Piston Hyundai
Member
That's not even the same HUD as the N64 version. I don't know what the hell he was thinking.
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Looking back I think PS1's graphics aged better than N64's (used to think opposite)
- Thread starter enigmatic_alex44
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That's not even the same HUD as the N64 version. I don't know what the hell he was thinking.
jellies_two
Member
this discussion is basically an echo of what Naught Dog discovered, the PS1 had huge flat shaded triangle pushing power vs the N64 so they could reproduce most of the look of correctly textured un-warped polygons by just using more un-textured triangles in different colours.
And once you have more geometry, potentially, you can look better in motion than larger textured triangles of the N64.
I definitely preferred the variety of the PS1 games including the downside of the warping where visible vs the N64 games which tended towards less complex environments. Others may have had the opposite view but I think PSX managed twice the lifetime sales because of that variety.
And once you have more geometry, potentially, you can look better in motion than larger textured triangles of the N64.
I definitely preferred the variety of the PS1 games including the downside of the warping where visible vs the N64 games which tended towards less complex environments. Others may have had the opposite view but I think PSX managed twice the lifetime sales because of that variety.
Fairly even split in my opinion if you are talking about the tiny percentage of games which still look really good, but the PS1 had so many more games it also had more good looking ones... it also had more "decent" looking games, bad-looking N64 games are REALLY bad.
The gameplay of 3d games on the N64 certainly aged better though.
The gameplay of 3d games on the N64 certainly aged better though.
StealYourFace
Banned
this game was awesome
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
Agree with OP. Both consoles did ugly, chunky polygons, but polygons from N64 games had that layer of Vasoline smeared on them.
LithiumSpade
Member
I've been waiting 20 years for that to happen. Still holding out hope. Maybe.
On topic, I think it's definitely a case of different systems, different strengths. My favourite 2 games of the generation were Majoras Mask and Perfect Dark, and I would say I don't think they would have been possible on PS1. But the PS1 had some amazing titles (remember Roll Cage?) and without a doubt something like FFVII would not have been directly portable to the N64.
The other huge factor to me at the time (not graphics related) was the number of N64 games with 4 player split screen. Even tho the PS1 obviously had the capability, my memory tells me that many games did not support it when their N64 counterparts did.
nordique
Member
I think anyone who has intentions of being fair in a graphics comparison between the PSone and N64 will come to the conclusion he n64 was the more powerful system. Sorry to say OP, but I don't agree with your comparison or post at all. N64's best looked like a clear, distinct step up from the PS1's best. Emulators and bullshits aside, the N64 was as clear a victor in best graphics overall just as PS1 was the clear victor in sales
The evidence is there to support it even before one takes a screen shot comparison into consideration - the N64 was more powerful on paper, it came out a year later, even without the expansion pack it had more ram (and with the expansion pack it was on an even higher level...), it had a cleaner and sharper image with no warping....it's main limitation was the cartridge.
But in the end thats not to say the PSone shouldn't get any props - it looked fantastic for its time. Lots of great games and great memories.
Outside of a few gems on both systems, in general games from that era didn't age too well.
I don't think it would be possible to reproduce the best N64 games on PSone. There was a distinct drop in quality between the two systems, textured aside. But that's not entirely fair given the N64 was released later and was limited by cartridges while using system resources for have AA and sharp images often in higher resolution yet producing games without that strange texture warping.
On the flip side PS1 was an industry pioneer and set the stage for the modern era. It was a great system with arguably one of the best RPG lineups ever to grace a system (I could care less for RPGs but I can certainly respect that aspect of the ps1)
The evidence is there to support it even before one takes a screen shot comparison into consideration - the N64 was more powerful on paper, it came out a year later, even without the expansion pack it had more ram (and with the expansion pack it was on an even higher level...), it had a cleaner and sharper image with no warping....it's main limitation was the cartridge.
But in the end thats not to say the PSone shouldn't get any props - it looked fantastic for its time. Lots of great games and great memories.
Outside of a few gems on both systems, in general games from that era didn't age too well.
I don't think it would be possible to reproduce the best N64 games on PSone. There was a distinct drop in quality between the two systems, textured aside. But that's not entirely fair given the N64 was released later and was limited by cartridges while using system resources for have AA and sharp images often in higher resolution yet producing games without that strange texture warping.
On the flip side PS1 was an industry pioneer and set the stage for the modern era. It was a great system with arguably one of the best RPG lineups ever to grace a system (I could care less for RPGs but I can certainly respect that aspect of the ps1)
Show me a PSX game that look like this
...solid frame rate etc.
N64 wins.
Were we playing the same game?
Discussing the same genre, I always thought Spyro 2 and 3 put most of the N64 library--in terms of graphics--to shame, especially frame rate.
DidntKnowJack
Member
I tend to agree but I think I have a bias as the PS1 is my all time favorite system for a host of reasons I won't go into here. There's something about the grittiness of those old games I love, but again that might just be me.
But as I always understood it, the N64 and PS1 each had their own strengths and weaknesses. So an across the board "which one was better" argument seemed like a fool's errand. Or at the very least didn't always tell the whole story. I always chalked it up to personal taste. I love both systems, though.
But as I always understood it, the N64 and PS1 each had their own strengths and weaknesses. So an across the board "which one was better" argument seemed like a fool's errand. Or at the very least didn't always tell the whole story. I always chalked it up to personal taste. I love both systems, though.
nkarafo
Member
Wait, what?
StarStabbedMoon
Member
And this is the story of how Nintendo, so distraught over the criticism of fuzzy visuals during the N64 era, vowed to never use anti-aliasing ever again.
Dictator93
Member
Pretty sure it used 3d models, just without motion interporlation on the animations. Correct?
nkarafo
Member
Yes. Kinda like the PC original Quake enemies.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
How about comparing it to a similar low budget and subpar JRPG, like maybe Beyond the Beyond or something?
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Yeah, that's why it have that choppy sprite like animation.
Nikodemos
Member
If anything, this helps OP's position. By using modern emulators with advanced post-processing (z-buffer, texture tweaks, increased resolution) one can make PS1 games look reasonably decent, whereas in the case of N64 games, there's not much that can be done regarding the low-detail textures.
Uncle Rupee
Banned
Show me a PSX game that look like this
So, what do we see here? A fully open ended 3D world that you have freedom to explore (its fully loaded with no loading spots), with sharp graphics, unlimited draw distance, nice geometry detail, rich textures, solid polygons with no warping, beautiful animation, solid frame rate etc.
N64 wins.
The problem with always quoting Banjo Kazooie is that is just one game on the platform. Sure, it's impressive, as were the other half dozen games Rare made for the N64. But that's only like 5-6 games that you can point to, whereas the PS1 has literally dozens of games in just about every genre that look better (especially fighting games, racing games, survival horror, shooters, and role-playing games).
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Okay I'm far from an expert but are you sure these aren't emulated screenshots? Looks suspiciously clean at times.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Just to get a few things out of the way.
The PS1 pushed more polygons than the N64, and tended to use higher resolution texturing, but a range of early realtime 3D issues imposed very real limitations on the system. No perspective correction meant wasting large swathes of polygons to remedy that.
N64 pushed fewer polygons more intelligently. But tex mem limitations were real. Leading to spatially pleasant, but blurred texturing. And poly deficits. Which, in part, lead to the abundance of Victorian fog.
PS1 games with perspective correction hold up better than N64 games. But for their time, and when used really well N64 visuals were very impressive too.
Both systems win the award for "Ugliest generation".
What an honor.
The PS1 pushed more polygons than the N64, and tended to use higher resolution texturing, but a range of early realtime 3D issues imposed very real limitations on the system. No perspective correction meant wasting large swathes of polygons to remedy that.
N64 pushed fewer polygons more intelligently. But tex mem limitations were real. Leading to spatially pleasant, but blurred texturing. And poly deficits. Which, in part, lead to the abundance of Victorian fog.
PS1 games with perspective correction hold up better than N64 games. But for their time, and when used really well N64 visuals were very impressive too.
Both systems win the award for "Ugliest generation".
What an honor.
AcademicSaucer
Member
Low poly assets with pixeled textures is an aesthetic I really like.
N64's texture blurring is to me akin to modern emulator sprite filtering and hurts the artstyle.
I wish indie devs would move into 3D games using a MML/Vagrant Story/MGS1/other good looking PS1 game visual style.
Of course, there's plenty of technical flaws in this era that should be left behind, so I mean more like "good looking PS1 game run through an emulator to increase res and fix glitches".
DS 3D games reminded me of that style
Prophet Steve
Member
Yeah I think so.
SneakyStephan
Banned
Always been allergic to blur so I never liked how n64 games looked, I'd take the jaggy psx graphics over it any day.
One eye is king of the blind
One eye is king of the blind
Shadow Man looks better on N64:
Mortal Kombat 4 looks better on N64:
These two shot's demonstrate why I STILL prefer N64 graphics. The smoothing just works for some games. To Me, PS1 always had this "rough edge" look to it.
A game that demostrates this is Porsche Challenge:
I loved this game as a kid (my brother had the PS1, l had the N64), but even then, it looked rough when compared to Top Gear Overdrive ect.
baphomet
Member
I just took all these from on real hardware via RGB and running them through an XRGB Mini upscaler. This is even giving an added benefit to the N64 as it has to be modded to even output RGB. Otherwise S-Video is as good as it got back in the day.
I tried to get the best looking picture out of each game. Click on them to view them in full detail.
Wipeout
Racing games
3D platformers
PS1 games are on the top N64 games are on the bottom.
The blur filter that covers everything on the N64 just makes it look bad, even compared to the PS1 with it's texture warping.
I tried to get the best looking picture out of each game. Click on them to view them in full detail.
Wipeout
Tony Hawk Pro Skater
Racing games
3D platformers
PS1 games are on the top N64 games are on the bottom.
The blur filter that covers everything on the N64 just makes it look bad, even compared to the PS1 with it's texture warping.
The N64 had Turok 2: Seeds of Evil which used the expansion pack and has definitely helped the game age better than most N64 games. Overall I would think N64 wins this debate:
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Rogue Squadron:
http://2-game.be/games/Star Wars Rogue Squadron 1.jpg
Star Wars Episode 1 Racer:
Shadow Man looks better on N64:
Mortal Kombat 4 looks better on N64:
San Francisco Rush Extreme Racing looks better on N64:
Wipeout looks better on N64:
Quake 2 looked great on PS1 with better textures but the N64 version has better image quality:
N64 version:
PS1 version:
This is pretty much all that is needed.
baphomet
Member
I don't think a bunch of emulator shots and shots with tons of artifacts prove anything.
Really? It's not just the choppy firing animations I get that impression from. The movement animations are also very different from the other versions and it pretty much looks like a 2D image being shaken around using rotation to give the illusion of motion (which is perfectly smooth unlike the other animation types).
There's also Wipeout 3 and Threads of Fate
So Good.
When displayed at their native resolution without any emulation bells and whistles, I also prefer the PS1 "look". N64 games are just a blurry mess, and often ran at a horrible framerate. And I think disregarding the technical side of things, the PS1 just ended up having the best looking games of the generation.
On some level, primarily when it came to overall image quality and image integrity. The PS1 pushed more polygons and had better texture quality.
What is the middle fighting game and how did it look so good?
It's all about knowing how to work with what you got.
MML2 still looks charming as hell thanks to a seriously forward thinking art style.
MML2 is frankly one of the best looking games on the platform. It was seriously under appreciated at the time.
Thanks for the comparison! N64 really was horrifically blurry. What the hell is even going on there.
Also this. You cannot ignore the warping graphics or the stiff,and often jittery, animation on the PS1. As well at things like frame rate.
Duke Nuklem Zero Hours vs Time to Kill
Also Duke 3D's PS1 and N64 counterparts.
baphomet
Member
Its the Vaseline filter that is literally in every n64 game. Most peoples rose tinted glasses don't include the filter, but it has always been there. It completely kills the image quality of the system. It was probably put in to alleviate the aliasing, but it ends up just looking bad, especially in 2015.
Not to mention the awful draw distance the system had.
I really enjoy the n64, but both the Saturn and ps1 aged significantly better.
Those low FPS, though...
I really love both system although I had to decide back then when I was a child. The choice felt on the N64 because of Zelda. But later I got a used PS1 and some of my all time favourites is MediEvil 1. What. A. Game. Totally love it. But I hate what they have done to Rayman 2 on the PS1. Lower gamespeed, only 80% of the content of the N64/PC/DC version plus no option for the raymanian gibberish. I loved that gibberish.
7DollarHagane
Banned
I actually like the unfiltered, but higher detail textures of ps1 to the low detail low ram blurry filtered ones on n64.
Tobal 2, it was only released in Japan.
It ran in high resolution (640x480) and at 60fps. Uses mostly gourad shading rather than much texturing, which makes all the characters have a smooth and rounded look them. It's what has helped the game age so well. The animation being absolutely fantastic obviously helps, too. It's also, I think, one of the first games that used motion capture, along with an approximation of hair and cloth physics.
It was also one of the first 3D fighters with true and functional 360° movement. Tobal 2 was released in April 1997. Ahead of its fucking time.
Combined with the higher resolution a lot of the times it just made the 3D graphics that were on display to look simplistic and cheap even though it was more powerful in a lot of ways than the PS1.
sublimit
Banned
Spyro on PS1 has some really good graphics, and I think the game aged really well:
![37595-Spyro_the_Dragon_3_-_Year_of_the_Dragon_[NTSC-U]-3.jpg](http://199.101.98.242/media/shots/37595-Spyro_the_Dragon_3_-_Year_of_the_Dragon_[NTSC-U]-3.jpg)
I agree.And it actually looks even better on an OLED Vita.
Does anyone think this game runs at an acceptable framerate on an actual n64?
I did. Played the hell out of it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RcKkqmjb4M
Framerate looks great to me.
Uncle Rupee
Banned
I honestly can't tell if you're trolling, you not only posted emulator shots showing games running in much higher resolutions but you also posted shots from what appears to be an early version of the podracer game on PS2 (the hud doesn't match the one on the N64/Dreamcast/arcade) and appears to be much higher resolution. Also, as someone who logged tons of hours on Wipeout XL (PS1) I wasn't all that impressed with the N64 version to be honest.
Also this. You cannot ignore the warping graphics or the stiff,and often jittery, animation on the PS1. As well at things like frame rate.
Duke Nuklem Zero Hours vs Time to Kill
Also Duke 3D's PS1 and N64 counterparts.
That's a 800x600 resolution shot. And the image URL links to ModDB which is a PC modding website. Hmm....
baphomet
Member
Mortal Kombat 4 looks better on N64:
Just so you know, MK4 doesn't look like that on the N64. Actually, none of the pictures you posted are accurate of the console.
This is captured directly from the console just now by me.
