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[Mengy]

Wait, nobody in here actually thinks he forgot, right?

Either he truly forgot planning to and assaulting a fellow classmate with several accomplices and witnesses during his senior year of high school, or he is blatantly lying about it. Neither of these is a good thing for a man running for President.

 

[demon]

And what in Obama's colelge thesis is at the same level of cruelity as battery & bulling a gay student?

Nothing. Nor with drug use, or if he shop-lifted in highschool or cheated on a test (random hypotheticals). What Romney allegedly did wasn't just wrong or illegal but an act of cruelty, and one that, quite frankly, does nothing but reinforce what we already knew about his character.

 

[polyh3dron]

He killed K.B. Toys

Fuck this guy.

whaaaat

yeah let's swift boat the shit out this bitch

 

[Kusagari]

His heavy drug use?

But don't get me wrong, I think bringing up the past from anyone's youth is empty and cheap.

'Heavy' drug use? Really?

And where exactly is his drug use going to be in his college thesis? Did he write his thesis on the benefits of getting high?

 

[massoluk]

The part where I said,



might be your first clue.

Obama admitted to having used drug, nevermind that him using drug didn't actually hurt anyone.
Romney said he don't remember bullying someone...

Yeah, totally not false equivalence fallacy here.

 

[RDreamer]

I wouldn't put it past him, but there's a lot I wouldn't put past high school kids.

Whether it actually happened isn't really the issue though. It's just the fact that people think he's lying when he says he doesnt remember it and are using it to say that it has bigger implications on his character.

The implications on his character, for me, don't come that much from him lying and saying he doesn't remember. The implications come from him hearing the story and then laughing hysterically while also admitting that his pranks went to far. Another implication is when he said he would apologize if it offended anyone. Reading the story it should be obvious that what he did offended people. He should have owned up to that and said yeah that sounds terrible, and I feel bad for what I've done. I also feel awful that I'll never get to make amends with him, since he's gone now. Something like that. Show real remorse. Laughing hysterically while admitting you went way too far and then being wishy washy on whether something that should be offensive has even offended anyone at all is the implication. Whether he really remembers it or not is part of the implication, I suppose, but it's a small part compared to those things for me.

 

[bengraven]

That's the real troubling thing here. I know gays aren't his primary audience, but Romney could take the time to apologize. It would give him a chance to look kind and empathetic.

This is the last thing his voting base wants.

They want him to stick to his ideals and not be PC.

 

[Foxy Fox 39]

My mom is 65. Age shit is a joke. People know and remember whether they were a bullying schmuck in highschool or not.

Which is why he said the very general term"pranks". That tells me that he remembers being a jerk in HS, but that doesn't say he remembers the specific incident. He could very well be lying, but I think its a bit silly for people to act like they KNOW he's lying.

 

[Carnby]

'Heavy' drug use? Really?

And where exactly is his drug use going to be in his college thesis? Did he write his thesis on the benefits of getting high?

I think your confusing my post as a response to someone else's. You should research the context of the original post.

 

[Charoncaori]

How the hell can you "apologize" for something you claim you can't remember? What a waste of a human being.

 

[echoshifting]

How the hell can you "apologize" for something you claim you can't remember? What a waste of a human being.

He didn't apologize for it.

“Back in high school, I did some dumb things and if anybody was hurt by that or offended, obviously I apologize for that,” Mr. Romney said. “I participated in a lot of high jinks and pranks during high school and some might have gone too far and for that, I apologize.”

That's as far as it goes.

 

[Devolution]

Which is why he said the very general term"pranks". That tells me that he remembers being a jerk in HS, but that doesn't say he remembers the specific incident. He could very well be lying, but I think its a bit silly for people to act like they KNOW he's lying.

If he thinks that falls under pranks he's a bigger douchebag than he even let on.

 

[Carnby]

Obama admitted to having used drug, nevermind that him using drug didn't actually hurt anyone.
Romney said he don't remember bullying someone...

Yeah, totally not false equivalence fallacy here.

You have some serious problems with reading comprehension. I never compared the two being a "bad" as the other.

 

[Foxy Fox 39]

If he thinks that falls under pranks he's a bigger douchebag than he even let on.

I would agree.

 

[kehs]

Why are people actively giving this non story attention?

You know what requires more attention? Romney's pledge to affirm one man, one woman on a federal level.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2...t_have_the_same_position_on_gay_marriage.html

 

[Kosmo]

If he thinks that falls under pranks he's a bigger douchebag than he even let on.

Maybe this one fell under hi-jinks.

 

[Amir0x]

At some point, most people were bullied in school, and bullied someone. That's what kids do. Not only gay-looking kids, but fat, poor, tall, small, with freckles, with disabilities, red hair, not good in sports, etc. Doesn't make it right, of course, but blaming Romney for acting like a kid when he was a kid is dumb.

yup. All this kid stuff needs to be offlimits, whether its experimentation with drugs or bullying or whatever. I've done some cruel stuff as a kid, I know most of my friends have, most of everyone I know has... it's what kids do. Kids are assholes to each other. Kids need to grow up to learn how to act civil in society; before then, they make really dumb decisions.

This Obama eats dog meat at 6 yrs old and Romney acts a bully in school shit is just ridiculous attacks.

So many more substantive ways to go after Romney

 

[Devolution]

yup. All this kid stuff needs to be offlimits, whether its experimentation with drugs or bullying or whatever. I've done some cruel stuff as a kid, I know most of my friends have, most of everyone I know has... it's what kids do. Kids are assholes to each other. Kids need to grow up to learn how to act civil in society; before then, they make really dumb decisions.

This Obama eats dog meat at 6 yrs old and Romney acts a bully in school shit is just ridiculous attacks.

So many more substantive ways to go after Romney

We're talking about planning out and attacking someone at 18.

 

[Dram]

Wasn't Romney's camp that played up the dog eating news?

 

[theBishop]

Why are people actively giving this non story attention?

You know what requires more attention? Romney's pledge to affirm one man, one woman on a federal level.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2...t_have_the_same_position_on_gay_marriage.html

Look, it's absolutely right to throw scorn at this. The politics of discrimination is fucking ugly. But at the same time you have to keep in mind that this is NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN. It's really goddamn difficult to amend the constitution, and the crafters of this goofy pledge know it.

There are real human beings affected by this discrimination and we have to take that seriously. But these issues are being used specifically to make sure nothing happens on the economy. They're throwing these cultural boulders at us so we never get to discuss the material issues keeping the masses of society down, including gays, racial minorities, women, etc.

 

[Cheebo]

Maybe this one fell under hi-jinks.

This isn't something really to joke about. If this happened in a high school today there would be some serious legal action taken against Mitt.

 

[echoshifting]

yup. All this kid stuff needs to be offlimits, whether its experimentation with drugs or bullying or whatever. I've done some cruel stuff as a kid, I know most of my friends have, most of everyone I know has... it's what kids do. Kids are assholes to each other. Kids need to grow up to learn how to act civil in society; before then, they make really dumb decisions.

This Obama eats dog meat at 6 yrs old and Romney acts a bully in school shit is just ridiculous attacks.

So many more substantive ways to go after Romney

One, he was an adult...yeah, he was in high school, but this was a crime - a serious crime, not innocent experimentation - and he would have been tried as an adult.

Two, most are more upset by his reaction to the story than by whatever he did in high school (I think).

Three, given Romney's response, this is a substantive event which feeds into the Romney Narrative. If he had apologized and promised anti-bullying legislation this wouldn't just be a non-story, it would be a tremendous "get" for the Romney camp since that would actually go completely against that narrative. They done fucked up. From that perspective, it's an interesting story for political junkies (like me) regardless of how they might feel about it.

 

[Amir0x]

We're talking about planning out and attacking someone at 18.

18 is still plenty young to make youth mistakes that should not haunt someone until they're fucking 60 years old. At 18, as we can see, he was still in school, subject to the oppressive nature of peer pressure and all that implies. You may say you made better choices, but if you hadn't, I wouldn't give a shit. That stuff is part of growing up, and while it's wrong and the kids should be reprimanded for doing these things, it should essentially be 'removed' from the public record once you graduate and move on into adulthood (unless you, like, murder or rape someone).

Plenty of legitimate shit to criticize Romney on - if you get caught up on this one, it just makes the people criticizing him look silly.

 

[Enron]

The more telling thing is how barely anybody is disputing whether they think it happened. We believe it very well could have.

What, that kids bully other kids? Stop the fucking presses!

 

[Mercury Fred]

18 is still plenty young to make youth mistakes that should not haunt someone until they're fucking 60 years old. At 18, as we can see, he was still in school, subject to the oppressive nature of peer pressure and all that implies. You may say you made better choices, but if you hadn't, I wouldn't give a shit. That stuff is part of growing up, and while it's wrong and the kids should be reprimanded for doing these things, it should essentially be 'removed' from the public record once you graduate and move on into adulthood (unless you, like, murder or rape someone).

Plenty of legitimate shit to criticize Romney on - if you get caught up on this one, it just makes the people criticizing him look silly.

To me, the bullying stands out more when paired with the blind teacher stuff and strapping a dog to a roof. It makes a "youthful misstep" begin to appear much more like part of a pattern.

 

[Bombadil]

Romney's an asshole but this story was released at a rather convenient time. It's a political tactic and I don't care for this kind of political debate.

I remember when Arnold Schwarzenegger was running for governor of California and in the weeks leading up to the election, a bunch of women started popping up out of the woodwork to accuse him of groping them when he was a much younger man. Whether they were true or not, the allegations had nothing to do with the man's politics.

With Romney, we're already aware of his stance on gay people and gay marriage. I didn't need a story to help me decide that I wouldn't vote for him.

The victim's family is probably upset that his memory is being used to further a political agenda. I'd be furious about it, too.

 

[DarthWoo]

This is the last thing his voting base wants.

They want him to stick to his ideals and not be PC.

That's pretty much what I was thinking. His base consists pretty much of the same people who think any sort of apology is a sign of weakness and if made by the President will make the nation look weak, even if it is for something like the wholesale slaughter of a wedding party by a misdirected drone strike.

 

[Devolution]

What, that kids bully other kids? Stop the fucking presses!

What highschool did you go to where that kind of thing happened to kids on the regular?

 

[cousins]

This is harassment, not bullying. Bullying is calling some kid fat, not pinning said kid down with other kids and traumatizing him or her. And, he was 18, not 13. That's old enough to be tried, and old enough not to be a complete prick.

 

[Amir0x]

To me, the bullying stands out more when paired with the blind teacher stuff and strapping a dog to a roof. It makes a "youthful misstep" begin to appear much more like part of a pattern.

It's clear there WAS a pattern of bullying when he was a kid. He was a kid bully. I don't think anyone is disputing that. What many are saying is that it's ridiculous to try to hold a 60 year old adult responsible for being a bully as a kid. I understand people are trying to paint the arbitrary line of 18 as "NOW YOU MUST BE HELD RESPONSIBLE", but that's also absurd. He was in school, he was just as prone to peer pressure as anyone else, and it was clearly he was still immature and making immature decisions. But he's not a bully now. It's just silly. It doesn't accomplish anything, because clearly Mitt Romney isn't going around now giving adults swirlies. He's not that same person. He's awful in plenty of real world ways that one doesn't need to resort to inventing baggage to attach to him as an adult.



And, by the way, the dog thing is totally legitimate - he was an adult, an adult even technically breaking a law as I understand it, and it shown a clear lack of common sense too. So if you want to go there, be my guest, even though I'd suggest there is still more critical things to take up to town for.

What highschool did you go to where that kind of thing happened to kids on the regular?

What high school did you go to where shit like that didn't happen on the regular? I actually know of bullying that was far crueler than what Romney did that took place in my school.

 

[kaching]

Gotta wonder if this is the fun loving Romney that his wife was telling us that we knew nothing about.

Maybe this is how they gave their kids haircuts...

 

[cousins]

It's clear there WAS a pattern of bullying when he was a kid. He was a kid bully. I don't think anyone is disputing that. What many are saying is that it's ridiculous to try to hold a 60 year old adult responsible for being a bully as a kid. It's just silly. It doesn't accomplish anything, because clearly Mitt Romney isn't going around now giving adults swirlies. He's not that same person. He's awful in plenty of real world ways that one doesn't need to resort to inventing baggage to attach to him as an adult.



And, by the way, the dog thing is totally legitimate - he was an adult, an adult even technically breaking a law as I understand it, and it shown a clear lack of common sense too. So if you want to go there, be my guest, even though I'd suggest there is still more critical things to take up to town for.



What high school did you go to where shit like that didn't happen on the regular? I actually know of bullying that was far crueler than what Romney did that took place in my school.

At least where I went, bullying was verbal. Physical shit meant someone really got under someone else's skin

 

[Devolution]

What high school did you go to where shit like that didn't happen on the regular? I actually know of bullying that was far crueler than what Romney did that took place in my school.

I recall fighting or random acts of violence. I don't recall someone being systematically targeted, held down and his hair cut.

I'm not buying "boys will be boys" on this one.

 

[Eight Diagram Bat Fighter]

He killed K.B. Toys

Fuck this guy.

He was long gone from Bane Capital by the time KB went down. He had nothing to do with that.

 

[cousins]

I recall fighting or random acts of violence. I don't recall someone being systematically targeted, held down and his hair cut.

I'm not buying "boys will be boys" on this one.

Exactly.

 

[Seanspeed]

We're talking about planning out and attacking someone at 18.

They didn't 'plan an attack'. They planned to hold him down so they could lop of some of his hair. Its not like he was beaten or anything.

 

[Mercury Fred]

It's clear there WAS a pattern of bullying when he was a kid. He was a kid bully. I don't think anyone is disputing that. What many are saying is that it's ridiculous to try to hold a 60 year old adult responsible for being a bully as a kid. I understand people are trying to paint the arbitrary line of 18 as "NOW YOU MUST BE HELD RESPONSIBLE", but that's also absurd. He was in school, he was just as prone to peer pressure as anyone else, and it was clearly he was still immature and making immature decisions. But he's not a bully now. It's just silly. It doesn't accomplish anything, because clearly Mitt Romney isn't going around now giving adults swirlies. He's not that same person. He's awful in plenty of real world ways that one doesn't need to resort to inventing baggage to attach to him as an adult.

So what's the cut off time then? 20? 30? 40?

And, by the way, the dog thing is totally legitimate - he was an adult, an adult even technically breaking a law as I understand it, and it shown a clear lack of common sense too. So if you want to go there, be my guest, even though I'd suggest there is still more critical things to take up to town for.

Of course there are more critical things to take him to town for. He has been and he will be. But at the moment, I still argue that we're seeing a pattern emerge for a person with very clear sociopathic tendencies.

They didn't 'plan an attack'. They planned to hold him down so they could lop of some of his hair. Its not like he was beaten or anything.

lol wow, this is your defense? Pathetic.

No big deal, just a group of guys holding down a scared kid while someone wields a sharp object in their face.

You sound almost as sick as Romney trying to defend this.

 

[Devolution]

They didn't 'plan an attack'. They planned to hold him down so they could lop of some of his hair. Its not like he was beaten or anything.

Oh okay that's all fine and dandy then. No. Still not buying it. If you think this is just "boys will be boys" frankly you have some growing up to do.

 

[Eight Diagram Bat Fighter]

Pussification of America at critical levels here. Crying over cut hair like it was a national tragedy. The victim probably got over it in the 2 months it took to grow it back.

 

[Amir0x]

I recall fighting or random acts of violence. I don't recall someone being systematically targeted, held down and his hair cut.

I'm not buying "boys will be boys" on this one.

Well I'm glad you went to a special mystical school, but the school I went to - which is a pretty typical public high school - had plenty of bullying. And MUCH of it was the systematic, torture-someone type.

There was this one guy, we called him Monkey Face because he looked exactly like a chimpanzee (he wasn't black, it wasn't a race thing - he just looked like a chimpanzee), but a couple of these dudes I knew would just brutally torture him everywhere he went. Went to a pool, they'd steal his clothes and then drag his trunks off, forcing him to painfully and embarrassingly wade his way into the boys locker room in full view of all the girls he had crushes on. They'd sit behind him in class slapping him in the back of the neck and then when he yelled, would act like nothing happened and would threaten him so much that he would actually tell the teacher that he just felt a random pain. They beat him up. They would toss food down his outfits. They would really loudly complain about how much he smelled, in front of every classmate he was ever near. One time they spent the entire bus ride spitting into a water bottle, and then by the end of the bus ride dumped it all out on top of the guys head.


And I can list at least 5 other examples of such systematic torture bullying in my old high school alone. And those were just in classes and with friends I knew. Not to mention the slight bullying I dabbled in when I was in school. I regret it now, sure, but it was a kid being a kid. If I ran for president and someone started trying to throw it in my face, I'd be a little annoyed.

 

[bengraven]

Nice title change.

Pussification of America at critical levels here. Crying over cut hair like it was a national tragedy.

Oh please go on.

I must hear this.

 

[Mercury Fred]

Pussification of America at critical levels here. Crying over cut hair like it was a national tragedy.

Let's all man up and defend terrorizing a scared kid!

Americuhhhh

 

[B_Rik_Schitthaus]

I recall fighting or random acts of violence. I don't recall someone being systematically targeted, held down and his hair cut.

I'm not buying "boys will be boys" on this one.

Also fighting would lead to shit (parents being called, detention ,expulsion)
Just shows what a hate filled person Romney can be and just how much being born with a silver spoon in your mouth will shield you.

 

[Devolution]

Well I'm glad you went to a special mystical school, but the school I went to - which is a pretty typical public high school - had plenty of bullying. And MUCH of it was the systematic, torture-someone type.

There was this one guy, we called him Monkey Face because he looked exactly like a chimpanzee (he wasn't black, it wasn't a race thing - he just looked like a chimpanzee), but a couple of these dudes I knew would just brutally torture him everywhere he went. Went to a pool, they'd steal his clothes and then drag his trunks off, forcing him to painfully and embarrassingly wade his way into the boys locker room in full view of all the girls he had crushes on. They'd sit behind him in class slapping him in the back of the neck and then when he yelled, would act like nothing happened and would threaten him so much that he would actually tell the teacher that he just felt a random pain. They beat him up. They would toss food down his outfits. They would really loudly complain about how much he smelled, in front of every classmate he was ever near.


And I can list at least 5 other examples of such systematic torture bullying in my old high school alone. And those were just in classes and with friends I knew. Not to mention the slight bullying I dabbled in when I was in school. I regret it now, sure, but it was a kid being a kid. If I ran for president and someone started trying to throw it in my face, I'd be a little annoyed.

So your highschool sucked and fostered an environment with pervasive bullying. Still not buying "boys will be boys."

 

[Lesath]

Pussification of America at critical levels here. Crying over cut hair like it was a national tragedy.

Absolutely. Why, back when men were men, the manliest thing to do was to traumatize the socially vulnerable, not speak on their behalf.

 

[Amir0x]

So your highschool sucked and fostered an environment with pervasive bullying. Still not buying "boys will be boys."

My high school was actually quite good. It's just that people bully each other, hard. It's a problem virtually every school in the nation has. I don't know where you've been, but it's like national news every day that some kid kills themselves because of brutal torture bullying. Your school was the exception, and I'd just say it's just because you never saw it - guarantee it exists just as much there as anywhere else.

 

[Trojita]

He was long gone from Bane Capital by the time KB went down. He had nothing to do with that.

So he created the thing that killed KB Toys.

KB Toys was purchased and taken private in 2000 by the leveraged buyout firm of Bain Capital for $305 million, Bain announced the purchase on Dec. 8th, 2000. Only $18 million of the purchase money was cash, the rest was borrowed against the assets of the company. Sixteen months after the buyout, Bain Capital paid itself $85 million in dividends in early 2002. Two years later, due to increasing competition from national discount chains such as Wal-Mart and Target and its enormous debt, on January 14, 2004, K·B Toys filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection and closed 365 stores.

What the fuck.

 

[terrdactycalsrock]

Im not very clear on poltics, is this guy doing well? Is there a real chance he could be president? Also, I think this is terrible, yes it was in high school but it was hes senior year of high school. People are old enough to know not to do that when their 18 years old. And I know the conversation is around him bullying a person he thought was guy, but I think its disgusting that he would cut someones hair ( Ie invade personal boundaries) like that

 

[faceless007]

I actually think "bullying" is not a strong enough word for this. "Bullying" makes me think of verbal harassment or just one guy picking on another. This was several guys teaming up on one guy and physically holding him down. That's straight-up assault. It's a gang beating (and let's not pretend for one moment how differently this would be portrayed and thought of in the media if it were 5 black guys doing it). And yes, at 18 you should fucking know better.

 

[Devolution]

My high school was actually quite good. It's just that people bully each other, hard. It's a problem virtually every school in the nation has. I don't know where you've been, but it's like national news every day that some kid kills themselves because of brutal torture bullying. Your school was the exception, and I'd just say it's just because you never saw it - guarantee it exists just as much there as anywhere else.

I went to a school that didn't allow for the myth of "boys will be boys." I don't know what point you're trying to make here but you aren't going to change my mind and your high school was shit if they allowed that behavior to continue. As are the high schools in which the kids feel no way out and kill themselves. It's not normal to let that behavior continue and I feel sorry for the victims at your high school who dealt with your bullshit and that you'd continue to rationalize it with "well bullying happens durr."

I actually think "bullying" is not a strong enough word for this. "Bullying" makes me think of verbal harassment or just one guy picking on another. This was several guys teaming up on one guy and physically holding him down. That's straight-up assault. It's a gang beating (and let's not pretend for one moment how differently this would be portrayed and thought of in the media if it were 5 black guys doing it). And yes, at 18 you should fucking know better.

You're right let's call it what it is, assault.