Kresnik258
Member
Ohhhhh snap.
(But To Love Ru got 31 points, because that was exactly COMG's type of thing!)
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Media Create Sales: Week 51, 2014 (Dec 15 - Dec 21)
- Thread starter Chris1964
- Start date
Ohhhhh snap.
(But To Love Ru got 31 points, because that was exactly COMG's type of thing!)
SS
ßig
Unconfirmed Member
I can believe that. For some reason 3DS games have really small windows between announcement and release. At this point in 2013 we didn't know about Monster Hunter 4G. Or the Youkai Watch sequels.
Sammy Samusu
Member
CardFight is their biggest success.
3DS : Cardfight!! Vanguard: Ride to Victory!! ( FuRyu ) { 2013-04-11 } - 44,092 / 70,029 [MC: 82.671]
Comgnet Final Pre-Order Points: 67
And that success was actually cut short because they shipped the game with a breaking bug, lol. Pray for Legend of Legacy.
3DS : Cardfight!! Vanguard: Ride to Victory!! ( FuRyu ) { 2013-04-11 } - 44,092 / 70,029 [MC: 82.671]
Comgnet Final Pre-Order Points: 67
And that success was actually cut short because they shipped the game with a breaking bug, lol. Pray for Legend of Legacy.
While I replied once to this post, I did want to follow up on this part in particular again after thinking about it for a while.
I also feel an important part of sales discussion is not just calling back to when you were right, but also to when you were potentially wrong, and why you feel that was and/or what changed to make you feel that way.
So, earlier I had proposed a few times that I felt Square Enix had largely dumped mid-tier handheld gaming, and that since Bravely Default and Theatrhythm seemed to be the only real titles they had left (Dragon Quest Monsters is not mid-tier), they felt like exceptions rather than the rule.
I do believe that for quite a while that was true, given the complete paucity of handheld output in this timeframe. However, when FF Explorers first came up, my assumption was that it was also an exception, since it didn't feel enough had changed to assume any greater change in behavior, while also being targeted at one of the absolute biggest markets in the genre.
However, let's boil down Square Enix's current slate of mid-tier titles:
1.) Bravely Second - This seems to be a title built on heavy very heavy asset re-use from the first game with an 18 month development cycle, and doesn't really seem to try and push any new boundaries. I don't mean that in terms of reusing the cast, but in terms of using the same costumes, maps, bosses/fights, having identical graphics, and things of that nature. In many ways it's a lot more like a -2 release to a mainline Final Fantasy game as opposed to a high effort sequel. If someone told me this game had half the budget of the first, I'd believe them. This feels like a definite mid-tier title instead of a follow-up meant to push the series to new sales heights.
2.) Theatrhythm: Dragon Quest - Not only did Square Enix not port the previous game to mobile (at least yet) despite announcing it as the last FF entry and stating it would be a DLC platform going forward (very logical mobile business model), they announced another game based on Dragon Quest. If they're actually keeping this as primarily a handheld rhythm game series, then it definitely feels like an ongoing (low end) mid-tier type series.
3.) Final Fantasy Explorers - Looking at this some more I can see why people feel it's a lower effort game. This is not the kind of effort you put in if you want to challenge Monster Hunter, and is much more in line with the mid-tier series Crystal Chronicles.
4.) SaGa - It's only on Vita, and Kawazu insists it's a regular JRPG that's sort of like being Romancing SaGa 4. Assuming it has a retail price and isn't f2p, this is pretty much the definition of a mid-tier game.
So, if we're looking at four mid-tier series instead of just two, and two of them were announced within the last six months, it starts to look a lot less like a series of exceptions and more like a trend.
I'm not quite willing to call it completely on board yet, given we're still talking about a pretty low volume here, but I think 1-2 more games of this nature (DQM doesn't count), and we have a solid trend of Square Enix bringing back their mid-tier handheld games as part of their general strategy. It still feels reduced in volume from before, but well, that's true of just about every part of the industry as standards go up.
Interestingly their mobile output doesn't seem to have slowed at all. They actually seem to have a fair bit more output than before (especially when taking effort into account), and more internal output on mobile to boot, so if they have both more handheld and more mobile games coming out, this suggests the mid-tier titles don't seem to be leaching resources from the mobile department. That leaves the options of FFXIV needing less staff now that it's launched (the update rate and expansion pack kind of suggests otherwise though), there being less AAA games to work on (plausible with only FFXV and KH3), or them simply hiring a lot and/or contracting more studios than they used to (certainly not impossible).
theprodigy
Member
duckroll has influenced you too much, Nirolak
TreasureHunterG
Banned
In the middle of the development process, it took THREE years. More than enough time to realize Wii U was the system in more distress for a big prospect to boost hardware first than 3DS, who was already stabilized and had many other prospects to carry on like MH4U, YW2 and Pokémon AS/OR.
ßig;144878200 said:
I'm (mostly) joking with that but there are a number of avenues for them to go down and New 3DS is definitely a possibility.
I definitely don't think you were wrong, it did seem like Asano had slipped through the cracks a bit with Bravely Default. In regards to Bravely Second you are right that it seems to be reusing assets a lot but I think we still haven't seen a lot of the game and we might see more now that FF Explorers is out of the way.
With FF Explorers I imagine it was a case of the SaGa remake team being free and basically making a pitch of "We can FF Monster Hunter for x amount" where x amount is a very low number.
I do feel it's important to note that Silicon Studios and Indies Zero are both new partners for Square Enix and IIRC Racjin have now gone from Fullmetal Alchemist to SaGa remakes to FF Explorers so it seems they are filling a void left by h.a.n.d.
Overall I think it's a good thing for SE if they can manage all the different types of product. I don't think it's any coincidence that Namco Bandai is the number one third party in Japan and happens to have a very diverse portfolio, supporting all platforms.
duckroll was actually looking this up the other day and Namco had fallen to I think it was fifth place (behind Nintendo, Level 5, Pokemon, and Capcom) despite having an astronomical 52 titles. They weren't exactly really close to the others either.
This was also as of the end of November so there's a possibility they're even further behind now.
They did have an abysmal per game record of like 62K or something to boot.
I do think their strategy worked well historically, but as the market polarizes I can understand why most other publishers are more cautious.
That is interesting but not entirely surprising when you consider Level 5 and Capcom had Yokai Watch 2 and MonHun 4G respectively. Namco Bandai has allocated significant resources towards Smash Bros(and now Pokken too) and their big game(Tales) is coming out next month.
Bandai Namco's licensed games business isn't something easily replicated. You need the big properties, and outside of Spike Chunsoft snatching Attack on Titan, they're usually all BN's domain. The majority of Furyu's output is licensed stuff and they've yet to find a 100k seller.
I think the biggest potential issue for Namco is how many of their games actually made money when they're averaging 62K.
Like, some things sold a fair bit more than that so we're having some pretty poor performers too.
It's like trying to paste together a bunch of really small margins to make what someone might make on one title at another publisher.
The big Western publishers used to all do this too (EA, Activision, and THQ, who were the three biggest in 2006), but the business blew up and majorly hurt them all, even actually killing THQ in the process.
Activision did a merger with Vivendi (and Vivendi got the controlling share) after closing down 66%+ of their studios and EA went through something like 3000-4000 people laid off.
Now, I doubt Namco's licensing is nearly as expensive as in the West, but low margin businesses tend to be really risky if something goes wrong.
Pennywise83
Banned
Also, Bandai Namco best-selling game is One Piece: Pirate Warriors, at 830k units. The company has yet to find a mega-seller on traditional systems; it has a wide array of IPs that sell well, though.
That is all very true but doesn't Bandai Namco benefit greatly from the Bandai side of things owning a few properties and also being responsible for stuff like merchandising as well.?
I imagine the business of licensed video games is slightly different for BN than it is for a purely gaming company.
I imagine the business of licensed video games is slightly different for BN than it is for a purely gaming company.
That's true. For example Warner is able to leverage all their IPs for free to great success.
That said Warner also sells a lot better per game, but I just mean in the greater "sea of titles" business it can get a bit dicey.
Takao also has a strong point though in that they don't own their partner studios, so they can just dump them to immediately drop all costs without severance fees if things go poorly.
Sammy Samusu
Member
15./16. [3DS] Sumikko Gurashi: Koko ga Ochitsukundesu <ETC> (Nippon Columbia) {2014.11.20} (¥5.184) - 19.848 / 55.901 (+62%)
Shipment reaches 100k
"Sumikko in Japanese means 'corner', and Gurashi means 'living'. They are the Living Beings of the Corners."
>.>
Anyway, apparently this is popular enough to get a hard case, releasing on Dec 30. Nippon Colombia making some serious money on the 3DS.
Shipment reaches 100k
"Sumikko in Japanese means 'corner', and Gurashi means 'living'. They are the Living Beings of the Corners."
>.>
Anyway, apparently this is popular enough to get a hard case, releasing on Dec 30. Nippon Colombia making some serious money on the 3DS.
Moor-Angol
Banned
17 PS4 waiting for new owners
(Book-Off West Shinjuku)
(Book-Off West Shinjuku)
Hero of Legend
Member
Speaking of Bandai Namco teams, I just remembered a REALLY bizarre pairing of game and dev by them; Pac-Man Party 3D on 3DS was by Namco Tales Studio. Wat.
It's true, it's in the game's boot up.
It's true, it's in the game's boot up.
They're not special editions, no one wants them! Slap a coat of red or blue on them or something.
Pennywise83
Banned
I predicted this the week it opened at just 11k
Nippon Columbia has a history on DS and 3DS; its best-selling title is Kobito Dukan on 3DS, with a first week of 26k units and an incredible LTD of 254k units:
The sequel wasn't near as successful, selling only 10k. But they found some more success with Hoppe-chan, which opened at 8k and went to sell 34k units:
Nothing spectacular, but Nippon Columbia has always been a company producing niche games from kidsì IPs. Its best-selling DS game is Akogare Girls Collection: Wan Nyan Doubutsu Byouin, with 60k units:
Therefore, they're definitely a company that found more success on 3DS than DS!
bigmit3737
Member
Were the total software sales for the Vita this year really much lower than last year ?
Pennywise83
Banned
If I'm not mistaken, PSV 2014 sw sales are 1m ahead of last year sw sales.
To think I own almost all these games. AND Chocolate Dog RPG!I predicted this the week it opened at just 11k
Nippon Columbia has a history on DS and 3DS; its best-selling title is Kobito Dukan on 3DS, with a first week of 26k units and an incredible LTD of 254k units:
The sequel wasn't near as successful, selling only 10k. But they found some more success with Hoppe-chan, which opened at 8k and went to sell 34k units:
Nothing spectacular, but Nippon Columbia has always been a company producing niche games from kidsì IPs. Its best-selling DS game is Akogare Girls Collection: Wan Nyan Doubutsu Byouin, with 60k units:
Therefore, they're definitely a company that found more success on 3DS than DS!
Weird. That would be their final game too since Namco shut the studio down around the same time as it's release.Speaking of Bandai Namco teams, I just remembered a REALLY bizarre pairing of game and dev by them; Pac-Man Party 3D on 3DS was by Namco Tales Studio. Wat.
It's true, it's in the game's boot up.
edit: After a little more digging it seems they also worked on the Wii Pac-Man Party and developed Namco Museum Battle Collection on PSP.
Just realised something... Sonic Toon (Boom in the West) was supposed to come out on Dec. 18, yet it's nowhere to be seen in MC's Top 50.
Bomba of the year? Can't say I'm surprised tbh, and I still don't understand why SEGA bothered at all since they initially didn't plan to release thsoe games in Japan.
Bomba of the year? Can't say I'm surprised tbh, and I still don't understand why SEGA bothered at all since they initially didn't plan to release thsoe games in Japan.
They should have called it Cactuar Hunter
Sammy Samusu
Member
http://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/bestsellers/2014/videogames/
FFEX is the #20 best selling game on Amazon in 2014. Come through!
Now we wait for FFV and FFTA3.
FFEX is the #20 best selling game on Amazon in 2014. Come through!
Now we wait for FFV and FFTA3.
Bruno MB
Member
That was to be expected seeing how previous Sonic titles had sold in the last 10 years.
Code:
First Week Sales: (Media Create)
[WII] Sonic and the Secret Rings (SEGA) {2007.03.15} - 11.246
[WII] Sonic Unleashed (SEGA) {2008.12.18} - 7.393
[WII] Sonic and the Black Knight (SEGA) {2009.03.12} - 4.799
[WII] Sonic Colors (SEGA) {2010.11.18} - 4.102
[WIU] Sonic: Lost World (SEGA) {2013.10.24} - 2.430
[WIU] Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric (SEGA) {2014.12.18} - ?Also does anybody have LTD on FE: Awakening (Old, I know D
471.467 (Media Create)
I've gone grey waiting for the 5 remake.
FFTA3 is the one that seems a no brainer after FE: Awakening's success but no one has really rushed to get in on that. It is truly bizarre.
There were a couple of similar games on mobile about 12 months later IIRC.
Pennywise83
Banned
FE Awakening was released on 3DS, though. It seems weird, indeed, that few companies chased the huge success of this game (500k units for a tRPG on console was really something in 2012), by releasing games in the same genre.
Oh, no, I agree with the overall sentiment. It's just my best guess at what happened.
Like just a week or two ago we were talking about Monster Hunter's success on 3DS and the people who chased that almost all showed up on Vita.
We even have Square Enix releasing their Uncharted competitor as an Xbox timed exclusive.
There's sometimes an odd "target a different platform" approach with Japanese publishers.
Yeah I know publishers love mobile and all but that IS bizarre. Like I understand that publishers love mobile stuff but how could a massive success on 3DS motivate you to make further inroads on another platform?
To be fair Tales: Reve Unitia and Forbidden Magna did come out recently and Stella Glow is out next year.
Pennywise83
Banned
Tomb Raider and hunting-actions on PSV can easily be explained by money-hatting, agreements and stuffs like that. The absence of tRPG whatsoever on traditional console, and their minuscole presence on mobile as well is something else.
There were some attemps, though, but more recent and not really something to be excited for, such as Reve Unitia and Stella Glow. I would have expected something from Nippon Ichi and a FFT game.
Afaik that approach actually existed from a few generations before.
(The "different platform" must have install base though).
Support from other platform holders, competition within a platform, and distribution channel may be factors to it. There must be more factors I missed too, for sure.
I feel for the most part that could be a case of publishers expecting Capcom to go to Vita. The majority of posters here thought MonHun would go to Vita as well.
Koei Tecmo said they put Toukiden on Vita specifically because Monster Hunter went to 3DS but I very much doubt it would have been a 3DS game had the situation been reversed.
FFT's issue might be that a lot of the main staff work in notable positions on FFXIV and Square places that as higher priority.
Excluding Nippon Ichi for a second, are there a lot of other publishers who make notable TRPGs?
Like platformers do really well on 3DS, but no one competes with those either.
Excluding Nippon Ichi for a second, are there a lot of other publishers who make notable TRPGs?
Like platformers do really well on 3DS, but no one competes with those either.
Sammy Samusu
Member
Most hunting games for Vita were probably in development before the Monster Hunter betrayalton, there was also the chance of Monster Hunter 3DS selling less than expected.
Remember when God Eater 2 vanished from the face of the earth? Good times.
Remember when God Eater 2 vanished from the face of the earth? Good times.
IIRC that was because the character design was panned by audience and they had to redo the whole thing.
You do have a point there. The only other semi-notable one I can think of is Luminous Arc and whilst Marvelous is taking that to Vita Image Epoch is putting their new SRPG on 3DS.
Yeah it's not exactly new, but I feel we never see this in the West outside of 5 person indie teams.
Even Western developed games that tried to do this like The Conduit had to find Japanese publishers.
I don't think it's a completely bad idea but I would think usually(and definitely in the case of The Conduit) it would be case where a genre or niche is heavily covered on one system and not the other.
In the case of FE:Awakening there wasn't much else in the genre(Devil Survivor?) and Nintendo has even left quite a big gap. They could have had a new FE out by now.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
This.
And good that they changed it too since shit would have bombed hard with that ugly as fuck "Nomura" look they were trying to go for. Since they would have ripped out the largest part of the games design that made it stand out, the character design / style.
Pennywise83
Banned
IIRC it was because PSP was dying software-wise and the team had to make the game multi with PSV.
Of course, the fact that the genre was barely alive played a factor, as for platforms. During last generation, though, many companies developed tRPG on handheld, such as Atlus (which is porting Devil Survivor on 3DS anyway), Level-5 (Jean d'Arc), Square Enix (FFTA2, Front Mission, IIRC even Valkyrie Profile was a tRPG on DS?), Sega (Valkyria Chronicles moved to PSP at a certain point), AQI (Blue Dragon Plus), even Nintendo outside its most notable franchises (ASH).
It just sounds weird that when a tRPG could finally succeed in a mass-market way, almost no one is going to serve that audience.
I'm guessing it's a scale of economics issue.
Western publishers don't want to sell 300K on the off platform instead of chasing 3 million on the main one.
The decision to make STEAM was kind of interesting since it almost looks like it's trying to target the West but with a stylistic approach that doesn't quite understand the market correctly.