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Microsoft Says Sony Will Benefit From Launching First-Party Games on PS Plus

Three

Member
04/01/2020 to 04/30/2020? In a month period of March 2020 when MS don't release anything but Sony releases MLB The Show? What big game released then for MS to advertise. Don't be silly. Now do November/December last year.
 
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Wohc

Banned
Indeed because there is no way on God's earth that I'm paying £70 for new games. And even Ratchet & Clank Rift Apart has never dropped below £50 yet.
There is a difference between Sony's very high budget production and marketing games and games like Returnal, Ratchet or Demon Souls. Those are not that expensive and Sony does not have to sell tons of them. I expect GOW2 to drop to 30 bucks before Easter 2023.
Shortened
Halo is the only game that got some serious marketing while Sony has like half a dozen games and jugding on where i live, Sony spent much more on it. When they release one of their big games they rent nearly all the billboards in my town (medium sized city in Germany). Imagine that + all the other marketing medias worldwide. Those product ads are not super expensive, because both sites profit from it. I bought Pringles, Kinder and so on myself to get some codes and don't like to eat that stuff.

Unortunatley we don't have exact numbers, but im 100% when it comes to marketing specific games Sony is the undisputed king and i'm absolutely serios about the 10m Knack 3 or The Order 2 if they market it like their big hitters.
 
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saintjules

Member
That's a weird statement to make. I'm sure Sony is analysing the market especially with Gamepass being around for quite some time. If TLOU Remake sells like hot-cakes for 70$ - that's potentially amazing profit that company would miss if they put it in a PS+ bundle.

Trust me, the people complaining about the $70 are mostly at the forum level. The Firefly Edition sold out almost immediately after it went live for pre-order. And guess what? That was $100USD.
 

Robb

Gold Member
04/01/2020 to 04/30/2020?
Good catch, I didn’t even read the date. Need some coffee..

You’re definitely correct on that this varies greatly from month to month, I checked a few additional moths and sometimes Sony isn’t even included due to having so little spending it seems.

Found this one which cover a whole year (same source, which I cannot vouch for since I’ve never heard of them);


Although given the monthly variation I think the yearly variation could be pretty big as well.
 
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Topher

Gold Member
Good catch, I didn’t even read the date. Need some coffee..

You’re definitely correct on that this varies greatly from month to month, I checked a few additional moths and sometimes Sony isn’t even included due to having so little spending it seems.

Found this one which cover a whole year (same source, which I cannot vouch for since I’ve never heard of them);


Although given the monthly variation I think the yearly variation could be pretty big as well.

The fact that graphic uses green for PlayStation and blue for Xbox automatically disqualifies it as a legitimate source of data.

Movie Orchard Films GIF by 1091
 

Godot25

Member
04/01/2020 to 04/30/2020? In a month period of March 2020 when MS don't release anything but Sony releases MLB The Show? What big game released then for MS to advertise. Don't be silly. Now do November/December last year.
Yeah. Do november/december last year, when Sony did have jack shit to market and Microsoft had two AAA games. That will be for sure comparable more comparable :messenger_grinning:
 

Three

Member
Good catch, I didn’t even read the date. Need some coffee..

You’re definitely correct on that this varies greatly from month to month, I checked a few additional moths and sometimes Sony isn’t even included due to having so little spending it seems.

Found this one which cover a whole year (same source, which I cannot vouch for since I’ve never heard of them);


Although given the monthly variation I think the yearly variation could be pretty big as well.
It's hard to spot so not your fault. Yeah, it varies greatly especially when looking at percentages and the variation is so large that you sometimes get random outliers like MLB Advanced Media outspending Nintendo (the biggest TV spender) for a game like RBI Baseball which I'm sure very few people have even heard of.
BTW that yearly one you posted is impressions and not spend. Impressions are how many times it showed on someones screen and not the spend/cost.

Yeah. Do november/december last year, when Sony did have jack shit to market and Microsoft had two AAA games. That will be for sure comparable more comparable :messenger_grinning:

That's exactly my point. The point is that this wouldn't tell you anything about individual game marketing spend.

Somebody said that the only reason Sony games sell 10M+ plus is because Sony spend more on marketing them than MS. That simply isn't true though. MS spend a great deal of money on marketing for their games. Halo had one of the biggest marketing budgets out there. The Order 1886 also had massive marketing but its sales weren't impressive.
 
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Godot25

Member
Somebody said that the only reason Sony games sell 10M+ plus is because Sony spend more on marketing them than MS. That simply isn't true though
Ehh. It kinda is. But mainly because of how many first-party games in last gen Sony had compared to Microsoft. More games = more money spent on marketing. It's not rocket science.

Also, I think that Sony markets their games more heavily in more countries. Xbox's marketing is practically nonexistent outside US/UK markets. So again more countries = more money spent. For example, whole marketing for Xbox in Japan revolves around Game Pass.
 

Robb

Gold Member
Impressions are how many times it showed on someones screen and not the spend/cost.
Heh, well there you go. Thanks for clearing that up. Good that some people here have good reading comprehension at least. Time for that coffee..
homer brain GIF


I don’t think I’ll bother trying to find a similar graph for spending then, although I’d be interested in seeing it on a yearly basis if anyone else can manage.
 
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Three

Member
Ehh. It kinda is. But mainly because of how many first-party games in last gen Sony had compared to Microsoft. More games = more money spent on marketing. It's not rocket science.

Also, I think that Sony markets their games more heavily in more countries. Xbox's marketing is practically nonexistent outside US/UK markets. So again more countries = more money spent. For example, whole marketing for Xbox in Japan revolves around Game Pass.
How would marketing for God of War result in 10M+ sales for GTSport or Horizon Zero Dawn? What you are saying makes no sense. They would need to sell 10M+ individually.

Does/did Sony spend more money to market an individual game than MS spend. That's a simple question and the answer is no.

Advertising God of War does not directly increase sales of Horizon Zero Dawn so number of releases has no relevance. They would both sell 10M+. The guy was saying you could get 10M+ Knack 3 or State of Decay 3 sales with good enough advertising budget. Again that simply isn't true.
 

Three

Member
When they release one of their big games they rent nearly all the billboards in my town (medium sized city in Germany). Imagine that + all the other marketing medias worldwide.
Well that makes sense now then. I can see why in a place where xbox consoles are selling very little and Playstation has a much larger install base Xbox's presence may seem nonexistent to you. After all MS are not dumb enough to spend 10s of millions advertising a game in a region where even selling to 100% of the xbox install base means 50k game sales or something (number from my a** but hope you get the point).
 
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DaGwaphics

Member
Yet they don't report about Xbox (division) profits. Why?.

Edit: Also, if I remember correctly in the Brazilian documents Xbox said basically that they "lost" the traditional business model?.

To Sony, in the last-gen console sales war, sure. I know this may be controversial, but it is possible to be #3 or even #9 or #10 in a particular field and still have a profitable business. MS's gaming revenue rivals Nintendo's, I'm not sure why many figure that Nintendo and Sony are profitable, yet somehow MS isn't. Please explain the added costs that they have that the other manufacturers don't.
 

Labadal

Member
To Sony, in the last-gen console sales war, sure. I know this may be controversial, but it is possible to be #3 or even #9 or #10 in a particular field and still have a profitable business. MS's gaming revenue rivals Nintendo's, I'm not sure why many figure that Nintendo and Sony are profitable, yet somehow MS isn't. Please explain the added costs that they have that the other manufacturers don't.
Paying a boatload of money to keep or grab games for Game Pass?
 

Wohc

Banned
Well that makes sense now then. I can see why in a place where xbox consoles are selling very little and Playstation has a much larger install base Xbox's presence may seem nonexistent to you. After all MS are not dumb enough to spend 10s of millions advertising a game in a region where even selling to 100% of the xbox install base means 50k game sales or something (number from my a** but hope you get the point).
That's the thing, i think outside of the USA MS does little to nothing games specific. They are mostly advertising Game Pass, because they want to sell subscritpions and Sony wants to sell games.
 

Zok310

Member
1. PS gamers are the most satisfied group in the gaming community. Yet the pay $60-$70 per game.

2. Sony makes and nets billion off PS annually.

3. Sony 1st party makes their best games under the current model.

With XB all of the above is the complete opposite yet MS want Sony (who's approach is working) to abandon it and follow their gp model😂😂😂😂
 

yurinka

Member
Well, MS said they won't make CoD console exclusive because it wouldn't be profitable. And Sony said it wouldn't make finantial sense to them to put their games day one on PS Plus. Both are right, no lies detected.

Sony has a very successful business focused on selling games for their console/digital store. To destroy that, their main source of revenue and profit wouldn't make sense at all. For them game subscriptions is a good secondary extra, even if having twice the subs and way less deals than MS it's pretty small market for them compared to selling games.

It doesn't make sense to "kill" their most successful business model of selling games to replace it with a smaller and way less profitable as the game subs. Specially when Sony already is the market leader in both console markets (to sell games + game subs).
 
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Ansphn

Member
So a company that is in 3rd place that can't get their base to buy their games or even subscribe to their service at $1 is telling the top company in gaming that is selling 10-20 million of their exclusive games how to run their business? The arrogance of Microsoft.
 

phil_t98

Gold Member
Halo infinite isn't even a subscription service game at heart, it was primarily a f2p GaaS multiplayer game. With Halo Infinite they aimed to be the next fortnite and spent big. Unfortunately it didn't gain much traction. Now they are buying their 'Fortnite' like franchise in CoD/CoD Warzone.


I have a hard time believing that to be honest. They pretty much advertised everywhere and on everything where I am so it was near impossible to miss. This 2:30 minute TV spot aired during major matches like Chelsea vs Man U.


They turned oxford street into an xbox junction

Not to mention all this crap they did








Halo marketing was impossible to miss


Yeah because no game company makes no money from merch

Halo is that big company’s want in on some of that money.

Halo was made with single player and it hit gamepass day one. Microsoft believe in their service were Sony dose not simple
 

Three

Member


Yeah because no game company makes no money from merch

Halo is that big company’s want in on some of that money.

Halo was made with single player and it hit gamepass day one. Microsoft believe in their service were Sony dose not simple
You think promoting Halo Infinite on Pringles and Lucozade is "merch"?



Who said that doesn't exist. If you wanted statues and TShirts there is an abundance of that too for Halo.
 

phil_t98

Gold Member
You think promoting Halo Infinite on Pringles and Lucozade is "merch"?



Who said that doesn't exist. If you wanted statues and TShirts there is an abundance of that too for Halo.

you think Microsoft pay them for that or lucazade pay them?
 

phil_t98

Gold Member
Considering you think it's called Lucazade I can see why you think Lucozade pay them but it's already been confirmed that MS paid $40M for past Halo advertising like this.
A

For past halo advertising or this actual advertising
 
It was double xp for any platform and it doesn't mention Playstation or a playstation game so I'm not sure why it's being posted.

I know Sony had a marketing deal but I always thought that was for special edition consoles, betas and having gameplay footage only shown on that platform. The Doritos and Mountain Dew ads don’t seem connected to PlayStation to me heck there’s a possibility that Sony wasn’t even behind them.
 
Many of Sony's first-party studios will need to start adding multiplayer/co-op game modes in their titles before they can start doing day one subscription releases. I don't believe linear action/adventure games with 15-25 hours of content is enough to entice people to get a 1-year subscription. Replay-ability, multiplayer game modes, and frequent updates/expansions are the name of the game when it comes to this model which so far has not been Sony's MO.
 
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That's what MS was hoping for but it doesn't look like Sony fell for it (so far), MS admittedly couldn't compete in the traditional console market so they are pretty much attempting to destroy it. It obviously wouldn't be sustainable for Sony to keep producing the same amount of games at the same quality level if they were just going to include them on PS+.

This sort of shows how Gamepass didn't turn out to be nearly as disruptive as MS hoped for, Sony with very little effort is still able to have a much more successful service.

All that Sony needs to do is to maintain their position for a few more of years until the MS leadership starts being pressure by shareholders to explain why they have invested so much on Gamepass to get beat by PlayStation once again.
In the past 12 months Sony has cried to regulators from various countries about why losing COD would be a big blow to them, have released a tiered subscription model in the last 12 months that most people agree does not hold a candle next to GamePass, and have completely torn down their old policy of never releasing first-party games on PC. If GamePass was not a big deal, why would Sony not have just continued with their PS4 strategy?
 

Three

Member


They all do it
They all do marketing no doubt. Nobody is saying otherwise though. What's peoples point with what they are posting though?
The conversation :

[Sony Games sell] Because Sony spends crazy amounts on marketing and MS doesn't. Two different business models.

Are you seriously trying to suggest Sony spend more than MS on marketing? Have you seen the marketing budgets for the Halo series..

Much more on their big games. I've barely seen any Halo marketing compared to GOW/Spiderman/Horizon/TLOU/Uncharted..

Thats when I showed the extent of the Halo marketing where they advertised on everything out. Now though I don't understand what the usual suspects are doing posting some (likely unlicensed) t-shirt merch on an obscure site for GoW, Call of duty marketing or a McDonald's themed controller but I suspect they don't know what they are arguing and are just upset I highlighted Halos marketing and promotions.
 
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1. PS gamers are the most satisfied group in the gaming community. Yet the pay $60-$70 per game.

2. Sony makes and nets billion off PS annually.

3. Sony 1st party makes their best games under the current model.

With XB all of the above is the complete opposite yet MS want Sony (who's approach is working) to abandon it and follow their gp model😂😂😂😂
Yes, because despite this console success, one bad hack in 2011 had Sony laying off employees, selling corporate buildings, and getting rid of their VAIO laptop division.
 
I'm not gonna pretend to have some strong evidence to prove my case but I think they'd do better to release their 1st party games day one on PC @ full retail versus a subscription service. The sales would be much higher and people are obviously willing to pay for the games they put out on both platforms, why not boost your day 1 numbers?
 

phil_t98

Gold Member
They all do marketing no doubt. Nobody is saying otherwise though. What's peoples point with what they are posting though?
The conversation :







Thats when I showed the extent of the Halo marketing where they advertised on everything out. Now though I don't understand what the usual suspects are doing posting some (likely unlicensed) t-shirt merch on an obscure site for GoW, Call of duty marketing or a McDonald's themed controller but I suspect they don't know what they are arguing and are just upset I highlighted Halos marketing and promotions.

Why did you do an epic post with loads of marketing?

What was the point of it , the point I as referring to origianally was sub services we won’t get AAA games and they won’t invest as much and halo breaks that theory as it’s a mega expensive game and as you proved huge marketing to
 
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Three

Member
Why did you do an epic post with loads of marketing? What was the point of it
Because somebody said I've barely seen any marketing for Halo when I said it had huge marketing and I was showing the extent of the Halo marketing. I made that clear already.
 
In the past 12 months Sony has cried to regulators from various countries about why losing COD would be a big blow to them, have released a tiered subscription model in the last 12 months that most people agree does not hold a candle next to GamePass, and have completely torn down their old policy of never releasing first-party games on PC. If GamePass was not a big deal, why would Sony not have just continued with their PS4 strategy?
I mean, nothing has changed so far, all they did was rearrange PSNow and PS+ into a single service with multiple tiers. They still have shown no intention of adding their games day one on the service.

What has changed from the PS4 strategy?

The online pay wall cost $60 a year. Literally nobody paid $9.99 a month. And yes, there is a difference between $9.99 a month and $14.99 a month.
Do people pay full price for Gamepass now? Why? So many tricks and promos going on all the time with it. I never paid more than $1 a month and had it for years.
 
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xrnzaaas

Member
They will eventually have to. TLOU2 showed us that it doesn’t take much to severely undercut a PlayStation IP. Even discounting that, I feel the genuine intrigue for their first party games is waning.
Naughty Dog is to blame for that, surely they knew that the choices they've made will heavily polarize the audience and turn away some customers. I'm not saying they should be playing very safe with the sequels but it's still a product for the mass audience and making it too controversial is a recipe for disaster.
 
I mean, nothing has changed so far, all they did was rearrange PSNow and PS+ into a single service with multiple tiers. They still have shown no intention of adding their games day one on the service.

What has changed from the PS4 strategy?
Just 2 years ago, no one would believe you if you told them God of War and SpiderMan would come to PC. I'm willing to bet PlayStation studio games will begin releasing day and date on PC sometime within the next 2 years and once that happens I don't think PS+ will be far behind.
 
Just 2 years ago, no one would believe you if you told them God of War and SpiderMan would come to PC. I'm willing to bet PlayStation studio games will begin releasing day and date on PC sometime within the next 2 years and once that happens I don't think PS+ will be far behind.

That all depends if Sony will lose money or not. Really is going to rely on their financials to make it work.

P.S Im talking about day 1 PS+ releases. They won’t do it if it will lose them money.
 
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Just 2 years ago, no one would believe you if you told them God of War and SpiderMan would come to PC. I'm willing to bet PlayStation studio games will begin releasing day and date on PC sometime within the next 2 years and once that happens I don't think PS+ will be far behind.
What does Sony selling games on PC has to do with Gamepass? If anything it shows Sony is even more committed to the model of selling their games.

They obviously would put PS+ on PC if they could but that would require an extreme amount of work or some very clever solution because they don't even have a store front on PC at this point.
 
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