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Jim Sterlings PS4 Top Ten(MS PR wont talk to him?)

The Faceless Master

The Faceless Master

Member
hydrophilic attack said:
Come on, man. I don't care much for him and his work either but we should be better than this. Ad hominem attacks like this only makes it easier for people like Gies to dismiss GAF as an "angry Internet mob" when they get uncomfortable with the discussion going on here.
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who cares what that clown has to 'discuss' anyway? it's all talking points from the PR handlers that control his monologue.
 
A

Amir0x

Banned
hydrophilic attack said:
Come on, man. I don't care much for him and his work either but we should be better than this. Ad hominem attacks like this only makes it easier for people like Gies to dismiss GAF as an "angry Internet mob" when they get uncomfortable with the discussion going on here.
Click to expand...

Except it's true. We have documented proof it is true. I am tired of posting these examples just to have to inform people. Go out and read about his many crimes. Gies is an awful person. I don't care what Gies thinks of it, because it's a fact.

Jim Sterling on the hand is just, what, overly harsh? What reason does MS or any company have to ignore him but for that?
 
Sub_Level

Sub_Level

wants to fuck an Asian grill.
MS can feel the low Ryse scores and so-so DR3 scores coming (unless they have moneyhatted lol) .
 
E

Eoin

Member
Just sounds like he has an inflated sense of his own importance in the world of game reviews. He's been given the games to review and would have been given the date and time of the embargo as well. One does not come without the other. He has everything he needs to do his job, but is throwing a twitter tantrum because someone in PR isn't talking to him.
 
S

SneakyStephan

Banned
Derrick01 said:
Batman Arkham Origins: 3.5/10.

You sure about that?
Click to expand...

You can't be serious
formulaic, quicktime event ridden AAA ungame gets a 3.5, that is exactly what it should be scoring

I swear you're like 2 different posters on one account
Half of the time you bemoan poor gameplay and AAA games, on the other hand you get mad when a game that symbolises everything wrong with AAA gaming gets a 3.5
Such hypocricy

ot: more light is shed on how this gross industry works and how much of a bitch the games press is to publishers
if they act unpredictable they get cut off and get no material to do their job with

that's why polygon/ign/kotaku and the likes all defend MS and sony and try to damage control for them, they either act as an extention of PR or they don't get to play along.
 
Dr. Kitty Muffins

Dr. Kitty Muffins

Member
Empty said:
because a negative jim sterling review means a lot less later after ign and polgyon have crowned it a masterpiece than it does coming at the same time when everyone is checking out the reception and looking at xbone metacritics.

i might be getting this completely wrong though. i'll admit. that's just what came to mind when i hear that they're messing with embargoes for a divisive reviewer. they want the launch to go as smoothly as possible.
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While that is true, he does have some ability to influence the hardcore. It isn't like the mainstream gamers are much aware of him but he can definitely stoke any fires already burning amongst hardcore types like us. Piss off enough guys like Jim and gasoline will be poured any time a MS controversy comes out.

And for full disclosure, I happen to like Jim Sterling. He can be overly harsh but he thinks like a true blue NEOGAF'fer.
 
F

fastballspecial

Member
Eoin said:
Just sounds like he has an inflated sense of his own importance in the world of game reviews. He's been given the games to review and would have been given the date and time of the embargo as well. One does not come without the other. He has everything he needs to do his job, but is throwing a twitter tantrum because someone in PR isn't talking to him.
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There's nothing wrong with Jim contacting Microsoft's PR to make sure whatever date he thinks is correct ACTUALLY is correct. If whoever he was trying to contact was at all professional then this would be a non issue.
 
K

Kerned

Banned
Eoin said:
Just sounds like he has an inflated sense of his own importance in the world of game reviews. He's been given the games to review and would have been given the date and time of the embargo as well. One does not come without the other. He has everything he needs to do his job, but is throwing a twitter tantrum because someone in PR isn't talking to him.
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He's the reviews editor for The Escapist. I don't think he has to have an inflated sense of self-importance to expect MS (or any other publisher) PR to talk to him. A person in his position is exactly who they should be talking to, that's kind of their job. That's what makes the situation sort of curious. I wish Jim would come in here and elaborate a bit, though I imagine that probably wouldn't really help the situation for him.
 
U

unbias

Member
Eoin said:
Just sounds like he has an inflated sense of his own importance in the world of game reviews. He's been given the games to review and would have been given the date and time of the embargo as well. One does not come without the other. He has everything he needs to do his job, but is throwing a twitter tantrum because someone in PR isn't talking to him.
Click to expand...

Again, this isnt simply about embargo's and reviews, PR isnt talking to him. He mentions it in the video w/o mentioning embargo's and twitter also confirms it isnt about the embargo's. If you are in charge of a game website and the industry is ran by PR, you probably want them talking to you, is my guess.
 
H

hydrophilic attack

Member
Amir0x said:
Except it's true. We have documented proof it is true. I am tired of posting these examples just to have to inform people. Go out and read about his many crimes. Gies is an awful person. I don't care what Gies thinks of it, because it's a fact.
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I'm not disagreeing with you, as I said I don't like him much either, but you can't just throw out accusations like that without showing the evidence of the matter. It makes your argument look weak, and makes people like Gies look better, because he can just deflect any criticism and valid argument against what he does by vague statements about mob mentality and Internet hivemind.

If all you people are so tired of posting these examples over again, just make a post where you compile a list of all the stuff he has done, bookmark it and keep linking to it/quoting it whenever you feel someone needs to be informed of why is he a hack, or whatever. It would make your case a lot stronger, and would be much more difficult to deflect than non-specific ad hominem attacks. :)
 
M

Mistwalker

Member
hydrophilic attack said:
Come on man, doing something like that to a semi-known person can only backfire. I think they really regret blacklisting Kotaku back in the day.
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Then again, Polygon spent half of their 12-hour PS4 livestream coverage trashing the Playstation 4, and the other half talking about how much better the Xbox One is. Didn't one viewer ask what PS4 title is worth looking forward to in 2014 and get told "Sorry, Titanfall is an Xbox exclusive lol" during that? Not sure what kind of backfiring could possibly be worse than the blatant sabotage Polygon/Gies ended up pulling.

hydrophilic attack said:
Come on, man. I don't care much for him and his work either but we should be better than this. Ad hominem attacks like this only makes it easier for people like Gies to dismiss GAF as an "angry Internet mob" when they get uncomfortable with the discussion going on here.
Click to expand...
Ad hominem? Yes it is. It also happens to be absolutely and completely true. Gies dismissed GAF long ago in any case.

I'm not a big fan of Sterling myself, but if this is in fact a case of PR breakdown, it's not happening at the best time for MS.
 
E

Eoin

Member
unbias said:
Again, this isnt simply about embargo's and reviews, PR isnt talking to him. He mentions it in the video w/o mentioning embargo's and twitter also confirms it isnt about the embargo's. If you are in charge of a game website and the industry is ran by PR, you probably want them talking to you, is my guess.
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Jim has always done his own thing. He doesn't give a shit who he offends in his reviews, just gives his honest opinion on whether he likes a game and can be scathing if he doesn't, I quite like his reviews because of this, but it seems naive not to expect less than chummy relations from PR if this is the road you tread. As long as he's getting the games to review I don't see the issue.
 
A

Amir0x

Banned
hydrophilic attack said:
I'm not disagreeing with you, as I said I don't like him much either, but you can't just throw out accusations like that without showing the evidence of the matter. It makes your argument look weak, and makes people like Gies look better, because he can just deflect any criticism and valid argument against what he does by vague statements about mob mentality and Internet hivemind.

If all you people are so tired of posting these examples over again, just make a post where you compile a list of all the stuff he has done, bookmark it and keep linking to it/quoting it whenever you feel someone needs to be informed of why is he a hack, or whatever. It would make your case a lot stronger, and would be much more difficult to deflect than non-specific ad hominem attacks. :)
Click to expand...

I did. Y2Kev told me to stop cross posting it. That's why I am not posting it once again :p
 
J

jmood88

Member
HariKari said:
This implies that Gies is somehow looking to have a reasonable discussion, either with GAF or other parties. That's not what he is about. Polygon has some terrific pieces, but it's propped up by all that is wrong with the industry, and that starts with Gies. Who the fuck openly whines about not wanting to review a game (Killzone) on twitter, then goes on to give it an expected bad score? Gies, that's who. There's no attempt at professionalism, so he should be given no quarter in reasonable circles.
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That's not what he was complaining about. He was complaining about not wanting to see Killzone during the ps4 reveal.
 
njean777

njean777

Member
Not surprised, he is one of the only journalists that took MS to task for their bullshit DRM and policies. Keep fighting the good fight Jim.
 
U

unbias

Member
Eoin said:
Jim has always done his own thing. He doesn't give a shit who he offends in his reviews, just gives his honest opinion on whether he likes a game and can be scathing if he doesn't, I quite like his reviews because of this, but it seems naive not to expect less than chummy relations from PR if this is the road you tread. As long as he's getting the games to review I don't see the issue.
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He isnt stomping his feet or saying he is blacklisted though, he is just giving MS crap for not talking to him. I honestly see nothing wrong with what he is doing. It isnt like he is talking about rethinking his career(Sessler)...

Poking the bear if they refuse to talk, I would say, is a good tactic to either get what you want or piss them off more.
 
R

razgriz417

Member
Untalkative_Bunny said:
Review sites that need to make money absolutely have to have day one reviews with a numerical score. Having a huge player like MS blackball a reviews editor would mean fewer pre-release review copies which means less money for the owner(s) of the website, and probably the loss of a job for the editor. So 'greylisting' JS when he is just starting as a reviews editor is a pretty big message.
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He's not a reviews editor now for Escapist, I'm pretty sure he's the Editor in Chief over there
 
C

Coxy

Member
Disgusting but not surprising, he was one of the few to actually say DRM might actually be a slightly bad thing, that crazy maverick. Should have been defending it tooth and nail like every other shill
 
Ardenyal

Ardenyal

Member
Guess it's safe to assume XB1 exclusives are going to get amazing reviews despite them looking as mediocre as the rest of the launch line up.
 
A

akashhhhh

Member
I'm not seeing why anyone thinks this has anything to do with review scores, that's a huge leap. There are a million other ways to piss off a PR agency or a client.

Moreover, he got copies of the games. Press copies always, always, ALWAYS come with a nice letter extolling the game's qualities and reiterating the embargo dates.

Finally, yes you have to play nice with companies to get early access to games and access to developers. Jim is welcome to go buy copies on street date and review them.

I really don't get why Jim is such a folk hero in this thread. He needs to be more mature, in my opinion.
 
R

rschauby

Banned
We need more journalists like Jim Sterling, and not just for games.

Yes, he is often overly critical, but I prefer honest shit over fake rainbows.
 
W

WickedCobra03

Member
zainetor said:
He punished origins just for beeing more of the same.
But the 7th consecutive cod gets 9,5 from him.
I dont know what to say.
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Oh, yeah. I don't even know what to say about that? I really loved New Super Mario Bros Wii, but that was nothing really special, right? Just a prettier Super Nintendo game.

But yeah, I think that is weird area when people basically love a series even when age or flaws are showing without really mentioning them, but then criticize another series that has the same flaws but are not as long in the tooth or flawed as previous.
 
K

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
Hmmm...

Which website is bigger? Destructoid or The Escapist? Even if his name is known, if Escapist is a much smaller site with less traffic, wouldn't that put it lower on the totem pole for every publisher?
 
U

unbias

Member
akashhhhh said:
I'm not seeing why anyone thinks this has anything to do with review scores, that's a huge leap. There are a million other ways to piss off a PR agency or a client.

Moreover, he got copies of the games. Press copies always, always, ALWAYS come with a nice letter extolling the game's qualities and reiterating the embargo dates.

Finally, yes you have to play nice with companies to get early access to games and access to developers. Jim is welcome to go buy copies on street date and review them.

I really don't get why Jim is such a folk hero in this thread. He needs to be more mature, in my opinion.
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He didn't say all PR, he said MS PR. And without any specific spot to point to, for Pr to be pissy, all we have is his unpredictable nature when it comes to how he reviews. As for "mature", the fuck man, the Game industry is the most immature industry there is, in terms of personalities. Seems like an incredible cop-out to complain about him when the majority are immature.
 
A

akashhhhh

Member
There's a lot of ill-informed conspiracy mongering in this thread. Games get terrible reviews all the time (see, um, Knack or Killzone or every Kinect game for the past two years) and writers/outlets aren't "blacklisted" or "greylisted" (what does that even mean?) by publishers.
 
T

Triggerhappytel

Member
Untalkative_Bunny said:
Jim is very well known and worth their time. & any decisions like that are made with one aim and that is managing the message, they aren't 'bitter'.

So the natural conclusion is that Jim wont play ball and so he isn't worth their time. They would rather talk to journos like Gies, Sessler, Orland, etc. who are more receptive to helping them manage the message.
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Yes, those others you listed can and do act more like PR extensions, while Sterling actually tells it like it is and doesn't sugar coat anything. So there's that.
 
A

akashhhhh

Member
unbias said:
As for "mature", the fuck man, the Game industry is the most immature industry there is, in terms of personalities. .
Click to expand...

What makes you say this? Some gamers are certainly immature, but I've never thought of developers, professionals at the publishers or even the journalists themselves as immature at large.
 
digoutyoursoul

digoutyoursoul

Member
Ardenyal said:
Just calling it as I see it. Nothing shown of the exclusives so far looks particularly interesting or ground breaking. They're launch titles and it shows.
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So you do think they will be money hatted if they get positive reviews because they don't look particularly interaction or ground breaking to you ?

Next week is going to be awful reading on here at times, can see it a mile away.
 
U

unbias

Member
akashhhhh said:
What makes you say this? Some gamers are certainly immature, but I've never thought of developers, professionals are publishers or even the journalists themselves as immature writ-large.
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I've always found the personalities of the inudstry, for instance: Cliffy B, Sessler(when people disagree with him), TB(acts like a child when people call him out or disagree), Annoyed Gamer's "use a real name" spiel, Arthur Gies, Garnett Lee(with his absurdness back during I think it was GDC?), Brian Crecente(his BS with copying Johns article without sourcing him and then playing dumb), Ben Parfitt(taking pot shots at anyone who doesnt play by the PR rules), Rob Crossley(people criticizing his PR articles as "beneath him".).

Then you have media people on this site who continually have drive by comments at gamers.

Then for developers you have people like Denis Dyack, David Jaffe, Cliffy B(mentioned him before), Phil Fish, and others showing their maturity levels. This isnt to say that the immaturity is always bad... Just seems like immaturity is a terrible excuse in this industry to not talk to someone.

I mean I could find more examples, but I think ive mentioned enough of them.
 
T

Tensketch

Member
I am a massive fan of Jims work. I always have been. First thing I ever read on Destructoid was his article on how Kane and Lynch really isnt as bad as people made out and I agreed with everything he said. Since then I've followed his reviews and though some people think he is too harsh, I like the fact that he reviews games from a personal standpoint, if he isnt a fan of a game, regardless of its popularity, he will tell you.
Needless to say, he becomes the Marmite to PR guys in the games industry, they either love him (Sega's brilliant giant poster stunt) or hate him.

Plus he seemed to grow up around the same generation as me and is constantly making callbacks in his articles and videos that have me flip out in nostalgic glee. Case and point, Magic Magic E in this video.
 
E

Ethranes

Member
Just want to say I have no idea what this thread is about, who that guy is, or what any of you are talking about, it's like I'm not of this Earth right now
 
A

akashhhhh

Member
unbias said:
I've always found the personalities of the, for instance: Cliffy B, Sessler(when people disagree with him), TB(acts like a child when people call him out or disagree), Annoyed Gamer's "use a real name" spiel, Arthur Gies, Garnett Lee(with his absurdness back during I think it was GDC?), Brian Crecente(his BS with copying Johns article without sourcing him and then playing dumb), Ben Parfitt(taking pot shots at anyone who doesnt play by the PR rules), Rob Crossley(people criticizing his PR articles as "beneath him".).

Then you have media people on this site who continually have drive by comments at gamers.

Then for developers you have people like Denis Dyack, David Jaffe, Cliffy B(mentioned him before), Phil Fish, and others showing their maturity levels. This isnt to say that the immaturity is always bad... Just seems like immaturity is a terrible excuse in this industry to not talk to someone.

I mean I could find more examples, but I think ive mentioned enough of them.
Click to expand...

I don't think you're describing immaturity, you're just mentioning bad moments people have had. I really think that a lot of those folks you mentioned (Cliff, Crecente, Sessler, Garnett) are real stand up people who represent the industry well. But to each their own.

I've always viewed Jim as someone who takes an enormous pleasure in being SEEN as so counter-industry and goes to lengths to rock the boat. That can be a huge liability for any company. I imagine that nothing sucks more than working your butt off on a release only to have Jim go off on it for doing something that every other game also does. That said, Microsoft is sending him games and that's what matters. My guess is they aren't giving him the same level of access as some other outlets (interviews, quotes, etc), but that's the price you pay for wanting to be the hero of gaming.
 
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