MiamiWesker
Member
DrBo42 said:
Yeah it was, it might as well not be there. How can a series go from something so easy as pressing against something to that. Luckily just ducking behind stuff provides enough cover.
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MGS4 review - Swedish LEVEL #26 (NO SPOILERS!)
- Thread starter Yoshichan
- Start date
Yeah it was, it might as well not be there. How can a series go from something so easy as pressing against something to that. Luckily just ducking behind stuff provides enough cover.
SolidSnakex
Member
DrBo42 said:
The reason for the lack of a cover system is because they don't want you relying on standing behind objects anymore. It encourages using the Octocam more as well as other forms of stealth.
I found the cover system fine when playing as Snake and trying to hide, but inadequate for moving quickly in and out of cover in a heavy firefight.
Is it realistic to poke your head above cover and shoot?
It's been in a lot of games recently, and that's not to say that it's bad, but I thought that's kind of like saying "shoot me" to your enemy.
Is it realistic to poke your head above cover and shoot?
It's been in a lot of games recently, and that's not to say that it's bad, but I thought that's kind of like saying "shoot me" to your enemy.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
DrBo42 said:
No wonder we were whooping your ass in MGO, right?
I mean if you suck at the game, surely it's lag or cover system or auto-aim noobs right?
i kid 
That said, i loved the cover system and did it's job as it should do. It's called "cover system", not "hide and no one will be able to see you while you shoot them with perfection". Once again, this ain't Gears of War.
Pressing up against walls in MGS2 and firing at a soldier down a hallway..I will forever miss those days. It was so damn awkward to peak out and shoot someone in MGO, not to mention slow. They could headshot you 3 times in the amount of time it takes you to peak around. It almost felt like a downgrade from the past games. Wtf?MiamiWesker said:
Actually I was pretty damn good at MGO. I tried the cover system a few times and quickly realized it was useless, just like everyone else. Shut it nub. :lolshagg_187 said:No wonder we were whooping your ass in MGO, right?
I mean if you suck at the game, surely it's lag or cover system or auto-aim noobs right?
They don't want us standing behind objects in a Metal Gear game anymore? Where did you get this updated design doc?SolidSnakex said:
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
DrBo42 said:
who u calling a nub, noob!
Guled said:
No.
Danne-Danger
Member
Hmm, guess I'll go with Hard right away. Otherwise I'll probably just headshot my way through MGO-style.
BumbleBee Castle
Member
You want a spoiler? Who wants to hear a spoiler?
YOU WILL DIE ALONE!
YOU WILL DIE ALONE!
MollyMillions
Neo Member
As a chica who hasn't played MGO (PS3 is coming along with MGS4), am I right in interpreting the above comments to mean that there is NO cover system? If so, that really fucking sucks.
I thought that the previous "touch a wall and stick" had been removed in favor of a more GoW/Uncharted\GTA IV style "push a button and stick" system. If there's no way to spin out from behind cover and fire, color me disappointed.
I thought that the previous "touch a wall and stick" had been removed in favor of a more GoW/Uncharted\GTA IV style "push a button and stick" system. If there's no way to spin out from behind cover and fire, color me disappointed.
MiamiWesker said:
I actually like that you press a button to get into cover. In MGS3S trying to press against cover and move around using the new camera was tough to the point of being useless. The problem with the new MGS4 controls is that, like others have pointed out, trying to fire from behind cover is way too slow and ends up being pointless.
No no, cover is there. Press triangle to get against a surface. They system of firing from cover just sucks.MollyMillions said:As a chica who hasn't played MGO (PS3 is coming along with MGS4), am I right in interpreting the above comments to mean that there is NO cover system? If so, that really fucking sucks.
I thought that the previous "touch a wall and stick" had been removed in favor of a more GoW/Uncharted\GTA IV style "push a button and stick" system. If there's no way to spin out from behind cover and fire, color me disappointed.
MollyMillions said:As a chica who hasn't played MGO (PS3 is coming along with MGS4), am I right in interpreting the above comments to mean that there is NO cover system? If so, that really fucking sucks.
I thought that the previous "touch a wall and stick" had been removed in favor of a more GoW/Uncharted\GTA IV style "push a button and stick" system. If there's no way to spin out from behind cover and fire, color me disappointed.
There is a push a button and stick, and there is a fire out of cover system. But they're not as snappy as other games. It takes time to get to the edge of cover and shoot. I think they'll be useful in SP, not so much in MP, but if they were too good, then it would be a bit too godly in MP.
I'd say the whole process is about as fast as it was in MGS2, without the back to the wall thing. Now your front is to the wall.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
Long story short, you have to get used to the controls like every other game out there and make a decision on what to use at a certain situation. Cover works in some but doesn't in other.
SolidSnakex
Member
DrBo42 said:
I mean they don't want you relying on standing behind it. You can still do it if you need to but they want you to use other forms of stealth. Using Octocam, or finding something to crawl under/into ect.
This is true, and I don't argue that it will be a great game. I just wish the system had a few more options and was a little quicker. Like if you're pressed against a low surface such as a small box, I can't peak up and fire over it? Instead I have to move to the side to shoot from it? Kinda lame.shagg_187 said:
But you have to be standing behind something or laying down to use the octocamo.. I'm not trying to pick on you, I understand what you're trying to say. They're giving us more options, I agree. The problem is that the option that was always there, feels gimped.SolidSnakex said:
Red Blaster
Member
MollyMillions said:As a chica who hasn't played MGO (PS3 is coming along with MGS4), am I right in interpreting the above comments to mean that there is NO cover system? If so, that really fucking sucks.
I thought that the previous "touch a wall and stick" had been removed in favor of a more GoW/Uncharted\GTA IV style "push a button and stick" system. If there's no way to spin out from behind cover and fire, color me disappointed.
It's actually fundamentally the same as it's always been in the series, though now you just need to push a button to shimmy up to the wall instead of holding the analog stick into it. You still pop out and shoot the same way you always have.
It's pretty useless in MGO, yes. However I could see it having plenty of use in the single player part of the game and Matt Leone appears to have affirmed its usefulness at least on the higher difficulties. It's a godsend compared to MGS3's worthless jump-out-shot, which wasn't even altered in the wake of the general scarcity of flat surfaces in the game.
SolidSnakex
Member
DrBo42 said:
I guess you could say it's gimped. It puts it closer to being on the same level as the other types of stealth you can use. In other words it means that if you come upon a situation your first reaction won't be "stand behind that wall/rock", you'll have to scan around and think of what would be the best option. Like I said it gives you a sense of never being safe, which is something I don't think you get if you can always rely on a wall to save your ass. If you play that mini game on the official website it gives you an idea of what i'm talking about.
The new crouch move compensates for the lack of a quick wall hug IMO. Adding in Uncharted/GeOW-style cover mechanics would mean that they'd have to pepper the environments with cover objects. I think it works fine the way it is now - it's still useful against enemies that are far away.
So does every game have to have a Gears-esque cover system now? (EGM seems to be the only one who has complained about a lack of it btw) Can't you just like manually walk behind cover and strafe to the sides or momentarily uncrouch to shoot? If it had a Gears-like system they would complain the game was too easy anyway.
The only purpose of latching on to walls and stuff in MGS4 is so your octocamo will change textures and you can move slowly through an environment or slide into small crevaces(Midtown Maelstrom in the beta had such crevaces).
The "cover system" ,if you can call it that, is not intended for combat, it's intended to aid with stealth.
The only purpose of latching on to walls and stuff in MGS4 is so your octocamo will change textures and you can move slowly through an environment or slide into small crevaces(Midtown Maelstrom in the beta had such crevaces).
The "cover system" ,if you can call it that, is not intended for combat, it's intended to aid with stealth.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
^^^
Basically it is useless for normal soldiers and most game types in MGO yes, I would agree. However it was very useful if you are playing as Snake. Hitting triangle to go onto cover changes your octocam and raises you camo %. Again, its useless for combat, as it is probably not intended for combat, but it is great for stealth.jett said:
I guess I just don't understand some of those EGM complaints about the lack of a cover system...I would think that by implementing one KP would have had to completely change the feel of MGS. Granted, I haven't got my issue in yet so I'm not
Once I got used to the timing of running close to the wall and hitting Triangle just as I reached the wall, I had little problem using cover in MGO. The problem really is that:
1. Movement on the wall is too slow to be useful in reactionary combat situations.
2. Peeking out takes too much time, and you can't peek over, only to the sides.
However, if you could snap to the wall and move very quickly, and peek in and out in an instant, I'm afraid that you'd be able to just peek out, go for a headshot, and duck back a little too quickly. In MGO if you have a good bead on someone, you can headshot them extremely quickly and kill them instantly. With this slower cover, you're exposed for a moment while using it, so it's not too powerful, but I'd be afraid if you could snap in and out in half a second.
Also I think blindfire has no place in MGO, although GTA4 and Gears is fine.
In single player, your camo goes up on the wall, and it's usually a bit more slower paced, so you can take your time to line up shots, wait for the enemy to turn their back, pop out and shoot. In SP, you're probably going to benefit a lot when shooting from cover, more so than MGS3, because your camo index doesn't go to zero anymore when you're trying to hide, there's no more peek from FPV, and you're pretty well protected when you just peek out a little bit in SP.
My theories, anyway.
1. Movement on the wall is too slow to be useful in reactionary combat situations.
2. Peeking out takes too much time, and you can't peek over, only to the sides.
However, if you could snap to the wall and move very quickly, and peek in and out in an instant, I'm afraid that you'd be able to just peek out, go for a headshot, and duck back a little too quickly. In MGO if you have a good bead on someone, you can headshot them extremely quickly and kill them instantly. With this slower cover, you're exposed for a moment while using it, so it's not too powerful, but I'd be afraid if you could snap in and out in half a second.
Also I think blindfire has no place in MGO, although GTA4 and Gears is fine.
In single player, your camo goes up on the wall, and it's usually a bit more slower paced, so you can take your time to line up shots, wait for the enemy to turn their back, pop out and shoot. In SP, you're probably going to benefit a lot when shooting from cover, more so than MGS3, because your camo index doesn't go to zero anymore when you're trying to hide, there's no more peek from FPV, and you're pretty well protected when you just peek out a little bit in SP.
My theories, anyway.
jett said:
Agreed, which is why I personally dont get down on the MGS3 train - the camo, cure, hell, all the pace-killing menu systems are similarly useless. Im in the minority I know, but MGS3 was a big disappointment for me. 1 and 2 are easily top 10 games for me, but 3 left a bad taste in my mouth. And dont even get me started on the awful VA, especially Hayter's ever-worsening Snake and The Boss. And please, no one give me that shit about how The Boss was supposed to be cold and dispassionate - there is a difference between that and monotone, piss-poor VA work, and The Boss was the latter.
An UNCHARTED!!!111!!!
cover system but with the ability to click on R1 to crouch-walk, x for jump and grab hold/climb on top/vault over obstacles, O to roll and snap to cover or to drop down and hang on a ledge, you can take or leave the blindfire as the nature of the game dictates but L1 peek over/around and aim would be quick and painless.
Ynos Yrros
Banned
Snake is much faster than regular mercenaries in MGO, he peeks out of cover much faster.
SolidSnakex
Member
Ashhong said:
It still has it, but it's done differently now. Instead of hugging a wall with your back you use your stomach. You're still able to peak out and fire off a shot if you need to.
Ynos Yrros
Banned
Legendary hero skill set, lvl 3 fast move.KTallguy said:
Ashhong said:
A series trademark??? Yeah, there's a pop out and shoot option in previous MGS games but it's not really all that important in any of them. The cover system was never meant to make the game play like GOW; the system was there to facilitate the stealth gameplay. It sounds like the cover system in 4 is there for the same reason.
People are talking like they're disappointed that it doesn't have GOW style gameplay. The fuck? I'd be really disappointed if MGS4 were to imitate GOW like a dozen other games.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
Ynos Yrros said:
Man, makes me wish you had 6 lvl sets in MGO instead of 4
Pop On Arrival
Banned
I almost cried after listening to the MGS4 version of the theme. When that shit plays during an awesome cinematic, it'll be fucking so mind-bogglingly epic. Cannot. Fucking. Wait.
fuck.
fuck fuck.
fuck fuck fuck!
FUCKERS.
fuck.
fuck fuck.
fuck fuck fuck!
FUCKERS.
SolidSnakex
Member
GamePro has given MGS4 a 5/5.