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Is Support For VITA already dying? [Use the new thread]
- Thread starter Fezan
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Alright, it's actually almost four months (Feb 26th launch of 3DS -> June 16th launch of Zelda).
Just food for thought, not an answer to a question.
People bought the Vita FOR Uncharted. Uncharted was even No 1 at the UK chart the week it launched. It was the go-to game for Vita. In fact the reason why Vita managed to pull similar numbers to 3DS in the last month in NDP, despite being 100 dollars more expensive, could be attributed to people buying the system for Uncharted.
Also both zelda and Starfox didn't really help 3DS's sales either that much. It was the price cut that got things going.
That may be true but it took a port of Zelda game 6 months to come about. Uncharted was there day 1.
I assumed he meant launch as in "launch period" since that's what we were talking about.
You're right actually. The original games arrived at least one year later. Most of them in 2000.
You quoted and responded to someone else, by the way.
Wait what? No, it managed to sell 200K in last month's NPD because the system JUST came out.
In the west you still got God of War (in Japan... no, not gonna do shit, if past performance is any indication). Don't know about Gran Turismo anymore, I'd be damn surprised if a portable entry has any pulling power after how badly they treated the PSP version.
I'm guessing your main point was that we're not talking about simultaneous releases here, and I agree. Uncharted on a new console w/ no userbase yet isn't going to put up a fight against two marios on a system that already had a 4million head start.
This wouldn't work if they didn't maintain consistent quality.
axisofweevils
Holy crap! Today's real megaton is that more than two people can have the same first name.
A lot of people are saying that CoD will be the thing to turn the system round, but I don't see that either to be honest - especially if the game is just a PS3 port....
AceBandage
Banned
Sorry if me posting relavent facts with no spin is upsetting you.
If you want my thoughts it's simple.
Sony has completely screwed the pooch. They learned nothing from the PSP in terms of how to support a system, and I doubt they ever will.
I questioned, long before its announcement, why Sony would even bother releasing a new handheld, and I question the decision even more now.
I think they've gone backwards in a lot of ways far past the mistakes of the PSP.
A lot Vita's sales in NDP regions by people that'd be hyped for the system would come in February. The thing was out for 2 weeks (including the FEB) so in march sales would have stabilised.
Oh man, thank you for this juicy nugget! GAF never fails to entertain.
The Hermit
Member
I find really ironic the name Vita looking at things right now...
Seriously though, even the 3DS had a rough start and it had no competition. Give it time.
Seriously though, even the 3DS had a rough start and it had no competition. Give it time.
Sure. Uncharted was the stand out launch game, no question, even if it was a new Wipeout that personally got me to stump up my cash Day One. But what has happened to those sales since? Uncharted is one of Sony's biggest franchises and yet it's not really driving the Vita. Uncharted was the go-to game for launch buyers, but I don't think people are rushing out to buy the system to play Uncharted. I'd be interested to see what its current sales total is.
Zelda and Starfox were strong releases at a time when the 3DS was on its arse in terms of releases and sales performance, but they served the existing community more than they drove sales. Nintendo turning around was due to the triple whammy of a price cut, new Mario and new Mario Kart. That was the turning point. But I don't know what Sony could do to emulate that. A price cut by itself wouldn't be enough, in my opinion. Ordinarily I'd say a portable Uncharted would be one of the games to help them achieve what Nintendo did, but I don't think Uncharted's current performance backs that up, leaving the question of what's left for Sony to use.
Good point regarding Gran Turismo. Along with Uncharted that would be the game I'd say Sony could fall back on, but even then I still think you're talking about performance a long way away from the games that dragged Nintendo out of its hole with the 3DS. And, as you say, after GT PSP, there's no guarantee GT Vita would shift Vita consoles.
Sony have plenty of games that will sell well to Vita owners but I see very little that they can use to spark a 3DS-esque turnaround. Uncharted is one of the two or three games you would say would be capable of that, but we already have Uncharted (and it's a particularly good game, in my opinion), yet consumers just aren't responding to it beyond the launch sales.
AceBandage
Banned
Difference being the 3DS had Nintendo. The Vital has Sony.
One has a long history of fully supporting handhelds. The other has a short history of shoving them.
Vita would "die for" the rough start the 3DS had.
No, you can't just arbitrarily count the FEB bundle period in this context. That doesn't make sense.
But the Vita DOES have competition now. Very strong competition in fact.
iceatcs
Junior Member
No need to be sorry :/ lol You just shown yourself too much.
But that's not good enough. Please explain why you though of that.
I think Sony was on good position until Nintendo went crazy mode by massive price cut and releasing all their games in short term made Vita difficult to stand out. Nintendo do a good job, we should see if it will continue longer term.
Smartphone/cheap app popular might be the other reason too.
There is a big appeal to smoking n00bs while taking a dump.
Honestly, what other possible market does the Vita have? 3DS and iOS literally have every other market locked up. Sony needs to get full blown CoD on Vita, or they might as well pull the plug now.
I said it at launch and I'll say it again. Sony, get me a Vita, memory card, and CoD for $199 and I'm in. As it stands now, the market for it is so niche I don't see the appeal even from the standpoint of people who play a LOT of games (i.e. GAF).
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Yup. It had mascot game, multiplatform racing game, multiplatform boxing game, Football game, sequel to zombie shooting game, and fighting games.
Oh wait, you're comparing the Dreamcast's entire library to a new system?
gotta agree with you there
and also the commercials...(at least step up from squirrels)
.Hahaha, if "launch period" lasts 6 months, then Vita has still has 4 months to go.
AceBandage
Banned
OK. Let's say the Vita existed by itself right now.
You still have three things fighting against it.
1. Sony's treatment of the system. Putting lower teams on their franchises and not having any real Japanese titles ready for it in the launch window.
2. Poor marketing. Better than PSP certainly, but still not good at telling people why they should buy it.
3. A rash of bad decisions. Launching after the holidays in the west. Mandatory memory cards that Jack up the price. Not securing any real big third party exclusives.
And the kicker? These are the same problems that the PSP faced. It's just frustrating to watch it happen two generations in a row.
I'd argue that Sony has a pretty damn good track record when it comes to supporting their systems. The PSP wasn't a huge success in the West but it still received solid support and continues to see new game releases.
They've never dropped a platform early even when it isn't lighting up the sales charts.
Of course, when the Virtual Boy tanked Nintendo dropped it immediately so there IS a precedent there (not that the VB situation has anything to do with modern Nintendo). ;P
That sounds fair to me (and it won't help the Vita's case) but why are people estimating OOT3D came out 6 months after launch? It was 3.5 months in Japan and 2.5 months everywhere else.
iceatcs
Junior Member
That's slight better from you. Well done, Keep it up next time.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
This right here. With 3DS there was never a question of whether the system was going to be successful, because even if people weren't buying it at launch, they damn sure would be once the Mario calvary arrived.
With Vita there's no calvary coming to save the day. There's no Pokemon or Mario that's going to propel sales, and keep them going strong.
3.5 + 2.5 = 6
Gotta say, this is one of the things that assures me I'll still be buying Vita games in 5 years. Sony does not drop a system quickly.
Jazzy Network
Member
Once the PS Vita can play PS1 games then I will get one.
But they supported it with console experiences on handhelds that are objectively worse then handheld experiences.
I wish I made up that argument
They should have made Vita a souped up PSP so that the developers could make games on a similar budget in mind like on the PSP and 3DS. They should have also released it at the same time as the 3DS or before it but no. Now they are paying the consequence of releasing a portable that costs more to develop on and came out almost a year after the 3DS
Read my previous post.
Cornbread78
Member
I bought mine and love teh $jit outta it. I'll researve judgement on long term support until E3 this year, when they should be announcing the releases of all those "rumored" games on VITA. I'm relying on announcements of GoW VITA, Gran Tourismo VITA, we already know LBP is coming, but more info on FFX remake and an inevitible Kingdom Hearts VITA will all be welcomed announcements.
If they can pull off some of these titles, along with in on the Call of Duty VITA, I think that will put them in a good place software wise for awhile. They just need to get them out the door....
If they can pull off some of these titles, along with in on the Call of Duty VITA, I think that will put them in a good place software wise for awhile. They just need to get them out the door....
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
I agree with you on every point except for when it comes to securing real big third party exclusives being a problem shared with PSP. With the PSP Sony secured exclusive GTA, Final Fantasy, and MGS titles. Arguably three of the biggest franchises at the time, and suprisingly it mattered little.
You have to make a noticeable leap in some shape or form though. The DS had its limitations, and therefore 3DS could come out and still make a splash with something that's better than the PSP but not by a huge margin. Not to mention, the 3D added far more than naysayers are likely to admit to (and likely still won't, since they haven't seen it properly in action). There was just too much in the way for Sony to do the same -- issues with keeping an optical disc in a portable, differentiating with something other than performance (note they tried this with the PSP Go and failed), pricing new hardware at a reasonable level after walking the plank on 'high performance.'
I'm sure they wanted to release at the same time (or before it) if they could, but I doubt they could have at a competitive price. Even now we can see it's a stretch, as the memory cards are obvious cost cutting measures vs embedded storage.
And if it had no compelling games at all it would still have sold 200K?
Uncharted has helped Sony move most of the units they have sold in a highly competitive handheld market. It isn't enough, but it is the start and it is a system seller. In a year or two when the library is more fleshed out you'll still see people buying a Vita with Uncharted. Hell, you'll probably see Sony bundle Uncharted with the Vita at some point in the next couple of years.
The big problem with the Vita is MSRP (too high, especially when you need a memory card) and current library depth. Not quality, depth. The games on it are pretty damn good at this point, and some very compelling content is on the way, just not enough of it.
You buy a Nintendo handheld and you know that Nintendo will have ample first party content on it throughout it's life. Most likely spaced out pretty well to prevent any mega droughts.
If Sony already had announcements for God of War, Gran Turismo, etc. out for the Vita with at least some media shown and real time lines that paint a long term picture the general perception wouldn't be nearly as glum.
Imagine if the system unveiling was paired with a chart that looked something like this.
Launch Games:
Uncharted
Wipeout
Motorstorm
MLB 2012: The Show
First six months:
Little Big Planet
Resistance
Gravity Rush
Journey
Second six months:
Killzone
New title from Sucker Punch/Ready at Dawn/etc.
Early in second year:
Gran Turismo
Holidays year 2:
God of War
Couple that with actually having some real concrete info on 3rd party titles (like Assassin's Creed, Bioshock, CoD, etc.) and the system wouldn't have nearly as negative a perception. Of those games I listed only four (Journey, a PSN to PSV port, a new game from SP or Ready at Dawn neither of whom have an announced title right now, GT, and GoW) have yet to be announced. It is a very realistic road map for Sony to have assembled.
The problem isn't the games, the problem is Sony's inability to market the game well. They've failed at gaining it exposure with a legitimate launch/post-launch advertising campaign and they've failed to turn the hardcore gaming community into advocates by not giving a real, tangible road map on what is to come.
Maybe that kind of road map can't exist because the games don't exist. But given Sony's willingness to stick with struggling hardware before I doubt that is the case. The problem is their failure to show it, promote it, and build excitement for it.
Same as their problem with the Suite SDK. If they had a clue the key indie devs who could make it a real success would already have olive branches extended to them with the intent of building a robust apps and lower cost indie games lineup to fill in the weak spots in their own calendar.
I don't know about that - it still managed to move around 40 million units outside of Japan, so perhaps it helped?
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
The fucking problem is it should be out by now, not until the Middle of Fucking June
I want the title, but it's far away still, you got still got rest of April, all of May, and then half of June to get the title
Do people want to just put down their VITA's and twiddle their thumbs till June 12th
The ones who are on the fence will eventually buy it, but those who already bought it, like me, need to be fed content, if not people will move on, then whatever releases most will likely not give a fuck
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
In terms of launch lineup sales, Nintendogs 2 alone will probably go on to outsell all the Vita launch games combined. Hell, Layton 5 is probably going to outsell Uncharted GA and FIFA Vita combined worldwide.
You can certainly argue the merits of Vita's launch lineup in terms of quality or diveristy, but in terms of sales? 3DS beat it hands down.
I agree, and a road map of what that content looks like should be laid out.
For example, Resistance: Burning Skies is coming out in late May. A date for a demo should already be announced and some real previews should be coming out, not cam footage from trade shows. Same with LittleBigPlanet Vita, which also comes out in June (in theory).
Sony is letting what content it has slip by unnoticed just like they did with the PSP. They need to make a legitimate effort to educate gamers on what is coming both short and long term, not just assume everyone will wait and expect the best.
Yeah, it does kind of suck, but the lineup we already have is awesome.
I had to wait just as long for a port of Zelda last year with the 3DS and there wasn't a whole lot else worth playing until that.
It's just the unfortunate reality of launching a new platform.
Blue Submarine No. 6
Member
The unit seems to be selling slowly, yes... saying it has issues with "support" is unjustified... It's been out in the West for two months; what other system ever had this much quality software available two months after launch?
Sure. It has a bunch of franchises migrating straight over from the most successful handheld of all time and will likely follow in said handheld's shoes towards a strong user base.
Why do people keep viewing this as a 3DS v. Vita deal? Of all the "we don't compete with them" arguments you can make for system v. system comparisons this one is by far the most valid. The two systems have massively different hardware features, genre types, and target demographics. Sony carved out a healthy niche for the PSP within the shadow of the most successful handheld ever and throughout its life cycle the PSP was declared "dead" repeatedly.
If you put Nintendogs on the Vita and gave it nothing else from Nintendo do you think it would suddenly move millions of Vitas? If you put Layton 5 on it do you think that it would suddenly be selling like wild fire? Of course not. The entire rest of the system is targeting a different customer. Very few people buy systems (especially $250 systems) for just one game.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
I think it's disingenuous to blame Sony's marketing instead of the market they've placed their product into. They can only do so much with this product in a landscape that it's leaning toward different experiences. A "killer app" for the hardcore would not make as big a dent as some are suggesting, I don't think.
THAT is god damned depressing.
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