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[Lostconfused]

As if, you know, Liara hadn't accepted Shepard's death, mourned, and moved on.

Well she didn't. I mean she gave Cerberus Shepard's body because Illusive Man was all like "We can rebuild him, we have the technology. THE SEVERAL BILLION CREDIT MAN"

 

[Patryn]

As long as my I can continue my romance with Liara (And ditch Miranda if necessary) and that Kasumi can still be my squadmate, then I'm a happy man.

I'd almost be willing to take a ban bet that Kasumi will not return as a squadmate in ME3.

Almost. Basically I'm 99.9999999 percent certain that, at most, you will get an e-mail from Kasumi.

 

[Yoshichan]

I'd almost be willing to take a ban bet that Kasumi will not return as a squadmate in ME3.

Almost. Basically I'm 99.9999999 percent certain that, at most, you will get an e-mail from Kasumi.

Out of curiosity, why are you so certain? Is it because she's only in the DLC? What about Zaeed?

 

[Fimbulvetr]

Kaiden is easily the worst character of the bunch in ME1. Ashley...yeah, I was surprised she didn't join me in ME2.

That scene where you meet Ashley again is so hilarious.

She walks out from behind a crate and randomly starts describing Shepard's accomplishments.

 

[Zen]

I liked the Mako enough and the sky boxes were some of the best around. However, I vastly preferred ME2's approach with more varying missions and scenery. The copy paste side mission settings of ME1 kill the game every time I reply it.

Thats the one thing I hope Bioware doesn't take from DA2 and put back into ME3.

Of course, I think they found a happy medium with the Overlord DLC. I'm betting there will be more of that type of structure in the game.

I don't know, every core mission in Mass Effect was basically 'dialogue -> Shooting time -> Dialogue. Except the dialogue and the backgrounds were different. It got old.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

He may have been "vanilla," but he definitely wasn't the self-righteous blowhard he is in ME2. The Kaiden I knew would have allowed Shepard to explain what was going on, and he almost definitely would have joined up.

And let's not even talk about space racist Ashley: You'd think she'd jump for joy for the opportunity to work with a human-centric organization like Cerberus.

Frankly, the only character who had a good excuse for why they don't join you is Wrex.

I don't think that's entirely right, Ashley before a racist (argueably, but I think so too) it's a soldier from toes to head, she's clearly a person that follows the book and clearly Cerberus it's an outlaw organization, also she clearly states in ME1 that she's against extreme pro-human organization.

I think mades more sense if you did the Cerberus sidequest in ME1, since both Kaiden and Ashley, references all the cerberus experiments and adds logic to their refusal...

That scene where you meet Ashley again is so hilarious.

She walks out from behind a crate and randomly starts describing Shepard's accomplishments.

You mean when she was supposed to be frozen and taken by the Collectors and the she appeared fine like if nohing happened?...yeah

 

[Yoshichan]

That scene where you meet Ashley again is so hilarious.

She walks out from behind a crate and randomly starts describing Shepard's accomplishments.

What's the reason he/she didn't get petrified by the bugs anyway :lol?

edit: Also, what's the OFFICIAL ending of the game? Does Sheppard give the Reaper thing to the Illusive Man?

 

[EatChildren]

Well she didn't. I mean she gave Cerberus Shepard's body because Illusive Man was all like "We can rebuild him, we have the technology. THE SEVERAL BILLION CREDIT MAN"

At the end she's not completely convinced Cerberus can bring Shepard back. She states in Shadow Broker that it's been two years since she began hunting the Shadow Broker. Two years of no Shepard, no word of Shepard, and no idea of Shepard will ever come back, while she's trying to search for someone she knows is alive.

She accepted it and moved on, and her reaction to Shepard's return in ME2 was appropriate.

What's the reason he/she didn't get petrified by the bugs anyway :lol?

No reason. Another glaring plot hole in ME2. Especially since it shows her get frozen.

 

[Patryn]

Out of curiosity, why are you so certain? Is it because she's only in the DLC? What about Zaeed?

Oh, I'm sure Zaeed won't show up either.

But Zaeed = Free for any new copy.

Kasumi = Released several months after game release, paid DLC.

Now let's see how Bring Down the Sky, the first and only notable ME DLC, was referenced in ME2: One broadcast message in Omega. You have to make a major decision, there is possibly a character you'd REALLY like to get a second crack at.... and all you get is a single fucking news report.

Aim your expectations low.

What's the reason he/she didn't get petrified by the bugs anyway :lol?

edit: Also, what's the OFFICIAL ending of the game? Does Sheppard give the Reaper thing to the Illusive Man?

Official Shepard is Renegade Shepard. So, yes, he would have given the base to the Illusive Man, sold Legion to Cerberus, etc, etc.

No reason. Another glaring plot hole in ME2. Especially since it shows her get frozen.

The thing that kills me about this is that Bioware had to WORK to make this a plothole. If they had just let Ash/Kaiden get abducted, and then rescue them at the end of the game, it would remove any and all complaints about "Why don't they join me?"

 

[Yoshichan]

No reason. Another glaring plot hole in ME2. Especially since it shows her get frozen.

Wow...

Official Shepard is Renegade Shepard. So, yes, he would have given the base to the Illusive Man, sold Legion to Cerberus, etc, etc.

... really?

 

[Ickman3400]

What's the reason he/she didn't get petrified by the bugs anyway :lol?

edit: Also, what's the OFFICIAL ending of the game? Does Sheppard give the Reaper thing to the Illusive Man?

She did get petrified, that's the thing. She's one of the first on the colony to get frozen out in the middle of the field, and the Collectors just...ignored her or something.

How she even got behind crates is beyond me

edit: Beaten

 

[Lostconfused]

She states in Shadow Broker that it's been two years since she began hunting the Shadow Broker. Two years of no Shepard, no word of Shepard, and no idea of Shepard will ever come back, while she's trying to search for someone she knows is alive.

Two years is nothing for an Asari though.

She did get petrified, that's the thing. She's one of the first on the colony to get frozen out in the middle of the field, and the Collectors just...ignored her or something.

Which is funny because he/she was the reason the colony got attacked.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I would have loved to see more Wrex, but I will say his character devlepment made plenty of sense, and it's cool seeing him sit on the Krogan throne with a genuine passion for saving his people while also bringing out of the stone age. Shitting on the face of stupid, backwards cultural traditions that are holding their species back.

Oh Wrex, how I love thee.

Seriously one of the best characters in the series.

 

[Confidence Man]

Adept was broken in ME1, maybe GC was an extreme measure but actually playing adept is more fun in ME2 because is more challenging.

So it was more fun not being able to even use combos like lift/throw thanks to global cooldown and the fact that pull sucked? Or maybe it was because the fun biotics didn't work on shielded enemies, so if you did manage to get a pull in before the enemy was killed after their shields went down they'd likely be dead anyway because you were prohibited from using powers back to back?

 

[Patryn]

... really?

If you start a ME2 game without importing and without using the comic, Shepard made every renegade choice in ME1. It's the easier one to handle, since people and species tend to die around renegade Shepard, meaning you don't have to deal with them later.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

No reason. Another glaring plot hole in ME2. Especially since it shows her get frozen.

We'll discover in ME3 that the Ashley and Kaiden we meet in ME2 aren't the real ones!!, they're collector clones that will try to kill you!!.....

...only if you cheated, if not you will fuck them again like if nothing happened.

 

[Patryn]

I don't think that's entirely right, Ashley before a racist (argueably, but I think so too) it's a soldier from toes to head, she's clearly a person that follows the book and clearly Cerberus it's an outlaw organization, also she clearly states in ME1 that she's against extreme pro-human organization.

I think mades more sense if you did the Cerberus sidequest in ME1, since both Kaiden and Ashley, references all the cerberus experiments and adds logic to their refusal...

I didn't want to get into this, because it opens up the can of worms that is: Why does a paragon Shepard who did all those sidequests even consider for a second working with Cerberus? This goes double for Sole Survivor paragons.

Bioware tries to hang a lampshade on it in Lair of the Shadow Broker, but it still makes no fucking sense whatsoever. Probably one of the things that predisposed me to be more negative towards the game.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

So it was more fun not being able to even use combos like lift/throw thanks to global cooldown and the fact that pull sucked? Or maybe it was because the fun biotics didn't work on shielded enemies, so if you did manage to get a pull in before the enemy was killed after their shields went down they'd likely be dead anyway because you were prohibited from using powers back to back?

Well, I'd say if you're the only biotic on your team...yeah, it's a bit frustrating, even so, combos aren't mean to do alone in ME2, you have to use your squadmates, having another biotic on your team in a lot of fun.

 

[Kyoufu]

So it was more fun not being able to even use combos like lift/throw thanks to global cooldown and the fact that pull sucked? Or maybe it was because the fun biotics didn't work on shielded enemies, so if you did manage to get a pull in before the enemy was killed after their shields went down they'd likely be dead anyway because you were prohibited from using powers back to back?

Exactly.

I miss my Adept and Vanguard in the first game. Lift/Throw combo made me feel so good inside.

 

[shinobi602]

Lol, everybody here is so passionate about bashing the hell out of ME, why even be in this topic? Then don't buy the game and move on.

We get it, there are plotholes in the game, "oh shit ME the only game in history to contain plotholes!!!!" *grumble grumble*

 

[Yoshichan]

If you start a ME2 game without importing and without using the comic, Shepard made every renegade choice in ME1. It's the easier one to handle, since people and species tend to die around renegade Shepard, meaning you don't have to deal with them later.

That is moronic... bleh.

Lol, everybody here is so passionate about bashing the hell out of ME, why even be in this topic? Then don't buy the game and move on.

We get it, there are plotholes in the game, "oh shit ME the only game in history to contain plotholes!!!!" *grumble grumble*

We're not mindlessly bashing the game. As for someone who hasn't played ME1, this is great information for me and a good way of understanding some parts of the game

 

[Lostconfused]

LALALALALA I CANT HEAR YOUR CRITICISM LALALALALALALALALA

Edit:

I didn't want to get into this

And that's the best course of action. Just don't think about it. Ever.

 

[Mindlog]

Look at the ME1 CG trailer "Decisions".

As equally unrepresentative of actual gameplay.

I could go on. It is a flawed, but better game overall IMHO.

The AAR system is better because it doesn't punish efficient play. A Vanguard skipping spawns deserves just as much XP as some invincible Sentinel just grinding her way through the game. I'd be amused with a placebo AAR system where Sheppard first submits his thoughts. I bet there wouldn't have been as many complaints even though it's effectively the same thing.

The inventory system is what disrupted my immersion as much as anything else. Magic backpacks are ridiculous. The one size fits all armor is equally ridiculous. I definitely want to be able to personalize ally armor, but keep it in a tailor system. I hate reload grinding vendors looking for a specific item. Keep differentiated weapons (Good job ME2) and let us further specialize their upgrades (Good job ME3.)

Improve the combat by not forcing me to stay in cover so much. The beauty of the first game was no global cooldown when using an ability, meaning the combat flowed very nicely. It was dynamic. In ME2 you use one ability then you have to duck back in cover before you can use another. What a downgrade from the first game.

I prefer the current cooldown method. It provides another vector to distinguish powers (fastcast/slowcast.) ME1's global cooldown and ineffective barriers made it way too easy to stunlock enemies. In ME2 I use a setup ability and then my ally abilities. 9/10 casts are meant to sync with each other. In ME1 9/10 casts were made because they had finished their cooldown.

Lift/Throw has nothing on Pull/Warp.

I'm only discussing Insanity difficulty here.
I'm also only discussing the same boring shit that's been wrought through the ringer a dozen times over.
Donatelli: What say you?

 

[ThusZarathustra]

Lol, everybody here is so passionate about bashing the hell out of ME, why even be in this topic? Then don't buy the game and move on.

We get it, there are plotholes in the game, "oh shit ME the only game in history to contain plotholes!!!!" *grumble grumble*

It's not like they were making a story-focused trilogy that touted decision-tracking and depth of universe or anything. It's not like they hyped the story and interconnectedness of their trilogy and then purposefully dropped the ball on their second outing for the sake of "character" or anything.

 

[shinobi602]

Edit:

That's cute. Please don't assume something about someone you don't know. Actually I expressed my criticisms countless times on the official Bioware forums just so they themselves can read it.

But this takes to a whole other level. Aren't you guys tired yet? Seems like every angle's been covered, what else is there?

 

[Patryn]

We're not mindlessly bashing the game. As for someone who hasn't played ME1, this is great information for me and a good way of understanding some parts of the game

Yeah, if you want to blow your mind, read up on Cerberus's portrayal in ME1. Pay special attention to their role in the backstory of sole survivor Shepard.

 

[Kyoufu]

That's cute. Please don't assume something about someone you don't know. Actually I expressed my criticisms countless times on the official Bioware forums just so they themselves can read it.

But this takes to a whole other level. Aren't you guys tired yet? Seems like every angle's been covered, what else is there?

Lets talk about not being able to hide my fucking helmet. Fuck you BioWare.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

Yeah, if you want to blow your mind, read up on Cerberus's portrayal in ME1. Pay special attention to their role in the backstory of sole survivor Shepard.

What's better are Miranda reasonings and explanations to all that shit..., I think it would have been much better if they didn't tried to explain it at all...

Lets talk about not being able to hide my fucking helmet. Fuck you BioWare.

If you can't hide your helmet in ME3 I'm not buying the game....

Spoiler

I'm kidding

but yeah that sucks, I can't be the only one who got tired of wearing the same fucking visor because was the only one that aloow you to see Shepard's face.

 

[Fimbulvetr]

Lol, everybody here is so passionate about bashing the hell out of ME, why even be in this topic? Then don't buy the game and move on.

We get it, there are plotholes in the game, "oh shit ME the only game in history to contain plotholes!!!!" *grumble grumble*

I wish I could live in your world of absolutes. Where if you like something it's because that thing is utterly perfect and nothing needs to be improved.

Where even having a single complaint about something, regardless of what you think about it as a whole, means you hate it and think it is the worst thing of all time.

Sadly I live in a world where things tend to make actual sense and, as such, things aren't as simple as lynch mob vs circle jerk.

 

[Kitschkraft]

It was Gears from the beginning, but a bad one. Now it needs to jump from decent Gears to good Gears.

Sure, it's always been a third person shooter, but when comparing the CG trailers, I was speaking more on the tone.

Edit :

As equally unrepresentative of actual gameplay.

Who cares? That wasn't what I was talking about. Both the CG trailers for ME1 and ME2 seemed to be spot on with the general atmosphere and tone that each game would have. ME1, even with the shooting, did seem like a somewhat somber experience at times. ME2 had Wrex and Thane guns a blazing...and the game was pretty representative of that.

Wow, I really had no clue... I found both Kaiden and Ashley (on both my playthroughs) to be boring characters and I'm glad they disappeared. God damn, if they were good developed characters in ME1 then I can completely understand the disappointment in some cases.

Personality wise, a lot of people didn't like Ashley. But she was probably the most realistic and well developed character in ME1. She was probably the only ME1 character that could match up with the characterization of some of the better written ME2 characters (Of course though, she didn't have her own personal mission so it's sorta hard to compare.)

 

[Lostconfused]

That's cute. Please don't assume something about someone you don't know.

Its not really an assumption when most of your posts that I have read end up being

"If you don't like it why are you here"

 

[Yoshichan]

Yeah, if you want to blow your mind, read up on Cerberus's portrayal in ME1. Pay special attention to their role in the backstory of sole survivor Shepard.

Hmm but I thought this was already explained in ME2? Miranda and Jack talks about it?

 

[Patryn]

I wish I could live in your world of absolutes. Where if you like something it's because that thing is utterly perfect and nothing needs to be improved.

Where even having a single complaint about something, regardless of what you think about it as a whole, means you hate it and think it is the worst thing of all time.

Sadly I live in a world where things tend to make actual sense and, as such, things aren't as simple as lynch mob vs circle jerk.

Yeah, despite all my complaints, I freely acknowledge ME2 is a great game.

Do I like it as much as ME1? No. Do I think it lives up to the promise of the series, and functions as a good part of the trilogy? No.

But it's definitely really good on its own merits.

Hmm but I thought this was already explained in ME2? Miranda and Jack talks about it?

They get like three lines that attempt to sweep all that under the carpet. It's clear that Bioware took the name Cerberus and the idea of it being this special organization, and jettisoned everything else about it.

 

[HDgaming42]

That's cute. Please don't assume something about someone you don't know. Actually I expressed my criticisms countless times on the official Bioware forums just so they themselves can read it.

But this takes to a whole other level. Aren't you guys tired yet? Seems like every angle's been covered, what else is there?

People typically stop discussing things when they feel their complaints have been heard and addressed in some fashion.

ME2 moved backward in some peoples eyes. Perhaps all this discussion only shows how strongly people feel about the ME universe, and how they'd like ME3 to turn out...

 

[Totally NarNar]

I hope this is more like ME1 with less repetition.

 

[HDgaming42]

Yeah, despite all my complaints, I freely acknowledge ME2 is a great game.

Do I like it as much as ME1? No. Do I think it lives up to the promise of the series, and functions as a good part of the trilogy? No.

But it's definitely really good on its own merits.

I like how you think.

 

[Yoshichan]

They get like three lines that attempt to sweep all that under the carpet. It's clear that Bioware took the name Cerberus and the idea of it being this special organization, and jettisoned everything else about it.

All right I better read up on Cerberus because the only thing I pretty much know is that they did some pretty bad experiments on kids to create powerful soldiers (?). Was the Illusive Man under control when Cerberus was doing these experiments?

 

[shinobi602]

I wish I could live in your world of absolutes. Where if you like something it's because that thing is utterly perfect and nothing needs to be improved.

Where even having a single complaint about something, regardless of what you think about it as a whole, means you hate it and think it is the worst thing of all time.

Sadly I live in a world where things tend to make actual sense and, as such, things aren't as simple as lynch mob vs circle jerk.

Good grief mate, way to over exaggerate what I said. I know for sure, the game's been out for over a year now, the criticisms have covered ever nook and cranny of the game. How much more is there? Unfortunately, again you assumed that I don't have criticisms myself V_V

 

[Mindlog]

Yeah, if you want to blow your mind, read up on Cerberus's portrayal in ME1. Pay special attention to their role in the backstory of sole survivor Shepard.

I also had my problems with it. There was not enough meat in the warmup act before you jump into recruiting a team.

However, the collaboration with Cerberus is an interesting reflection of Mordin's work. Mordin's highly praised loyalty mission speaks to the necessity of getting a job done by any means necessary.

 

[shinobi602]

Its not really an assumption when most of your posts that I have read end up being

"If you don't like it why are you here"

....I've only posted a couple times in this thread dude, and those were when the trailer was revealed.

 

[scarybore]

Lol, everybody here is so passionate about bashing the hell out of ME, why even be in this topic? Then don't buy the game and move on.

We get it, there are plotholes in the game, "oh shit ME the only game in history to contain plotholes!!!!" *grumble grumble*

One of the reasons I really like the Mass Effect threads on GAF is that we don't mindlessly fellate the franchise. Both games have their problems, some of them inexcusable, but a lot of people here love them all the same. Compared to a lot of the threads on GAF, I find that quite refreshing.

Saying that, people opening a GAF Mass Effect thread for the first time probably do think we are a right bunch of miserable shits.

Lets talk about not being able to hide my fucking helmet. Fuck you BioWare.

Damn right, I have never worn any piece of headgear in ME2 as they all look so bloody awful. Such a strange regression since Mass Effect had it and I don't think I've ever seen anyone complain about the feature.

 

[Yoshichan]

Damn right, I have never worn any piece of headgear in ME2 as they all look so bloody awful. Such a strange regression since Mass Effect had it and I don't think I've ever seen anyone complain about the feature.

I was using the Dragon Age armor because it had quite nice stats... worst part of it was that I couldn't even take my helmet off Stupid Dragon Age...

 

[Patryn]

All right I better read up on Cerberus because the only thing I pretty much know is that they did some pretty bad experiments on kids to create powerful soldiers (?). Was the Illusive Man under control when Cerberus was doing these experiments?

It's basically implied that the Illusive Man has always been in control of Cerberus.

 

[Smelly Tramp]

they just need to mix the best of both games together.

and for the love of god bring back combat earned xp, i loved ME2 but come on, just getting xp after a mission was lame.

 

[Fimbulvetr]

Good grief mate, way to over exaggerate what I said. I know for sure, the game's been out for over a year now, the criticisms have covered ever nook and cranny of the game. How much more is there? Unfortunately, again you assumed that I don't have criticisms myself V_V

And you assumed people hated the game.

 

[Yoshichan]

It's basically implied that the Illusive Man has always been in control of Cerberus.

Gotcha.

While I'm at it, anyone got a 1024x768 (hardcore, I know) wallpaper of the Illusive Man staring at the sun?

 

[Lostconfused]

They get like three lines that attempt to sweep all that under the carpet. It's clear that Bioware took the name Cerberus and the idea of it being this special organization, and jettisoned everything else about it.

The thing is that every single returning character that doesn't join you in ME2 is saying to pretty much stay the hell away from Cerberus. I can only hope that means you actually get the chance to tell TIM to shove and never work with Cerberus again in ME3.

Edit: And Cerberus is portrayed in a darker light in the latest book than they are in ME2.

 

[sonicmj1]

I didn't want to get into this, because it opens up the can of worms that is: Why does a paragon Shepard who did all those sidequests even consider for a second working with Cerberus? This goes double for Sole Survivor paragons.

Bioware tries to hang a lampshade on it in Lair of the Shadow Broker, but it still makes no fucking sense whatsoever. Probably one of the things that predisposed me to be more negative towards the game.

As a sole survivor Paragon Shepard, this bothered me so much when I was just starting the game. When Shepard never brought up anything about what Cerberus did in that sidequest chain, I was wondering if I was somehow misremembering what happened.

I guess that, in theory, it wouldn't be impossible to convince me to join them, but they just pretend that none of it ever happened, which felt really weird.

Makes you wonder if Cerberus did more to Shepard than just revive him, in order to ensure his compliance.

 

[shinobi602]

And you assumed people hated the game.

No, I didn't.

 

[RedSwirl]

The thing that kills me about this is that Bioware had to WORK to make this a plothole. If they had just let Ash/Kaiden get abducted, and then rescue them at the end of the game, it would remove any and all complaints about "Why don't they join me?"

I feel like each character should have had a different response to Shepard showing up on Horizon.

I can understand Ashley being too loyal to the Systems Alliance to join Cerberus. I don't even hate her character (didn't romance her because she reminded me of too many chicks I know IRL). She has her opinions, but those are superseded by her essentially lawful neutral nature. She even draws the line between herself and people like the Terra Firma party, and she can't forgive the things you all saw Cerberus do to people like Admiral Kohoku and Corporal Tombs. In fact even Kaidan would be hesitant after what he's seen of Cerberus first hand.

That's where the similarities between them should have ended though. I haven't seen Kaidan's reaction to Shepard on Horizon, but in ME1 he always came off as one of the more open-minded humans on the Normandy. He would've at least listened to what you had to say on Horizon. Refusal to join Shepard should have only possibly been because his current mission kept him from doing so.

Speaking of Kaidan, in ME1 is it at all possible for female Shepard to talk to him without him going into romance mode? Same for Jacob in ME2.