Support NeoGAF

[Croatoan]

How’s Red Dead running for you guys?

Xbone X is running at medium / high settings at 30fps at 4K for £299

How are your £299 rigs going?

If you are cheaping out on PC you are doing it wrong. My next build is going to be ~$3k+ and will shit all over the PS5/xbox sex. I will also have it before the PS5/Xbox sex come out.

Nobody has ever said consoles aren't good for the money, but console only peeps like to puff their chest and ignore that PCs can brute force their asses to death.

Its all so stupid. Why do console only peeps have such an annoying chip on their shoulder? Or is it an inferiority complex or something? I basically own everything and I am cognizant of all of the strengths and weaknesses of the various devices. It irritates me when I see people swerve out of their lane and act like they are hot shit when they really really aren't.

I see this in the real world a lot with "new money" folks. You know, the people who have recently come into money and act like they are suddenly royalty. Then they buy a lot of stuff and usually end up broke as a dog. All the while, old money is laughing their asses off at the clown show these people make of their lives.

I picked that analogy for a reason as it is what happens every new console release. Console only peeps are new tech. It happened with PS4/xbone. Lots of chest puffing, hype, hyperbole and unearned hubris. Console only peeps wrote checks with their mouth they would never be able to cash. The consoles came out and, whelp, they were under powered compared to enthusiast's PCs.

PC enthusiasts are old tech they already own powerful rigs and have a lot invested in upgrade paths for them. When new consoles come out these people tend to try to temper the clown show, but in the end get shouted down by the new tech that thinks they know better. Words like coding to the metal, cloud processing and secret sauce are thrown about. New Tech gets excited about this incredible new technology (SSDs) that only consoles will every have (LOL). A lot of PC enthusiasts just laugh from afar because they don't want to directly interface with the insanity.

I saw posts like yours last time as well. Moving the goal posts so that you can win the argument. Of coarse consoles can beat PCs at price for performance, but PCs can smoke consoles when you remove price. If you want to claim you have the most powerful gaming device for $500 then yes you will win that one, but don't go around saying that Consoles are going to be more powerful than PCs unless you want to start bouncing the checks you write.

 

[Spukc]

If you are cheaping out on PC you are doing it wrong. My next build is going to be ~$3k+ and will shit all over the PS5/xbox sex. I will also have it before the PS5/Xbox sex come out.

Nobody has ever said consoles aren't good for the money, but console only peeps like to puff their chest and ignore that PCs can brute force their asses to death.

Its all so stupid. Why do console only peeps have such an annoying chip on their shoulder? Or is it an inferiority complex or something? I basically own everything and I am cognizant of all of the strengths and weaknesses of the various devices. It irritates me when I see people swerve out of their lane and act like they are hot shit when they really really aren't.

I see this in the real world a lot with "new money" folks. You know, the people who have recently come into money and act like they are suddenly royalty. Then they buy a lot of stuff and usually end up broke as a dog. All the while, old money is laughing their asses off at the clown show these people make of their lives.

I picked that analogy for a reason as it is what happens every new console release. Console only peeps are new tech. It happened with PS4/xbone. Lots of chest puffing, hype, hyperbole and unearned hubris. Console only peeps wrote checks with their mouth they would never be able to cash. The consoles came out and, whelp, they were under powered compared to enthusiast's PCs.

PC enthusiasts are old tech they already own powerful rigs and have a lot invested in upgrade paths for them. When new consoles come out these people tend to try to temper the clown show, but in the end get shouted down by the new tech that thinks they know better. Words like coding to the metal, cloud processing and secret sauce are thrown about. New Tech gets excited about this incredible new technology (SSDs) that only consoles will every have (LOL). A lot of PC enthusiasts just laugh from afar because they don't want to directly interface with the insanity.

I saw posts like yours last time as well. Moving the goal posts so that you can win the argument. Of coarse consoles can beat PCs at price for performance, but PCs can smoke consoles when you remove price. If you want to claim you have the most powerful gaming device for $500 then yes you will win that one, but don't go around saying that Consoles are going to be more powerful than PCs unless you want to start bouncing the checks you write.

 

[lukilladog]

Yea bandwidth is where consoles fell flat on the PS4, not the dog shit CPU, and terrible GPU solution. Oh by the way didn't you hear its now on a single soc which will make it it a super PC architecture and compete with high end hardware on that front with more v-ram then PC's have and 8 cores more then PC's have and that all for only 400 bucks. While a guy with a 3 year old i7 could slam a new GPU in his box for 300 bucks and get a PS4 pro already but with 60 fps years before it even releases? its laughable at best.

Sorry mate, i have been around already for a while and the PR shit those console company's are pushing is beyond laughable at best. Massive respect for phil spencer to not walk into this hype bullshit again ( remember power of the cloud ) and just straight up give us the data we want and say what the performance is like and be realistic.

Hell even red dead redemption 2 people where convinced that the xbox one X was running stuff at ultra settings before the settings came out on PC to start chanting there victory's. Men i remember when xbox one x got announced and everybody and there mom was announcing that box to be as fast as a 1080. a card that's what 20% slower then a 5700xt which phil says is 100% faster then xbox one x. Yea there you go. Stop believing the hype start believing actual numbers because that's what it pushes at the end of the day.

2080ti sits at ~35% above the 5700xt performance wise, 35% = a generation leap. So your idea of 2080ti only pushes 3 fps higher more forwards on 4k, that means the PS5 only runs the game at 9 fps while the PC sits at 13.5 fps aka both are unplayable.

And 35-40% on if you want to hit 60 fps on 4k = the difference between 40 and 60 fps any % more for 4k matters let alone 35-40%. If you don't think this is a big upgrade or the concept of it u probably never played or owned higher end systems or the market for it. People spend bucket loads of money for 30% increase in performance any day.

The only way to make the 2080ti obselete is when they push a next generation amd gpu in that box that performs faster then a 2080ti and AMD has nothing like that at this point and frankly microsoft will just release Xbox series X1 a year later with that gpu in it if they cared for it, so what's the point.

Also PC gamers do not sit at 4k which will give that 2080ti even longer legs then those consoles have unless they start dropping resolutions and they will u can count on that straight out of the gate.

I don´t pay much attention to PR or fanboys either, but the ps5 gpu is gonna have architecture improvements and isn´t limited by apis or drivers. The thing is that a next gen game that pushes the gpu ported back to xboxX is gonna run bad, half the speed or less... 10-15fps. How do you think the 2080ti is gonna handle that when it can barely push 30fps 4k xboxX games to 50-60fps with reduced settings?. I think you will be lucky if you can play it at 30fps 4k.

 

[mckmas8808]

In-engine does not mean anything. The Uncharted 4 trailer was in-engine. Final product was not anywhere close in terms of fidelity.

I'd argue the cutscenes did look just like that in-engine UC4 trailer. But we on GAF have proven this for years now.

 

[sunnysideup]

If you are cheaping out on PC you are doing it wrong. My next build is going to be ~$3k+ and will shit all over the PS5/xbox sex. I will also have it before the PS5/Xbox sex come out.

Nobody has ever said consoles aren't good for the money, but console only peeps like to puff their chest and ignore that PCs can brute force their asses to death.

Its all so stupid. Why do console only peeps have such an annoying chip on their shoulder? Or is it an inferiority complex or something? I basically own everything and I am cognizant of all of the strengths and weaknesses of the various devices. It irritates me when I see people swerve out of their lane and act like they are hot shit when they really really aren't.

I see this in the real world a lot with "new money" folks. You know, the people who have recently come into money and act like they are suddenly royalty. Then they buy a lot of stuff and usually end up broke as a dog. All the while, old money is laughing their asses off at the clown show these people make of their lives.

I picked that analogy for a reason as it is what happens every new console release. Console only peeps are new tech. It happened with PS4/xbone. Lots of chest puffing, hype, hyperbole and unearned hubris. Console only peeps wrote checks with their mouth they would never be able to cash. The consoles came out and, whelp, they were under powered compared to enthusiast's PCs.

PC enthusiasts are old tech they already own powerful rigs and have a lot invested in upgrade paths for them. When new consoles come out these people tend to try to temper the clown show, but in the end get shouted down by the new tech that thinks they know better. Words like coding to the metal, cloud processing and secret sauce are thrown about. New Tech gets excited about this incredible new technology (SSDs) that only consoles will every have (LOL). A lot of PC enthusiasts just laugh from afar because they don't want to directly interface with the insanity.

I saw posts like yours last time as well. Moving the goal posts so that you can win the argument. Of coarse consoles can beat PCs at price for performance, but PCs can smoke consoles when you remove price. If you want to claim you have the most powerful gaming device for $500 then yes you will win that one, but don't go around saying that Consoles are going to be more powerful than PCs unless you want to start bouncing the checks you write.

You will pay 3 grand to play upprezzed ps4 games and games made for the lowest common denominator, which is just above the crap that is on your mobile phone.

And the ps4 exclusives will still look better.

Pc gaming is in such a sad state.

 

[Shangounchained]

You will pay 3 grand to play upprezzed ps4 games and games made for the lowest common denominator, which is just above the crap that is on your mobile phone.

Yet the ps4 exclusives will still look better.

Pc gaming is in such a sad state.

Pcs are only good for content creation and weather simulation by now theres no point of spending over 3000$ to beat 600$ consoles simple math

the xboxsex has a 12 teraflop gpu faster than the quadro 5000 costing 2000£ and 16-24gb rumourd vram thats between a quadro 5000 and a titan rtx so it seats between those 2 expensive monster cards on a 600$ console, the war ended long ago mate, you cant beat consoles in gaming, they are simply made for that.

 

[sunnysideup]

Yea you pay 500 bux for a console, and you can play every major thirdparty game in a stable fashion for the next 5-6 years. And on top of that play exclusives that are the absolute top in terms of presentation.

If i payed 3 grand for a pc, i would want games that looked a generation beyond ps4. But its not happening. Because there is no such content. Only ps4 ports.

 

[Shangounchained]

Yea you pay 500 bux for a console, and you can play every major thirdparty game in a stable fashion for the next 5-6 years. And on top of that play exclusives that are the absolute top in terms of presentation.

If i payed 3 grand for a pc, i would want games that looked a generation beyond ps4. But its not happening. Because there is no such content. Only ps4 ports.

Playstation is simply the best most affordable proper quality games way to play, if xbox pull their socks up and actually make proper exclusives like playstation then itll be good for gaming, but as for pc gaming i think its a dying trend! ... Consoles can now output 4k and next gen will output 4k 60-120 and at 600$ or even 700 nobody would need a pc for gaming anymore its just pointless.

 

[Bruno_Arrais85]

keep dreaming about those new console outputing native 4K@120

 

[Shangounchained]

keep dreaming about those new console outputing native 4K@120

They just said it so ill chose to believe them over you mate!

 

[Bruno_Arrais85]

They just said it so ill chose to believe them over you mate!

Ken Kutaragi was also right: https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/news311005ps3120

 

[HarryKS]

I'd argue the cutscenes did look just like that in-engine UC4 trailer. But we on GAF have proven this for years now.

Yeah, but not gameplay. In-engine doesn't mean much if the physics, polygon count, etc can't be replicated while you're playing.

 

[mckmas8808]

Yeah, but not gameplay. In-engine doesn't mean much if the physics, polygon count, etc can't be replicated while you're playing.

It's what the console can do "graphics wise" at it's best. Real-time Cutscenes matter to many of us still.

 

[VFXVeteran]

UPDATE:

I'm getting conflicting info on this trailer guys. *sigh*

Now I'm hearing it was captured from an XSX at 24FPS. To me, that doesn't mean real-time at all... Here's hoping that a 2080Ti or higher can render that in realtime but probably not. Which would put us back pre-PS4 days when demos came out, blew people away, and then you never saw them again.

 

[Shangounchained]

It's what the console can do "graphics wise" at it's best. Real-time Cutscenes matter to many of us still.

Hes just jelous that the ps4 could pull it and it showed in so many ways, the chase scene for instance it was just like the trailers and had more on screen than the trailers it even had volumetric smoke at one point and looked incredible when nathan was trapped inside the flaming jeep!

 

[Shangounchained]

UPDATE:

I'm getting conflicting info on this trailer guys. *sigh*

Now I'm hearing it was captured from an XSX at 24FPS. To me, that doesn't mean real-time at all... Here's hoping that a 2080Ti or higher can render that in realtime but probably not. Which would put us back pre-PS4 days when demos came out, blew people away, and then you never saw them again.

It was realtime, this just shows that 24-30fps is still the norm

 

[Shangounchained]

Yeah, but not gameplay. In-engine doesn't mean much if the physics, polygon count, etc can't be replicated while you're playing.

This is what a ps4 can do easily! Ur underestimating it.

 

[Shangounchained]

The Polygonal Evolution of 5 Iconic PlayStation Characters – PlayStation.Blog

 

[ScaryBrandon]

UPDATE:

I'm getting conflicting info on this trailer guys. *sigh*

Now I'm hearing it was captured from an XSX at 24FPS. To me, that doesn't mean real-time at all... Here's hoping that a 2080Ti or higher can render that in realtime but probably not. Which would put us back pre-PS4 days when demos came out, blew people away, and then you never saw them again.

The next gen downgrades have already begun haha. That's what happens when you take 3 year old gpu power, put it on a console and call it next gen. Poor console owners can never catch a break.

 

[hooijdonk17]

The biggest jump next gen consoles will have over their current gen refreshes will be on the CPU side. GPU-wise, they will be on par with a 2070 or thereabouts I would think. Of course, console developers will be able to get a lot more out of that hardware than current PC games do, but regardless a 2080 with a Zen+/Zen2 CPU will probably not be outdated for at least through 2021, in terms of console parity. Even an RX5700/5700XT will probably play all console games fine at 1080p in the same period.

 

[MilkyJoe]

If you are cheaping out on PC you are doing it wrong. My next build is going to be ~$3k+ and will shit all over the PS5/xbox sex. I will also have it before the PS5/Xbox sex come out.

Nobody has ever said consoles aren't good for the money, but console only peeps like to puff their chest and ignore that PCs can brute force their asses to death.

Its all so stupid. Why do console only peeps have such an annoying chip on their shoulder? Or is it an inferiority complex or something? I basically own everything and I am cognizant of all of the strengths and weaknesses of the various devices. It irritates me when I see people swerve out of their lane and act like they are hot shit when they really really aren't.

I see this in the real world a lot with "new money" folks. You know, the people who have recently come into money and act like they are suddenly royalty. Then they buy a lot of stuff and usually end up broke as a dog. All the while, old money is laughing their asses off at the clown show these people make of their lives.

I picked that analogy for a reason as it is what happens every new console release. Console only peeps are new tech. It happened with PS4/xbone. Lots of chest puffing, hype, hyperbole and unearned hubris. Console only peeps wrote checks with their mouth they would never be able to cash. The consoles came out and, whelp, they were under powered compared to enthusiast's PCs.

PC enthusiasts are old tech they already own powerful rigs and have a lot invested in upgrade paths for them. When new consoles come out these people tend to try to temper the clown show, but in the end get shouted down by the new tech that thinks they know better. Words like coding to the metal, cloud processing and secret sauce are thrown about. New Tech gets excited about this incredible new technology (SSDs) that only consoles will every have (LOL). A lot of PC enthusiasts just laugh from afar because they don't want to directly interface with the insanity.

I saw posts like yours last time as well. Moving the goal posts so that you can win the argument. Of coarse consoles can beat PCs at price for performance, but PCs can smoke consoles when you remove price. If you want to claim you have the most powerful gaming device for $500 then yes you will win that one, but don't go around saying that Consoles are going to be more powerful than PCs unless you want to start bouncing the checks you write.

 

[existensmaximum]

If you honestly think motion blur can make 30 FPS look like 60, then you need to get your eyes examined. Digital Foundry did a video a few years ago where they recorded some Uncharted 4 footage at half speed and then sped it up to get true 60 FPS gameplay, and the difference was night and day.

Ignoring input lag and controller responsiveness etc, am I the only one who thinks the 60 fps version of this looks like utter garbage and ass compared to 30 fps? I agree that the difference is night and day - in the worst possible way to me. Like watching The Hobbit at 48 fps, gross.

 

[thelastword]

Well since the 3080ti will be coming out in 2020 then yes, the 2080 will be outdated in 2020. The consoles will have no bearing on that though.

What an odd question.

edit: the 3080ti will blow consoles out of the water so all of you console only folks should really keep it in your pants.

The "blow consoles out of water line" really means little in this day and age...…...You will be paying over $1200 to play the same third party games that are on consoles at higher resolutions and framerates, this is not blowing the consoles out of the water, this is blowing your pocket out of the water........The reality is; you're doing this for the same game which can also be enjoyed on consoles, but the upside for consoles is that they will be playing exclusive games that will not be available on the 3080ti ever, games which also look better than all those multiplats at ultra graphics because that 3080ti's full power will never be fully utilized like the closed boxed units......

 

[VFXVeteran]

This is what a ps4 can do easily! Ur underestimating it.

Well, this doesn't mean anything. It's not like no other platform could do it.

 

[ScaryBrandon]

The "blow consoles out of water line" really means little in this day and age...…...You will be paying over $1200 to play the same third party games that are on consoles at higher resolutions and framerates, this is not blowing the consoles out of the water, this is blowing your pocket out of the water........The reality is; you're doing this for the same game which can also be enjoyed on consoles, but the upside for consoles is that they will be playing exclusive games that will not be available on the 3080ti ever, games which also look better than all those multiplats at ultra graphics because that 3080ti's full power will never be fully utilized like the closed boxed units......

The PC platorm has the most exclusives by far. All consoles have are a few 10 hour shallow scripted experiences.

 

[VFXVeteran]

The "blow consoles out of water line" really means little in this day and age...…...You will be paying over $1200 to play the same third party games that are on consoles at higher resolutions and framerates, this is not blowing the consoles out of the water, this is blowing your pocket out of the water........The reality is; you're doing this for the same game which can also be enjoyed on consoles, but the upside for consoles is that they will be playing exclusive games that will not be available on the 3080ti ever, games which also look better than all those multiplats at ultra graphics because that 3080ti's full power will never be fully utilized like the closed boxed units......

That's a lot though. Of course a dev is going to put in similar assets (except textures) and most of the FX, animations, environment sky, etc. and stuff will be the same. But having more bandwidth to show more of the director's vision shouldn't be taken lightly. It is a significant step up. Detroit for PS4 is a perfect example. Excellent use of PBR materials (only a handful of games can match it), but yet on the PC, it looks way better and stands out even more due to the higher resolution assets and the sharper fidelity on the final rendered image.

Lastly, those exclusives you are talking about... you are going to be shocked at what comes down the pike for the PC on Sony's end.

 

[Shangounchained]

The "blow consoles out of water line" really means little in this day and age...…...You will be paying over $1200 to play the same third party games that are on consoles at higher resolutions and framerates, this is not blowing the consoles out of the water, this is blowing your pocket out of the water........The reality is; you're doing this for the same game which can also be enjoyed on consoles, but the upside for consoles is that they will be playing exclusive games that will not be available on the 3080ti ever, games which also look better than all those multiplats at ultra graphics because that 3080ti's full power will never be fully utilized like the closed boxed units......

Well, this doesn't mean anything. It's not like no other platform could do it.

Nobody said other platforms cant do it, were discussing about ps4 here

 

[OmegaSupreme]

That's a lot though. Of course a dev is going to put in similar assets (except textures) and most of the FX, animations, environment sky, etc. and stuff will be the same. But having more bandwidth to show more of the director's vision shouldn't be taken lightly. It is a significant step up. Detroit for PS4 is a perfect example. Excellent use of PBR materials (only a handful of games can match it), but yet on the PC, it looks way better and stands out even more due to the higher resolution assets and the sharper fidelity on the final rendered image.

Lastly, those exclusives you are talking about... you are going to be shocked at what comes down the pike for the PC on Sony's end.

I'm looking forward to those sony games on pc. The whole "exclusives" argument really only works in the console space. PC gets damn near everything these days besides first-party Sony and Nintendo stuff. Besides all that the list of exclusive pc games is absolutely huge. Add in mods, free online, superior graphics, cheaper games, almost infinite backward compatibility and to me, you have the best platform. I also own all the consoles so I'm no stranger to their benefits. PC defense force standing down lol.

 

[Shangounchained]

That's a lot though. Of course a dev is going to put in similar assets (except textures) and most of the FX, animations, environment sky, etc. and stuff will be the same. But having more bandwidth to show more of the director's vision shouldn't be taken lightly. It is a significant step up. Detroit for PS4 is a perfect example. Excellent use of PBR materials (only a handful of games can match it), but yet on the PC, it looks way better and stands out even more due to the higher resolution assets and the sharper fidelity on the final rendered image.

Lastly, those exclusives you are talking about... you are going to be shocked at what comes down the pike for the PC on Sony's end.

An image will always look better with more powerful hardware its pointless cause you can upscale any game from ps1 even ps10 can be upscaled, not even pcs are eternal any new year comes with more powerful hardware on pcs so detroit as it looks on a gaming pc now will look even better with newer pcs next year and years after, gaming isnt about competing how much pixels you can push its about the initial design and detroit was perfect as they wanted to present it on the ps4 and thats the bottom line!

 

[thelastword]

Did everyone forget the infamous "in engine" Uncharted 4 trailer from 2014? Remember how Sony and Naughty Dog claimed that this is what the final game would look like, and that it would run at 60 FPS? Needless to say, Uncharted 4 ended up looking nothing like it, and it didn't run at 60 FPS, either. "In engine" doesn't mean shit. If this was running in real time on the actual console they would have straight up said it.

They said they were targeting 60fps, they never said it would run at 60fps outright...…...The same was said of DC, it was targeting 60 fps early in development too...…..Yet at least the MP in UC4 is indeed 60fps.....I believe ND will make 60fps a reality on both SP and MP next gen, because of the CPU and more powerful GPU architecture.....

One thing is for sure, it's always a good thing to target higher framerates in development...…..Always felt this was a good practice.....Look at DC, it targeted 60fps at first and everything they throwed at it therafter, it was able to handle at a locked 30fps...…….(Heavy weather, high end lighting, cloud simulation, large detailed tracks etc...)

We can expect cutscenes for next gen ? AFAIK they didn't show any gameplay ?

I think we will see much more impressive cutscenes, facial animations and character graphics than what we saw in that HB2 trailer.....And of course, right now I think I'm a bit more stoked for visuals which looks to be in-game and running at 60fps, like in Godfall...

The PC platorm has the most exclusives by far. All consoles have are a few 10 hour shallow scripted experiences.

Quality, not quantity...….How many of these PC exclusives push the graphical boundary like Console first party exclusives, how many are GOTY candidates or win GOTY frequently?

That's a lot though. Of course a dev is going to put in similar assets (except textures) and most of the FX, animations, environment sky, etc. and stuff will be the same. But having more bandwidth to show more of the director's vision shouldn't be taken lightly. It is a significant step up. Detroit for PS4 is a perfect example. Excellent use of PBR materials (only a handful of games can match it), but yet on the PC, it looks way better and stands out even more due to the higher resolution assets and the sharper fidelity on the final rendered image.

Lastly, those exclusives you are talking about... you are going to be shocked at what comes down the pike for the PC on Sony's end.

It's not a lot, relative to what you see on screen, what you see is the same thing, the same game, you get the same experience.....It's what always existed.....You take COD, pc gets a few more effects, better filtering, consoles players play at 60fps, PC guys can play at 120fps if they desire, Console players still get the same COD experience the way the devs imagined it, no stutter, it's smooth and playable and they enjoy it with their friends...Most times the larger playerbase is always on consoles too, so it's not like they are pertubed by a guy who spent thousands of dollars to play at 8k 120fps......

Also, we will need some receipts on all those PS games heading to PC...…..Please tell me of all these SWWS games coming to PC next gen? Give us a morsel....

 

[VFXVeteran]

An image will always look better with more powerful hardware its pointless cause you can upscale any game from ps1 even ps10 can be upscaled, not even pcs are eternal any new year comes with more powerful hardware on pcs so detroit as it looks on a gaming pc now will look even better with newer pcs next year and years after, gaming isnt about competing how much pixels you can push its about the initial design and detroit was perfect as they wanted to present it on the ps4 and thats the bottom line!

It was perfect how they designed it with the PC hardware they used and porting down to the PS4. Those textures on the PC were already made and not re-created (ala Halo: Reach). They used lower res textures for the PS4.

Listen, I'm not going to sit here and argue with you all day about the PS4. Some of you think that there's still this magic bullet inside a console even when the hardware is clearly x86 architecture and AMD/Nvidia GPU chipsets. You never see this "advantage" in practice as you put it when the same game is compared to the console box. There is a reason why that is the case. Developers want the best hardware they can get to show the director's vision. I'm not looking to figure out how to find a new lossless compression algorithm using only an x87 FPU stack-based register set or some special CUDA cores on a GPU. Whatever I do on this box, I can do also on the PC. What I can't do on this box is load the VRAM up to 5G when I only have 8G of total RAM in the system. Therefore, my game is going to look much worst than an PC running an Nvidia board that has 8-11G of VRAM and 16G or more of OS RAM. Those are the facts. They are irrefutable.

Stop trying to justify a console over a PC. It just sounds silly these days and it's reaching.... if you want to appreciate the consoles for what they can do I'm all for it! But getting into these discussions about magic hardware "pills" when there are none to justify it being a better hardware option for a game is just sounding trollish.

 

[VFXVeteran]

It's not a lot, relative to what you see on screen, what you see is the same thing, the same game, you get the same experience.....It's what always existed.....You take COD, pc gets a few more effects, better filtering, consoles players play at 60fps, PC guys can play at 120fps if they desire, Console players still get the same COD experience the way the devs imagined it, no stutter, it's smooth and playable and they enjoy it with their friends...Most times the larger playerbase is always on consoles too, so it's not like they are pertubed by a guy who spent thousands of dollars to play at 8k 120fps......

Also, we will need some receipts on all those PS games heading to PC...…..Please tell me of all these SWWS games coming to PC next gen? Give us a morsel....

Yes, you see the same thing.. sortof. If you take a step back far enough, everything will look the same. That's just the limitation of our vision. But that doesn't factor in anyway what gets added to the rendering equation to make a more accurate looking game.

Consoles may have CoD: Modern Warfare, but I can guarantee that they are missing a hell of a lot of fidelity not to mention the pasted on small objects on the ground which should have shadows.. (i.e. PC has ray-tracing which is the perfect solution to that non-dying problem).

If next gen consoles can't render at 4k with the ability to match the fidelity of the PC image in CoD:MW for example, they are already behind before they have even come out. There is no way I'll go back to playing the console version of CoD:MW now after seeing it in all of it's glory on PC maxed out. But CoD:MW is the leader of the pack (imo) right now in tech and beauty. There really is nothing like it right now on the market.

And in answer to your "receipts" claim. I'll prove my case to you just like I had to do with N Negotiator . Tell you what. Of the games you know are on the horizon as PS4/5 exclusives, how many of them being ported to PC would it take for you to buy a new PC and skip the entire generation of consoles next winter? Btw, you already are in the hole since the first ever PS5 exclusive is also coming on the PC.

 

[DJ12]

UPDATE:

I'm getting conflicting info on this trailer guys. *sigh*

Now I'm hearing it was captured from an XSX at 24FPS. To me, that doesn't mean real-time at all... Here's hoping that a 2080Ti or higher can render that in realtime but probably not. Which would put us back pre-PS4 days when demos came out, blew people away, and then you never saw them again.

Come on now, I literally saw a guy with the video queued up showing it was 24 fps 2 days ago.

And if it was a 24 fps video, and it was running at 24 fps (which I doubt) surely it's real time.

 

[DeepEnigma]

UPDATE:

I'm getting conflicting info on this trailer guys. *sigh*

Now I'm hearing it was captured from an XSX at 24FPS. To me, that doesn't mean real-time at all... Here's hoping that a 2080Ti or higher can render that in realtime but probably not. Which would put us back pre-PS4 days when demos came out, blew people away, and then you never saw them again.

24FPS?

They just pushed play on the Bluray.

 

[VFXVeteran]

Come on now, I literally saw a guy with the video queued up showing it was 24 fps 2 days ago.

And if it was a 24 fps video, and it was running at 24 fps (which I doubt) surely it's real time.

Meh.. potato potAto... I couldn't play a game at 24fps. Don't know of anyone that would these days.

 

[DeepEnigma]

The PC platorm has the most exclusives by far. All consoles have are a few 10 hour shallow scripted experiences.

 

[Black_Stride]

Pcs are only good for content creation and weather simulation by now theres no point of spending over 3000$ to beat 600$ consoles simple math

the xboxsex has a 12 teraflop gpu faster than the quadro 5000 costing 2000£ and 16-24gb rumourd vram thats between a quadro 5000 and a titan rtx so it seats between those 2 expensive monster cards on a 600$ console, the war ended long ago mate, you cant beat consoles in gaming, they are simply made for that.

Who the fuck games on a Quadro or a RTX Titan?
Both are NOT gaming cards.

Second your TFlop comparison dont mention any direct comparisons in actual performance between Turing and RDNA, so just counting FLops doesnt matter.

And before you say yeah it does compare RDNA to GCN with similar Tflops and youll see that architectural differences make a.....err difference.
Do you have any basis for saying the RDNA chip in these new consoles is any match for a 2080TI

Wiat why are you looking at the most expensive non-gaming chips when vs looking at the actual gaming chips?

 

[Shangounchained]

It was perfect how they designed it with the PC hardware they used and porting down to the PS4. Those textures on the PC were already made and not re-created (ala Halo: Reach). They used lower res textures for the PS4.

Listen, I'm not going to sit here and argue with you all day about the PS4. Some of you think that there's still this magic bullet inside a console even when the hardware is clearly x86 architecture and AMD/Nvidia GPU chipsets. You never see this "advantage" in practice as you put it when the same game is compared to the console box. There is a reason why that is the case. Developers want the best hardware they can get to show the director's vision. I'm not looking to figure out how to find a new lossless compression algorithm using only an x87 FPU stack-based register set or some special CUDA cores on a GPU. Whatever I do on this box, I can do also on the PC. What I can't do on this box is load the VRAM up to 5G when I only have 8G of total RAM in the system. Therefore, my game is going to look much worst than an PC running an Nvidia board that has 8-11G of VRAM and 16G or more of OS RAM. Those are the facts. They are irrefutable.

Stop trying to justify a console over a PC. It just sounds silly these days and it's reaching.... if you want to appreciate the consoles for what they can do I'm all for it! But getting into these discussions about magic hardware "pills" when there are none to justify it being a better hardware option for a game is just sounding trollish.

They ported it from the ps4 to the pc, its bullcrap to think otherwise, or maybe they ported crysis 1 from a beefier pc to a consumer pc its barnacles, the fucking game was engineered to work om a ps4 what pc got was extra! And if they wanted to theyll make it extra for a super computer, the fucking game is a ps4 game at heart they designed it to work on 5gb or less of ram! To work on a ps4. Its mediocre eben having this discussion.

 

[Shangounchained]

Who the fuck games on a Quadro or a RTX Titan?
Both are NOT gaming cards.

Second your TFlop comparison dont mention any direct comparisons in actual performance between Turing and RDNA, so just counting FLops doesnt matter.

And before you say yeah it does compare RDNA to GCN with similar Tflops and youll see that architectural differences make a.....err difference.
Do you have any basis for saying the RDNA chip in these new consoles is any match for a 2080TI

Wiat why are you looking at the most expensive non-gaming chips when vs looking at the actual gaming chips?

So whats a gaming card? what u classify as a gaming card is stupid. There is nothing like a gaming card.

 

[VFXVeteran]

They ported it from the ps4 to the pc,

Let's go more in depth with this. So you believe that every company that supports a console, loads up the OS, starts up a shell, loads their source code editor, starts coding and then uses the BSD to compile the code. So what application are they using to actually MAKE the assets? The PS4 running Maya? 3DS Max running? Do they have a FreeBSD version of Photoshop on their PS4? You tell me?

There are no tool creation apps specific to a console.

Photoshop (texturing) - PC
Maya (Model, Rigging, Animation, Scene layout, etc..) - PC
3DS Max - PC
Houdini (FX) - PC
3rd party tools - PC

its bullcrap to think otherwise, or maybe they ported crysis 1 from a beefier pc to a consumer pc its barnacles, the fucking game was engineered to work om a ps4

You are absolutely 100% correct! They did design it to run on a PS4. Period. No arguments from here at all.

what pc got was extra!

How does that work specifically?

Here, let's see how it would work doing your workflow and creating specifically for the PS4 and working backwards to the PC:

Graphics Settings in Detroit on PC:

Texture quality: HIGH = Higher resolution textures. 2k instead of 512.
- That requires re-texturing all those textures. How many man hours is that? You can't upscale them because it will blur out the image. Gotta be created from scratch if we made the game strictly on a console dev box.

Texture Filtering: HIGH = 16x.
- PS4 only has 4X. I guess we could make that a switch in the renderer but we made the renderer with the PS4 in mind, so why would we go back and change that. Whatever, we ask the GPU for 16x samples.

Shadow Quality: ULTRA = higher resolution shadow maps.
- Whelp, is that a switch too? I guess we can make parameters for higher resolution SM in our engine so that we can render our depth pass at a higher res. Does this break anything else in the renderer since it was made strictly for a PS4?

MODEL Quality: ULTRA = higher level of detail.
- Wait a minute? How can you make high poly assets when we designed this game for a PS4? So do we go back and increase the polygons on the characters/objects? That would mean we need to possibly change our LOD algorithm and pipeline to give it more levels. But that means we have to create models with heavier polys.

MOTION Blur: ULTRA = highest amount of re-rendering assets to blur between them.
- Is this a switch too? Are we going to add a different range to our renderer so it can re-render the scene more than our PS4 limit?

SSR: ULTRA = maximum resolution to render the scene to get good reflections.
- I guess we can add a switch here too that goes beyond what a PS4 can do but maybe that slows down some utility or perhaps we made constant maximums that we need to change in the code.. more work.. *sigh*

OK - I have an idea! Let's just design a renderer that does MORE than what our target platform does, test it at the maximum of what it can do on a *PC* and then turn these dials down, lower our resolution, lower our textures, etc.. and release on PS4. THEN later re-release the game on PC to make us even more money without having to spend anymore money on manpower. Sounds sensible to me.


THAT'S the business guys. PC dev boxes with brute force power that can be tweaked down for the target platform is common sense. Yes, the target is the console, but it would be shooting yourself in the foot to completely make your entire pipeline work as if they only have a single closed box to work with and NO plans whatsoever on designing the engine on a more powerful platform.

 

[MadAnon]

Phil flat out said that the trailer was in-engine, not CGI movie.

Witcher 3 trailer was also in-engine. Doesn't mean shit.

 

[thelastword]

Witcher 3 trailer was also in-engine. Doesn't mean shit.

Everybody knows I'm not the biggest fan of Witcher and what went down with it.....Yet in that initial Witcher 3 reveal...

At least you could see lots of foliage, geometry, levels, Witcher riding through the forest, npc's all over, water etc......What you saw looked like a realized game with everything intact (On a very powerful PC, no less, but it looked like a real game with full levels that you could play)....That Hellblade 2 video was pretty much a face surrounded by darkness for more facial focus......How are we judging this when you actually play, the lighting, texturing, npcs whilst you play?.....HB2 is just not an impressive trailer to me.......Now if they show gameplay and a full level where the character actually moves and fights in it, then I will see what they've got.....At this point, the HB2 demo was just like the Series X reveal, just a shell or a mockup in video form......There are too many details missing from a gameplay perspective to call this impressive....

 

[Shangounchained]

Everybody knows I'm not the biggest fan of Witcher and what went down with it.....Yet in that initial Witcher 3 reveal...

At least you could see lots of foliage, geometry, levels, Witcher riding through the forest, npc's all over, water etc......What you saw looked like a realized game with everything intact (On a very powerful PC, no less, but it looked like a real game with full levels that you could play)....That Hellblade 2 video was pretty much a face surrounded by darkness for more facial focus......How are we judging this when you actually play, the lighting, texturing, npcs whilst you play?.....HB2 is just not an impressive trailer to me.......Now if they show gameplay and a full level where the character actually moves and fights in it, then I will see what they've got.....At this point, the HB2 demo was just like the Series X reveal, just a shell or a mockup in video form......There are too many details missing from a gameplay perspective to call this impressive....

Honestly as ive collected my thoughts by now i dont feel like the hellblade demo was really that impressive!

They start with a barren landscape with volumetric volcano smoke which is deffinetely prebaked and they did that with current gen on ryse, tombraider, uncharted 4 as u can see here

So its nothing new, and they end the trailer with a close up of the characters head so thats easy to do since the data in ram is all focused on her head!

I mean till today microsoft havent shown anything clear its all smoke and mirrors, its 2 games shown now, halo infinite with no gameplay whatsoever and hellblade same without gameplay! They are acting like cunts!

When sony revealed ps4 they came up with killzone gameplay, they showed tsushima on tgs gameplay so why the fuck are microsoft pussying around, if they cant do it then why not just quit and call it a day, the industry is called gaming and we play games not watch movies and cutscenes!

 

[Mista]

Remember that this was in-engine, not in-game. And yes, there is a difference.

As for the RTX 2080 becoming obsolete, it might, but not for the reasons implied in the OP.

Exactly this. Lets not jump ahead and wait a bit. We haven’t even shifted yet

 

[mckmas8808]

Honestly as ive collected my thoughts by now i dont feel like the hellblade demo was really that impressive!

They start with a barren landscape with volumetric volcano smoke which is deffinetely prebaked and they did that with current gen on ryse, tombraider, uncharted 4 as u can see here

So its nothing new, and they end the trailer with a close up of the characters head so thats easy to do since the data in ram is all focused on her head!

I mean till today microsoft havent shown anything clear its all smoke and mirrors, its 2 games shown now, halo infinite with no gameplay whatsoever and hellblade same without gameplay! They are acting like cunts!

When sony revealed ps4 they came up with killzone gameplay, they showed tsushima on tgs gameplay so why the fuck are microsoft pussying around, if they cant do it then why not just quit and call it a day, the industry is called gaming and we play games not watch movies and cutscenes!

Okay, now you are getting crazy. There's no way we can say the Hellblade 2 video wasn't impressive if it's all real-time. Lets control ourselves here.

 

[Shangounchained]

Okay, now you are getting crazy. There's no way we can say the Hellblade 2 video wasn't impressive if it's all real-time. Lets control ourselves here.

Im not denying the tech looks impressive but looking at it again yes theres alot of poly count on the scenes yes the girls face and poly counts are up the roof and yes its realtime but wait a minute its one character on the scene thats not heavy to do, and the volumetrics on that smoke on the mountain, they did that on ryse aswell this gen + where is the gameplay?

Im simply saying micrisoft havent comvinced me yet, its just hard to tell im between a rock and a hard place!

 

[CameFromNearFuture]

A wall of usless text lmao

 

[Dacon]

We havent even seen gameplay of a single Xbox X game, and we're already talking about stuff like this?

How about we wait to see an actual game running with some actual confirmed specifications before we start all the crazy speculation?

 

[Shangounchained]

Okay, now you are getting crazy. There's no way we can say the Hellblade 2 video wasn't impressive if it's all real-time. Lets control ourselves here.

We havent even seen gameplay of a single Xbox X game, and we're already talking about stuff like this?

How about we wait to see an actual game running with some actual confirmed specifications before we start all the crazy speculation?

they are too scared to show!

 

[Team Andromeda]

We havent even seen gameplay of a single Xbox X game, and we're already talking about stuff like this?

How about we wait to see an actual game running with some actual confirmed specifications before we start all the crazy speculation?

That always happens with any console. I'm sure come May or June, we'll see some games running with the in-engine and even then, one can't always trust it
. Like with how SONY sped up The Last Guardian on the PS3 LOL