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If you were Phil Spencer, or Jim Ryan, would do acquire Platinum Games?
Nautilus
Banned
Only to those that have some eye problem.
PaintTinJr
Member
I don't believe it has because you only need ask yourself if they were targeting the Ps4/X1 with Naughty Dog game dev and marketing budgets, team size and development times for those games, would they have produced very similar results and sales? or different? Obviously, the results would be different.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
You seriously think it looks as good graphically as the best looking PS3 games? It just doesn't.
Nautilus
Banned
The first Bayonetta was that, and how did it turn out?
Indies with zero budget manages to sell dozens of million(Stardew Valley), while AAA games like Bayo 1 and 2 did what it did. Bayonetta need a fresh perspective and better marketing, not a bloated budget
Nautilus
Banned
It looks as good as most PS4/XOne games. If you think this is anywhere PS3 levels, you're mad.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Yes, I would. They are still a very talented studio and can make good playing games that most other developers cannot create. They just probably need some guidance and direction. Give them a larger budget and I bet they can develop some impressive games. Say where you want about them, but I doubt most modern developers can make a game like Bayonetta or Neir these days. Personally, I would acquire them over those live service companies.
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Rhazer Fusion
Member
Souls has great combat, but I wouldn’t say it’s better than Bayonetta.
Robbinhood
Banned
Not even for free.
Buggy Loop
Member
I would look at what’s left of the team behind Nier automata, Astral Chain and Bayonetta 3 and see what’s that worth. Surely something salvageable.
Platinum will make crap if that’s what you assign and pay them to do. Cut them some slack for Babylon fall.
Platinum will make crap if that’s what you assign and pay them to do. Cut them some slack for Babylon fall.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Haha, no, I'm sorry. Either you're the mad one here or you haven't played many PS4 games.
BabyfaceRe
Member
Yes and it would likely benefit them a lot! Their biggest problem is they lack guidance and business savvy. Talent and creativity is something they have plenty of, but they are a bit out of touch with the industry as seen with Babylon which was clearly DoA from the first trailer. Besides that game and the run with licensed titles for Activision, they've have been making world class games.
People claiming they are washed clearly havnt played Nier Automata and havnt seen Bayonetta 3. Platinum is a studio that would do amazing with some marketing guidance and a modern engine. One of the rare causes where you WOULDN'T want to give them complete creative freedom lol
People claiming they are washed clearly havnt played Nier Automata and havnt seen Bayonetta 3. Platinum is a studio that would do amazing with some marketing guidance and a modern engine. One of the rare causes where you WOULDN'T want to give them complete creative freedom lol
Nautilus
Banned
It seems you're the one who never did. PS3 man? You guys can come up with better insults. I don't get this unfounded hate on Bayo 2 and 3 when Nintendo is the one who saved the franchise and gave it enough budget so that it looks and plays incredible.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Who's hating on it? I'm just saying it, like all Switch games, visually looks two generations behind what we're getting on PS5/XSX. I think most people agree on that.
Nautilus
Banned
They don't lol. Most people agree with me.
deriks
4-Time GIF/Meme God
RoadHazard
Gold Member
That the Switch is on the level of the PS4 in visuals? It factually isn't, it has a fraction of the GPU power. And it's obvious.
But we'll just have to agree to disagree!
(I love the Switch BTW, I just want a new one that isn't so far behind the other current consoles.)
Ghost of Caelid
Banned
It’s more thoughtful and intentional imo. Most Platinum games can be won via button mashing unless you up the difficulty a ton.
Nautilus
Banned
Yeah? The PS4 is obviously more powerful in terms of raw power, but some PS4 games have been ported over to the Switch(that people though that were previously impossible) and while they obviously have lower resolution and cut some corners here and thrre, they look really good and not that far from PS4 and XOne games counterparts.
But visuals isn't just raw visuals. Art style plays a large role in it. If you go asking around, I think that a lot of people, far more than you think, would say that BOTW, Mario Odyssey and even XC 3 looks better than most games that push solely for realism.
So yeah, a lot of Switch games looks better than PS4 games, including Bayonetta 3.
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RoadHazard
Gold Member
The PS4 games that have been ported to the Switch (Doom, TW3, etc) look lightyears worse. It's impressive that those developers managed to get them to run on it at all, but they are absolutely crippled and by far the worst way to play those games. They are not "not that far from the PS4 version", the difference is absolutely humongous.
I'm not talking about art style, only technical prowess. But I do think that the Switch's dated hardware does hurt the great art styles of many of its games, and they would look better on better hardware. I loved BOTW on the Switch, but it obviously looks much, much better at 4K on a PC. Odyssey also suffers from its low resolution, as do most Switch games (often made even worse by a lack of AA).
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PaintTinJr
Member
It was hardly triple AAA. It didn't even have the budget for PG to do the PS3 version, meaning it didn't use any of the specific hardware of the console, and then just used an engine that looked as cross-gen(Xbox1 to 360) as Kameo. In fact, the facetted corridor geometry backdrops looked as unloved and unmemorable as those in Kameo. Hardly the AAA standard of say an Arkham game, etc. Even compared to an indie game like Journey on PS3 - which was finished with the help of AAA GoW dev Santa Monica - it looks AA, every day of the week, with dialled in staple graphics techniques used for 4-5years prior, and modelling that is mainly spent on the characters, with almost a disconnect between environment art and character art.
They would output so much more with the resources of a Sony first party dev. Compare to the octo camouflage and environments in MGS4 and it is definitely AA level output, it probably isn't on par with Devil May Cry 4, and that is a bit cross-gen(ps2-ps3) IMO.
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Nautilus
Banned
I beg to differ. While I do agree that there are better places to play those games, they are the same game, and as every critic who reviewed those games, most of them agree that the experience is pretty much the same, just with lower resolution/framerate. For a system that "barely does better than PS3 graphically", its games look suspiciosly close to PS4/XOne games if that were the case.
And I was talking about art style, because whenever you talk about graphics(which is different than talking about raw power) artstyle is as, if not more, important than how much polygons a carachter has. And the Switch, in that sense, has some of the best looking games out there.
And sure, if the Switch were to be more powerful, the games would look better. But in that sense, you could also say that the PS5 and Series are also holding games back, because there are PCs out there that are more powerful, and Sony and MS games are being held back by the consoles. Should we start discussing about a third party buying Sony and Xbox, so that those IPs are developed exclusively to PC, so that they aren't held back by the PS5 and Series?
Nautilus
Banned
Are we now rewriting history? Bayo and Vanquish weren't now AAA efforts by Sega and Platinum, just because they weren't successful? lol
Bayo had a great 360 version, and that was the second most popular console of the gen(behind the Wii), so that's not an excuse.
Just because a game doesn't have a budget of GTA V, doesn't mean it isn't AAA. And ypu guys work in a false assumption: Even if Capcom or MS bought Platinum, they wouldn't give them all the money in the world to make a game, because they would asses the viability of the project and budget it properly. Ad any company would.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Yes, but the PS5 and XSX have enough power to make games look good on a modern TV. The Switch does not.
Nautilus
Banned
The Switch always had enough power to make them look good.
People can barely notice the difference between PS4 and PS5 games, myself included, and some PS4 games look better than PS5 ganes(granted, its only a few of them). That's just an example of how power is becoming more and more irrelevant to the game's quality, and thus the areas which the budget are alocatted.
With the Switch not being that far off of a PS4 real world performance, they also look good. They could look better, and I am looking forward to the Switch 2 whenever it launches, but they do look good.
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RoadHazard
Gold Member
That's because there are barely any proper PS5 games yet. So you just get a higher resolution and framerate over the PS4 version (which is still very noticeable though, especially 60 vs 30 fps, but also the resolution difference). There are some exceptions though, games that are actually "next gen", but too few so far.
Meanwhile, whenever the Switch tries to run a PS4-level game it has to do so at well below 720p, at 30fps (usually with severe drops), and with dramatically reduced visual settings. Which makes sense because its GPU is only about 1/5 as powerful (docked) as the base PS4. It's much closer to the PS3 in raw GPU power (but has more modern features (and more memory), which makes it possible to run things on it that the PS3 couldn't).
So:
This is still not true, doesn't matter how many times you repeat it.
The Switch 2 will hopefully reach something like base PS4 graphics power, but it might end up closer to the base XB1.
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Nautilus
Banned
Its been basically two years already. Sure there may be a Naughty Dog 9th gen focused game later down the line, but by this time, in the 6th, 7th and even 8th gen, we would already see what the newfound power would bring to the table. But now? Barely none, outside of games like Ratchet and Clank(and that game is next gen because of the awesome speed of the SSD, not the GPU). Its not because there isn't proper PS5 ganes as of yet, its because power nowadays barely matter. Its the reason why the real world performance of the Switch is far closer to the PS4 than you might think looking at its specs.
About the Switch 2: If the leaks are in anyway credible, raw specs would put it around Steamdeck performance(if not above), but the inclusion of DDLS and ray tracing dedicated chips might indicate its real world performance will be much closer to the Series S than one might think. But this is all just a rumor for now.
ResilientBanana
Member
No, their games are rehashed garbage.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
R&C definitely does stuff visually you wouldn't see on PS4. But it isn't showing the full potential of the console of course. Spider-Man 2 will be a lot more impressive I'm sure.
Well, the Steam Deck runs games at around base PS4 level in general, sometimes a bit better, BUT at a lower resolution (typically 720p, whereas almost all PS4 games are 1080p). I expect the Switch 2 to run all games at 1080p docked at minimum, I don't want to see 720p on my 4K TV ever again. DLSS should hopefully let it punch above its weight, but it will still be a mobile device, so I highly doubt it will get anywhere near the Series S.
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Nautilus
Banned
Steam Deck doesn't need to run at a higher resolution because of the screen and the pixel density and whatnot. At least that's what the more tech savvy people say.
But like I said, we will see. I personally expect the Switch 2 release in 2024 at the earliest, so there is still time.
As for Platinum, until Project GG launches, and if it fails, I don't think they will entertain any negotiations about being bought. But if project GG fails, then its another story. We'll see.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Exactly, the Deck has a 720p screen. The Switch 2 probably will too, but I hope the docked experience will be better than it is with the current Switch, which means it will need to be capable of higher resolutions than that.
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PaintTinJr
Member
No rewriting, they never were and this is the first time I've ever encounter someone that would fight the case that they aren't AA games by a AA dev.
It wasn't, because of the failure rate, but that's neither here nor there to the point about the game's production and marketing being well below expected AAA levels of the time.
No, but if as a dev you'd never have anything to present at a siggraph over a decade, or don't have a large dev team(400) with a marketing budget per game equal or greater than the dev costs, then you probably aren't a AAA dev. I bet PG themselves would say they are a AA dev currently.
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Rhazer Fusion
Member
Most of their combat isn’t too difficult to learn, but imo the majority of their games play great and have a smooth flow to them. That’s why I think they are still valuable to the industry because they can do something I feel most modern developers just cannot match. It seems like the combat is usually slower paced, less responsive or even janky in other games. For example, look at all the clunky playing Soulsborne clones out there.
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Ghost of Caelid
Banned
I prefer the slower combat and intentional movement souls offer to fast pace sporadic combat. Even a quicker game like sekiro is mroe intentional. Platinum games are like melee bullet hell if thast makes sense. So you die due to bas misfortune more than your own mistake. I'm not saying its bad but the market spoke on combat with all the souls clones we have now.