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[i-Lo]

BF4 is rumored to be running in 60fps on next gen consoles. Dream a little bigger darling.

I mustn't and neither should you before you have proof being presented either by official source or have seen it with your own eyes.

Anything can run 60fps and simultaneously at 1080p. It's about how much detail there is in the scene that is needed to be rendered.

Plus BF4 for XB3 and PS4 may look like BF3 for PS3 and 360 compared to the version on PC, i.e. gimped.

 

[Reiko]

I mustn't and neither should you before you have proof being presented either by official source or have seen it with your own eyes.

Anything can run 60fps and simultaneously at 1080p. It's about how much detail there is in the scene that is needed to be rendered.

Plus BF4 for XB3 and PS4 may look like BF3 for PS3 and 360 compared to the version on PC, i.e. gimped.

It's using DX11 spec like on PC.

And... DICE and EA haven't denied anything...



They usually do quickly on Twitter

 

[Mik2121]

Welcome to this thread haha.

I know, right? I have been reading other posts after my reply and it's like every other person just thinks that a game's art style or other things are just defined by what engine it uses. Sure, it might help get some art styles done easier than others, but still... wow :/

 

[i-Lo]

Well so far... DICE and EA haven't denied anything...

They usually do quickly on Twitter

Well why would they? People are free to assume what they want to without any obligatory intervention. It adds to the hype and is in essence free promotion of the product.

I just don't want you guys to be disappointed, that's all. As bad as things are now with how some people are disappointed with the Wii U on either HW or software port front and have been very vocal about it, things can be a lot more volatile and uglier when XB3 and PS4 are announced with games running on them and all of a sudden it's not up to the overwhelming hype that preceded the début.

 

[Reiko]

Well why would they? People are free to assume what they want to without any obligatory intervention. It adds to the hype and is in essence free promotion of the product.

I just don't want you guys to be disappointed, that's all. As bad as things are now with how some people are disappointed with the Wii U on either HW or software port front and have been very vocal about it, things can be a lot more volatile and uglier when XB3 and PS4 are announced with games running on them and all of a sudden it's not up to the overwhelming hype that preceded the début.

The fruits of the leak will be revealed if the final DLC for BF3 is confirmed. Right now, nobody knows about that...

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

I'm a harsh critic of the wii u, especially when it comes to the power of the system, but with that said that Zelda demo looks by far better than anything on ps3 or 360. Whether or not a wii u game will ever look that good remains to be seen.

It really doesn't.

Uncharted series (2 & 3), God of War, Beyond, Last of Us, Halo 4, etc. all look at the very least of comparable quality, and I'd argue they look superior.

 

[ACH1LL3US]

While I am not going as rude, I have kept my expectations in check. I expect the first generation PS4 or Xbox 3 games to look like the best looking games out for PS3 and 360 that are up-rez'd and anti-aliased with perhaps better real time shadows.

In time however, hopefully, games will look as good as BF3 at somewhere between high and max setting with optimization.

In the twilight years, we should see games that come somewhere close to Crysis 3 in effects but not in resolution.

Sorry if I came off as rude, that was not my intention.

Resolution and image quality are very important to me, even if next gen can surpass crysis 3 in assets, doing that combined with 1080p an iq I personally don't think next gen will be able to all of those things at once.

If crysis 3 had all the same assets as the pc version running at max settings at 720p , to me it wouldn't look near as good as 1080p same assets.

 

[CronoShot]

I'm a harsh critic of the wii u, especially when it comes to the power of the system, but with that said that Zelda demo looks by far better than anything on ps3 or 360. Whether or not a wii u game will ever look that good remains to be seen.

Don't really agree with this, but I think it looks comparable to some of the better looking PS360 games. Lighting is quite good.

Also, Zelda games generally end up looking quite a bit better than their tech demos, so that's good sign.

 

[Zarx]

Well if Unity 4 quilifies Unigine is probably worth a look, it's still very much WIP and they are basicaly an indie studio, but they were one of the first to do a proper DX11 tech demo and the engine is coming along.

Features

Multiple API render (DirectX 9 / DirectX 10 / DirectX 11 / OpenGL 3.x / OpenGL 4.x / OpenGL ES 2.0 / OpenGL ES 3.0 / PS3)
Shader Model 5.0 support
Hardware tessellation with displacement mapping
Real-time global illumination
Per-pixel dynamic lighting
DOF with Bokeh effect
Subsurface scattering
Cinematic post-processes
Volumetric light, shadow and fog

 

[JordanN]

Was going through some of my youtube favourites and happened to stumble upon an old video.

It's the NeutronEngine. Technically not a game engine (more of a real time 3D renderer) although I recall one of the dev's said you could try and make a game with it. It basically uses alot of Directx 11 for doing stuff like Bokeh Depth of Field and Tessellation. It's also compatible with Directx 10.1 with the difference being some features are turned off.

Some videos of the engine in action:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A01KzQSNqdw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rg-7-lP6iNc

 

[Metroid-Squadron]

There's a clip of Crysis 3 -- some dev walkthrough showing your dude dodging rockets in the grass and then fighting in the sewers -- and at one point a Cell soldier jumps into ankle-high water in front of the player. This creates ripples in the water, and as the water deforms it casts a reflection of the ripple on the surrounding surfaces. The rippling water correctly reflects light in real time on the surrounding geometry.

...

mindblown.gif

 

[Thunder Monkey]

To the guy posting that Zelda image.

You do realize that they rarely achieve better versus their demos in a purely technical sense right? Most of the time it's just more efficient uses of the hardware that end with better looking games. Tech demos are rarely achieved in gameplay.

 

[shinobi602]

I am sorry my friend but be prepared to be VERY disappointed :

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rdGmH2AFvQo

Next gen will not look like Crysis 3 maxed out, this gen couldn't even come close to crysis 1 maxed out, what makes you think next gen will at 1080p?

I have to say the amount of ignorance to how much power is needed to run a game like that max is staggering.

Maybe not at 1080p, but I have no doubt the next gen MS/Sony systems will be able to run it with all the bells and whistles turned on, but most likely at a somewhat lower framerate and resolution.

 

[Black_Stride]

what we want:
http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/575/412/81.jpg[/IMG

what we will probably get:
[IMG]http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/575/412/79.jpg[/IMG
But yea SE did open conference for Luminous Studio this week, so a lot of Japanese game sites have loads of information on them.
They were running it on single GTX680 with 32GB of RAM.[/QUOTE]

Nobody wants FXAA.
And theres a thread about this demo, pretty interesting stuff.

 

[Always-honest]

Maybe not at 1080p, but I have no doubt the next gen MS/Sony systems will be able to run it with all the bells and whistles turned on, but most likely at a somewhat lower framerate and resolution.

To the guy posting that Zelda image.

You do realize that they rarely achieve better versus their demos in a purely technical sense right? Most of the time it's just more efficient uses of the hardware that end with better looking games. Tech demos are rarely achieved in gameplay.

Yeah, but nintendo usually exceeds them

 

[The_Hitcher89]

Wonder if the ICE guys will come up with an all-new engine for the PS4, or adapt the current one.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Yeah, but nintendo usually exceeds them

Through intelligent uses of the hardware.

Not because they've outdone what was achieved in a tech demo.

 

[zoukka]

Through intelligent uses of the hardware.

Not because they've outdone what was achieved in a tech demo.

This is the nature of all tech demos and game development.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

This is the nature of all tech demos and game development.

Duh.

I'm trying to explain why it's disingenuous to say they exceed their tech demos. In a purely technical sense they don't. Even though the end results look better.

 

[Reiko]

Wonder if the ICE guys will come up with an all-new engine for the PS4, or adapt the current one.

All new. They can finally offload their work to the GPU without much hassle

 

[Pranay]

I wonder what new stuff we will see in sport games.

 

[Reiko]

I wonder what new stuff we will see in sport games.

All of the detail is there. It just needs even higher fidelity.

I hope 2K gets to make a next gen football game.

 

[squidyj]

All new. They can finally offload their work to the GPU without much hassle

i think you mean stop offloading work onto SPEs

 

[Reiko]

i think you mean stop offloading work onto SPEs

Better correction.

 

[The_Hitcher89]

I wonder what new stuff we will see in sport games.

Same shite as we got this gen with fooball/soccer games, to an even worse degree. Focus on animation and shiny graphics at the expense of engaging gameplay and the feeling of weight and satisfaction that Pro Evo provided on the PS2. Shite ball physics, awkward and sloppy player movement and unresponsive controls. That's current-gen alright

 

[Reiko]

Same shite as we got this gen with fooball/soccer games, to an even worse degree. Focus on animation and shiny graphics at the expense of engaging gameplay and the feeling of weight and satisfaction that Pro Evo provided on the PS2. Shite ball physics, awkward and sloppy player movement and unresponsive controls. That's current-gen alright

No that's just EA's lack of commitment.

EA is dropping NCAA football exclusivity in 2014. As well as the Arena Football license for just sitting on it.


Time for the king to return.

 

[nelsonroyale]

People are low balling expectations if they think Crysis 3 is beyond what we will see next gen. I mean next gen consoles will be around for 5 or 6 years, ample time for devs to optimize their engines.

 

[The_Hitcher89]

No that's just EA's lack of commitment.

EA is dropping NCAA football exclusivity in 2014. As well as the Arena Football license for just sitting on it.


Time for the king to return.

Don't think Konami have it in them anymore. Probably talking out of my arse, but I reckon they should take a year out, let FIFA have the year unopposed, and spend 2 years getting their house in order. They have to try and remember what made the old games so good, and replicate it if they can, even if it means sacrificing some animations or 360-degree dribbling.

If they came back at even a fraction of their old quality, they'd absolutely blow FIFA out of the water. Is it true that Seabass was fired?

 

[universalmind]

It's using DX11 spec like on PC.

And... DICE and EA haven't denied anything...



They usually do quickly on Twitter

 

[Reiko]

Don't think Konami have it in them anymore. Probably talking out of my arse, but I reckon they should take a year out, let FIFA have the year unopposed, and spend 2 years getting their house in order. They have to try and remember what made the old games so good, and replicate it if they can, even if it means sacrificing some animations or 360-degree dribbling.

If they came back at even a fraction of their old quality, they'd absolutely blow FIFA out of the water. Is it true that Seabass was fired?

I have no idea. Last I heard he was working on a new secret project for 2013.

 

[The_Hitcher89]

I have no idea. Last I heard he was working on a new secret project for 2013.

Probably a baby-killing simulator

 

[i-Lo]

Here's me wondering what the next Mass Effect game will look like on next gen Frostbite engine.

Btw, what about LoD model switches? That shit along with pop-ins can really detract from immersion. I remember watching nVidia's Endless City demo where tessellation was used to replace multiple LoDs. Will we see something akin to that next generation?

 

[rottendevice]

It's worth mentioning id Tech 6, even though we know hardly anything about it.

 

[Scrabble]

It's worth mentioning id Tech 6, even though we know hardly anything about it.

If I recall correctly I think Carmack said the basis would be fully customizable geometry. Basically taking the idea of mega textures and applying it to building geometry. I could be wrong on that though.

 

[Jac_Solar]

Anything that fully *supports* open world games, instead of making the development a chore, or is built up in such a way that making a slightly large, open world would require extreme amounts of performance.

Basically, an engine that is built from the ground up to support open-world development.

Even if you don't like open world games, an engine that supports open enviroments has far more options for level diversity. More realistic levels in terms of scale/exploration aspects, and of course enjoyability.

CryEngine is probably the best engine overall in terms of graphics, potential and how seemingly easy it is to make huge levels.

They really, really need to stop developing multi-million dollar engines to show off graphics, and instead focus on gameplay support and open worlds -- they can obviously develop all the linear games they want in an open world as well.

 

[StrangeADT]

To me, UE4 seems to be the least impressive, without thinking about all the bells and whistles like particle effects. I mean just by looking at it hem for a bit.

Edit - however seeing as what gears 3 did for 360, UE4 must be insane when put in masterful hands,

At this point, until we see an actual game made in all of these engines by comparatively talented teams, it's all conjecture.

 

[ghst]

Don't really agree with this, but I think it looks comparable to some of the better looking PS360 games. Lighting is quite good.

Also, Zelda games generally end up looking quite a bit better than their tech demos, so that's good sign.

the next zelda is guaranteed to look incredible on a postage stamp.

 

[toxicgonzo]

Sub'd to this thread. Props for a good OP.

Next gen is going to look amazing!

 

[Putty]

+1 for mostly looking forward to proprietary engines from both MS and Sony.

 

[cajunator]

Twilight Princess Engine

Looks like this?

- On Wii U

Dunno how it will end up but would be happy if it was close to that.

 

[aegies]

For those wondering, Ubi didn't have a front-facing name for the engine powering Watch_dogs at E3, but they did talk to me about it. It's using bits and pieces of their various internal engines — Dunia, Anvil 2, and Splinter Cell: Conviction's implementation of LEAD (which is based on UE2, which the series started off with).

I got demos of most of these at E3. I saw Watch_Dogs in person three times — and the demo went differently each time, by the way, and they covered different ground for the same objective at the end, so it wasn't especially scripted — and it's much more impressive in person than any video of it online. Video compression kicks the shit out of the IQ.

Meanwhile, UE4 is doing stuff that UE3 just can't do, particularly with lighting, and I imagine from an efficiency standpoint, it's running global illumination and deferred rendering tech better than the UE3.5 stuff we're seeing in 1313. Again, the videos you can see online of the full demo aren't doing it justice, which is going to be a trend for a lot of games this coming generation. Shit, even Wonderful 101 looks much better in person than it does in any of the videos they've released.

Other stuff: Cryengine 3 and Luminous are very philosophically similar in major ways, particularly in how they mix deferred and forward renderers to focus on each technique's strengths. Weird thing about Agni's Philosophy: first they did a full CG movie of the demo without worrying about the engine, then they rebuilt it in Luminous and did all they could to make them like for like. It seemed considerably more solid than you'd expect from most tech demos, and I don't think it's misrepresentative of what we'll see early next gen. It was pretty impressive in person, and Square worked with programmers and engineers from all over the world, including the west, to put it together.

So yeah. Get excite.

 

[Roquentin]

Was there any indication if Just Cause 3 (or whatever Avalanche Studios is working on now) will use proprietary engine?

 

[i-Lo]

It's worth mentioning id Tech 6, even though we know hardly anything about it.

Seems like id Tech 5 did not meet expectation if they already moving to id Tech 6. It's unfortunate that under the agreement with Bethesda (Zenimax) id can't license its engine to any third party developer. It's a shame that their engine doesn't get used in games beside their own. In two years time we'll most likely see a new Fallout game from Bethesda and I am sick of their Gamebryo engine.

For those wondering, Ubi didn't have a front-facing name for the engine powering Watch_dogs at E3, but they did talk to me about it. It's using bits and pieces of their various internal engines — Dunia, Anvil 2, and Splinter Cell: Conviction's implementation of LEAD (which is based on UE2, which the series started off with).

I got demos of most of these at E3. I saw Watch_Dogs in person three times — and the demo went differently each time, by the way, and they covered different ground for the same objective at the end, so it wasn't especially scripted — and it's much more impressive in person than any video of it online. Video compression kicks the shit out of the IQ.

Meanwhile, UE4 is doing stuff that UE3 just can't do, particularly with lighting, and I imagine from an efficiency standpoint, it's running global illumination and deferred rendering tech better than the UE3.5 stuff we're seeing in 1313. Again, the videos you can see online of the full demo aren't doing it justice, which is going to be a trend for a lot of games this coming generation. Shit, even Wonderful 101 looks much better in person than it does in any of the videos they've released.

Other stuff: Cryengine 3 and Luminous are very philosophically similar in major ways, particularly in how they mix deferred and forward renderers to focus on each technique's strengths. Weird thing about Agni's Philosophy: first they did a full CG movie of the demo without worrying about the engine, then they rebuilt it in Luminous and did all they could to make them like for like. It seemed considerably more solid than you'd expect from most tech demos, and I don't think it's misrepresentative of what we'll see early next gen. It was pretty impressive in person, and Square worked with programmers and engineers from all over the world, including the west, to put it together.

So yeah. Get excite.

That sounds very interesting indeed. I don't think we'll see proper utilization of UE4 before the mid life of next gen consoles. As for Luminous, while it may not a deliberate misrepresentation, what has been shown portrays greater leap than what other demos (samaritan, watch dogs) have shown to imply improvement over current gen visuals. So, I'm sceptical.

And at the end of it still doesn't answer the question about improvement that are so intrinsic to immersion:

• AA
• AF
• Abrupt LoD transitions
• Pop-in
• Z-fighting

 

[EightBitNate]

Can someone explain how iCEnhancer looks so good? Must be voodoo or some shit.

 

[Zyrusticae]

• AA
• AF
• Abrupt LoD transitions
• Pop-in
• Z-fighting

Pop-in and LOD transitions go hand-in-hand here, two symptoms of failed attempts to solve the same optimization problem. Tesselation should hopefully mitigate that, if not remove it entirely.

AF is a solved problem, and it's been one for a long time now. Unless you're talking about the consoles, in which case it's just a hardware issue.

We have some nice AA solutions in the form of TXAA and SMAA 2x/4x. Hopefully those see some good use in the future.

And Z-fighting shouldn't happen if the game uses proper collision detection... alas, it is never so simple.

 

[Perkel]

Can someone explain how iCEnhancer looks so good? Must be voodoo or some shit.

Because Boris is fucking master. His ENB is god sent for pc people.

 

[eso76]

I'm a harsh critic of the wii u, especially when it comes to the power of the system, but with that said that Zelda demo looks by far better than anything on ps3 or 360.

That's a tech demo, so basically a cutscene for now, and as such it should be compared to cutscenes.
Here's a few hours worth of current gen cutscenes you might have missed.

Halo 4
Gears of War 3
Uncharted 3 (awful quality though)
GOW3

Ehh, no, i wouldn't say it looks by far better.

And frankly, even forgetting the fact that this is indeed a tech demo, i think there's quite a few games that look better than that even while playing.

 

[Jack_AG]

All of these wonderful eyegasmic visuals won't matter when developers will push IQ over playability and push games that run 10-20fps in intense situations while controlling a human character that feels like a tank due to video latency (controller lag for everyone else).

Yep. I can see pretty visuals next-gen but the rest will remain the same: "We're aiming for 30fps at least a few times throughout the entire game!"

60fps with low video latency for smoothness of both visuals and peripheral control, plz.

 

[squidyj]

All of these wonderful eyegasmic visuals won't matter when developers will push IQ over playability and push games that run 10-20fps in intense situations while controlling a human character that feels like a tank due to video latency (controller lag for everyone else).

Yep. I can see pretty visuals next-gen but the rest will remain the same: "We're aiming for 30fps at least a few times throughout the entire game!"

60fps with low video latency for smoothness of both visuals and peripheral control, plz.

yes they will.

 

[Demoncarnotaur]

Halo 4 may be a let down on some fronts, but I am really interested to see what 343 will pull off with next gen consoles, cause Halo 4 looks crazy good. Add Bungie to the list with Destiny as well. One way or another, next gen consoles cannot come soon enough because it looks like there will be a bunch of great engines to choose from.. I only hope next gen can offer some good and fresh game experiences as well.