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[Orodreth]

360 Idolmaster - similar numbers to Seikaiju no Meikyuu last week (20k?)

There were bundles/ 360 packs + the limited editions, werent? are those included in the number?

 

[Eteric Rice]

Demand for the Wii in Japan is waning? When did this happen?

Anywho, I predict that the next generation in consoles won't be as huge of a leap as this generation was. If the Wii wins, MS and Sony may see that investing millions into a cutting edge processor, etc, won't help them much.

The Wii 2 will be at, or under the power of the 360/PS3, most likely. The only thing I can see being much different is that the Wii2 will likely have a physics processor. I don't think it'll need much else.

 

[Pope Benedict XVI]

What does marketshare have to do with the 360 trending below the original XBOX? Not to mention the PS2 was nice and entrenched before the XBOX 1 ever got to Japan.

I would use the word "tracking" rather than "trending" there. Total 360 sales are lower than total xbox sales at this point in their respective lives. But the 360 is actually trending higher, i.e. it's weekly sales at this point are higher than the weekly sales of the xbox at this point in its life.

And I would have thought that bungalow bob's point is that market share affects sales. The 360 is less marginalised now than the xbox was, which might help somewhat with weekly sales.

 

[MrSardonic]

One thing that´s a fact though, is that the 360 lauched early, while the XBOX launched late. This is a huge advantage the 360 has relative to the XBOX.

And the X360 totally failed to capitalise on it. It is tracking below the Xbox at the moment despite a full 12 months on the Japanese market without competition

 

[BrodiemanTTR]

Why do I keep seeing Wii Music listed among upcoming Wii games, coming in the next few months no less! Do we know anything about this game, when it's coming out, or that it even exists?

 

[Bungalow Bob]

And the X360 totally failed to capitalise on it. It is tracking below the Xbox at the moment despite a full 12 months on the Japanese market without competition

*Sigh*
If you don´t realize that the early 360 launch was a huge help to it worldwide (including Japan), then you´re wrong.

Whether it could have capatalized on it better than it did shouldn´t enter into this discussion (everyone would agree that it could have, anyways).

 

[Odysseus]

why in the blue blazes are people arguing about xbox 360 in japan, of all things?

stop it

 

[PhoenixDark]

why in the blue blazes are people arguing about xbox 360 in japan, of all things?

stop it

It's better than facing reality lol

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

I would use the word "tracking" rather than "trending" there. Total 360 sales are lower than total xbox sales at this point in their respective lives. But the 360 is actually trending higher, i.e. it's weekly sales at this point are higher than the weekly sales of the xbox at this point in its life.

And I would have thought that bungalow bob's point is that market share affects sales. The 360 is less marginalised now than the xbox was, which might help somewhat with weekly sales.

I see what you're saying, but the only reason the 360 had any limelight to begin with was because it was the sole next-gen hardware on the Japanese market for an entire year.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

Since this is still a Media Create sales thread, here is a chart link that should be good for throughout this year, displaying the cumulative YTD sales of each system, though I didn't bother splitting up the DS or GBA. Here is the non-cumulative version.

Here's the equivalent cumulative chart for 2006, and the weekly.

Hey, if you want to pretend it was the year headstart that made PS2 so massively, insanely successful - that's your prerogative.

Whether GCN or Xbox launched the same day or a year later, the scenario remains precisely the same. PS2 would have annihilated them.

I don't deny PS2 could've steamrolled them. I do deny it would've done so exactly as much. It's mathematically impossible.

Now that PSP/PS3 are underperforming I've noticed people have been trying to find ways to downplay the success Sony found with PS2, as if it was a fluke and as if everyone else handed it to them. But Sony won because they marketed the thing insanely well, from the get go.

That is where we disagree. Marketing schmarketing. They were the previous generation market leader, and thus inherited the developer support and public interest. Without a scary enough price and Dreamcast as their then-next-gen opponent, they were free to run with it. If anything PS1 was the fluke, with the established players bungling their efforts.

I have to disagree here man. I think that Nintendo thinks that it's in their best interest to stay out of that race. If they can keep limitations in place, it help keep budgets from ballooning, and they probably figure that that's better for them in the long run as it helps keep projects profitable. Wii HD will be 1.5ghz tops. It will include 50% more ram, and it will have a better GPU (fill rates to render at HD res) and it will have a scaler chip similar to the Ana from the 360. There will be some other things, like a bigger chunk of flash, but it will be built to support HD resolutions, not propel game budgets into orbit.

I agree to disagree. I think it's quite possible to stay out of the processor arms race without permanently limiting themselves to successive minor updates to 2001 hardware, which would eventually come to bite them in the ass. As I said before I figure they could get away with it this gen due to their price and controller advantages, but by next gen someone else could wise up and offer a $300 enhanced waggle system with post-X360 graphics and some exclusive features of its own. Competition, the reason improvements in successive systems have always been necessary.

Next gen just started in Japan. That´s the other thing you have to take into account. The point is that the 360 will continue selling for many more years than the original XBOX.

That doesn't necessarily make X360 reach a million, though. Xbox's last year in Japan without getting end-of-year sales neutered by X360 was 2004, and sales for the year didn't reach 40K. It could've maintained that rate for 10 years and not reached a million.

Certainly, though, a direct comparison with Xbox can't account for the recent hot X360 season and the lukewarm early PS3, so I'm not totally writing off X360 to reach a million.

 

[justchris]

why in the blue blazes are people arguing about xbox 360 in japan, of all things?

stop it

No, don't stop them yet. I need them to keep going until the Postal Service delivers my package so I can get some sleep.

 

[E-phonk]

Why do I keep seeing Wii Music listed among upcoming Wii games, coming in the next few months no less! Do we know anything about this game, when it's coming out, or that it even exists?

?

The game was shown at E3, TGS etc. It includes at least 2 totally different sections, namely an orchestra and drum section. Both were playable at E3 when the Wii lineup was originally shown. The characters in your orchestra are Mii's (something we didn't know until TGS when they showed the concept of the mii's). We also known the drum game has splitscreen multiplayer.

It was once rumoured to be a launch game, and has appeared in official nintendo magazines like nintendo power. It is assumed more instruments/sections will be added in the final game.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

I don't deny PS2 could've steamrolled them. I do deny it would've done so exactly as much. It's mathematically impossible.

To expand on what I meant here, I've compared Reality (as things were in our world) with Fake (GCN/Xbox launches pushed up to PS2 launch month/week), then looked at the market share (PS2/Xbox/GCN) at the end of each of the first three years on the market.

US
2000 real: 100%
2000 fake: 28%

2001 real: 73%
2001 fake: 46%

2002 real: 66%
2002 fake: 51%

Japan

2000 real: 100%
2000 fake: 64%

2001 real: 89%
2001 fake: 70%

2002 real: 82%
2002 fake: 72%

It's a very different world, in more ways than can be shown here. PS2 wouldn't by default get the next-gen exclusive on games like Madden in 2000. Does it make a difference when SSBM becomes the first million-seller of the generation in Japan? If PS2 doesn't have a commanding lead throughout 2001, are games like GTA3 exclusive from the get-go? If GCN has a 25% presence in Japan instead of 10-15%, does support from Namco and Square extend beyond what it did in reality?

 

[PantherLotus]

This Week Sales:

Sales History:

Since 11/27/07 - 8 total weeks:
360 - 2nd lowest week. Consistently insignificant (TM). (avg. week = 15,625)
Wii - 2nd lowest week. New trend (85-100k) appearing. (avg. week = 161,885)
PS3 - lowest week to date, 2nd week in a row. New trend (20-30k) appearing. (avg. week = 52,217)

Results, Analysis, & Expectations
The 360's sales are so insignificant that their inclusion in the data tracking is almost insulting. At this point it's just a 3rd color on the chart and should never, ever be regarded as more than such. Without significant change, price drops ($99 Core Pack?), numerous mega-Japanese-exclusives (FF, DQ, etc), or extraordinary cultural change (another nuclear bomb), the 360 has no hope of ever reaching 500k. <---I'm not going to change this paragraph until 360 sales go above 30k for a week.

Sony's first post-holiday PS3 sales are disgusting. No, it's not panic time, but now would be the time to make some announcements. The FFXIII demo is a start, but it's going to take much, much more than that. Everybody knows that PS3s are available -- and nobody is buying them. There could be any number of possible reasons, including the games, the price, or a changing console audience and their expectations. I suspect it is a combination of all three. But god damn. Sony, if you have a plan, now would be a good time to reveal some of it. A couple months of sales like this in conjunction with the competitions' continuing sales will be highly damaging to long-term success. Nobody can hope that FFXIII, GT5, and MGS4 will carry this thing alone. Those will help but Sony needs to find that next-gen mega-wow. I expect that they will try. <---These are the same thoughts from last week as well.

The Wii's first 8 weeks have been very very solid. At 86k this week, the Wii is within a 1k of the lowest sales it's ever had. The Wii officially has 60% of the next gen market share after 8 weeks (that's 2 months fellas). A slow next couple months for releases will not slow this thing down. March looms large.

Expectations for 01/22-01/29
360 - 8k
Wii - 100k
PS3 - 25k

This Week's Market Share:

Market Share History:

[B][U]Date____               360             Wii             PS3[/U][/B]
11/27-12/03:            25%             49%             26%
12/04-12/10:            24%             49%             27%
12/11-12/17:            21%             50%             29%
12/18-12/24:            17%             57%             26%
12/25-12/31:            16%             56%             28%
01/01-01/07:            15%             58%             27%
01/08-01/14:            14%             59%             27%
[B]01/15-01/21:            14%             60%             26%[/B]

 

[WrathOfOtaibah]

Its not complicated, really. PS3 is $600. Wii is $210. This is pretty much the only reason why the PS3 is tanking and the Wii is doing well. PS3 will not be coming down to affordable levels anytime soon. X360? LOL in Japan. Then you got the Wii.

The problem is that the lead that the Wii is building is going to make it tougher for PS3 to recover and overtake the Wii, if that is even possible anymore. Sony needs to reassess their PS3 strategy. The fact that its a new Playstation system isn't really doing it anymore and most people don't have HDTVs.

 

[Battersea Power Station]

Its not complicated, really.

...

Sony needs to reassess their PS3 strategy. The fact that its a new Playstation system isn't really doing it anymore and most people don't have HDTVs.

Reassessing the ol' strategy to compensate for the fact that the general population doesn't care about HD would involve going back in time a couple of years, and it doesn't get more complicated than time travel.

 

[Datschge]

Sony, if you have a plan, now would be a good time to reveal some of it. A couple months of sales like this in conjunction with the competitions' continuing sales will be highly damaging to long-term success.

I'm getting the impression Sony has as much of a plan for PS3 as it has one for PSP...

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

To expand on what I meant here, I've compared Reality (as things were in our world) with Fake (GCN/Xbox launches pushed up to PS2 launch month/week), then looked at the market share (PS2/Xbox/GCN) at the end of each of the first three years on the market.

US
2000 real: 100%
2000 fake: 28%

2001 real: 73%
2001 fake: 46%

2002 real: 66%
2002 fake: 51%

Japan

2000 real: 100%
2000 fake: 64%

2001 real: 89%
2001 fake: 70%

2002 real: 82%
2002 fake: 72%

It's a very different world, in more ways than can be shown here. PS2 wouldn't by default get the next-gen exclusive on games like Madden in 2000. Does it make a difference when SSBM becomes the first million-seller of the generation in Japan? If PS2 doesn't have a commanding lead throughout 2001, are games like GTA3 exclusive from the get-go? If GCN has a 25% presence in Japan instead of 10-15%, does support from Namco and Square extend beyond what it did in reality?

Not according to Amir0x.

 

[ZeoVGM]

Its not complicated, really. PS3 is $600. Wii is $210. This is pretty much the only reason why the PS3 is tanking and the Wii is doing well .

Uh, no?

 

[KTallguy]

I'm getting the impression Sony has as much of a plan for PS3 as it has one for PSP...

PS3 just needs more games.

PSP is getting good titles, and now sales are up in Japan.

PS3 needs good games, quickly, before people write it off.

 

[meltpotato]

Its not complicated, really. PS3 is $600. Wii is $210. This is pretty much the only reason why the PS3 is tanking and the Wii is doing well.

yeh the software must be priced too high as well :lol

 

[Sgt. Killjoy]

pac man is closing his mouth

 

[Jokeropia]

Its not complicated, really. PS3 is $600. Wii is $210. This is pretty much the only reason why the PS3 is tanking and the Wii is doing well.

Actually, the 20 GB version sells for the equivalent of $412 in Japan, and one chain is running a sale where they let it go for $329.

 

[BigGreenMat]

Man these numbers are REALLY bad for Sony. Did the PS3 really launch in Japan? I haven't seen a game in the weekly top 30 since november.

 

[jj984jj]

Reassessing the ol' strategy to compensate for the fact that the general population doesn't care about HD would involve going back in time a couple of years, and it doesn't get more complicated than time travel.

I thought the PS3 was going to bring 4D to the world?

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

PS3 just needs more games.

PSP is getting good titles, and now sales are up in Japan.

PS3 needs good games, quickly, before people write it off.

I thought PSP hardware sales are down. As well, PSP software is okay, at best.

 

[Wyndstryker]

maybe in the extreme case...people are disappointed that they're seeing things in 3D instead of 4D >_>

 

[FitzOfRage]

PS3 just needs more games.

PSP is getting good titles, and now sales are up in Japan.

PS3 needs good games, quickly, before people write it off.

Aren't PSP sales actually down slightly vs. last year?

 

[Eteric Rice]

maybe in the extreme case...people are disappointed that they're seeing things in 3D instead of 4D >_>

How can you see 4D, anyway? If I remember correctly, 4D is time. Do they want to sit around watching a plant grow or something? :lol

 

[duderon]

PS3 just needs more games.

PSP is getting good titles, and now sales are up in Japan.

PS3 needs good games, quickly, before people write it off.

PSP hardware is down YOY and the software sales are still poor.

 

[MrSardonic]

If you don´t realize that the early 360 launch was a huge help to it worldwide (including Japan), then you're wrong.

*yawn*

 

[PhoenixDark]

Its not complicated, really. PS3 is $600. Wii is $210. This is pretty much the only reason why the PS3 is tanking and the Wii is doing well. PS3 will not be coming down to affordable levels anytime soon. X360? LOL in Japan. Then you got the Wii.

Nice spin. How do you explain the software disaster then?:lol

 

[Mrbob]

Nice spin. How do you explain the software disaster then?:lol

To be fair, has there been a single PS3 title released yet aimed at the Japan consumer?

 

[A Link to the Past]

Nice spin. How do you explain the software disaster then?:lol

$60 is too expensive for Japanese gamers!

 

[duderon]

To be fair, has there been a single PS3 title released yet aimed at the Japan consumer?

RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRIDGE RACCCCCCCCEEEEEEEERRRRRRRRRRR!

 

[PhoenixDark]

To be fair, has there been a single PS3 title released yet aimed at the Japan consumer?

You'd think games like RR and Genji would have sold much better if only because they were launch titles. Yet the PS3 is selling less than 40k a week and not one game can at least manage 15-20k along with that?

Very few people expected this

 

[meltpotato]

To be fair, has there been a single PS3 title released yet aimed at the Japan consumer?

everyone seems to be forgetting AC4.. with online play no less. still only at 69k apparently. a shame.

 

[PantherLotus]

The Wii has a 720k unit lead on the PS3 after 8 weeks.

How long until they have a 1 million unit lead? Make your predictions now.

Spoiler

Last week of february

 

[mr tibbs]

Didn't see our usual stats posted.

Figures on opening page need to be corrected.

15th jan- 21th jan

Hardware - This Week | Last Week | 2007 | LTD

1.) Nintendo DS Lite – 127,647 | 89,287 | 561,812 | 7,985,136
2.) Nintendo Wii – 86,395 | 93,708 | 375,434 | 1,295,077
3.) PlayStation Portable -37,032 | 48,804 | 204,022 | 4,736,151
4.) PlayStation 3 – 21,105 | 25,531 | 116,580 | 574,138
5.) PlayStation 2 – 20,169 | 22,663 | 94,869 | 20,249,728
6.) Xbox 360 – 7,041 | 9,035 | 34,311 | 299,013
7.) Game Boy micro – 1,864 | 1,959 | 7,134 | 567,064
8.) Game Boy Advance SP -1,498 | 1,547 | 5,409 | 5,920,449
9.) GameCube - 554 | 611| 2,423 | 4,171,891
10.) Nintendo DS - 123 | 41 | 239 | 6,582,594
11.) Game Boy Advance - 94 | 79 | 230 | 8,823,339

 

[Mithos Yggdrasill]

The 360's sales are so insignificant that their inclusion in the data tracking is almost insulting. At this point it's just a 3rd color on the chart and should never, ever be regarded as more than such.

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

Sony's first post-holiday PS3 sales are disgusting

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol I'm dying laughing.

 

[Oblivion]

I agree to disagree. I think it's quite possible to stay out of the processor arms race without permanently limiting themselves to successive minor updates to 2001 hardware, which would eventually come to bite them in the ass.

What makes you think that, though? Like Ziran said:

i don't think i understand what you're saying.

firstly, the difference in power between the wii and 360/ps3 is nothing like ps2/gc/xbox, which were similar. 360 and ps3 are almost a full generation ahead in terms of graphical power and operate at much higher resolutions, so it's like comparing a ps1 to ps2, or ds to psp.

secondly, if wii becomes the dominant console this gen it would prove graphics aren't important so why would nintendo increase the power of its next machine at all? i mean maybe go to hd with 2-3x the power, but what would be the point of going any more if consumers don't care about the graphical improvement?

I think the interesting thing is to see what effect Nintendo's potential success could have on the competition. If Sony and MS start thinking the same thing about people not caring about graphics, they could be doing Xbox360+ and PS3+ as well.

 

[meltpotato]

I think the interesting thing is to see what effect Nintendo's potential success could have on the competition. If Sony and MS start thinking the same thing about people not caring about graphics, they could be doing Xbox360+ and PS3+ as well.

Gears of War sales pretty much quash that. Also, the whole reason MS and Sony care so much about gaming is because they want to dominate all emerging high-tech developments in the living room.

 

[AdmiralViscen]

To be fair, has there been a single PS3 title released yet aimed at the Japan consumer?

To be fair, Sony said they could sell consoles without any games at all. And most of GAF agreed (myself included).

Then there's AC4, Ridge Racer.. Genji? I'd assume theres a Mahjong game in there somewhere.

 

[Bebpo]

everyone seems to be forgetting AC4.. with online play no less. still only at 69k apparently. a shame.

I see Armored Core brought up a lot but it's not a huge series in Japan. With an installed base of around 20 million systems, this is how that last one sold first week on PS2:

6) ARMORED CORE: LAST RAVEN - PS2 - 49,203 units*

http://www.gamepro.com/news.cfm?article_id=47631

Suddenly now, the PS3 sales look fine for the game. With 1/20th the userbase it's only selling a little less.

 

[Agent Icebeezy]

What makes you think that, though? Like Ziran said:



I think the interesting thing is to see what effect Nintendo's potential success could have on the competition. If Sony and MS start thinking the same thing about people not caring about graphics, they could be doing Xbox360+ and PS3+ as well.

Sony would, moreso than Microsoft would. I think you see that already with the inclusion of tilt in the Sixaxis. Sony stands to lose a lot more than Microsoft does with this due to the fact that Japanese developers support the leader in Japanese install base. Microsoft barely factors there. They beat Nintendo worldwide by being viable in only 2 markets. So, I don't see how this would affect them. Considering so many of us Xbox and 360 owners came from the PC space, they they tried to pass of not caring about graphics, a lot of us would just go back to primarily just gaming on PC.

 

[PantherLotus]

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol


:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol I'm dying laughing.

It wasn't meant to be funny!

 

[meltpotato]

I see Armored Core brought up a lot but it's not a huge series in Japan. With an installed base of around 20 million systems, this is how that last one sold first week on PS2:


http://www.gamepro.com/news.cfm?article_id=47631

Suddenly now, the PS3 sales look fine for the game. With 1/20th the userbase it's only selling a little less.

fair enough, but i think the first week sales of Armored Core 2 back in August 2000 would be a far more relevant number. I think its partially that im an AC fan and am disappointed to see the game doing poorly.

 

[icecream]

There were bundles/ 360 packs + the limited editions, werent? are those included in the number?

It would be like BD, so probably yes.

 

[Oblivion]

Gears of War sales pretty much quash that. Also, the whole reason MS and Sony care so much about gaming is because they want to dominate all emerging high-tech developments in the living room.

I dunno. One game can't really decide the rule, I think.

Sony would, moreso than Microsoft would. I think you see that already with the inclusion of tilt in the Sixaxis. Sony stands to lose a lot more than Microsoft does with this due to the fact that Japanese developers support the leader in Japanese install base. Microsoft barely factors there. They beat Nintendo worldwide by being viable in only 2 markets. So, I don't see how this would affect them. Considering so many of us Xbox and 360 owners came from the PC space, they they tried to pass of not caring about graphics, a lot of us would just go back to primarily just gaming on PC.

What does it matter if MS is not viable in Japan? I agree with you that Sony would be more likely to do so, though.

As for 360 gamers going back to PCs. Well, yeah obviously you could do that, but what if they want to try and take the path that Nintendo is taking, and sacrifice potential hardcore losses to gain more casuals? (Yes, yes we're still getting Marios, Zeldas and SSBs, but Nintendo's trying harder to get everyone else, though)

 

[Bebpo]

fair enough, but i think the first week sales of Armored Core 2 back in August 2000 would be a far more relevant number. I think its partially that im an AC fan and am disappointed to see the game doing poorly.

I wouldn't worry. I'm pretty sure it'll end up being the best selling AC worldwide after it gets good sales in the US on X360 and maybe in the US on PS3 as well.