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[lukeskymac]

It's not quite as heavy handed as he makes it out to be

Not quite? None of those posts are even remotely like the poster described.

but there was a loooot of hand-waving and explanation how minorities would be out of place

Expecting internal consistency = hand-waving. Riiight.

I'm not gonna waste my time 1) shitting up this Bloodborne thread 2) retreading a topic that was handily dealt with in the thread i just linked to you.

Well, clearly you don't mind wasting your time making suggestions devoid of sense such as:

You can either read that thread, or just do a simple google search of black londoners. Warning: results may shock you.

 

[Sami+]

Looks like Otacon to me.

It's just like one of my Japanese animes!

 

[hotnheavyload]

Anyone else looking forward to Fashionborne? Long coats are so in this season.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

Not quite? None of those posts are even remotely like the poster described.



Expecting internal consistency = hand-waving. Riiight.



Well, clearly you don't mind wasting your time making suggestions devoid of sense such as:

What the hell are you talking about? You asked for a link, I provided it. And now you're just insulting me based on an argument I never made? Fact: Black Londoners existed, and were stratified among all social circles at the time. Seeing one is not "internally inconsistent". What are you even arguing, and what do you think I'm arguing?

Try not to use ad hominen this time.

 

[I'm Awesome]

Harry Poter the boy who live come to die

 

[tcrunch]

Anyone else looking forward to Fashionborne? Long coats are so in this season.

I use my caboose to distract the beasts.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

What the hell are you talking about? You asked for a link, I provided it. And now you're just insulting me based on an argument I never made? Fact: Black Londoners existed, and were stratified among all social circles at the time. Seeing one is not "internally inconsistent". What are you even arguing, and what do you think I'm arguing?

Try not to use ad hominen this time.

Black Londoners existed in tiny numbers. We're talking a few tens of thousands of people in a city of over four million. One percent of the population at most.

 

[WGMBY]

Anyone else looking forward to Fashionborne? Long coats are so in this season.

There better be some dapper as fuck outfits to go with my specs and trick cane. I want to look fancy while slaying beasts.

 

[aly]

I use my caboose to distract the beasts.

Gonna be so mad if these outfits aren't an option. Also need an umbrella sword.

 

[Tow]

Looks amazing. Starting to get hyped for this, not long now!

 

[SDCowboy]

Those spectacles. I will likely rock those.

 

[AwakenedCloud]

I want to choose Cruel Fate out of principle, but who knows what that even entails in a Miyazaki joint.

 

[Steel]

I use my caboose to distract the beasts.

I can imagine getting a kick out of crossdressers wearing something like this if it is an armor option.

 

[RK9039]

Black Londoners existed in tiny numbers. We're talking a few tens of thousands of people in a city of over four million. One percent of the population at most.

Actually by the 1750s the number was in between one and three percent, and that was in London alone.

 

[Red Liquorice]

I can imagine getting a kick out of crossdressers wearing something like this if it is an armor option.

Dusk's wedding dress was the only option for STR build male characters in DS1

 

[Stone Ocean]

I use my caboose to distract the beasts.

Fuck, I totally forgot the possibility of victorian dresses for armor.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

Black Londoners existed in tiny numbers. We're talking a few tens of thousands of people in a city of over four million. One percent of the population at most.

And when did I state that they were a booming in numbers? (I'm not sure about your numbers because they were on a rise in the 19th century, but that's a discussion for an off-topic thread). My point, and that thread's point, was that they existed in most social classes, and seeing them was not inconsistent from a historical standpoint.

 

[Dr. Kaos]

doesn't work bro

Fixed, Sorry.

 

[Finalow]

you know that classes will be useless, as usual, rite guyz? I'll throw a dice to choose one.

OH, the editor seems slightly better than the one in the souls game. just slightly though. I'm pretty sure that I can still make my personal deformed monstrosity.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

Actually by the 1750s the number was in between one and three percent, and that was in London alone.

We're talking about the 1880s, not the 1750s. England abolished the slave trade in 1807, effectively halting growth of the black population - this while immigration to London from Europe and the rest of Britain was exploding.

And when did I state that they were a booming in numbers? (I'm not sure about your numbers because they were on a rise in the 19th century, but that's a discussion for an off-topic thread). My point, and that thread's point, was that they existed in most social classes, and seeing them was not inconsistent from a historical standpoint.

"There were black people in London in 1886" isn't a point. There were indeed black people in London: so few of them that your average Londoner could probably go weeks or months at a time without ever seeing a black person. Immigrant communities from the colonies were insignificant in 1886; the vast majority of immigrants came from Europe: Jews, Germans, Italians, etc. The obsession with wanting The Order to reflect modern American racial demographics is utterly shortsighted.

 

[lukeskymac]

What the hell are you talking about? You asked for a link, I provided it.

I asked the other poster for links to people acting like said poster described, which is not what you find in the link you posted.

And now you're just insulting me based on an argument I never made? Fact: Black Londoners existed, and were stratified among all social circles at the time. Seeing one is not "internally inconsistent". What are you even arguing, and what do you think I'm arguing?

Did you read through that thread? People complaing about the lack of minorities weren't just asking for a realistic representation. (which would probably be like one rebel for the entire game, if that). We had some posters complaining about the all-white main cast. In a Victorian London game. Where the protagonists are semi-immortal beings belonging to a medieval order. What are odds of that, right?

Try not to use ad hominen this time.

Protip: people not being polite to you != ad hominem

 

[Mandelbo]

Ah, the new hair tech isn't just exclusive to the beasts!

 

[brightsons]

Nice!

 

[hotnheavyload]

I use my caboose to distract the beasts.

I demand hats

We shall destroy the creatures of the night with ENVY.

 

[RK9039]

We're talking about the 1880s, not the 1750s. England abolished the slave trade in 1807, effectively halting growth of the black population - this while immigration to London from Europe and the rest of Britain was exploding.

Oh that's true, just read about that now.

 

[Mermandala]

There better be some dapper as fuck outfits to go with my specs and trick cane. I want to look fancy while slaying beasts.

I haven't got a chance to watch the video yet and I'm getting close to initiating a media blackout on any more Bloodborne material but I agree that Dapper is the word du jour. With all of those wonderfully intricate armor sets gone the time of the Blood-Soaked Dandy draws nigh. Nightly, I will rummage through my armoire and set out to dispense of the wretched (and poorly dressed) beasts with extreme savoir faire.

 

[JudgmentJay]

you know that classes will be useless, as usual, rite guyz? I'll throw a dice to choose one.

They're not useless for role-playing, which is why Miyazki includes them.

 

[Markitron]

This is my first proper go at a Soul's game, if I like it I'll get Dark Souls's 2. Hopefully it won't be a step down.

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

This is my first proper go at a Soul's game, if I like it I'll get Dark Souls's 2. Hopefully it won't be a step down.

If this turns out to be everything it hopes to be, every western RPG after this would be a step down.

 

[RK9039]

This is my first proper go at a Soul's game, if I like it I'll get Dark Souls's 2. Hopefully it won't be a step down.

You should get all of them if you like Bloodborne.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

I asked the other poster for links to people acting like said poster described, which is not what you find in the link you posted.



Did you read through that thread? People complaing about the lack of minorities weren't just asking for a realistic representation. (which would probably be like one rebel for the entire game, if that). We had some posters complaining about the all-white main cast. In a Victorian London game. Where the protagonists are semi-immortal beings belonging to a medieval order. What are odds of that, right?



Protip: people not being polite to you != ad hominem

And did you see my posts in that thread? Did you see me hollering for tons of black people in the Order? No, because that's not what I care about, nor was it my opinion. I linked you with what he was referring to. It's as simple as that. You took it upon yourself to assume that I agreed with the dissenting opinions, demanding for extreme representation of minorities.

And yes, the last line of your previous comment is an ad hominem. I'm done with this derail nonsense.

 

[Aikidoka]

We had some posters complaining about the all-white main cast. In a Victorian London game. Where the protagonists are semi-immortal beings belonging to a medieval order. What are odds of that, right?

I don't get your point. The developers could have easily made one of the protagonists black - they would just need to write him or her a back story that makes sense with the time. There is nothing preventing them from doing it and is an active choice on their part.

edit: It's not like the devs just chose from people randomly from the population of london and they all just happened to turn out white.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

I don't get your point. The developers could have easily made one of the protagonists black - they would just need to write him or her a back story that makes sense with the time. There is nothing preventing them from doing it and is an active choice on their part.

1. How exactly would they "write him or her a black story that makes sense with the time?" Welcome to this ancient order of immortal Arthurian knights, son of immigrants!

2. If they're expected to include a black protagonist shouldn't they be expected to include a Chinese protagonist, an Indian protagonist, a Middle Eastern protagonist, a Jewish protagonist, a Latin American protagonist, a German protagonist, etc? If not, why not? If so, don't you see how that could have the effect of attenuating The Order's setting as a game set in Victorian London?

 

[Angelus Errare]

They could write them in the same way they wrote that unrealistic as fuck for the time period female lead. And they're not the actual knights of the round table. They take on their names, when one dies the next person takes their place and the name. If Galahad dies midgame and a new protagonist is introduced, he is now Galahad. Personally I'd be totally fine with an Asian lead. Would be pretty awesome to have one in this fictious London.

Anyways, we're getting off topic. This is about Bloodborne, a game set in a fictious Victorian era filled with werewolves and other nasty creatures.

No one did that. Paste the post.

okay.

I don't think I've trained my mind in such a way. I think that werewolves existing would have far far less of an impact on British society of the late 19th century than racial equality would have.

>.>

 

[tcrunch]

Some guy's ironic joke post got a bunch of people shitting up the thread with a different game's discussion.

Good job, jokester.

 

[Veritigo_X]

This is my first proper go at a Soul's game, if I like it I'll get Dark Souls's 2. Hopefully it won't be a step down.

You should go for Dark Souls 1 or Demon's Souls over Dark Souls 2. DS2 will almost certainly be a step down from Bloodborne (or at least I really hope it is).

 

[cerulily]

I use my caboose to distract the beasts.

Speedrun % officially renamed hustle your bustle %

 

[Neoweee]

They're not useless for role-playing, which is why Miyazki includes them.

Dark Souls 2 didn't have the same giant disparities that DkS1 did, and Bloodborne looks like it is using some of the dark souls 2 improvements (like fast travel and more accessible blacksmithing).

 

[Blakynt]

the video went private too slow

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

okay.



>.>

A reasonable sentiment. For London to have werewolves all you need to do is posit that there is magic in the world and werewolves exist - that's not realistic, but it is internally consistent. For London in 1886 to have a totally different set of demographics you'd need to posit a totally different world history, where for some reason (why? is it an economic reason? a geopolitical reason?) non-European immigration to England was significantly higher than in the real world. One of these things is fantasy, the other is historical fiction: to write fantasy you need to be a storyteller, to write historical fiction you also need to be a historian.

 

[tcrunch]

the video went private too slow

Right here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXK2_CFGK7w

 

[Creaking]

Does anyone have the video? It's gone under.


edit: never mind.

 

[Night Angel]

LOL, did people seriously say they don't want to play as minorities in Victorian London?

Bloodborne is a fictional universe, I want to create a brown character, what would they gain from limiting customization options? They can make a white character if they want & it won't affect their enjoyment of the game at all.

No, that poster is misrepresenting and skewing discussion from another thread, further proving they are not mentally capable of legitimate discussion about such topics.

Let me rephrase since of course that is going to be interpreted in the worst way: they are not mature enough to discuss the actual points raised by others and instead attack positions of their own creation.

 

[Veritigo_X]

Dark Souls 2 didn't have the same giant disparities that DkS1 did, and Bloodborne looks like it is using some of the dark souls 2 improvements (like fast travel and more accessible blacksmithing).

If anything they're using ideas that were already present in Demon's Souls with the Nexus.

 

[JudgmentJay]

Dark Souls 2 didn't have the same giant disparities that DkS1 did, and Bloodborne looks like it is using some of the dark souls 2 improvements (like fast travel and more accessible blacksmithing).

Huh? I'm not talking about stats, I'm talking about the actual definition of a role-playing game. Miyazaki has said that role playing a character and creating your own backstory and the such is why he likes having the different classes and starting gifts.

Side note, fast travel from the beginning being an "improvement" is very subjective.

 

[PigzFly]

Working Youtube link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXK2_CFGK7w

Shame they didn't go through everything, but it's a good tease.

One of the character origins that was on screen for a split second:

 

[BabyFaceKillah]

No, that poster is misrepresenting and skewing discussion from another thread, further proving they are not mentally capable of legitimate discussion about such topics.

wtf

 

[Angelus Errare]

A reasonable sentiment. For London to have werewolves all you need to do is posit that there is magic in the world and werewolves exist - that's not realistic, but it is internally consistent. For London in 1886 to have a totally different set of demographics you'd need to posit a totally different world history, where for some reason (why? is it an economic reason? a geopolitical reason?) non-European immigration to England was significantly higher than in the real world. One of these things is fantasy, the other is historical fiction: to write fantasy you need to be a storyteller, to write historical fiction you also need to be a historian.

You mean a different world history like the one being presented in The Order?

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

Working Youtube link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXK2_CFGK7w

Shame they didn't go through everything, but it's a good tease.

One of the character origins that was on screen for a split second:

Ahhh, interesting. The guy in the wheelchair diagnoses the protagonist with "pale blood." Related to the bloodtinge stat, surely - the darkness or paleness of blood having some relation to the disease.

You mean like a different world history being presented in The Order?

No, a world history that could explain large-scale population transfers from Africa to England in the 19th century. The only population transfer of that magnitude until the 20th century was the colonization of the New World, including the slave trade. Clearly England doesn't have the climate for a slave-based agricultural economy and it doesn't have a surplus of depopulated wilderness for immigrants to settle on, so where are all these people coming from, and why?

 

[Lifejumper]

I wonder if there will be a cgi intro? It was a good mood setter for the previous games.