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Japanese Execs Talk Upcoming Console Wars
- Thread starter Mark Gonzales
- Start date
I think CoD2 (360) was a pretty good example of how patching will be prominent next-gen. Shouldn't have been released in that state (multiplayer, corrupting saves), but it was to make launch and it was patched up a couple months afterwards.
It really blows but its a reality. If you need to get a product out the door and a systems in place to fix bugs post-product launch, you're going to utilise it.
It really blows but its a reality. If you need to get a product out the door and a systems in place to fix bugs post-product launch, you're going to utilise it.
IMO what they're saying is, "we'll fix the big bugs and common flaws before we launch, but instead of spending thousands of man-hours looking for uncommon stuff (like 'crouch jump over a rivulet in the third map whilst shooting will make you fall through the ground'), after we can't find anymore easily we'll pass it over to the users and let them find it. Then we'll fix it."loosus said:
Hes talking about next-gen systems as a whole (PS3/Wii/360). Sony, Ninty or MS probably aren't going to find anything that SE or any other company couldn't find in the testing they do do.DCharlie said:
marvelharvey
Member
I guess that without an HDD onboard, no Wii games will get the patchathon treatment.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
sharukins said:
at least you didn't make it
So they plan on saving alot of money on bug testing and by forcing downloaded in-game advertising.
Will any of these savings be passed onto the consumer? I doubt it.
Sounds like they want to offer episodic content for a fee, that has up-to-date advertising and the end user is left to find the bugs and report them if they want an eventual fix.
sound like a good revenue stream for the developer, from both the consumer and through company adverts. If I was in the business this is definitely the way I'd go, but it sucks for us.
Will any of these savings be passed onto the consumer? I doubt it.
Sounds like they want to offer episodic content for a fee, that has up-to-date advertising and the end user is left to find the bugs and report them if they want an eventual fix.
sound like a good revenue stream for the developer, from both the consumer and through company adverts. If I was in the business this is definitely the way I'd go, but it sucks for us.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
again, reiterating, but i fail to see how you can cut back on bug testing.
Surely all companies have to pass the TCR - so unless the TCR is relaxed, then surely the debugging effort is still going to be exactly the same?
And i just don't see Sony/nintendo relaxing their TCR... not sure about MS though!
I'm confused !
DCharlie said:again, reiterating, but i fail to see how you can cut back on bug testing.
Surely all companies have to pass the TCR - so unless the TCR is relaxed, then surely the debugging effort is still going to be exactly the same?
And i just don't see Sony/nintendo relaxing their TCR... not sure about MS though!
I'm confused !
"He also thinks that with the growth in "always-on" Internet connections, the "huge cost of debugging" to developers will decrease, as regular software updates will become possible. Wada suggested that, thanks to the availability of software updates, developers won't have to work so hard to find the zaniest bugs."
well I guess it depends on what he considers "zany bugs" to be.
regardless, it seems to me that he's talking about saving money on bug testing by having the user report the more obscure bugs.
surely the only way to save money on bug testing is to do less of it.
DCharlie said:
well that's true. but in this case he's talking about releasing patches after the games release, not using better tools to lower costs. essentially using the consumer to 'automate' debugging.
if he meant using better tools he would of said that, not:
"thanks to the availability of software updates, developers won't have to work so hard to find the zaniest bugs."
sugarhigh4242
Banned
Do Japanese people play a lot of PC games??
If not, then PS3 will definitely have an audience. Even if Wii is a blockbuster, there's still going to be a demand for a more next-gen experience. Though it is looking like the demand is heavily in Nintendo's favor.
If not, then PS3 will definitely have an audience. Even if Wii is a blockbuster, there's still going to be a demand for a more next-gen experience. Though it is looking like the demand is heavily in Nintendo's favor.
If it could be automated, it would. But there are bugs in software that don't show up in any variables as a problem but are clearly a problem to a human playing the game.DCharlie said:
But what you said is irrelevant, anyway. He said that it would lower because of the ability of updates, not automated debugging tools.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
yes, but this brings me back to my original point - unless the people approving their games don't care about zanny bugs anymore then i don't see how they can do this.
Sony's quality control is pretty tight , as is nintendos meaning notoriously harsh TCRs would have to be slackened for these zanny bugs to be passed through.
Unless of course this is a somewhat slight nod to the fact that they are all going X360 exclusive where standards are , shall we say, a little more lax on the testing front?
again, need to see the japanese it's derived for - it could just as easily mean "because of updated TESTING software, we now don't need to worry about finding the zanny bugs" for instance. That would certainly reduce costs and would still mean no change in TCRs.
Lets face it - we LIKE well tested software - part of this is me wanting the TCRs in tact to remain as it helps games quality.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Wario64 said:
Even better, patches will be released, but only for some versions of the game... Bethesda/Take 2 why are your ears buzzing ?
Less debugging?
Sounds like they're wanting to leave the QA testing to the consumers who already forked over $60.
I can see the screens now when you're playing and your game crashes:
"Madden 2007 has encountered a serious error and will shutdown. Would you like to send this information to EA?" This bug has been brought to you by Gatorade!
Sounds like they're wanting to leave the QA testing to the consumers who already forked over $60.
I can see the screens now when you're playing and your game crashes:
"Madden 2007 has encountered a serious error and will shutdown. Would you like to send this information to EA?" This bug has been brought to you by Gatorade!
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
... you weaksaucian! you are supposed to race to finish it before your Xbox overheats WITHOUT saving.
see also : Over G on JPN X360.
The game is made twice as long, because the first time you save after completing a mission crashes your system - then when you do it the second time, it saves fine. It does this for each mission... now that is REPLAY VALUE! and forced replay value is where it is at!
I can't wait until a bug in some top-selling game erases people's memory cards/memory sticks/hard drives/whatnot because it wasn't properly tested. The backlash will be amazing, and the number of future people who buy games--any games--first-day might drop dramatically.Mark Gonzales said:
SolidSnakex
Member
Jiggy37 said:
I think one of the demo discs Sony went out would corrupt your memory card. They stopped shipping them though and then for everyone that had the problem they sent them a free game.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
DCharlie said:you know the last game that springs to mind that did something like this was the Pokemon dungeon game?
I wonder whether the next pokemon game will struggle or not ?
"once they get the 300th pokemon, delete"
"whoops it was a bug, i guess you get more replay time out of your game then!"
SolidSnakex
Member
DCharlie said:
Glad they got that worked out before it got to us.
WiiConnect24 will be used for patching too kids but probably less than than on PS3 and 360. Honestly patching could be a good thing for consoles, they're more likely to be solid out of the gate cause they're consoles. I doubt very many game crippling and save corrupting bugs will get through. They can't release games assuming people have internet connections, not for a while at least. Still who can deny how crucial glitch fixes and balancing tweaks for fighters, FPS, and RTS games are? Small upgrades to make my experience better are welcome if they are truly like the PC experience. They start trying to charge for patches....jesus I don't even wanna think about it.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
products that still hit the standards of the more strict TCRs whilst also having the ability to patch/tweak/update/improve/fix anything - allowing games to be more balanced, to address cheats, to provide a better product after the sale is the utter ideal.
Consoles should not be held back by the multiple configurations of PCs and all that is needed is for companies not to lower their standards and it's ON.
It's amazing comparitively how hard PC devs work for such little return. Console space is still driven by sequels though, so hopefully devs will ease up on the whoring but they'll probably fleece us with what they charge for content all the same. Still for me the big upside is games that aren't that popular or successful to get continued support. The console support base is big enough that if the devs really develop, support, and listen to their community they'll hit that ideal for the better of all. Few will hit that mark but man when they do it'll be bliss.
Buggy Loop
Member
Shit, japan is already a guinea pig when it comes to releasing games with bugs in them, the japanese find them, the company fix them for the US version. At least they wont be ****ed in the A anymore by either having to buy an international version or a new revision, now its just gonna update the game, without them even knowing.
I prefer having the option of patching than no patching, morrowind on xbox, nuff said.
I prefer having the option of patching than no patching, morrowind on xbox, nuff said.
MrSardonic
The nerdiest nerd of all the nerds in nerdland
i pray for the destruction of these companies
Buggy Loop said:
There's nothing wrong with post-release patching if the company has made a best effort to find all bugs prior to shipping. However Wada is basically welcoming the 'opportunity' to cut back on pre-release testing, which he ought to be taken to task for. As medrew says, what if the game doesn't do so well? Or what if I find a bug that's rare or that no one else has (which is possible as games grow more complex and/or personalised to the user) - will that get attention?
DenogginizerOS
BenjaminBirdie's Thomas Jefferson
SolidSnakex said:
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!! Dummies!
Mark Gonzales
Banned
Talk about looking to deep into some comments....