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[Macmanus]

You obviously haven't been reading NeoGaf for long then as it used to be a 'classic' talking point when someone most innocently would ask what exclusives MS would have for any given year.

Any mention of a 360 game which was also on PC would more often than not be labelled not an exclusive.

Yeah that is fine. But were people actually bitching about the fact that a game was available on multiple venues? I get people arguing over whether something can be classified as exclusive or not, but complaining about increased software availability seems beyond most levels of myopia I'm familiar with.

 

[Scipius]

they aren't the only things going for it.

and a small subset of 8 bajillion people is more than 50 active participants a night. especially when you put your game up on sale for £3.50.

i've got a guest pass waiting for anyone who refuses to buy anything without a demo.

50 online users? Globally? Ouch. I know how you feel, it's a pity when it happens with a game you love, but considering that the PC already has a wealth of excellent multiplayer-only shooters available, they really should have included at least a DirectX 9 renderer. It wouldn't have made much of difference graphically and they could have potentially sold the game to twice as many PC gamers.

 

[epmode]

This has been mentioned earlier in this thread but Microsoft limiting DX10 to Vista is one of the most teeth-gnashingly horrible decisions of all time.

 

[quetz67]

So waiting if it turns out good:

If not - who cares
If yes - waiting for PC announcement

PC announcment coming - fine!
PC announcment really not coming - getting a cheap used 360 on ebay early morning, playing the game and selling 360 with a profit later.

 

[Saty]

Don't they make A LOT more money on the consoles? Publishers aren't driven by 'what sells good enough' but what sells the most. Anything less is called an opportunity cost.

And the cycle you describe seems to be a thing of the past. De xbox360 hardware is almost 4.5 years old(dated) and there's still no shift to the PC market. The investments in blockbuster games and franchises that moved to the consoles aren't returning at all. The game seems to have changed.

You're missing the point. Sure, they make more money on the consoles but that doesn't negate the fact that they do make decent money on the PC version as well. There is no financial reason to NOT release a PC version of your game if you're able to. Why would anyone say 'no' to more money and more profit?

Like i said earlier, the fact that the bulk of sales are expected to come from the console versions lowers the risk of producing a PC version - 'success' isn't confined to how much it sold on PC, therefore publishers are satisfied when the PC SKU sells anything between 500,000 to million copies (a figure that may not be very good for the console version).
So on one hand, they don't expect the PC sales to cover anything and thus be happy with 'modest' figures and on the other hand, the profit over making such version is pretty much "money in the bank".

Looking at NPD data, alot of consoles releases are doing mediocre numbers at best,nothing that is out of reach for a PC SKU, so i think there's lots of exaggeration in terms of 'PC games sell poorly, console games sell so much more'.

About the cycle thing, could be one of the symptoms of this gen being probably lengthened, or that publishers already invested so much and most of them are losing money that they are trying to target as many as platforms as possbile.

 

[DodgyGeezerFella]

This has been mentioned earlier in this thread but Microsoft limiting DX10 to Vista is one of the most teeth-gnashingly horrible decisions of all time.

I thought there was some genuine technical reason why it remained Vista (and beyond) exclusive ? Something about WDDM ? (Could be wrong).

 

[ghst]

50 online users? Globally? Ouch. I know how you feel, it's a pity when it happens with a game you love, but considering that the PC already has a wealth of excellent multiplayer-only shooters available, they really should have included at least a DirectX 9 renderer. It wouldn't have made much of difference graphically and they could have potentially sold the game to twice as many PC gamers.

twice as many, so, a hundred people? that's still pretty offensive considering the effort.

this game was futuremark's love letter to the possibilities of pc gaming, and the fps (i'm not expecting a zero-g shooter to win over ardent paradox-ites) community rewarded them with a "fuck you, we'll stick to our feature gimped console ports."

 

[Hari Seldon]

You're missing the point. Sure, they make more money on the consoles but that doesn't negate the fact that they do make decent money on the PC version as well. There is no financial reason to NOT release a PC version of your game if you're able to. Why would anyone say 'no' to more money and more profit?

Like i said earlier, the fact that the bulk of sales are expected to come from the console versions lowers the risk of producing a PC version - 'success' isn't confined to how much it sold on PC, therefore publishers are satisfied when the PC SKU sells anything between 500,000 to million copies (a figure that may not be very good for the console version).
So on one hand, they don't expect the PC sales to cover anything and thus be happy with 'modest' figures and on the other hand, the profit over making such version is pretty much "money in the bank".

Looking at NPD data, alot of consoles releases are doing mediocre numbers at best,nothing that is out of reach for a PC SKU, so i think there's lots of exaggeration in terms of 'PC games sell poorly, console games sell so much more'.

About the cycle thing, could be one of the symptoms of this gen being probably lengthened, or that publishers already invested so much and most of them are losing money that they are trying to target as many as platforms as possbile.

Yeah there is really only two reasons to not release a PC version:

1. You think PC piracy will force you to lose overall sales in the console world.
2. You are trying to push 360s.

Either case is extremely unlikely, which is why I simply think this will be a timed exclusive.

 

[Lonely1]

twice as many, so, a hundred people? that's still pretty offensive considering the effort.

this game was futuremark's love letter to the possibilities of pc gaming, and the fps (i'm not expecting a zero-g shooter to win over ardent paradox-ites) community rewarded them with a "fuck you, we'll stick to our feature gimped console ports."

I didn't get it because I was running WinXP until 4 days ago. Im running W7-64 now, but is hard for me to spend $20 on a multy only game with so few people playing it :/

 

[Saty]

Yeah there is really only two reasons to not release a PC version:

1. You think PC piracy will force you to lose overall sales in the console world.
2. You are trying to push 360s.

Either case is extremely unlikely, which is why I simply think this will be a timed exclusive.

About 1. , I would really like to see if publishers (mainly Ubisoft) has any data that shows that delaying the PC version helps the overall sales.

The 2nd reason is fair enough. MS are making their line-up better so more people would consider buying the console. The same Sony and Nintendo are doing even when they have low-selling exclusives (R&C) .
By your way, many of PS3 and 360 exclusives should have gotten a PC port, but obviously the platform holders want to keep them that way to allude to players, so as much as i would have liked seeing AW on PC, it probably aint going to happen. If it was timed-exclusive, they would have been coy about it, but they flat-out said there isn't going to be one.

 

[brain_stew]

Ah, really nice write-up there. And I didn't know that you could switch between pad and k+m on the fly either. Makes alot of sense there and then.
Really nice to know all that, specially for future reference.

Its an awesome feature for certain game like GTA4 and SR2. Heck in RE5 it works pretty nice as well, I can just be laying back taking it easy with the pad but when there's intense scenes or I need to be accurate I just pick up the mouse and fire off a load of headshots! Like I say its about choice, some of us PC gamers like to lounge back on the comfy couch and use a pad from time to time as well you know! :lol

You'll get the zealots that say you can't play any game without a keyboard & mouse but I can recognise its not a perfect fit for all games and all situations. I like having the option to use the controller I want, when I want so that's why I prefer to have controller support.

 

[-SD-]

Looking forward to buying an Alan Wake -branded couch from IKEA.

NOT

 

[brain_stew]

This has been mentioned earlier in this thread but Microsoft limiting DX10 to Vista is one of the most teeth-gnashingly horrible decisions of all time.

Nope, its pretty much the best thing that could have happened to the API. Breaking away from all that horrible unnecessary legacy code and supporting a new from the ground up driver model, made all kinds of sense. It was the poor reception that Vista faced that was the issue not DX10 it self.

Now with W7 in so many gamer's hands, we can finally start to see the benefits of that clean break.

 

[Scipius]

twice as many, so, a hundred people? that's still pretty offensive considering the effort.

this game was futuremark's love letter to the possibilities of pc gaming, and the fps (i'm not expecting a zero-g shooter to win over ardent paradox-ites) community rewarded them with a "fuck you, we'll stick to our feature gimped console ports."

It missed the opportunity to make the initial community as large as possible by setting the bar very high. For a multiplayer game the community is everything. The subsequent idea that the game wasn't as good as other multiplayer shooters only makes it a harder sell from then on. Is the number of players currently growing or dwindling?

It's understandable given Futuremark's origins (they built a game around their benchmark engine), but a PC multiplayer game does not need the highest graphical fidelity. No need to blame the PC FPS "community" as such, but you do have a point that MW2 PC players don't know what's good for them (but that's another debate).

 

[fizzelopeguss]

twice as many, so, a hundred people? that's still pretty offensive considering the effort.

this game was futuremark's love letter to the possibilities of pc gaming, and the fps (i'm not expecting a zero-g shooter to win over ardent paradox-ites) community rewarded them with a "fuck you, we'll stick to our feature gimped console ports."

Chances are if there's so few players then the game itself prolly isn't much good, I've played cult multiplayer shooters for years after their "death". Codename eagle, kingpin etc and i never had issues finding players. And that was before steam, we needed to use bizarre 3rd party clients from the likes of barrysworld and multiplay.co.uk. There was always had hundreds of people playing.

Still, release a demo and i'll make my own mind up.

 

[brain_stew]

It missed the opportunity to make the initial community as large as possible by setting the bar very high. For a multiplayer game the community is everything. The subsequent idea that the game wasn't as good as other multiplayer shooters only makes it a harder sell from then on. Is the number of players currently growing or dwindling?

It's understandable given Futuremark's origins (they built a game around their benchmark engine), but a PC multiplayer game does not need the highest graphical fidelity. No need to blame the PC FPS "community" as such, but you do have a point that MW2 PC players don't know what's good for them (but that's another debate).

I wouldn't give up hope on the game yet, W7 penetration has gone way up since the game's launch and a Steam sale coupled with the launch of the first batch of free DLC and a free weekend could work wonders. I've got to admit I'm part of the problem, I own the game but haven't put nearly enough time into it because that Steam holiday sale gave me such a ridiculous backlog. I'd like to feel I've done my part though as I was the first person to pimp around GAF back before the game was even in BETA and I plan to jump in "full time" once the DLC arrives.

 

[epmode]

Nope, its pretty much the best thing that could have happened to the API. Breaking away from all that horrible unnecessary legacy code and supporting a new from the ground up driver model, made all kinds of sense. It was the poor reception that Vista faced that was the issue not DX10 it self.

You're right about the Vista reception of course, but the other thing is that the DX10 break had a lot to do with the evaporation of envelope-pushing PC games.

It's nice that we may finally start to get stuff that actually requires the new API but 3-4 years (and counting) is a long time to wait.

 

[Oreoleo]

I'd like to feel I've done my part though as I was the first person to pimp around GAF back before the game was even in BETA and I plan to jump in "full time" once the DLC arrives.

DLC is already out DOOD

 

[brain_stew]

It's nice that we may finally start to get stuff that actually requires the new API but 3-4 years (and counting) is a long time to wait.

Its always been that way though, DX9 was released in 2002 and it wasn't until 2004 that we started see its widespread use, and even then, stuff like HL2 and Doom 3 were primarily built around DX8.1 hardware anyway. Sure the Vista requirement may have pushed that out a bit longer but the easy transition to DX11 is netting some pretty impressive results already. The API isn't 6 months old and yet we're about to see the release of a game that make's full use of dynamic tessellation for both the environment and characters. That's a pretty swift turnaround.

DLC is already out DOOD

It is, fuck, how'd I miss that! :lol Time to jump in then, seems like a missed opportunity not making a bigger deal out of it and tying it in with a free weekend and Steam sale.

 

[Curufinwe]

The integration of the 360 controller in a lot of modern games is so seamless that I find myself switching between control methods within the same game, and its awesome as hell when the button prompts even update in real time. Its perfect for something like GTA4, where I like to use my pad for driving round town or navigating obstacles, but I'll quickly switch to the kb&m for drive bys and major shootouts and the game will alter the targeting modes, button prompts and auto aim instantly as soon as I touch the keyboard. You can't begin to imagine how awesome having that amount of freedom is and once its something you get used to, you don't want it taken away.

I used the 360 pad to play Dead Space on the PC, but switched to the mouse for the asteroid shooting segments.

 

[Oreoleo]

It is, fuck, how'd I miss that! :lol Time to jump in then, seems like a missed opportunity not making a bigger deal out of it and tying it in with a free weekend and Steam sale.

Ninja release FTL. I agree with you about the free weekend and sale. Seems like a no-brainer. I'd really like to try this game with teams bigger than 3v3 sometime

 

[Fredescu]

Bought Shattered Horizon for $5. Launched it once. No one playing locally. Waste of time, no doubt due to shitty marketing. Blame gamers for their failure if you like, I'll just keep playing Bad Company 2 because it's awesome and I can get a game at any time of the day.

 

[Anticitizen One]

http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128197&page=1&

Oh jeez that was SOOOO hard!

If you can't take 5 seconds to use Google maybe you should just avoid the Internet altogether.

Tell me, having any luck getting Yoshi's Island working through Virtual Console?

Read what it says in the link. What the hell does SSmodtool do where do I even get it? its not so simple as doing a 5 second search, downloading somethign adn poof your done. You have to do all this other crap.

and ok Yoshi isn't on VC big deal. It ain't on PC either (unless you ROM it which is illegal).

 

[NIGHT-]

Well the PC probably has more exclusive than all three console put together, so no I don't see how that works.

Most of them are RTS or MMO games. I find the console exclusive games way more appealing.

 

[epmode]

and ok Yoshi isn't on VC big deal. It ain't on PC either (unless you ROM it which is illegal).

Prove it. (Linking to a publisher's TOS doesn't count)

There are gray areas with respect to ROM creation but emulation is truly legal, and has it has been upheld in the courts.

Read what it says in the link. What the hell does SSmodtool do where do I even get it? its not so simple as doing a 5 second search, downloading somethign adn poof your done. You have to do all this other crap.

So you're lazy. I understand that.

The neat thing about PCs is that there's almost always a way. I'd prefer to spend some time figuring it out instead of hoping that a publisher will bless you with a re-release or whatever. But that's just me!

 

[crimsonheadGCN]

Read what it says in the link. What the hell does SSmodtool do where do I even get it? its not so simple as doing a 5 second search, downloading somethign adn poof your done. You have to do all this other crap.

and ok Yoshi isn't on VC big deal. It ain't on PC either (unless you ROM it which is illegal).

There's a link to a site in that very thread, which hosts all files to make both System Shock and System Shock 2 playable on current OS. Follow the link provided in this post then go to File Archive. Look for appropriate game.

 

[brain_stew]

Most of them are RTS or MMO games.

No, they're really not, there's plenty of them, sure but that's not even the tip of the iceberg.

 

[clip]

Most of them are RTS or MMO games. I find the console exclusive games way more appealing.

The Void, ANNO 1404, and STALKER wouldn't work well on a console, and that just what I'm playing at the moment.

 

[Minsc]

Most of them are RTS or MMO games. I find the console exclusive games way more appealing.

You're a console die hard through and through, I don't think a person alive could call Crackdown > Steam's entire Holiday sale if they had an ounce of PC blood in them.

 

[Archie]

Most of them are RTS or MMO games. I find the console exclusive games way more appealing.

lolno

 

[Owzers]

You're a console die hard through and through, I don't think a person alive could call Crackdown > Steam's entire Holiday sale if they had an ounce of PC blood in them.

The Steam sale is like a blood transfusion. My only regret was that out of alllll the cheap pc games i bought during the holiday sale, i started playing Lucidity first. Complete buzz kill.

 

[Fredescu]

You don't need an ounce of PC blood to appreciate these deals: GTA4 for $7.50, Mass Effect for $5, Mirror's Edge for $5, Red Faction Guerilla for $10, Bioshock for $5, Dead Space for $10, Burnout Paradise for $7.50, and on and on.

Crackdown has been cheap for ages.

 

[Gully State]

You don't need an ounce of PC blood to appreciate these deals: GTA4 for $7.50, Mass Effect for $5, Mirror's Edge for $5, Red Faction Guerilla for $10, Bioshock for $5, Dead Space for $10, Burnout Paradise for $7.50, and on and on.

Crackdown has been cheap for ages.

Don't forget TF2 for $2.50.

 

[crimsonheadGCN]

lolno

I doubt that site will sway him, since he had this response to it when a thread was made a few months ago:

Looks like I will be gaming on consoles in 2010

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=18280757&postcount=4

Spoiler

I do not see why anyone is bothering to respond to him, since a lot of the posts that he made in PC related threads has generally been trollish.

 

[Fredescu]

I was only listing recent games that were also on consoles. Suffice it to say there was insane deals all around, and there continues to be on a weekly basis. The THQ pack that is on sale right now for example. It has been $50 few times, but it is still a pretty amazing deal.

 

[Archie]

And L4D for $7.50, Battlefield 2 for $7.50, King's Bounty Armored Princess for $10, Torchlight for $5, LucasArts Adventure Pack for $2.50, Trine for $5, XCOM Complete for $2 and so forth.

Fuck I spend to much money on Steam sales.

I doubt that site will sway him, since he had this response to it when a thread was made a few months ago:



http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=18280757&postcount=4

Spoiler

I do not see why anyone is bothering to respond to him, since a lot of the posts that he made in PC related threads has generally been trollish.

I don't know why I bother responding to blatant trolling either. :/

 

[Bloodrage]

lolno

 

[epmode]

I doubt that site will sway him, since he had this response to it when a thread was made a few months ago:

Yeah, this GAF search issue has me responding to proven trolls much more that I would otherwise.

 

[NIGHT-]

lolno

Most of the games on that site fall under the category I listed. Sorry but I find Super mario Galaxy 2, Crackdown 2 and God of war III much more interesting.

 

[killdatninja]

Most of the games on that site fall under the category I listed. Sorry but I find Super mario Galaxy 2, Crackdown 2 and God of war III much more interesting.

Yeah well, dude, I prefer alan wake... oh wait...

 

[Maccas]

I cannot believe I am coming to MS's defense here but I realised I have not touched my 360 since Viva Pinata 2. Why? Because no exclusives I want to play have come out, the PC covers me for most good 360 games.

Alan Wake will not be the game that makes me take another look at the 360 (the e3 demo was less than inspiring) but I can see the rationale behind their decision, although I'd respect their decision more if they didn't wrap it in a ludicrous lie.

 

[BuddhaRockstar]

Most of the games on that site fall under the category I listed. Sorry but I find Super mario Galaxy 2, Crackdown 2 and God of war III much more interesting.

A long time ago in a galaxy far far away...


LIST WARS!

 

[The Dutch Slayer]

New interview + a bit about the "pc version" about the same.

a snip of the interview:

At X10 there were some Remedy quotes explaining away the PC version saying the game was best played on the sofa, that it was best played in that style of set-up. Surely the real reason behind binning the PC SKU was a Microsoft corporate decision?

Oskari Häkkinen: Saying that Alan Wake is best played of a sofa with 5.1 surround and a big TV screen, I think is more of a preference than anything else. We’re not going out there to say that PC gamers can’t enjoy it from their own PC set-up. We’re certainly not saying that. We have a strong heritage in PC gaming as well. But, frankly, we’re a small studio. We’re 50 people, and being a small studio, it makes a lot more sense for us to focus on one platform. Currently we’re fully focused on the Xbox version, and [as for] what the future holds, we haven’t got anything to announce, and we haven’t thought that far right now. We’re fully crunching towards the Xbox 360 version.

Going forward, do you think there’s a chance you’d consider a PC version?

Oskari Häkkinen: I think that’s a decision to sit down [and make] with our publisher… and see where the title goes.

http://www.vg247.com/2010/02/19/interview-alan-wakes-hakkinen-on-surrealism-dlc-max-payne-and-more/

AKA maybe if MS pays for a pc version later we are willen to do it if not than we move on to alan wake 2/dlc for the first one.

 

[MacBosse]

Wow alot of crying and bitchin' in this thread.

 

[D4Danger]

New interview + a bit about the "pc version" about the same.

a snip of the interview:


http://www.vg247.com/2010/02/19/interview-alan-wakes-hakkinen-on-surrealism-dlc-max-payne-and-more/

AKA maybe if MS pays for a pc version later we are willen to do it if not than we move on to alan wake 2/dlc for the first one.

There's a thead on the Remedy forum about how much they have riding on this game being a success so I don't doubt we'll see a PC version later this year. When Halo and Natal are the focus you'll see a PC version.

 

[ghst]

Wow alot of crying and bitchin' in this thread.

pc gamers lost a console port and gained a numbered civ game.

i think we can call that a net profit for the week.

 

[Vinci]

Can't say this whole thing effects me too heavily. I played the demo and was pretty unimpressed. So I guess either this game is simply not for me or everyone else got a different demo. Had some neat concepts built into its mechanics but they weren't executed incredibly well, IMO.

 

[Hari Seldon]

pc gamers lost a console port and gained a numbered civ game.

i think we can call that a net profit for the week.

Yeah I don't give a shit about this game now. Civ 5 is all I need to be happy in life.

 

[Dennis]

pc gamers lost a console port and gained a numbered civ game.

i think we can call that a net profit for the week.

And so ended the thread...

 

[Steverulez]

Probably not the best place to put this, but I doubt its worth a new thread...

EuroGaf that has ordered it from GAME/Gameplay (maybe Gamestation too), the GAME head office staff are a bunch of morons and have taken pre-orders for Alan Wake 360 and PC off the site (obviously they were only supposed to do PC orders...), so if you get any orders saying it has been cancelled, they just fucked up on the Xbox version and it'll go back up soon I assume, I have no idea if they have kept pre-orders or not...