed something.
And not all Mario games can be considered to be among the best platforming games ever made. Funny you should mention "the fanboy argument" immediately prior to making such a claim.
Except I actually chose games with very, very similar game play systems as opposed to being completely ridiculous in my recommendations.
All the main Mario games have widely been regarded as the best or at least among the best in the genre. I think this is one case where there is not much debate to be had about the subject.
NSMB games have been more safe and they are more of an IP to keep the 2D platforming genre alive with multiplayer options, while the 3D Marios innovate more.
And which ones sell better? Oh, you mean not the ones that're regarded as the best, right? You've just proven my argument to be correct.
Jesus christ no. NSMB sells more because it's more accessible and has multiplayer.
I thought we were both being pretty ridiculous. Games don't substitute that easy. Overlord might be similar from a gameplay perspective, but Pikmin gets a lot of acclaim for its gorgeous world design and art - something that Overlord completely shits over. It is more of a game made to mock Pikmin rather than to sell to the same audience. Exactly the same situation with Zelda - Darksiders has some atrocious design choices.
edit: darksiders is less offensive than overlord, for the record
And there are plenty of other accessible games with multi-player that don't sell nearly as well. Why do you think that is? Those games don't have Mario.
What I'm getting at is that Mario games sell well because they're Mario games, and Nintendo games don't sell based on their quality. Nintendo games sell based on their familiarity. Mario isn't heralded by the masses because it's innovative and fresh; it's heralded by the masses because it's Mario and it's generally very safe when it's successful.
Nintendo knows that the quality of its games doesn't mean squat. That's why Kirby's Epic Yarn was a Kirby game, rather than a new IP. That's why the next one has Yoshi in it. Most Nintendo fans are too blind to recognize the quality of a game without the inclusion of a recognizable character.
I wasn't intending to be ridiculous by any stretch. Shadow Complex's game play is clearly derived from that of Metroid, although it also adds some really cool abilities that complement Metroid's style of encouraging sequence-breaking very well. Overlord is a more adult take on Pikmin. I didn't have a problem with the artwork. Honestly, some areas in those games look quite nice, and the character designs are chock-full of personality. As for Darksiders, it is to Zelda what Overlord is to Pikmin. It's an adult take on Zelda.
I realize that games don't substitute that easily. I love Shadow Complex, but I hate most Metroid games. (I hate the floaty jumps in most of the Metroid games.) Thing is, people need to be encouraged to go outside of their comfort zones and try new stuff. It's very possible that what they're waiting for is already out in some form.
I'm a huge Sega fan, and I'll admit to generally preferring Sega's style of game play. That has little to do with recognizable characters and names, though. In most cases, I only like a single installment in any given Sega series. I could never get into the Shining Force games, either, but I love me some Fire Emblem. Sometimes, it's good to go out of your comfort zone and try something unfamiliar.
Ok well you just officially crossed the crazy bitter fanboy line here. Because like I said, the quality of Mario platformers is widely acknowledged and is the reason why the games sell together and why the Mario IP has retained it's value.
Again, you'd have a point if Mario games were bad, and people still bought them.
Ha ha? No.
A fanboy of what, exactly? I admitted to loving Sega games, but I have absolutely no problem with sampling the wares of other companies. You probably wouldn't even see a single Sega-developed or Sega-published game in my top ten list. I also love Castlevania. I'd only consider one or two Castlevania games to be among my all-time favorites, though.
You seem to enjoy completely ignoring certain points to what I'm saying. Nintendo chickened out on creating a new IP and turned Epic Yarn into a Kirby game. What does that say about Nintendo's target audience? Exactly what I said. If something isn't recognizable, then it won't sell as well. Nintendo knows that, yet the company continues to train its fans to buy what it recognizes. If you made the NSMB games with other characters, then people wouldn't give two shits about them. That's a fact, whether you want to admit it or not.
To make it a bit clearer...
Make new game that's amazing. Nobody cares.
Put Mario into same game. People suddenly care.
Yes, people love Mario. We know that. The games he's in happen to usually be really good. Mario's presence isn't what makes those games good. Get it?
Yes! The reason why companies create new IP's and characters is for them to get popular. Then they can create sequels and an IP family under their name. This applies to every single publisher. If the IP does not sell, it slowly gets sweeped under a rug. This has happened to Nintendo characters and IP's as well.
Nintendo has Kirby, Mario, Yoshi and DK as their platformer characters. They have enough variation between them to supplement all kinds of games. How many more platformer characters they need in your opinion? What's the quota they need to fill? If some other publisher kills their old IP's and creates new ones, it's not because they want to offer fresh new shit to gamers. It's because the IP's were declining.
Would NSMB sell less if it wasn't a Mario game? Yes!
Would Uncharted 3 sell less if it had a new cast? Yes!
Would Halo 4 sell less if Master Chief was canned? Yes!
So take a wild guess why those characters stay for whatever perioud they are going to...
Mario's presence is also a big part of why they are good. The IP brings in a varied cast of characters/enemies/locations and power ups. IF you are arguing that the game would be better if it was identical mechanically and the setting would just be different, then that's one weird fucking argument :b
Wait you're telling me if I like collecting stuffs and killing creatures in a digital garden full of charm I should play Overlord with the demon controlling his minions?
If I like the design of Zelda I should play Warhammer's version of Zelda?
And If I want a bounty hunter alone in space I should play dudebro platformer?
Wth is going on here?
And people wonder why no one cared about Kirby Yarn?
spoiler : it's doubtful more people will care about Yoshi Yarn.
And that's not because Mario ain't in it.
If I like the design of Zelda I should play Warhammer's version of Zelda?
And If I want a bounty hunter alone in space I should play dudebro platformer?
Wth is going on here?
And people wonder why no one cared about Kirby Yarn?
spoiler : it's doubtful more people will care about Yoshi Yarn.
And that's not because Mario ain't in it.
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
People conflating the use of a mascot with milking a franchise.
sounds like the issue is youre bored of the aesthetics as the gameplay has been top notch.
sounds like the issue is youre bored of the aesthetics as the gameplay has been top notch.
DJ Crimson
Banned
There is no double standard. If you get out of that bubble, you would notice people complaining about those CoD, AC and Halo sequels all the time. Especially on GAF. Do Nintendo fans just ignore obvious facts when trying to make their point?
that's just how brand names work, kevinski. some dude comes up with a good soda pop, no one buys it. no one wants it because they have coca-cola, and coca-cola is always delicious. nintendo is coca-cola.
it is worse with nintendo, although people do complain about other franchises. i mean we're sitting here talking about mario being stale, and this is how many threads in the last month ? how many in the last 6 ?
how many for the franchises you're talking about? none?
it is worse with nintendo, although people do complain about other franchises. i mean we're sitting here talking about mario being stale, and this is how many threads in the last month ? how many in the last 6 ?
how many for the franchises you're talking about? none?
Yeah people were very pissed at Battlefield 3 before it came out and wished it would die already...
Oh and man Bioshock Infinite is being slammed for not being a new IP that's not a FPS!
And dear god I couldn't stop smh at all the topics blaming capcom for making ANOTHER Resident Evil!
IrishNinja
Member
i agree, we should see more sahnic
ionicbluebird
Member
lol
cartman414
Member
If Mario goes, can all the lesser platformers disappear as well?