Support NeoGAF

[justsomeguy]

MCC made it hard to convince any of my friends that Halo 5 had the best multiplayer of any Halo game. A few of them eventually figured it out, but some just refused to even try it.

Yeah. I am still mad about MCC. I'd love to see a post mortem on that.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

Not going to happen. Been saying this for how many years now?

I don't think it will either but you never know.
Anyone remember Everquest?

 

[jelly]

They definitely can and did with halo 5. Some of the best MP in the series

The mechanics of 343 Halo are really good but I wouldn't say they knocked it out the park with everything else. There are on the right track and get some stuff right. Campaign and co-op is a big thing for many people, they haven't done well in that area yet and MP doesn't give them a pass and certainly isn't content packed like old Halo no matter how many REQs and unlocks they bundle. 343 need both to be amazing. Third times a charm.

 

[shoreu]

I know right. Halo 3 in this day and age would sell much less than Halo 5. Purists don't seem to realize that. The landscape has changed. Games have their periods in time and people move on

honestly that term Purist is meh They aren't purist they just stick to the older game and act like they claim ownership to the series. I've been playing just as long and i can appreciate the things that Halo 5 has done for the series. I think it's time they innovate on the campaign a bit more and make a focus on more Cooperative content so people aren't put off by the Online

Exactly! Not to mention they supported the shit outta of it and continue to do so.

Better than pretty much anyone else

 

[viHuGi]

250-300m install base still not enough? That's like 8 times PS4 install base.

Most dont play games specially not on the Store.

Fable Legends should have been on Steam and Windows 7.

 

[BeamImpact]

wow expecting to have sold 2x the amount of consoles by now is quite a risky assumption they did, i would have expected the top management to calculate with some more realistic figures
2x would literally mean they expected to be the market leader right from the launch onwards with a sales-over-time-rate in the regions of the Wii

 

[Welfare]

Even if they are talking about Win10 Minecraft, it still makes no sense.

It's free to all existing Java users and it's the Pocket version for Win10 for $9.99, and is marketed as a beta.

What the hell would be a good number for this to be at? Not much. How can this be so below expectations when they should be low to begin with.

 

[michaelius]

And MS being a analytical company, it's probably right on par to what they thought it would sell.

Analytical company with proven track record of successes

- Zune
- GfWL
- Bing
- Nokia aquisition
- Arm based Surface Tablets
- Windows Phone 10
- Xbox One

 

[ethomaz]

wow expecting to have sold 2x the amount of consoles by now is quite a risky assumption they did, i would have expected the top management to calculate with some more realistic figures
2x would literally mean they expected to be the market leader right from the launch onwards with a sales-over-time-rate in the regions of the Wii

Not only MS but 3rd-parties expected Xbone to be sales leader this gen.

 

[ProvenDeadly]

I love Halo 5's MP, but it's gonna have a much narrower fanbase than other FPS' just because of it's difficulty. I think one of the bigger issues is that, despite being Microsoft's premier studio, 343 really doesn't inspire any confidence.

They just ripped off CoD mechanics for Halo 4, and MCC was straight up broken, and still is. Where's Frank O Connor with that explanation of why it launched as it did that he promised? They launched Halo Waypoint, which had a bit of life, then replaced it with The Halo Channel, which basically died immediately, never mind because it lacked content, it performed horribly on XB1. Why did a video streaming service stutter and lag so much? Forward unto Dawn was decent, and Nightfall was abysmal, and what happened to that Spielberg TV show? The most recent offense being Halo 5's boring story, especially compared to what the marketing and Hunt the Truth were doing, how come we didn't get that in the game? Instead, the big thing for campaign was 4 player coop and some of the most basic AI commands seen in any video game.

I think all of this stems from the fact that 343 doesn't really have much in the way of creativity or innovation. Bungie pushed brand new features, and we've not actually seen anything "new" in Halo since they left. Look at Doom's Snapmap versus the current state of Forge in Halo 5. Sure Tom French and the Forge team are doing amazing work putting in new features with every update, but then they're hindered by the lack of a custom games playlist in matchmaking and a decent way of finding the content people are making. Even Halo 3 had the "Bungie Favourites" bit.

It hurts to say it, because I really like Halo, especially Halo 5, but even when you look at the DLC plan for Halo 5 being old features from previous games, I can't say 343 is a studio I trust. In all honesty, I only really enjoy the Arena multiplayer, and I'm inclined to say it seems to have come together as more of an accident than any skill or direction.

On top of that, the Xbox One's position is probably hurting all its exclusives, so they have less and less money to play with.

I would also add that they can't even seem to copy what Bungie did well in terms of outside infrastructure and content. Halo 3 had better functioning systems and that game came out 9 years ago. None of my friends trust 343 either and they've all quit playing Halo because of it.

 

[UpDownLeftRight]

Windows 10 Store is going to be the next Windows Mobile.
Nobody cares about it.

You know what? I've had W10 for most of a year now and I still don't even know how to access the store. I quickly removed a bunch of crap I didn't want on my start menu and one of those was probably the store link. Since then, I've never encountered it and never will. I guess my point is, it actually appears like bloatware to most users and even the less tech savvy people I know have asked me to remove the same stuff from theirs. Anecdotal sure, but I do think there's something wrong with the way their latest OS tries to represent itself to the user and in effect making some of their own software appear intrusive.

 

[ProvenDeadly]

Not only MS but 3rd-parties expected Xbone to be sales leader this gen.

I can't wrap my mind around how it happened so fast so it must have been a shock to them.

 

[prwxv3]

Not only MS but 3rd-parties expected Xbone to be sales leader this gen.

And then you had companies like SE that were headging their bets and announcing two big JRPG games (KH3 and FF15) on both consoles just in case ps4 performed like early PS3. And now look at their Japanese game platform choices lol.

 

[LordBaztion]

I understand 2012 MS expecting to in Sony's position at this point but, somehow, they didn't adjust their expectations after terrible 2013?

Minecraft's expectations should have been huge for it to under perform. I think the future of that franchise is in expansion other media they should be pushing movies and series more strongly.

I don't know how are they measuring W10 use base but the service basically has just started and MS has barely released a couple of big games, I think it's too early to cal it a failure.

W10/Xbox integration is the way to go, gradually eliminate the consoles and concentrate all hardcore gaming around Windows, and take advantage of azure as much as possible.

 

[JaggedSac]

I don't know if I'm inclined to entirely believe this.

I don't doubt that MS isn't happy with performance, but this sounds like people who were fired looking for reasons other than "no one wanted Fable Legends"

Yeah, I can't imagine MS thought they would have 600 million Windows 10 devices by this point in time.

 

[Poster#1]

Win 10 below expectations? Yeah I don't believe this.

 

[VincentMatts]

honestly that term Purist is meh They aren't purist they just stick to the older game and act like they claim ownership to the series. I've been playing just as long and i can appreciate the things that Halo 5 has done for the series. I think it's time they innovate on the campaign a bit more and make a focus on more Cooperative content so people aren't put off by the Online

I agree with innovating on the campaign. 343 put all their eggs in the MP basket and it shows. Halo would benefit by going open world-ish for one. Kinda like ODST was.

This model 343 are using, its whats been done since the very beginning and thats fine, but they need to grow a pair and start innovating. How much cooler would a Halo game be if you just gave someone a map and tell them ok, pick the mission you want in this open world and go. Create an open world type game for the SP. Stop doing everything exactly the same. This isnt 2001. Games that are popular now are games that have an addictive progression system, like destiny, Division, Overwatch, etc. Theyre all addictive. They all give you loot that you strive for.

Im not saying Halo needs to become a loot based game, but some of those aspects would only benefit the game greatly.

Everything 343 has done, theyve had some good ideas but screwed it up on its execution. Every single time.

 

[AmyS]

They're getting ready for that scorpion sting.

I think this is why Scorpio is rumored to be so powerful. Trying to copy that x360 Magic.

This makes sense. With everything we've heard as well it seems they are moving away from the XBOX ONE branding.

We'll get a slim announcement st e3 and I think they'll go all in on Scorpio. The Xbox One was a huge misstep for them and I think they want to distance themselves from it

All of this ^

Agreed, you guys, very much agree.

 

[Nightengale]

Win 10 below expectations? Yeah I don't believe this.

http://www.theverge.com/2015/4/29/8514343/windows-10-1-billion-devices-goal

 

[walltowall]

I wonder who at MS thought there would be 600 million Win10 installs in lees that a year.

And are they still employed?

 

[AHA-Lambda]

W10 installs below expectations really??

 

[Bitch Pudding]

People ridiculing article for Minecraft need to do some math.

Even if each copy sold was worth 20$ to Microsoft (which we can safely guess it isn't) it would be 1 bilion $ in sales which isn't even half of what they paid.

I don't think they're dissatisfied because Minecraft didn't fullfil sales expectations or break-even.

They're dissatisfied because it didn't accomplish its major task: Push Windows phone and Windows store market shares. From that point of view, this $2,5bn investment utterly, utterly failed.

 

[gamz]

Analytical company with proven track record of successes

- Zune
- GfWL
- Bing
- Nokia aquisition
- Arm based Surface Tablets
- Windows Phone 10
- Xbox One

Every product is not going to be a hit. I mean come on.

 

[jet1911]

You'd think that after the mess that was Halo 4 and the MCC their Halo 5 expectation would be in check lol.

 

[shoreu]

MCC made it hard to convince any of my friends that Halo 5 had the best multiplayer of any Halo game. A few of them eventually figured it out, but some just refused to even try it.

Same

The mechanics of 343 Halo are really good but I wouldn't say they knocked it out the park with everything else. There are on the right track and get some stuff right. Campaign and co-op is a big thing for many people, they haven't done well in that area yet and MP doesn't give them a pass and certainly isn't content packed like old Halo no matter how many REQs and unlocks they bundle. 343 need both to be amazing. Third times a charm.

I can agree with you on the Campaign it needs to be bigger and better Hopefully Let's them do that. However, you may have had a point on content at launch but the game has been loaded with it at this point the only thing it Lacks is true Btb Maps

 

[Mooreberg]

So what doesn't add up here? Halo 5 underperforming adds up. Minecraft doesn't. Xbox consoles doesn't. Windows 10 installations doesn't. Is the source just an ex-Lionhead employee?

Windows Store is the problem. 98% of ROTR PC players got it through Steam. Fable Legends would likely have been similar. Windows 10 installations where people continue to install PC software through other means (Steam, direct downloads through websites) dont do much for MS. Nobody asked for an "app store" on PC.

It seems like one big strategic problem where the future of software distribution (or the present, for non-gaming applications) is digital, and they control very little of it outside of Xbox. This to me stems from the overall failure of WoA (Windows on ARM). They got no foothood on where a lot of application development occurs these days (platform stakes, not tools like Xamarin). All of the Windows and Xbox One apps would have inevitability happened once universal apps were rolled out to an actual developer base.

They are fighting on a lot of fronts. Apple focuses on iOS and OSX. Google focuses on Android and Chrome. Sony focuses on PS4. Microsoft is trying to do everything.

 

[Breakage]

Not surprised at Halo 5. Nobody talks about it these days.

 

[VincentMatts]

Not surprised at Halo 5. Nobody talks about it these days.

No one talks about COD either.

 

[Outrun]

Yeah the PR for Halo 5 just stopped after release

Fortunately the updates didn't....

 

[And_Boy]

From http://www.theverge.com/2015/4/29/8514343/windows-10-1-billion-devices-goal
"Microsoft says Windows 10 will be on a billion devices within three years"

 

[gamz]

I don't think it will either but you never know.
Anyone remember Everquest?

Is that even comparable?

 

[chromatic9]

It's a month old graph from Hexus but considering win 10 has been free for a year I wasn't that impressed. Win8 and 8.1 nearly match win10.

 

[Guevara]

.

how many opted in tho

 

[Outrun]

Shoddy story if you ask me.

Who thought that Win 10 would be adopted more than what it has been??

 

[JaggedSac]

http://www.theverge.com/2015/4/29/8514343/windows-10-1-billion-devices-goal

3 years. They will be over the 33% mark at the 1 year mark.

 

[Blueblur1]

Same


I can agree with you on the Campaign it needs to be bigger and better Hopefully Let's them do that. However, you may have had a point on content at launch but the game has been loaded with it at this point the only thing it Lacks is true Btb Maps

It's still missing at least a dozen game types.

 

[TheDarkKnight774]

Shoddy story if you ask me.

Who thought that Win 10 would be adopted more than what it has been??

It's not about what we think is realistic. It's about what MS forecasted for themselves. And companies can be very very optimistic.

 

[FullMetaltech]

I've never actually opened the store to begin with. Always got my games through Steam and the other services like Origin and EA Access so I can see why they implying it since most pc users go that route either way.

 

[LukasTaves]

Probably talking about how sales have most likely stagnated. No one is questioning it's overall success but MS did spend a ton to buy the series.

Didn't Minecraft doubled it's sales since Ms aquisition?

So it hasn't slowed down either.

 

[Elandyll]

Shoddy story if you ask me.

Who thought that Win 10 would be adopted more than what it has been??

How many computers elligible to upgrade for Free?
How many actually upgraded?

I guess the projection was a very high rate of conversion, and the reality much less, even if the number itself still seems huge?

As per Minecraft, if the report is accurate, I imagine the disappointment does not stem from the number of Minecraft licences, but more likely the actual $ sales and -where- the purchases were made (platform/ portal).

 

[VincentMatts]

It's not about what we think is realistic. It's about what MS forecasted for themselves. And companies can be very very optimistic.

Especially when its free.

But then again, people hated getting a free U2 album, so you figure it out.

 

[randomengine]

They bought Minecraft after it already peaked. Of course it will disappoint, you are at the long tail-end of its popularity.

 

[Mrbob]

W10 installs below expectations really??

It is a free upgrade so that is probably why.

 

[c0de]

Not only MS but 3rd-parties expected Xbone to be sales leader this gen.

Who? Or do you mean sales in the west when it comes to EA?

 

[And_Boy]

how many opted in tho

It was theirs early expactation, not actual numbers.

 

[J_Viper]

I know 343 can't be removed from Halo at this point, but MS really needs to do something to shake up the franchise.

They already have two big misses at this point with Halo 4 and 5, I don't think they could take another.

 

[LukasTaves]

A majority of the 100 million sales happened before MS even owned Minecraft.

Heck, MS has very obviously not recouped anywhere close to the amount of money they spent on Minecraft yet.

They never intended to (or so they said at least). The explaning was: There's no other investment in the world right now that we can invest 2 billion dollars that will give us as much money as Minecraft, so that's why we did it.

 

[michaelius]

3 years. They will be over the 33% mark at the 1 year mark.

Free upgrade period is ending in July. They won't be able to keep adoption rate at this level for next two years.

If we use steam stats only around half of upgrades happened in first month after that it slowed to crawl.

 

[Philippo]

I think Scorpio as a successor of XB1 is a mistake, they should just brand it a Win10 machine and completely merge the two ecosystems together.

 

[Toki767]

wow expecting to have sold 2x the amount of consoles by now is quite a risky assumption they did, i would have expected the top management to calculate with some more realistic figures
2x would literally mean they expected to be the market leader right from the launch onwards with a sales-over-time-rate in the regions of the Wii

It was supposed to be the next watercooler.

Turns out people were just thirsty for a different drink.