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Looking back I think PS1's graphics aged better than N64's (used to think opposite)
- Thread starter enigmatic_alex44
- Start date
Unless other people are willing to put up and make their own caps from real hardware, I agree. This whole 'i just grabbed whatever turned up on google images' thing ain't gonna fly.
It's called a joke. It gets passed around online for humor.
If you're going to do this, at least try to use the proper aspect ratio.
ReyVGM
Member
Here are a bunch of N64 screenshots taken with a pixel accurate plugin at their correct resolutions.
If by any chance you think they don't look "blurry" enough, that's because the CRT added an extra layer of blurriness. But the N64 plugin that shows these graphics has been verified by the MAME/MESS team. So how these screenshots look, that's how the games really looked.
http://www.vgmuseum.com/end/n64/
If by any chance you think they don't look "blurry" enough, that's because the CRT added an extra layer of blurriness. But the N64 plugin that shows these graphics has been verified by the MAME/MESS team. So how these screenshots look, that's how the games really looked.
http://www.vgmuseum.com/end/n64/
Like it or not, fmv is part of the visual package. Just like prerendered backgrounds. They were 2 things on the ps1 that really differentiated it from the n64 visually.
We are not arguing about power. If that were so, n64 wins. The end.
Holy shit, there isn't a single straight line in this shot lol.
Should have been called the Warpedstation.
SCReuter
Member
Wipeout 64 (a PS1 port), Tony Hawk's Pro Skater (a PS1 port), and a throwaway race car game probably aren't the best representations of Nintendo 64. Having said that, PlayStation's IQ is definitely crisper.
I'm checking to see if I have any old captures still left on my HDD, but so far all I can find are these tiny images of Super Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time.
What exactly am I supposed to be looking at? Both shots are in dark narrow areas that are not showing much and the flash it taking a decent piece of screen. Those just look like bad screenshots to me or really poorly chosen segments/moments for capture.
You can't see the eney in either shot because there are so far away on top of the being blocked out by the gun flash. Even more, the images are stretched tremendously.
That is definitely not how I remember them looking.
The warped geometry becomes much, much more pronounced when rendered at higher resolutions. The native res pixelly graphics actually do a lot to mitgate the effect.
DidntKnowJack
Member
Sounds like King's Field.
Interceptor
Banned
The qestion is pretty much answered once you look at actual videos and not stills.
The N64 was basically a gen ahead. Far better animations, more dynamic lights, more polys, better framerate etc etc. PSXs best was Vagrant Story and i dare you to look at real footage and not emulated nonsense. Zelda, Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, Rougue Squadron, Concer are in a whole different league if you talk graphics alone.
The N64 was basically a gen ahead. Far better animations, more dynamic lights, more polys, better framerate etc etc. PSXs best was Vagrant Story and i dare you to look at real footage and not emulated nonsense. Zelda, Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, Rougue Squadron, Concer are in a whole different league if you talk graphics alone.
Eh, emulated PS1 shots taken at native resolution are accurate to the original hardware.
Baphomet screen:
R4 on an emulator, blown up:
OTHO the N64 as it looked like is almost impossible to reproduce on an emulator, although I haven't tried that particular plug-in that was posted.
Most of the screens I posted I took myself at the games' native resolutions, except Threads of Fate and MML2, which I got from the interwebs, but they aren't uprezzed either. I made all the gifs.
I don't see how any of this matters. Nothing on the N64 approaches Tobal 2, less so in motion, and that's all there is to it. I dispute that the N64 would've been capable of reproducing it as is, anyway, since the characters are pretty high poly for the PS1 (that's where all the polys go to since the scenery is pretty simple). All of the fighters on the N64 look hideous and are horrifically polystarved.
ReyVGM
Member
Check the link I posted, there are a bunch of N64 shots taken with the pixel-accurate plugin.
While the game is crap, Mace The Dark Age looked amazing back then.
baphomet
Member
That's the first segment of each game. And neither are stretched.
This is how I remember my PS1 games.
And anytime you got close to a brick wall in silent hill
baphomet
Member
Wipeout 64 isn't a port. That racing game is considered to be one of the best looking N64 racing games. And Donkey Kong 64 still looks like shit when compared to Crash. Tony Hawk maybe a port, but it doesn't change the fact that it looks significantly worse on N64.
IMACOMPUTA
Member
Just look at the textures trying their best not to start shaking.If you want a good late gen PS1 FPS to compare with, there's Alien Resurrection
Rendering in high resolutions exacerbates the effect greatly, it's why I prefer to emulate PS1 games at their native res.
Nice, thanks!
ReyVGM said:
We have different definitions of the word amazing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-...v=-WaQvGGnhhc&feature=player_detailpage#t=145
The animation is awful it doesn't even seem to hold 30fps.
ReyVGM
Member
We have different definitions of the word amazing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-...v=-WaQvGGnhhc&feature=player_detailpage#t=145
The animation is awful it doesn't even seem to hold 30fps.
Well, I said "back then"
Besides, that's a stretched JPEG image. Here's here's another pixel-accurate screenshot at the correct resolution. You can't deny that doesn't look good.
I'm not even going to debate the polygon limits of the system. Those differences are well documented. The n64 had a higher limit both theotretically and in real world circumstances(see Turok 2 and Rogue Squadron)
Also, once again, you can't say the N64 couldn't run that, or run it better, as there are no high budget vs fighters on the N64 outside of Killer Instinct Gold, Clay Fighter, and Mortal Kombat Trilogy and 4(both of which outdid their PS1 counterparts as was demonstrated earlier in the thread) which were all sprite base expet MK4. Though, MK4 was no graphical feat.
Most fighters on the N64 were either ports or shovelware. There was nothing along the line of DOA, Tekken or Tobal. MACE would be the closted, but that is just a port of an Arcade game.
Haunted
Member
1998's Fighter's Destiny was the fighting game to beat on the N64, imo.
We have different definitions of the word amazing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-...v=-WaQvGGnhhc&feature=player_detailpage#t=145
The animation is awful it doesn't even seem to hold 30fps.
The art style was shite, the environments a joke, models were terrible, but they nailed the most important part - the animation (just skim around to different parts to get an overall impression).
Also helped that it had great methodical pacing and one of the best point systems in fighting games to this day (different moves being worth different amounts, Judo style).
Alaskanbullworm
Member
Never liked that pixelated look that PS1 games have. And looking at the *actual* comparisons, that opinion still hasn't changed.
Haunted
Member
Because Clayfighters 63 1/3 was hot garbage.
I remember it looking good its yeaaaars though. Thought it would make a good fighter comparison.
PS1 had larger cache memory and could push more polygons, so games look really nice in screenshots, but with the lack of perspective correction the 3D worlds in it's games were weird to say the least - approach a solid wall and watch as it becomes decidedly unsolid, jumping and warping every which way. Then there's also the lack of anti-aliasing, which made most games on the system look really pixellated.
The N64 had a much higher clock speed, double the ram, could handle much bigger 3D worlds with solid boundaries - walls actually looked and behaved as walls. It also had the Expansion Pak add-on that doubled the ram from 4MB to 8MB (compared to the PS1's 2MB), which developers chose to use to either double the resolution to the Dreamcast's 640*480 or add in more effects. Perfect Dark and Turok 2 - Seeds of Evil are two such examples of the former, Majora's Mask an example of the latter (notice the extra polygons in Link's face and hair, the more detailed and alive game world). Unfortunately, the N64 had a miniscule texture cache which resulted in the miserable vaseline filter.
For myself, I always preferred the N64, blurry textures and all. The games were bigger and some of the later ones especially were amazing. People have shown screenshots but not posted much videos, which is a shame. There is one video I'm going to link here that nobody has thought to mention, because it ended up not releasing on the N64 and instead was turned into Starfox Adventure on the GameCube. I remember seeing the N64 trailer and it looked incredible, and it still impresses me today considering the hardware it was running on. Here, look at the original trailer -
Dinosaur Planet
The N64 had a much higher clock speed, double the ram, could handle much bigger 3D worlds with solid boundaries - walls actually looked and behaved as walls. It also had the Expansion Pak add-on that doubled the ram from 4MB to 8MB (compared to the PS1's 2MB), which developers chose to use to either double the resolution to the Dreamcast's 640*480 or add in more effects. Perfect Dark and Turok 2 - Seeds of Evil are two such examples of the former, Majora's Mask an example of the latter (notice the extra polygons in Link's face and hair, the more detailed and alive game world). Unfortunately, the N64 had a miniscule texture cache which resulted in the miserable vaseline filter.
For myself, I always preferred the N64, blurry textures and all. The games were bigger and some of the later ones especially were amazing. People have shown screenshots but not posted much videos, which is a shame. There is one video I'm going to link here that nobody has thought to mention, because it ended up not releasing on the N64 and instead was turned into Starfox Adventure on the GameCube. I remember seeing the N64 trailer and it looked incredible, and it still impresses me today considering the hardware it was running on. Here, look at the original trailer -
Dinosaur Planet
Better than I was expecting.
Who told you the PS1 could push more polygons?
Can't a find a technial readout for the n64 but it was up to 500,000.
RowdyReverb
Member
I was just thinking this. Screenshots don't really make for fair comparison.
That depends on the mode, though, doesn't it? I thought most games used the Fast3D mode which only allowed for up to 100K polygons, as opposed to the Turbo3D mode which allowed the full 500-600K.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Compared to tekken, tobal, or Toshinden, Mace looked like poop.Well, I said "back then"
Besides, that's a stretched JPEG image. Here's here's another pixel-accurate screenshot at the correct resolution. You can't deny that doesn't look good.
ReyVGM
Member
Compared to the first outing of those games, Mace looks amazing.
IMACOMPUTA
Member
Like I said above. I didn't go out of my way looking for things like that. I just grabbed the first images I found in search that looked similar enough to do a comparison. I'm working with what is available. I grab most of these from google image search. Just click view image, and bam.
Are these more to your liking? They honestly don't show much of a noticeable difference from the one you singled out for being a PC mod to me as far as overall detail goes.
"I don't think about what I post, I just whip up some bullshit and BAM! hit the post button!"
From what I've read, it was more like 100,000 to 150,000 polygons per second with the tools that were available to developers. I have no doubt that once studios could start modifying the microcode, they got much more out of the system.
edit: oh, banned
SCReuter
Member
Didn't realize that about Wipeout 64. It always resembled a PS1 game to me and I never really paid much attention to it. It's not a title that comes to my mind when thinking Nintendo 64. As for Tony Hawk's Pro Skater, it doesn't look "significantly worse" to me from those captures, but then again, it's an afterthought port, so whatever.
Donkey Kong 64 is one of the muddier Rare titles along with Jet Force Gemini. Even so, it's still not "shit" compared to Crash, especially when I see it in motion like I am now.
baphomet
Member
Screen shots also don't show the awful draw distance in all the N64 games. It's pretty equal.
Here's just a bunch of random shots.
I don't know what it does differently, but the IQ on Super Mario 64 looks far better than than most other N64 games. I don't remember any other N64 game where the colors pop like that, specially the reds. Maybe the game rendered at 24-bit colors? I don't remember it having that muddy multicolored dithering that many N64 games had.
- EDIT -
Ah, it *does* have the dithering (it's visible on the gray floor tiles). Maybe it's just smart color choices or it doesn't affect untextured surfaces (Mario's cap and body).
- EDIT -
Ah, it *does* have the dithering (it's visible on the gray floor tiles). Maybe it's just smart color choices or it doesn't affect untextured surfaces (Mario's cap and body).
hotnheavyload
Banned
While the N64 certainly had higher highs, PS1 had developer support and CD-ROM on its side. I never really got the impression that any developers outside of Rare and Nintendo felt motivated enough to push the N64 in the same way the PS1 and Saturn were. Cartridge really held that system back.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
No. I have Mace. It moved poorly even compared to Toshinden 1. The geometry and animation was poor. It was hard to tell what was going on it was so jerky. There isn't a contest here. Mace was never a good fighter.
Heck, Iron and Blood looked better. At least that moved at 30fps.
It didn't help that the N64 was intentionally designed to be difficult to program.
ReyVGM
Member
Not true, DK64 looked extremely sharp and was not muddy or blurry at all.
That video you linked is horribly compressed, which adds a ton of filtering and artifacts.
That's because Mario 64's textures were simple, with simple colors which made everything pop. Also the game barely uses the trademark N64 filters.
I never said it was a good fighter, I said it looked good (visually). Specially compared to Tekken 1 and Toshinden 1.
ForsakenLotus
Member
I remember the PSOne having amazing cutscenes, but the N64 looking better while playing. That's pretty much accurate, correct?
baphomet
Member
DK 64 is extremely muddy. There's no denying it.
Also one look at the stairs and Mario on the screen above shows the blur filter in full effect.
ReyVGM
Member
It is not. Much less, "extremely".
I said it "barely" used it. Compared to most N64 games, Mario 64 looked extremely crisp.
baphomet
Member
I would call that muddy.
And that's a single shot in Mario 64. Its everywhere if you look.
