Support NeoGAF

[Tathanen]

Well that's better, but still a baffling design decision.

Yes, I get that they want a very shopfront-esque design here, but that shouldn't come at the expense of the ability to browse by category easily. There should be a dedicated button at the bottom of the home screen for it, and not be called SEARCH, considering they ALSO have a keyword search.

 

[fse]

3D hurting eyes is BS, looks great to me.

 

[Amir0x]

3D hurting eyes is BS, looks great to me.

how is it BS? It is widely reported by non-gamers, gamers and in scientific studies. You just mean that it doesn't effect you specifically. The 3D causing eye strain/headaches/etc does not effect 100% of people. Just a large minority.

 

[walking fiend]

how is it BS? It is widely reported by non-gamers, gamers and in scientific studies. You just mean that it doesn't effect you specifically. The 3D causing eye strain/headaches/etc does not effect 100% of people. Just a large minority.

do you have any specific data on how large it is and how long does it take for people to adapt to?

 

[Amir0x]

do you have any specific data on how large it is and how long does it take for people to adapt to?

that I don't. I just know a recent scientific study that was funded by Samsung in order to try to SUPPORT 3D technology actually turned against them when the study participants proved that, yes, 3D does have a very real negative impact on a large, meaningful number of individuals in regards to eye strain/headaches/nausea.

 

[walking fiend]

that I don't. I just know a recent scientific study that was funded by Samsung in order to try to SUPPORT 3D technology actually turned against them when the study participants proved that, yes, 3D does have a very real negative impact on a large, meaningful number of individuals in regards to eye strain/headaches/nausea.

I believe it is something that (some) eye may adapt to; although I am basing this on impression of the system and anecdotally on people trying to see cross eye 3D.

I believe Nintendo has most probably done some research as well, just like how they say vitality sensor is not ready.

and I have heard 4-10% of people can't really see 3D at all 0_0

 

[Kevtones]

$20 you should spend at the shop:

Boxlife ($5)
Aura Aura Climber ($2)
Donkey Kong 94 ($4)
DoDoGo! Robo ($2)
Pop Island Paperfield ($2)
Reflect Missile ($5)

 

[cakefoo]

What's BS is the army of 3D haters who infest every anti or pro-3D article on the internet. You'd think only about 1% of the population cared about 3D. Fortunately the truth is much, much higher, as 2D vs 3D exit polls for movies have shown. Part of the problem stems from many ignorant people who still think 3D is only about things that take place in front of the screen. As anyone with a 3DS or 3DTV would know, it's actually the opposite.

 

[Gamer @ Heart]

$20 you should spend at the shop:

Boxlife ($5)
Aura Aura Climber ($2)
Donkey Kong 94 ($4)
DoDoGo! Robo ($2)
Pop Island Paperfield ($2
Reflect Missile ($5)

The full 8 dollar dodo go is more than worth it. Check it out people.

 

[Agent_J]

bought one for my little brother, so i played for a few hours the other day (mostly street fighter & some dsiware) and found it very fun. the 3d effect is mild most of the time but sometimes it just makes you say, "wow, neat!"

screens are way too small for me, after using my dsiXL for a long time. plus the viewing angle fucking sucks! i can't tilt it at all or else the effect is lost. i will definitely pick one up just as soon as they fix the battery life. the cradle is not ideal in my situations.

i can't wait for the second or third generations of games; the 3d effect should be fully utilized by then, and the hardware's strengths & weaknesses understood.

the user interface is much improved from the ds/dsi and very sleek.

 

[NIN90]

Am I the only one who thinks that the 3D effect breaks way too easily?
The angle is very narrow and any movement of the 3DS breaks the effect immediately.
I read the first page and did not see a single mention of this issue.

EDIT: Yeah, and the post just above me mentions it. FML

 

[Kolgar]

Eh, I think people need to spend time with the 3DS before they can know for sure how well or how poorly the 3D works for them.

I supposedly have an astigmatism and I find the 3D effect to be deep and impressive. But my eyes were kind of freaked out for a while (I was one of those who inexplicably saw GAF and other web pages in 3D in the weeks after launch).

I accept that the viewing angle is narrow for best results, because 1) it's a small screen and 2) no glasses!

 

[TheBaldEmperor]

Eh, I think people need to spend time with the 3DS before they can know for sure how well or how poorly the 3D works for them.

I agree. It took my eyes a few days to adjust to the 3D effect. I'm golden now. I always have it turned all the way up.

 

[Amir0x]

Am I the only one who thinks that the 3D effect breaks way too easily?
The angle is very narrow and any movement of the 3DS breaks the effect immediately.
I read the first page and did not see a single mention of this issue.

EDIT: Yeah, and the post just above me mentions it. FML

No, it's a huge problem. I've taken to just thinking anyone who claims it doesn't break too easy is a liar. Everyone I know who owns one complains of the issue, the slightest fucking bump makes their eyes have to readjust to autostereoscopic 3D. The slighest off angle breaks effect. I haven't used the 3DS 3D, but when I utilized the FujiFilm 3D camera autostereoscopic screen it was as atrocious - and that's one better. I cannot imagine how worse it must be when you're playing a game and actually pressing buttons and shit.

 

[Lupin the Third]

Substantial details about the Samsung-funded study:
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news...-extra-eye-strain-and-fatigue-study-finds.ars
The actual findings of the study:
http://www.journalofvision.org/content/11/8/11.full

"Nausea" is mentioned only once in the study at all, and only as a reference to the extremes that TV manufacturers are "CYA"-ing their 3D TVs.

Also, "Samsung and the authors of the study have noted that the purpose of this study was to determine not whether 3D visuals cause harm, but which types of 3D conditions can cause discomfort." It was not a "backfired" study. I will concede that Ars' article may have implied this at one point before it was updated, however.

 

[chubigans]

No, it's a huge problem. I've taken to just thinking anyone who claims it doesn't break too easy is a liar. Everyone I know who owns one complains of the issue, the slightest fucking bump makes their eyes have to readjust to autostereoscopic 3D. The slighest off angle breaks effect. I haven't used the 3DS 3D, but when I utilized the FujiFilm 3D camera autostereoscopic screen it was as atrocious - and that's one better. I cannot imagine how worse it must be when you're playing a game and actually pressing buttons and shit.

While I agree with you, I think it's incredibly dumb that you haven't tried the 3D on your 3DS just to simply make sure you're right instead of assuming.

I mean, there's zero logic behind not even trying it. None.

 

[Amir0x]

While I agree with you, I think it's incredibly dumb that you haven't tried the 3D on your 3DS just to simply make sure you're right instead of assuming.

I mean, there's zero logic behind not even trying it. None.

There is zero difference between utilizing the autostereoscopic 3D screen on the FujiFilm camera and using the one on 3DS. It makes no sense for me to waste even a second once again getting angry at how bad the technology is.

One day in the future when they get some non-shitty autostereoscopic 3D tech into a handheld I'll try it. Until then, it's a waste of time.

 

[evilromero]

So maybe a 3DS revision could improve the latitude for viewing the 3D from greater angles? I would also hope they might improve the battery life as well. If they can address those issues they'll have some slick hardware. Then they just need the games.

 

[chubigans]

There is zero difference between utilizing the autostereoscopic 3D screen on the FujiFilm camera and using the one on 3DS. It makes no sense for me to waste even a second once again getting angry at how bad the technology is.

One day in the future when they get some non-shitty autostereoscopic 3D tech into a handheld I'll try it. Until then, it's a waste of time.

Hah, oooooook then.

Anyways as a new 3DS owner I was pretty shocked at how tiny the sweet spot is for 3D. Tried viewing a 3D video while I was using an elliptical at the gym, but man, forget that. :\

 

[Amir0x]

So maybe a 3DS revision could improve the latitude for viewing the 3D from greater angles? I would also hope they might improve the battery life as well. If they can address those issues they'll have some slick hardware. Then they just need the games.

Maybe. The idea of 3D is not a bad one. It's a neutral feature that simply is being held back by technology that isn't prime time ready; more negatives than positives.

When we get to the point when there are far more positives than negatives, I'll hop on board.

Why it's worth complaining about currently though is that the drive to have to use the 3D in 3DS games is actually holding back what the system is fully capable of, because they have to render scenes for the 3D which takes more processing power. If the system didn't have 3D the games would look much better. And they would look better in ways that actually substantively improve the gameplay and experience, so it's frustrating.

At least some games know to allow things like AA and 60fps when the 3D is turned off, but if nobody had to use the 3D at all the entire games could be designed from the ground up to take advantage of that extra processing power in a way that would benefit everyone in far larger ways. Instead of only some people in very tiny ways.

 

[thirty]

Good to see more people calling out the low res screen. It's pretty much unacceptable compared to just about any other handheld screen on the market today.

 

[Flame Lord]

I was hesitant at first but now that I have it, I love it. Love the look, the analog stick, apps, and definitely love OoT3D! I was unsure whether I was going to get it at first but I figured I had too when I heard the price was dropping and I would be able to get the 20 free games too.

Only problem I have is though is the 3D. It's nice, when it works. I don't know if it's just me but it's really hard to get it at the right angle for it. Can't wait for later in the year when i'll have a lot more choices of games to get.

 

[FoxSpirit]

It's abundantly clear that dedicated portable game devices of this ilk don't have much of a future. The iPhone's current hardware and user experience kicks this thing's ass, just like the iPhone 5 will probably put the PS Vita to shame by the time it finally launches.

Apple fanboy much? And the iPhone 5 will have a quadcore, a GPU as strong and a screen as good as the Vita? The only thing that will have going for it technically is pp.i But then again, the resolution is similar and I rather have the larger screen than one with higher ppi when overall detail is about the same. Oh, and the OLED blows the overall IQ of the iPhone 4 away. *swoon*
Plus no sticks or anything tactile.
Plus the game lineup.

As a gadgetophile, I found your claims ... lacking. Slightly ogg.
And really, a bad unboxing experience? They can deliver me the stuff wrapped in brown packing paper if the device inside that throwaway wrapping rocks.

 

[Amir0x]

Apple fanboy much? And the iPhone 5 will have a quadcore, a GPU as strong and a screen as good as the Vita? The only thing that will have going for it technically is pp.i But then again, the resolution is similar and I rather have the larger screen than one with higher ppi when overall detail is about the same. Oh, and the OLED blows the overall IQ of the iPhone 4 away. *swoon*

I think what Sony should have done is got rid of the rear touchpad shit and put holy spikes there instead. Then, once drawing your blood, it should have the PS Vita perform the demon summoning ritual of the Mayan divination chant. Then utilizing the individual demons that have been called forth unto the world by the horrified owners of the platform, it should march on to the Apple headquarters and destroy them all.

 

[Bumhead]

Interesting to hear people's impressions.

I've had mine since launch. I think I've only found a single game that 3D adds anything to. I think almost across the board the 3D effect generally makes games look worse (jaggy edges ahoy) and I think the effect is broken too easily by movement, which isn't good for a handheld. I've never felt that the effect made my eyes strain or anything, I just don't really like the 3D effect as part of my gaming experience.. although I remain open minded and ALWAYS try games on 3D long enough to make my mind up from game to game.

That said, I'm really enjoying my time with the 3DS and would say to any new or potential new owners that you shouldn't let any negative opinion on the 3D itself put you off the whole system. I prefer 3 of the 4 games I own (Pilotwings, RE: The Mercenaries and Zelda - Steel Diver is the one I do like) without 3D, but enjoy all the games regardless. Maybe it's because I haven't owned a handheld for a while, but to me the 3DS feels like a legitimate step up from the DS in just about every way. The OS is better, the online functionality is a step forward (if not totally perfect) and the 3DS is capable of outputting some pretty nice graphics. The hardware could do with a refresh sooner rather than later to iron out some of the kinks but.. apart from that, I think it's a good system.

I'm not at all sold on the idea of 3D, but I'm still really enjoying the 3DS as a system.

 

[The Technomancer]

I think what Sony should have done is got rid of the rear touchpad shit and put holy spikes there instead. Then, once drawing your blood, it should have the PS Vita perform the demon summoning ritual of the Mayan divination chant. Then utilizing the individual demons that have been called forth unto the world by the horrified owners of the platform, it should march on to the Apple headquarters and destroy them all.

That would have led to the most badass Shin Megami Tensei game ever.

 

[kitch9]

I agree. It took my eyes a few days to adjust to the 3D effect. I'm golden now. I always have it turned all the way up.

I have NVIDIA 3d so the 3DS didn't bother me from the start, but my non gamer mate moaned about his 3DS when he got it yesterday, saying he couldn't focus. He loves it now and he's just kicked my ass in Ridge Racer as he's been playing it all afternoon.

 

[yencid]

The 3D definitely does make my eyes/head hurt rather quickly. in fact i have to either lower the 3D to half or to none to be able to play zelda.

 

[Shiggy]

The 3D definitely does make my eyes/head hurt rather quickly. in fact i have to either lower the 3D to half or to none to be able to play zelda.

Maybe it's not the 3D effect but the game itself? Did you buy OoT in the past and yet again? Maybe your head hurts because you should've rather got a new game. This theory will be proven when Animal Crossing 3DS arrives - millions of people will have their heads hurt because they paid for the same game yet again

Spoiler

, I guess

.


On a serious note, does anyone have the impression that the 3D effect makes playing easier? Super Mario 3DLand will most likely show whether the display issues Super Mario Galaxy 2 had can be solved with the 3D effect.

 

[FoxSpirit]

As a side-note, the 3DS 3d headache may have something to do with the viewing distance. I never had any trouble with the 3D in cinema, IMAX or not.
But on the 3DS it heavily depends on the day I tested it.

 

[SmokedMeat]

The full 8 dollar dodo go is more than worth it. Check it out people.

I'll be more than happy to once Nintendo starts putting demos up.

 

[Labadal]

3D on 3DS works great for me. I can't stand it in cinemas. I get eye strain really fast, last movies watched in 3D were Transformers 3 and the latest Harry Potter movie(don't ask).

 

[HomerSimpson-Man]

As a person who gets headaches from the 3D effects in theaters if I watched it for more than 40 minutes, I'm adjusting to the 3DS a lot better than I thought. Getting that viewing distance sweet spot and the ability to adjust the 3D on the fly helps a lot.

Zelda 3D is awesome.

The only downside is that my HOME button seems to have stopped working and I've only had the thing for 3 days! asdfkjkl;asfd!

 

[SmokedMeat]

Am I the only one who thinks that the 3D effect breaks way too easily?
The angle is very narrow and any movement of the 3DS breaks the effect immediately.
I read the first page and did not see a single mention of this issue.

EDIT: Yeah, and the post just above me mentions it. FML

I agree, and don't think the 3D feature is all that great. So far I've seen both SSF4 and Zelda in 3D, and a few minutes after the "neat" factor wore off, I turned the 3D off.
But yeah, the slightest movement, and the image looks off. I guess that's what happens with glasses free 3D.

 

[Loonz]

I agree with those who think the stereoscopic 3D technology that 3DS is using is a bit premature. Hopefully it will develop in this next years, and perhaps Nintendo can include better 3D screens in future revisions of the console.

Now, as for the 3D effect itself, I love it. For movies, it's simply ok, but for games is wonderful IMO. I love to play Zelda in 3D, the game feels more atmospheric and somehow more "physical". I notice it more not in 3D mode, but when I turn the slider off. In 2D mode the games feel more lifeless, something is lacking. You get used to that in a matter of seconds, as 2D mode is like playing any other game on any other screen, but for me 2D it's just not the same.

I'm now keeping an eye for those 3D TVs. That Toshiba with passive glasses, anyone knows whether it's worthwhile or not?.

 

[Zafir]

I'd buy some stuff on the estore, but the pricing puts me off. $=Euro ftl.

 

[Link1110]

Friend in Japan picked me up one. I won't get to play it until she gets back to America, but I ordered three games to play on it (Layton 5, Tales of the Abyss, and Zelda) and I cam say this; it's been six months since launch, and there are three games I'd willingly pay money for. 3ds has the single best launch window out of any system I can remember for that reason alone.

At this point in the ps2 and ds's lives, they were an expensive ps1 and gba respectively, so 3ds deserves credit here.

Also, if my iPhone corrects 3ds to 3rd again, I'm gonna throw it at a wall. At least is given up on "3GS."

 

[wandering goat]

On a serious note, does anyone have the impression that the 3D effect makes playing easier? Super Mario 3DLand will most likely show whether the display issues Super Mario Galaxy 2 had can be solved with the 3D effect.

Hard to tell with Zelda, as there's no real platforming and accuracy isn't super important, but I think it does make it easier to navigate and position yourself. I could definitely see it working really nice with a good platformer (anyone who played Rayman can maybe chime in on how that works). The gyros also make it really easy to aim in Zelda, though best done with the 3D off for true freedom to move the system around. If the gyros work as well in Starfox, I'd probably mostly play it in 2D mode. Using first person view in Zelda, I'm kind of reminded of the Wii U, in that the screen kind of becomes a window into the world, as you can rotate it around your head to see. Would be neat to see a game based around that.

I agree with some of the people that the system doesn't feel too comfortable to hold for long periods of time, at least when you're positioned to be able to hit all keys (fingers over L and R). It feels very rigidly boxy and angular, in a way like holding an NES controller. The DS Lite was comfortable for me, so I don't know if it's the design or the fact you have to hold it pretty still to see the 3D effect / avoid viewing angle-based ghosting.

The resolution / aliasing is also a bit of a drag, as I think the 3D effect would be better at a higher res. The 2D AA perk is nice to have though.

 

[alysonwheel]

Just got mine today from Amazon. I've somehow managed to survive the last few years without seeing any 3D of any kind, so I'm absolutely blown away by the 3DS. I'm not bothered by the low resolution screen since nintendo-y games with chunky graphics will come out on the 3DS and gorgeous polygon nightmares will come out on the Vita. Besides, if I want to go online or read a book I've got an android phone and an ipod touch, both of which have daft PPI and rubbish games.

I rather like the resistive screen since the need to use a stylus means you don't end up obscuring whatever it is you're trying to do with your finger (World of Goo is awful for that on the ipod), and it's way more responsive than the touch screen on my (UK launch) DS. It's got a lovely smooth interface and a godawful store and an augmented reality whatsit that broke my brain in half. Love it.

Already getting stuck into Zelda (which I've never played before) and having a great time. Best £115 I've spent in a long while.

edit: I found the over-the-shoulder view in SF4 to be perfectly playable with 3D on and practically impossible with 3D off.

 

[KAL2006]

I don't get the hate 3D, gets, I personally love it, OoT looks great in 3D. I like that the 3Ds has 3D as it diffenciates itself from other systems. It just the shame 3DS is lacking other features such as higher resolution, larger screens, better online and dual analogs. If it wasn't for the 3D, I wouldn't be that impressed with the system as much as I am now. Though I can see some people getting annoyed with the sweetspot to get the 3D effect.

 

[timetokill]

Already getting stuck into Zelda (which I've never played before) and having a great time. Best £115 I've spent in a long while.

Wow, you are in for a treat!

 

[abasm]

If Nintendo can somehow combine the Pokemon juggernaut with augmented reality successfully, then they will have ALL THE MONEY.

Fingers crossed for a return of the Pokemon TCG to video games!

 

[cooltobeyou]

As a side-note, the 3DS 3d headache may have something to do with the viewing distance. I never had any trouble with the 3D in cinema, IMAX or not.
But on the 3DS it heavily depends on the day I tested it.

I am very glad the 3DS dropped in price for this reason. Avatar was the first and last movie I will watch in 3D. I left the theater with a severe headache and dizziness. I just put up with it because by the time it got bad the movie was great. At the $169 price point I can just consider it a hardware upgrade from the DSi for $20 and justify the purchase. I admit I haven't tried the 3D effect on it yet so I can't say for certain how it will affect me, but it's not looking good

 

[Apocryphon]

3D effect is great in OOT, and a nice thing to use occasionally in other games... but I can't use it for DOA or Street Fighter at all. It kinda works in Mercenaries, but I get pulled out of the sweet spot too often when playing it. I didn't have any problems with the Revelations demo though, no matter how many times I replay it.

 

[KAL2006]

If Nintendo can somehow combine the Pokemon juggernaut with augmented reality successfully, then they will have ALL THE MONEY.

Fingers crossed for a return of the Pokemon TCG to video games!

Hopefully this will be a feature in future 3DS Pokemon games. The last Pokemon game I played was Pearl, the games are similar so I tend to skip generations so it feels fresh again when I play a new one. I am really hoping the next Pokemon on 3DS uses those 3D models from Pokedex 3D, if they use 3D models, the Pokemon can also have more animation.

 

[thepotatoman]

When I first got the system with Ocarina of Time, the 3D was horrible. No matter how i focused my eyes all I could see is two side to side links running accross a blurry hyrule field. Occasionally my eyes would adjust but one blink and its back to being unfocused. Turning down the slider only made the double links appear closer together. But kept the slider all the way up throughout the whole game and every hour I played the period where my eyes were correctly focused increased just a little bit, and now I believe the 3D works perfectly on me.

3D Classics Xevious does still make me feel motion sick, but that game pretty much requires you to be focused on all layers of 3d at all times, so I think thats a different problem altogether which I'll probably never get over.

I have no issue with the controls or how they are layed out, but My hand does cramp a bit after a long period of playing, but I'm sure I'll get used to that as well. I'm also not a fan of how often the 3DS only gives you the option to select stuff by hitting the touch screen. The Yes/No option upon every start up the pokedex being the worst of them.

I can already tell the Virtual Console is going to be as big of a money sink for me as the VC on the wii. Getting to finally play classics I missed like Donkey Kong '94 is amazing and lesser known but still good games like Avenging Spirit and Fortified Zone is like crack to me. In fact playing all the way through Donkey Kong '94 has been my favorite 3DS related experience for the first two weeks that I've had it.

Which brings me to how disappointed I am with the games that the 3DS has offered so far. Most of the time when I get a new system that's all i can play for a few months, but I still find myself not even putting a single currently released game into my Gamefly Q. The only two games that I hear being worth it is Pilotwings and Ghost Recon: Shadow Wars, but Pilotwings doesn't sound like its worth it content wise and I'm just not a fan of Tom Clancy's universe. I look forward to Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor Overclocked, Super Mario 3D Land, Mario Kart 7, Kid Icarus Uprising, and Professor Layton and the Mask of Miracle, but 5 games over the next 4 months is disappointing to me, and I bet some of them won't even make 2011.

 

[Kato]

No, it's a huge problem. I've taken to just thinking anyone who claims it doesn't break too easy is a liar. Everyone I know who owns one complains of the issue, the slightest fucking bump makes their eyes have to readjust to autostereoscopic 3D. The slighest off angle breaks effect. I haven't used the 3DS 3D, but when I utilized the FujiFilm 3D camera autostereoscopic screen it was as atrocious - and that's one better. I cannot imagine how worse it must be when you're playing a game and actually pressing buttons and shit.

Keep thinking that. It suits you.

I can play OoT, RM or RR hours on end (if the battery would be so kind), then putting it down, getting a drink picking it up and on my way I am again with the slider on max. And that includes a lot of button pressing and shifting around in my seat. To counterattack your safety net of the "everyone I know"-club, the people in my "everyone I know"-camp have mixed results. It's all in the way you hold it and then getting used to it. After a while it comes natural for some of us. The 3D, the angle, the way to hold it, the sweet spot it all falls into place after a couple of hours.

For the other gamers out there with headaches or eyestrain or the constant loss of 3D. Sucks to be you

 

[BDGAME]

One thing I don't read anybody talking about is the surround sound. Its so good. In RR 3D the sound sometimes looks like its comming from my sides. Its amazing.

 

[zeelman]

I got a 3DS on Wednesday. I'm struggling to get used to the 3D, but I like everything else about it. I got OOT, and I'm really impressed by the graphics. Its nice to have a handheld with such crisp and clear graphics. I can actually enjoy this game without getting migraines like I did with the N64 version.

 

[BowieZ]

Keep thinking that. It suits you.

I can play OoT, RM or RR hours on end (if the battery would be so kind), then putting it down, getting a drink picking it up and on my way I am again with the slider on max. And that includes a lot of button pressing and shifting around in my seat. To counterattack your safety net of the "everyone I know"-club, the people in my "everyone I know"-camp have mixed results. It's all in the way you hold it and then getting used to it. After a while it comes natural for some of us. The 3D, the angle, the way to hold it, the sweet spot it all falls into place after a couple of hours.

For the other gamers out there with headaches or eyestrain or the constant loss of 3D. Sucks to be you

Pretty much this.

It's like playing the Wii and complaining that when you turn your head away from the TV you lose the effect.

Learn how to use devices properly lol.