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[water_wendi]

Game looks really fun. The majority of reactions both here and in reviewland arent surprising. Heres hoping it sells 2 million more.

 

[legend166]

Holy crap @ epic tag.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Hilarious tag aside, sambishop has a point. Being a good concept should not be rewarded (by critics, at least) if the execution is terrible.

Sometime soon, someone will make a Just Dance clone that actually works, has a more fleshed out song list, and better-than-bare-bones presentation, and it will score better.

Reviewers do not (at least, should not) exist to tell you that what you like is awesome.

If the game can be done better, people deserve to know. If the reviewer did not enjoy the game, he should say so.

Edit: Frankly, I'm amazed how quickly certain members are to champion any game that meets an 'acceptable' sales threshold, while saving their scorn for any game/publisher/dev that underperforms on the platform. If Ubisoft greenlights 5 new casual titles tomorrow, GAF will yet again let out a collective groan.

 

[HAL_Laboratory]

Sometime soon, someone will make a Just Dance clone that actually works, has a more fleshed out song list, and better-than-bare-bones presentation, and it will score better.

And sell less.

 

[AceBandage]

Holy crap @ epic tag.

Damn, that was fast.
Amazing what'll get you a tag around here.

 

[timetokill]

Hilarious tag aside, sambishop has a point. Being a good concept should not be rewarded (by critics, at least) if the execution is terrible.

Check the tag again. Heavy Rain got a 9.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Check the tag again. Heavy Rain got a 9.

Is Heavy Rain that bad?

 

[crazy monkey]

Is Heavy Rain that bad?

It has similar game play . I.e you follow onscreen instruction. just dance is more fun from what i hear. heavy rain tries to be like interactive movie.

 

[AceBandage]

It has similar game play . I.e you follow onscreen instruction. just dance is more fun from what i hear. heavy rain tries to be like interactive movie.

But can you press X to Jason in Just Dance?
Huh, smart guy?

 

[SapientWolf]

IGN is quite happy to writhe in rapturous ecstacy to the taste of a new chicken sandwich from a fast-foot restaurant like Call of Duty or Grand Theft Auto, though. (Is this metaphor still working?) There are sites that take a consistently elite position towards what they cover and how -- y'know, pretentious (often annoyingly so) sites like insertcredit that dedicate their coverage entirely to obscure and niche games.

A site like IGN is perfectly happy to cover popular but mediocre tripe as long as it fits the narrative, which is what makes the idea that they're the elite tastemakers protecting the hoi polloi from their own poor taste so utterly ludicrous.

I wouldn't go that far. Those games are more like great, innovative local restaurants that turned into chains that were happy to serve up more of the same to their regulars.

Tortured analogy aside, in the end a reviewer can only give his honest opinion. The only pretentious act is assuming everyone will or should feel the same way as you.

 

[darkwings]

is there a DDR out for wii supporting the balance board?

 

[Ollie Pooch]

It will be called Dance Hero and you'll need some kind of cheap plastic controller. I just can't think of one.

disco stick

 

[linsivvi]

It has similar game play . I.e you follow onscreen instruction. just dance is more fun from what i hear. heavy rain tries to be like interactive movie.

With a script that, if condensed to 2 hours and made into a movie, would definitely make the top 10 list of worst movies of the year, if not ever. And it sold more than a million copy with mostly positive feedbacks too. It just proves that hardcore gamers and reviewers are just as easily duped as the casuals.

 

[Mael]

The sooner 3rd parties realize that mega sales have almost ZERO to do with what gamers, gaming sites or GAF thinks, the sooner they'll start making profits on Wii. This game is a case in point. No true gamer wants to play Just Dance, but if you put it in front of a party -- one with real girls -- it's a hit. I'm so sick of hearing the whining about how 3rd party software doesn't sell well on Wii. I have no sympathy for those developers because if they'd just create compelling software for the masses (instead of gamers), this problem would be solved.

Because it needs to be repeated over and over.

I find it very funny that Ign trashed Just Dance and praised to high heaven something like Heavy Rain.
I guess if you target the hardcore you get a free pass :lol

 

[Penguin]

Curious why this game did so well when Boogie which was a similar concept failed so horribly. :lol

 

[Mad Max]

Do you even know what interactivity means?

If you have to ask, then it's probably you who doesn't know the meaning of the word.

What I mean is that, in Just Dance, there is almost no relation to what you do as a player and what happens in the game.

 

[Brobzoid]

Just dance is cool enough. It's entertaining in that singstar vorspiel way, and since that's what it's trying to do I'd say it's rather successful at it. y'all some haters. A proper comparison is something like EA's Boogie, which had dancing that was dreadful. It wasn't fun in the hardcorez DDR manner, and it had lots of shit popping up on the screen to tell you whether you were doing what you were supposed to be doing at any given moment. horrible.

 

[HAL_Laboratory]

...in Just Dance, there is almost no relation to what you do as a player and what happens in the game.

It's called Just Dance for a reason.

 

[TheFLYINGManga_Ka]

Um...is this something Ubisoft should be proud of? I mean, the game has got horrible ratings and reviews.

But I guess $$$ is all that matters.

 

[Pepto]

in Just Dance, there is almost no relation to what you do as a player and what happens in the game.

What about this post:

People say it's inacurate, but it's actually people not dancing, or not doing the movements right... I have a friend who does 20000 points in some songs (i do 15000+ half of the songs). And most people who try to cheat can't even get close to 10000.

 

[Caesar III]

I'd buy a Natal just to get a sequel with smarter tracking.

That's exactly why this game is so popular!

If the tracking is better and you have to really do 1:1 movement to score it wouldn't be the fun it is! The game is named "JUST DANCE" with a reason! It's not named "dance for points against your friends".

Curious why this game did so well when Boogie which was a similar concept failed so horribly. :lol

See above! Boogie was too strict and points-driven! I tried it at GC and it sucked!


BTW has anyone checked the credits? There are only like 20 people involved and the on screen dancers are Flash-Videos if I get this right because there is a flash programmer mentioned.

I hope the next game has download songs.

 

[Mad Max]

@Pepto

Even then it's still just the score bar filling, the game itself doesn't seem to react otherwise when you're playing it.

 

[Gowans]

It sponsors the surprise best show on UK TV of course it's done well.

Pineapple Dance Studios.

 

[DiscoJer]

Curious why this game did so well when Boogie which was a similar concept failed so horribly. :lol

Well, look at Amazon.com's reviews and see what consumers think:

I would say that the consensus that Boogie has a Kareoke part, not just dancing and so is bit confused as to what it is; seemed too kiddie (and thus patronizing to many Wii owners); too gamey, requiring you to unlock a bunch of stuff and missions; bad loading times; high price ($60 at launch); not all original tracks

OTOH Just Dance averaged like 4 1/2 stars. The reviews seem to agree on having mostly original tracks (only two covers); is based on real dances and has amusing but not patronizing graphics ; and well, fun. Fun is probably the most common description. I think that's sometimes something that game designers miss out on. No failing seems to be another thing that is popular. Again, game designers miss this, but it's something that I think made The Sims so popular.

Most the complaints seem to be from teenagers/20-ishes about the soundtrack being too old. Or from the elderly for it not being old enough. (One suggests a Richard Simmons Dancing to the Oldies game...but there's only like 20 negative reviews for it out of 400+)

Another thing, that seems to be going over the heads of many in this thread, is that people don't play it just to get a high score. So they aren't just twirling around the wiimote, they dance along with the videos, trying to replicate the moves, because it's fun. So a big part of it is not necessarily the scoring (which many do feel isn't as accurate as it should be), but the presentation and choreography of the dancing

 

[jorma]

Uh hold on now. Are people really suggesting that Heavy Rain and Just Dance are products of similar quality?

 

[Jtrizzy]

The idea behind the game is great, but they need to do a better job with it using the updated tech for each console. Right now it's just kind of hit or miss whether it's actually registering the movements, and it's painfully obvious that it's only able to tell where the wiimote is.

In other words, it's really like your right arm is dancing and the rest of your body can do whatever. (Which it can)

 

[Sirius]

*Facepalm* ... ffs.

Pretty much why third parties are scaling down Wii development in favour of titles like this. Convince the masses that their shallow controls actually map their actions 1:1, and sit back to watch the dough roll in.

The balance tips further down the other side.

 

[Prine]

Dont get upset or surprised when these types of products is all you get from 3rd parties. I dont understand this about Nintendo fans when they think its some anomaly. More will follow.

 

[Mael]

Dont get upset or surprised when these types of products is all you get from 3rd parties. I dont understand this about Nintendo fans when they think its some anomaly. More will follow.

I guess it's similar to how there's only military power shooters for the hd twins :lol

 

[Animation-Imp]

I'm part of the "problem"

My wife wanted it, so I gave her a copy this christmas.

This might sound stupid,
but it's the only game that's played on a regular basis in my otherwise dust-collecting Wii collection.

When visitors come over (mostly non-gamer females), they go bananas for Just Dance.
They don't mind the scoring, they don't mind it's not a game, they don't mind the small selection of songs and fugly graphics.
They love feeling foolish and jumping around in my livingroom,
laughing at their silliness.

So I understand these sale figures,
this is why many households got a wii,
partygames like wii sports (in a lesser extend wii-play), Rayman raving rabbits and noiw Just dance.

It acknowledges my theory of the Wii being viewed more as a toy then as a gaming console in a lot of households.

 

[Nuclear Muffin]

People asking for more accuracy don't understand it's appeal, the success of the game stems from the fact that it lets the player just enjoy dancing without cluttering up the experience with stupid onscreen instructions.

While I'm certain that the guys at Ubisoft made the game with the utmost contempt for its customers, the game as it is has every right to be successful (and there's nothing wrong with this type of game being successful at all, a greater variety of successful games is good for the industry!)

Good promotion and a low price certainly help too! (Though I'm sure that the onslaught of inevitable cash-in sequels will bomb spectacularly as they either offer nothing new, or Ubisoft do something stupid and miss the point entirely)

 

[Eteric Rice]

I'm part of the "problem"

My wife wanted it, so I gave her a copy this christmas.

This might sound stupid,
but it's the only game that's played on a regular basis in my otherwise dust-collecting Wii collection.

When visitors come over (mostly non-gamer females), they go bananas for Just Dance.
They don't mind the scoring, they don't mind it's not a game, they don't mind the small selection of songs and fugly graphics.
They love feeling foolish and jumping around in my livingroom,
laughing at their silliness.

So I understand these sale figures,
this is why many households got a wii,
partygames like wii sports (in a lesser extend wii-play), Rayman raving rabbits and noiw Just dance.

It acknowledges my theory of the Wii being viewed more as a toy then as a gaming console in a lot of households.

I think gaming consoles are pretty much viewed as toys anyway.

 

[Mael]

I think gaming consoles are pretty much viewed as toys anyway.

It's like model trains, everyone know they're toys but the smelly guys in the back with an unhealthy addiction that claim it's a lifestyle or something.

 

[linsivvi]

Dont get upset or surprised when these types of products is all you get from 3rd parties. I dont understand this about Nintendo fans when they think its some anomaly. More will follow.

Konami made Para Para Paradise almost a decade ago and it was a hit in the arcade. Have they stopped making hardcore games?

Try not to be so insecure about your hobby. There are more than one segment of the market.

 

[robjoh]

I think gaming consoles are pretty much viewed as toys anyway.

Agree, I bought a GameCube to get a toy to start up during my student years and I bought an xbox360 to get a new toy when no new games where coming for my GameCube.

 

[Sohter.Nura]

This game is pretty fun. I'd buy a Natal just to get a sequel with smarter tracking.
It's not good good, but it's pretty impossible not to like it. Really obvious to see why it's selling when you put it in front of more than two people.

Yeah, I think Natal would make it a lot more like an actual game, but then again, I think part of the fun of the game itself is that it doesn't track movements really well. If it did, maybe it just wouldn't attract people that much?

 

[gerg]

Yeah, I think Natal would make it a lot more like an actual game, but then again, I think part of the fun of the game itself is that it doesn't track movements really well. If it did, maybe it just wouldn't attract people that much?

I don't think that there'd be anything innately harmful in making the game more accurate. I think that what would hurt this type of game would be if this accuracy then meant that the game was that much harsher on incorrect movements, or that the whole game was structured towards dancing "correctly".

 

[Prine]

Konami made Para Para Paradise almost a decade ago and it was a hit in the arcade. Have they stopped making hardcore games?

Try not to be so insecure about your hobby. There are more than one segment of the market.

Its was a poke at people crying when 3rd parties release games like this.

 

[Animation-Imp]

The catch is its simplicity.
You can stand anywhere, just hold a remote and dance your ass of.
Nothing else is required.

I still think there's a fundamental difference in how the public percieves consoles between the Wii and his hd competitors.

For many households the Wii looks simple, easy to grasp, more toy-like,
while the hd consoles look difficult, more computer-like (mediadevice).

I think you're right in pointing out most consoles are viewed as toys,
but i think that's mostly before a hands on. Many of my friends just don't get the 360 or the ps3, they're too difficult.

 

[Stumpokapow]

In the event this makes it to a million units sold domestically, it will be the lowest rated (Metacritic/Gamerankings/whatever) million seller in US history.

 

[phisheep]

It's fantastic that people are enjoying themselves, but as it's my job to take a game on its merits, when breaking down the actual mechanics shows that even the singular thing it does in terms of interactivity is broken, surely you can understand why some would poo-poo the product and not the ones having fun with it? It's a half-assed effort and it's being rewarded. That's what I take issue with. It's also why I scored the review the way I did.

I'm definitely not ignoring the social part of things as that is literally the lion's share of what you get with Just Dance (and yes, I made a complete idiot out of myself while playing with my roommate, but then she's used to that after all these years of seeing me play stuff). I'm not contesting its success. I'm not saying my opinion is any more right than the two million people that obviously liked the game enough to purchase it. I am saying that I feel that for $40 people could get a whole lot more on top of the fun they already had, and in retrospect that this game probably shouldn't have been reviewed with the normal IGN scale because it comes up as a severely lacking product by the same standard that we'd apply to every other game out there.

I don't get it Sam. Are you reviewing the game, or are you reviewing its price?

Would you have given it an 8 if it cost 10 bucks? 15? 20? Where's the cutoff?

Would Heavy Rain get a 2 if it cost 200?

That's not reviewing the game on its merits.

 

[Cdammen]

I really wanna try this and see how good it measures rhytmic movement... and it looks like a lot of fun.

Good on them.

 

[Amir0x]

FWIW I'm pretty sure Just Dance is the best third party game on the Wii.

Yup. I've always been told that the reason games sell (or don't sell) is how high quality they are. Knowing this fact, it is easy to see why Just Dance rose above the fray. It has nothing to do with the demographics of the platform, but with how polished and intuitive it is to play. It really speaks to Ubisoft's dedication to the Wii that they put so much effort into making this game.

I'll be supporting them with my money in the future.

 

[Brobzoid]

I don't get it Sam. .

It's IGN homie. nothing to get.

 

[Baki]

I don't get it Sam. Are you reviewing the game, or are you reviewing its price?

Would you have given it an 8 if it cost 10 bucks? 15? 20? Where's the cutoff?

Would Heavy Rain get a 2 if it cost 200?

That's not reviewing the game on its merits.

The value of the product is also part of a product's "merits". Really not that hard to get.

 

[Acosta]

First, I'm going to say that the tag of SamBishop is the most unfair thing I have seen in this forum in years. Sam has been a great poster for years, and I have seen him giving well argued and balanced arguments even in the most heated discussions. A tag mocking him for a perfectly fair and argumented reason (that you could agree or not) is not what I expect from the high standards I have for the moderation of gaf.

I think gaming consoles are pretty much viewed as toys anyway.

For who? your mom? I don't give a shit what the "masses" think of videogames, they have no clue and I'm not going to level my view of videogames to theirs.

The idea that a simple idea, executed in an enjoyable fashion, can somehow be as fun -- or even more fun -- for some people than some sort of elaborate, baroquely complex "core game" is (apparently) an existential threat to an industry built up around circular bro-hug exchanges for titles that appeal to a single narrow demographic. A site like IGN has to give a game like Just Dance a terrible score, pretty much completely without regard to the actual content of the game.

You are the one that complain each time a reviewer fails to see the marvelous joy of a "game" that a cat could play succesfully with the wiimote attached to its tail.

Personally, I don't give a crap if the game sells a trillion, Just Dance has no merit, it has no design, not technical effort and it´s visuals are unappealing to say the least. What do you expect the critics say?

 

[ShinNL]

So if you guys aren't buying games for fun and playtime, what are you buying games for?

Personally, I don't give a crap if the game sells a trillion, Just Dance has no merit, it has no design, not technical effort and it´s visuals are unappealing to say the least. What do you expect the critics say?

Boy are you uptight or what. Yeah, the game made itself, no thoughts, ideas, design and programming went into it at all! Oh yeah, the lack of grittiness and darkness sure makes this game look bad. Why don't you just go back to your couch and play some console shooter.

 

[Acosta]

So if you guys aren't buying games for fun and playtime, what are you buying games for?

Boy are you uptight or what. Yeah, the game made itself, no thoughts, ideas, design and programming went into it at all! Oh yeah, the lack of grittiness and darkness sure makes this game look bad. Why don't you just go back to your couch and play some console shooter.

Please, define "fun" to us so we can understand the concept. Saying a game is "fun" is the same as saying nothing.

 

[cw_sasuke]

So if you guys aren't buying games for fun and playtime, what are you buying games for?

Boy are you uptight or what. Yeah, the game made itself, no thoughts, ideas, design and programming went into it at all! Oh yeah, the lack of grittiness and darkness sure makes this game look bad. Why don't you just go back to your couch and play some console shooter.

To talk about them on GAF

 

[Hammer24]

Hilarious tag aside, sambishop has a point. Being a good concept should not be rewarded (by critics, at least) if the execution is terrible.

Whatever happened to reviews of a game, taking into consideration if its actually fun to play? Nowadays you can read walls of text about production values and platform exclusivity - no casual gives a shit about. If the production value makes the score, and not the fun part, then reviewers shouldn´t wonder why readers turn away and they consequently lose their jobs.