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Is the Halo community extremely whiny or am I missing something with infinite?

h00ters

Member
I'm firmly on the fence for this one:

Complaints about lack of playlists
Yes, to an extent. But anyone who has played Halo for long enough knows that after the initial launch player base starts to dip a little, many of these playlists become empty wastelands. Ther eis such thing as TOO many playlists. I'd say the 10 that Reach launched with was too many, and you end up just spreading players too thin.

Progression
Maybe it's just because I'm old, but progression doesn't mean anything to me. I really couldn't care less how my Spartan looks. That being said, it does suck for people who fork out for the battlepass to not be able to unlock stuff without seriously grinding. The way that you only earn XP via challenges makes no sense

Lack of maps
Yes, to an extent. Halo 2 launched with 9 maps. Their quality was certainly higher, although Infinite still has some really solid ones. You can't use Reach as an example because Bungie went down the laziest route they could and just recycled maps from SP for MP. Hence why Reach had some of the worst maps in the series.

Infinite's biggest issues right now are a lack of Forge, lack of co-op and a crappy UI. The good news is, the core gameplay is the best it has been in almost 15 years. Reach had fundamental issues that were never going to be fixed. If the rumours about just how powerful this new Forge tool is going to be are true, we are in for some pretty incredible longevity. The introduction of co-op gives me a great reason to revisit the Campaign again, which is something I never do. And fingers crossed the UI/game customisation get fixed.

Once/if these three things are sorted, you could easily contend Infinite is the greatest Halo out there. I still put 2 up as the absolute pinnacle, but this one feels damn close already.
 

Winter John

Member
I haven't played Halo since Reach. It was a game I never really got into. I tried this new one and I was surprised how much I enjoyed it. I don't give a flying fuck about cosmetics. To me it seems like the dumbest thing possible to care about. I understand why cosmetics can be important in games like Red Dead, but this, what's the fucking point if you can't see them?
What I do agree with are the complaints about not being able to choose the game modes. I like the domination and deathmatch stuff but the moment I see that dumb ball or flag game I switch it off.
As for the single player I don't know if I give enough of a fuck to download it. I watched a couple of reviews and it doesn't look like much has changed. After the Battlefield disaster that's probably a good thing. It looks like the devs decided to stick to a formula that fans actually want.
 

Enjay

Banned
So I was never a huge halo fan but with infinite it just seemed to click. Me and a few of my friends play alot and often for roughly 3 hours a day since launch....after falling in love with the game I decide to join r/halo which to my shock it is non....stop...whining. Like I've seen communities dislike a game, but to the extent I see on the halo reddit was shocking. Halo infinite seems to be a super solid game that needs some improvement but I then had to double check if I was bugging for loving it. Is the halo community this whiny or is it just a weird circumstance? I was a big in the Modern Warfare 2019 community and even they werent as whiny about cold war as halo fans seem to be about the best FPS multiplayer game out there. So if any long time halo fan can catch me up...what going on?
People disagree. Tough shit, you'll live.
 
I'm firmly on the fence for this one:

Complaints about lack of playlists
Yes, to an extent. But anyone who has played Halo for long enough knows that after the initial launch player base starts to dip a little, many of these playlists become empty wastelands. Ther eis such thing as TOO many playlists. I'd say the 10 that Reach launched with was too many, and you end up just spreading players too thin.

Progression
Maybe it's just because I'm old, but progression doesn't mean anything to me. I really couldn't care less how my Spartan looks. That being said, it does suck for people who fork out for the battlepass to not be able to unlock stuff without seriously grinding. The way that you only earn XP via challenges makes no sense

Lack of maps
Yes, to an extent. Halo 2 launched with 9 maps. Their quality was certainly higher, although Infinite still has some really solid ones. You can't use Reach as an example because Bungie went down the laziest route they could and just recycled maps from SP for MP. Hence why Reach had some of the worst maps in the series.

Infinite's biggest issues right now are a lack of Forge, lack of co-op and a crappy UI. The good news is, the core gameplay is the best it has been in almost 15 years. Reach had fundamental issues that were never going to be fixed. If the rumours about just how powerful this new Forge tool is going to be are true, we are in for some pretty incredible longevity. The introduction of co-op gives me a great reason to revisit the Campaign again, which is something I never do. And fingers crossed the UI/game customisation get fixed.

Once/if these three things are sorted, you could easily contend Infinite is the greatest Halo out there. I still put 2 up as the absolute pinnacle, but this one feels damn close already.

Solid take mate. For sure 343 had to condense playlists again with Infinite and you can see events being their ebb and flow of timing against competing games/content drops so they keep players coming back. I'm sort of happy to see infection and grifball become events instead of playlist staples.

My biggest gripe is the lack of regional server selection for players/parties. I choose my words carefully here, what a shit stain on modern Halo.

My second biggest gripe is the esports vs BTB split again. It's a reboot of the same concept they drove home with Halo 5 Arena vs Warzone. Social and ranked are a very mild split away from that esports 4v4 and radar seems to have been caught up in that (which makes sense). However it seems the maps they've built really don't cater enough for that split to be anything meaningful in terms of classic playlists like OBJ or slayer or social etc. There's a real sense of loss for maps like High Ground, Terminal, Zanzibar, Standoff, Coagulation, etc that 4v4 games really built themselves out from in terms of that classic Halo feel. My friends and I were really hoping that classic was coming back with Infinite, it ain't at launch and isn't likely to be on the radar (pardon the pun) for a year or more at least given the roadmap they have release thus far. Behemoth is great but very limited to what equates to one 4v4 map of that classic ilk.

I'm glad the esports scene has mostly gotten what they want and being received well but after feeling like Halo 5 was a massive investment in that arena/staff resources why has classic been forsaken again with Infinite? It's a monumental long term shift from 343 over multiple game releases. It doesn't add up and I find large parties we get together for Infinite are already falling apart pretty quick due to the game modes and maps chaos of BTB. The core friends who are a little "more competitive" also are falling off quick due to the esports maps and modes of ranked forced onto us (if we want a BR start); where social obviously is an AR fest. I'm curious how that fairs long term in keeping players coming back again and again.

Everyone is hanging out for the campaign, we'll see what that delivers. Missing coop and forge are massive fuck ups though, again 343 has not learnt from previous launches. Story better be good this time around but I think we're getting a great fun campaign and a lacklustre story.
 

dvdvideo

Member
I'm of the opinion that at least 50% of the halo complaints on this board come from playstation owners who don't own or play the game. That probably skews your perception of whining. The other 40% come from people who played too much halo and are just hired of it. The last 10% are legit with constructive criticism.
 
So free means good? Laughable take.

How is wanting to pay full price for a full game entitled?

How is expecting a franchise to continue its trend of content, that has been in place for 20 years entitled?

How is anyone who played any of the previous games, payed full price, promoted the game and built the community entitled, for wanting to be rewarded for thier brand loyalty? (or at the very least not get shit on).

One battle pass in Infinite is 10 bucks. Thats half the price of Halo MCC. And that's not you paying to unlock everything, thats you paying for the opportunity to unlock everything.....for that one single battle pass. You would have to do some real janky maths for that to work out as equivalent value.

The only person that though this was a big brained take doesn't know the history of the franchise. Bungo began a trend of making you pay for the same game twice when ODST came out (continued in Destiny). There was an uproar then but you just probably don't remember or are being disingenuous. I have a harder time believing you don't remember Halo 5's lack of content, or the fact that it didn't have a single BTB map at launch that wasn't community made. One could say it was a pretty scummy move diverting those resources to the heavily monetized warzone playlist, eh?

Edit: and as a daily player of the MCC I find it hilarious that you mention that when the game launched for $60 (without ODST or Reach) and was broken for years. Everything that came after (some of which was admittedly awesome) has all been a make-good. Infinite's online release was comparatively hiccup free
 
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This is the mindset that's going to help 343 skate through this. Did you forget we're still paying full price for just the campaign, when before we used to get the campaign and multiplayer?

You also seem to be forgetting how bare bones the game is in terms of modes and maps. People have a right to be unhappy with this game.

The multiplayer is free. The single player is bigger than before. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this shit out. And a lot of people have gamepass.
 

01011001

Member
The multiplayer is free. The single player is bigger than before. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this shit out. And a lot of people have gamepass.

the single player is not bigger than before, in fact some say it is shorter than Reach and 4. also way less environmental diversity apparently

gamepass is not an intelligent argument. if you had a blockbuster subscription back in the day, was basically every game save from criticism because you could play it with your blockbuster subscription? wtf is that argument?

also the multiplayer being free is not a positive thing. all the stuff that now costs extra in multiplayer was included in that 60€ pricetag with the campaign in every prior Halo game. so that is a big fat negative.
not only because of the price either, free 2 play basically invites cheaters with the ability to create infinite accounts which they can use to cheat with then
 
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the single player is not bigger than before, in fact some say it is shorter than Reach and 4. also way less environmental diversity apparently

gamepass is not an intelligent argument. if you had a blockbuster subscription back in the day, was basically every game save from criticism because you could play it with your blockbuster subscription? wtf is that argument?

also the multiplayer being free is not a positive thing. all the stuff that now costs extra in multiplayer was included in that 60€ pricetag with the campaign in every prior Halo game. so that is a big fat negative.
not only because of the price either, free 2 play basically invites cheaters with the ability to create infinite accounts which they can use to cheat with then
I got three years of Xbox premium gamepass for under $100. You can too if you were smart. It's easily longer than either Reach or 4. The lack of environmental diversity is a consequence of working on a new engine and having to reboot the game.

A lot of people don't care about cosmetics and just want to play the game. Those people can now do so for free. Win? Not in your upside down world, apparently. And I'm not even going to entertain the cheaters argument. Literally a zillion games have dealt with this. They're working on it and I'm sure it'll be fine in the long run. But keep complaining about a wildly successful, popular and well made, return to form type of shooter because you're a badass contrarian
 
that is not the theme of the topic at all... it's about this:

Lmao, people need to chill. Season 1 isn’t over and the multiplayer is at an early stage and it’s free to play.

the campaign on the other hand hasn’t been done in Halo, mechanically it’s completely different than before. How do you have level select in an open world let alone the coop aspect of it. The world is too big.
 
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Naked Lunch

Member
Gosh the Halo reddit is just the worst right now. Spend 5 minutes reading over there and try not to get an aneurysm, I dare you.
Almost all of it is not understanding gaming's in general F2P model - to ultimately play Barbie dress-up.

My beef with Infinite is more about how op the AR is and how we dont have maps in the style of Zanzibar and High Ground.
 

Bernd Lauert

Gold Member
So I was never a huge halo fan but with infinite it just seemed to click. Me and a few of my friends play alot and often for roughly 3 hours a day since launch....after falling in love with the game I decide to join r/halo which to my shock it is non....stop...whining. Like I've seen communities dislike a game, but to the extent I see on the halo reddit was shocking. Halo infinite seems to be a super solid game that needs some improvement but I then had to double check if I was bugging for loving it. Is the halo community this whiny or is it just a weird circumstance? I was a big in the Modern Warfare 2019 community and even they werent as whiny about cold war as halo fans seem to be about the best FPS multiplayer game out there. So if any long time halo fan can catch me up...what going on?
The reason why Reddit cries about MTX in the game is because Halo targets mostly boomers (internet boomers aka millenials) and boomers don't like MTX, they want old school shit where you play because the game is fun, not because there's some season pass progression built into the game.
 

Bernkastel

Ask me about my fanboy energy!
Damn, I was just about to post this! I agree with everything Muta said, this is the difference between criticism and whining which I hate how some people on this board and other places are labeling people who have legit concerns with the title.
Sadly due to these people genuine criticism regarding this game that 343i needs to work on gets buried.
 

Shut0wen

Member
So I was never a huge halo fan but with infinite it just seemed to click. Me and a few of my friends play alot and often for roughly 3 hours a day since launch....after falling in love with the game I decide to join r/halo which to my shock it is non....stop...whining. Like I've seen communities dislike a game, but to the extent I see on the halo reddit was shocking. Halo infinite seems to be a super solid game that needs some improvement but I then had to double check if I was bugging for loving it. Is the halo community this whiny or is it just a weird circumstance? I was a big in the Modern Warfare 2019 community and even they werent as whiny about cold war as halo fans seem to be about the best FPS multiplayer game out there. So if any long time halo fan can catch me up...what going on?
Im having a blast as well, only beef i have about tge game is its progression and that certain weapons need buffed but otger tgen that its a great game
 

MidGenRefresh

Gold Member
I got 100 hours worth of fun out of a game that I received for free and it's not even officially out yet. My advice to some of you people is:



 
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RespawnX

Member
I got 100 hours worth of fun out of a game that I received for free and it's not even officially out yet. My advice to some of you people is:



The criticism is fully justified. It is understandable how many series veterans feel. Ultimately, Halo is an arena shooter that has distinguished itself through ever-increasing variety and personalisation options. If no one complains, nothing will change. Some serious design decisions have been made here. There is no question that community behaviour is completely out of bounds. People need to calm down. There are reasons why they have extended Season 1.

The developers have heard the complaints. Now they need to be given time to fix things. That can't be done immediately. Obviously, this is also because no one has thought about tools for such changes.
As I said, questionable design decisions. But the game has some features that make me doubt Microsoft's quality assurance. By the way, not only regarding Halo Infinite, but also other titles and services. This may be due, among other things, to the vast majority of this no longer happening in-house. The studios appear to be under enormous pressure to perform. They wanted to catch up with the competition, and they managed to do so. But sooner or later, these flaws will increase and become more dramatic down the road.
 

Assaulty

Member
Thing is, most of the critique the game is receiving is justified. It's just the way it's presented is awfull.

The multiplayer has some (major) issues with settings and content. I personally play ranked 24-7 so all I need from this game is an MMR rework so I stop matching plats and diamonds in my team and for the desync to be fixed. Also please, for the love of god remove Beheemoth CTF from ranked. The rest is great in my experience, the best Halo has ever felt imo.

But I can totally understand a more casual player wanting more from the game. The amount of options you currently have is laughable. Why didn't the game release with FFA, (ranked) slayer and a rumble playlist? Where's SWAT? Where's infection/griffball/permanent fiesta? Give the players option when the population is at it's greatest and the chance of a high player retention grow. Instead they chose to release with the least playlists of any mainline Halo game.

The foundation of this game is beyond great. This game, to me, is going to become the greatest multiplayer (arena) shooter of all time. But will that moment come in time for the majority of the casual population to still be there? I have my doubts. The team should have been ready to release more playlists at the official launch for example. Let's hope they've learned from Halo 5. I remain skeptical
 
The only person that though this was a big brained take doesn't know the history of the franchise. Bungo began a trend of making you pay for the same game twice when ODST came out (continued in Destiny). There was an uproar then but you just probably don't remember or are being disingenuous. I have a harder time believing you don't remember Halo 5's lack of content, or the fact that it didn't have a single BTB map at launch that wasn't community made. One could say it was a pretty scummy move diverting those resources to the heavily monetized warzone playlist, eh?

Edit: and as a daily player of the MCC I find it hilarious that you mention that when the game launched for $60 (without ODST or Reach) and was broken for years. Everything that came after (some of which was admittedly awesome) has all been a make-good. Infinite's online release was comparatively hiccup free
Firstly you've for some reason to decided ignore a huge chunk of Halos history and focus on the small negatives compared to the huge positives, but sure I'm the one being disingenuous.

Congrats on mentioning ODST, Halo 5 and the buggy launch if MCC. For some reason you ignored 1-3, reach and 4. All of which launched with full content which includes (drum roll) in game cosmetics that did require you to pay a huge extra fee. They also came with complete game modes and content.

MCC was a buggy mess sure, but holy shit is that apples to oranges. MCC was the complete collection of almost all halo games before it, that included all game modes , campaigns and customisation.

Infinite is one game not many. It launch buggy it launched broken, not through some mistake or oversight but through calculated design. Every single issue facing halo right now is through design.

So yes besides your little cherry picked examples, infinite flies in the face of the history of halo and what they have done historically. Halo games traditionally have full playlists and customisation at launch. I neither forgot about nor defended Halo 5, so you know, take it easy on those clouds dude.
 
Attack the argument, not the user.
Firstly you've for some reason to decided ignore a huge chunk of Halos history and focus on the small negatives compared to the huge positives, but sure I'm the one being disingenuous.

Congrats on mentioning ODST, Halo 5 and the buggy launch if MCC. For some reason you ignored 1-3, reach and 4. All of which launched with full content which includes (drum roll) in game cosmetics that did require you to pay a huge extra fee. They also came with complete game modes and content.

MCC was a buggy mess sure, but holy shit is that apples to oranges. MCC was the complete collection of almost all halo games before it, that included all game modes , campaigns and customisation.

Infinite is one game not many. It launch buggy it launched broken, not through some mistake or oversight but through calculated design. Every single issue facing halo right now is through design.

So yes besides your little cherry picked examples, infinite flies in the face of the history of halo and what they have done historically. Halo games traditionally have full playlists and customisation at launch. I neither forgot about nor defended Halo 5, so you know, take it easy on those clouds dude.
Guess you're too dimwitted to see it's been a slide toward 'modern' monetization since Halo 2. Dlc maps were free in 2. Outrage at $10 for 3 maps in Halo 3. Reduced number of unique multiplayer maps in Reach with a lot of locations taken from campaign? Check. Already mentioned the disaster that was ODST pricing. So obviously you just haven't really been paying and want to act like Halo hasn't been following the trends all these years. Stop trying to white knight the devs who made the older games. They loved money just as much as the current ones. The goalposts have just shifted.
 

Dane

Member
Halo 4/5 is for Halo 3 what Resident Evil 5 was for Resident Evil 4, they were sequels that are great, but they were a step down compared to its predecessors were GOTY.

I think Infinite will be on that line, the SP, gameplay and artstyle are on spot, but the MP which is also great has issues on content, they missed the chance to delay for a few months to deliver the ultimate package and be the landslide choice in FPS.

343i sounds like to have many MANY conflicts inside: Remember last year when Brad Sams reported the issues of the game and that the management was focusing on the TV Show? 343i tried to call it fake as damage control. Then they call in shortly the two guys who saved titles, Joseph Staten and Pierre Hintze (he pretty much resurrected MCC), probably the last 12-14 months of development were entirely to fix what could have been a mess, as Schreier (yeah I know) mentioned, it could have been an Anthem disaster.

Brad also said back when it was announced that there was the idea of splitting the game in two with different release dates, which seems that it was discarded and then brought back after the messy 2020 trailer as Spencer said that him and the rest of XGS felt to be a bad idea, this is mostly unheard of the industry, where a studio had to be talked into some sense by their superiors. For me, 343i was always a very corporate creation to squeeze out a big IP after its original developers leave, but they are still oblivious that since Spencer, Matt and Sarah came in that the traditional corporate mindset wouldn't be staying, all the other studios have been delivering very complete games with much more friendlier MTX (wasn't MCC cosmetics earning also praised?). Halo is not even their sole big leader anymore to try to extort people, Forza Horizon 4 already had a much more active playerbase on Xbox's most played and Steam, FH5 is the confirmation of being the new brand franchise for the Xbox.
 
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Guess you're too dimwitted to see it's been a slide toward 'modern' monetization since Halo 2. Dlc maps were free in 2. Outrage at $10 for 3 maps in Halo 3. Reduced number of unique multiplayer maps in Reach with a lot of locations taken from campaign? Check. Already mentioned the disaster that was ODST pricing. So obviously you just haven't really been paying and want to act like Halo hasn't been following the trends all these years. Stop trying to white knight the devs who made the older games. They loved money just as much as the current ones. The goalposts have just shifted.
Personal attacks, nice, now we are really getting into it.

First off, your form of debate is weak as fuck. All of your points are essentially trying to extract what I didn't say and use it as a way to make out like I'm ignorant. Just because I didnt mention dlc maps for Halo 3, or how Halo 5 was monetized does not mean I am not aware of them. Sorry thats your (very wrong) assumption.

"Stop trying to white knight the devs who made the older games." wow, what a pathetic little child you are. Did I mention or praise bungie specifically at any point? Then how could I possibly be white knighting for them? That rhetoric only exists in your mind, you fabricated it, seek help. I don't give a fuck about bungie and tbh I dont give a fuck about Halo. I care about the industry and how fucked it has become. A comparison that is easy to make when you look back at the history of the franchise. That is not me claiming Halo has always been perfect, that bungie are gods, or that dlc/bugs/monetisation has never existed in Halo, if that's what you take from it, cool, thats on you.

You can make an evidence based, objective comparison between infinite and every game in the franchise, and you can see without doubt it the most thin on content and the most aggressive/egregious monetisation the franchise has ever seen, by miles (even when compared to 5).
 
Every time I boot Halo Infinite up, I get to this screen and think "I just want to set up a little base over here, build communication infrastructure with allies, and traverse the open world to find opposing players..."



Then I get thrown in small arenas where I get my poo shoved in by joystick jockeys.

My day will come!
 

GymWolf

Gold Member
343 putting out the worse 2 titles in the saga kinda make your fanbase a little worried, yes.

Also releasing a barebone multy and that 1 year delay...add some craig coefficient to the mix and there you have it.
 
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Personal attacks, nice, now we are really getting into it.

First off, your form of debate is weak as fuck. All of your points are essentially trying to extract what I didn't say and use it as a way to make out like I'm ignorant. Just because I didnt mention dlc maps for Halo 3, or how Halo 5 was monetized does not mean I am not aware of them. Sorry thats your (very wrong) assumption.

"Stop trying to white knight the devs who made the older games." wow, what a pathetic little child you are. Did I mention or praise bungie specifically at any point? Then how could I possibly be white knighting for them? That rhetoric only exists in your mind, you fabricated it, seek help. I don't give a fuck about bungie and tbh I dont give a fuck about Halo. I care about the industry and how fucked it has become. A comparison that is easy to make when you look back at the history of the franchise. That is not me claiming Halo has always been perfect, that bungie are gods, or that dlc/bugs/monetisation has never existed in Halo, if that's what you take from it, cool, thats on you.

You can make an evidence based, objective comparison between infinite and every game in the franchise, and you can see without doubt it the most thin on content and the most aggressive/egregious monetisation the franchise has ever seen, by miles (even when compared to 5).

What a debate bro. You lose. Game is good. No one but internet crybabies care.
 
Yes they are - they will never be pleased because they all have a different vision of what the best halo game would be. And they look on the original trilogy with rose colored glasses. There’s issues to be sure, but the amount they freak out is ridiculous. If it’s not one thing it’s another, I’ve seen people saying completely contradictory things constantly - TTK is too fast, TTK is too slow, pistol needs a buff, pistol needs a nerf, it’s not halo with sprint and clamber, it’s not halo with a grappling hook, it’s not halo with Yadda yadda.

basically if it doesn’t have every feature of every halo game done better than every halo game but also plays exactly like halo 2 or 3.

I personally am just glad it’s actual good gameplay - I’ll be more stoked when co op comes out but I’m glad they’re just releasing it at this point since it clearly has had troubled management.
 
That's reddit for ya.

Cant stand r/MMA either because everyones a professional and everyone knows better and every fighter is loved and hated at the whim of an opinion.
 

MrFunSocks

Banned
The worst people are people like you. You complain about people's legitimate complaints while having low standards and letting companies get away with putting less effort into games. You go as far as defending them.
The complaints about infinite have been mostly not legitimate, they've mostly just been "I'm not filling bars fast enough to get skins I want NOW", and "I want to only play one game mode so they need to split the player base immediately!". Those aren't legitimate complaints, they're whiney entitled GaMeR complaints.

Halo Infinite is a F2P game, you don't judge it the same as you would if it was USD$60. There is no "less effort" put into it just because you don't like something about it.
 

WitchHunter

Member
So I was never a huge halo fan but with infinite it just seemed to click. Me and a few of my friends play alot and often for roughly 3 hours a day since launch....after falling in love with the game I decide to join r/halo which to my shock it is non....stop...whining. Like I've seen communities dislike a game, but to the extent I see on the halo reddit was shocking. Halo infinite seems to be a super solid game that needs some improvement but I then had to double check if I was bugging for loving it. Is the halo community this whiny or is it just a weird circumstance? I was a big in the Modern Warfare 2019 community and even they werent as whiny about cold war as halo fans seem to be about the best FPS multiplayer game out there. So if any long time halo fan can catch me up...what going on?
/r/ is a "strange" (emphasis lvl 1000) place, just do not enter. everyone tells their own take, nobody cares about others'. or if so they kill/bait each other
/r/ is not built for fruitful discussion, it is built to kill discussion

basically an echo chamber and upvote dopamine loop
 
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