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Monster Hunter: Whats the big deal

I like that in this topic we have fanboys of a series telling other people that their gripes about a series aren't legitimate--they're just bad at games! "Learn the crooked finger technique!" "Fighting the camera is part of the fun!" "The bad controls make the series great!"

How refreshing!
 
markatisu said:
As for the controls, you get used to them easily. MH3 has the sweetest controls, anyone with a PSP is doing themselves a disservice if they do not at least give it a playthrough using the Classic Controller (the camera mapped to the 2nd stick is incredible)
Think am the only one who cant get used to that control lol:lol
 
I think I would sound stupid telling you that what broke MH2 for me was that mark flying away from you as soon as you went in the room it was stalking? You had to explore all the areas again before meeting it again, only to see it flying away again as soon as it saw you. I went so angry with this hide & seek game that I put down the game and never touched it again (it was MH:F2).
 
kassatsu said:
Any other MH players pissed about the analog nub position on the pspgo? How the hell am I going to control the camera if I can't hook my finger over the D-pad?

That's the first thing I thought about when I saw the PSP Go! - "How can I hook my thumb to control the camera in MH?!"

I haven't tried it, but I'm interested in seeing if it's still entirely possible and doable with the new configuration on the Go!...
 
Eh I think it's phenomenal(though my experience is limited to about 40+ hours in Freedom 2). It features some of the best mechanics I've ever seen in an Action-RPG and the camera control(or lack there-of) actually works if you know what you're doing.

A lot of what makes the game work is the fighting itself. There's none of that Devil May Cry/Ninja Gaiden bullshit. It's all about watching the monster's behavior, predicting its next move, and constantly positioning yourself so you can take advantage of those one two second openings. The punishments for screwing up are quite severe(but never game ruining) since leaving yourself open for even a little bit is likely to get you killed.

There's more to a camera system than simply being able to see your enemy at all times. You have to be constantly aware of your surroundings and know what your hunt is going to do next based on prior actions. Not only that but there are still other monsters that can be a problem if you're too focused on the boss. It's limited certainly but it's that way for a reason. You're supposed to have consistent control of your character and hitting the lock-on button at the wrong time could mix up your controls(since you're now turned around to face the monster) and before you know it you're dead.

Sure it's not for everyone but it's excellent at what it does. Toss in multiplayer as well as an insane amount of depth and you have a serious hit.
 
Soneet said:
The bolded part: that's not an argument we can use in games. You can say that with every game.

It's also not entirely true. Except for running, you can adjust your camera during any attack or attack-chain or roll.

The benefit of precision manual adjusting is that you can put the monster right in the middle of your screen and when it moves a little I can adjust my camera a little so it stays in the center of my screen. I hardly ever have to adjust my camera a lot and losing the monster out of my vision is out of the question. I guess that's the conclusion I accidentally came up with while typing this: The possibility to prevent the monster from going out of my vision is a challenge on it's own.
It's not a design flaw, it's a feature! :D
SnakeswithLasers said:
I like that in this topic we have fanboys of a series telling other people that their gripes about a series aren't legitimate--they're just bad at games! "Learn the crooked finger technique!" "Fighting the camera is part of the fun!" "The bad controls make the series great!"

How refreshing!
Exactly.

My favorite is the "the controls/camera/whatever are like that for a REASON!" Well, I'm sure they are that way for a reason, that doesn't mean they don't suck ass.
 
Monroeski said:
My favorite is the "the controls/camera/whatever are like that for a REASON!" Well, I'm sure they are that way for a reason, that doesn't mean they don't suck ass.

Anybody can get into the controls of this game if they'd get over themselves and realize that not all games should control the way they want them to. It's what makes Monster Hunter what it is, kind of like RE4 not using that strafing nonsense.
 
Have you seen the ad in the latest issue of Play?

I want that picture as a desktop and I don't even like Monster Hunter

Frankly I don't get what the big deal with 95% of games is. If everyone was like me we'd all be gushing over how awesome Monkey Hero on the PS1 was
 
For anyone who says the camera sucks ass (*instantly marked down as a weak gamer*), just youtube videos of Monster Hunter. You know, people who actually play the game and make videos out of it. Do you see the camera going bat shit insane? No. Unless you like to admit that you're worse than every single Monster Hunter player, there no justification in calling the camera bad. The camera doesn't do anything, it's in your control. If anything is bad, it's the player.

There's nothing elitist or hardcore about it, how do you think everyone started? There are tons of people who started and continued playing. If the controls and camera were that bad, people wouldn't keep playing it and then mastering it, would they?

Yes it's part of the game and no, stop acting like it's a faulty mechanic. There's a reason why the camera has never been changed (seriously, you think it's that hard to program it? do you think the game designers want a bad game? think!)
 
markatisu said:
Lock-on Camera would ruin the game

As for the controls, you get used to them easily. MH3 has the sweetest controls, anyone with a PSP is doing themselves a disservice if they do not at least give it a playthrough using the Classic Controller (the camera mapped to the 2nd stick is incredible)
not lock on, just a button tap to flip the camera, just like how the bumper centers it behind your character. There's no way this would break the game, it's not like you ever lose track of it when its in the same area as you, it just makes the camera more responsive.

Actual lock on would be pointless, since you aren't targeting the center of gravity.

=If the controls and camera were that bad, people wouldn't keep playing it and then mastering it, would they?

Yes it's part of the game and no, stop acting like it's a faulty mechanic. There's a reason why the camera has never been changed (seriously, you think it's that hard to program it? do you think the game designers want a bad game? think!)
That's a pretty disingenuous answer. Ninja Gaiden has a poor camera, but it's an incredibly fun game so most people don't care, they keep playing. Same with Shinobi. In fact, action games are notorious for bad cameras, because the pacing of the movement and inconsistentcy of what the player is tracking. Apparently, yes, this is hard to program. If adding a better way to adjust the camera broke the game, I think it'd say more about the game than anything. As someone that has put several thousand hours into the Monster Hunter series, I'd say they're extremely fun, regardless of the camera system. I want more people to enjoy it, and "fixing" the camera is one way to make it more accessible.

On the other side, I don't think there's enough armor and weapons to satisfy me, so I'm not a casual player. :lol
 
Soneet said:
For anyone who says the camera sucks ass (*instantly marked down as a weak gamer*), just youtube videos of Monster Hunter. You know, people who actually play the game and make videos out of it. Do you see the camera going bat shit insane? No. Unless you like to admit that you're worse than every single Monster Hunter player, there no justification in calling the camera bad. The camera doesn't do anything, it's in your control. If anything is bad, it's the player.

There's nothing elitist or hardcore about it, how do you think everyone started? There are tons of people who started and continued playing. If the controls and camera were that bad, people wouldn't keep playing it and then mastering it, would they?

Yes it's part of the game and no, stop acting like it's a faulty mechanic. There's a reason why the camera has never been changed (seriously, you think it's that hard to program it? do you think the game designers want a bad game? think!)

Are you on Capcom's payroll or something? Seriously, that company's not in such dire straits that they need pro bono shills. Save the evangelism for trying to restart Breath of Fire.
 
I like Monster Hunter but I've never felt I had the time to really dig into it (and I haven't been able to go multiplayer). It's near the top of "Games I Wish I Could Master" list. The sense of the world, the customization, the crafting sub-game, the questing, the art... it's all strongly appealing. I'm thinking of buying Unite on the chance it can help me break into multiplayer and really dig into the hunting experience.

The controls take time to learn. I love that. The camera is a non-issue to me. If camera management is part of the challenge of the game, and they give me the tools to handle it, then I'm happy.
 
Syril said:
Are you on Capcom's payroll or something? Seriously, that company's not in such dire straits that they need pro bono shills. Save the evangelism for trying to restart Breath of Fire.
What would you say if someone gives ridiculous suggestions to "improve" your favorite game when it's obviously not a game improvement but a game-changing suggestion (as in: fit to my weak sauce taste). Hey, let's make all blocks into parries in Street Fighter 3. No, let's add lock-on to Counter Strike. Let's add a 360 fend off in Left 4 Dead.

Weak = weak and there's simply no other justification. I don't mind if people suggest it while admitting they are too weak to handle the camera. I do mind if people say it's a way to improve the game.
 
I think Monster Hunter is the closest your going to get to a gritty national geographic special on hunter/gatherers and animals in game ever. Well throw in a weird middle ground between the stone age/iron age in there. Anyway point being is this how many games out there allow "stalk" a prey and literally wear it as a reward. In fact I think the biggest draw is the sense of accomplishment after you tackle a difficult hunt.
 
Meh, as already stated, full camera control on the 2nd analog stick will already add complete control to the game more so than on PSP.
 
Soneet said:
What would you say if someone gives ridiculous suggestions to "improve" your favorite game when it's obviously not a game improvement but a game-changing suggestion (as in: fit to my weak sauce taste). Hey, let's make all blocks into parries in Street Fighter 3. No, let's add lock-on to Counter Strike. Let's add a 360 fend off in Left 4 Dead.

Weak = weak and there's simply no other justification. I don't mind if people suggest it while admitting they are too weak to handle the camera. I do mind if people say it's a way to improve the game.

I like how your argument is that fixing a camera would be akin to putting in lock-on in counter-strike. If what you're saying is to be believed, then the whole point of Monster Hunter is to fight the camera. As you so eloquently say, "weak = weak" and that's a weak argument and a weak sell.
 
At first, I hated it. Then, I just kept playing and realized that I had about 70 hours of MHF2.

I love the game, but I can totally see how it isn't for everyone. The controls kind of suck, the camera is a pain in the ass, it is really difficult, and there is no plot whatsoever.

But, alas, it still is my favorite PSP game of all time.
 
SnakeswithLasers said:
I like how your argument is that fixing a camera would be akin to putting in lock-on in counter-strike. If what you're saying is to be believed, then the whole point of Monster Hunter is to fight the camera. As you so eloquently say, "weak = weak" and that's a weak argument and a weak sell.
Sorry, I was wrong. Let's put in lock-on. Let's add a full body stun counter as well, so it's possible to combo-stun without aim on different body parts. Let's make all moves cancelable into rolls as well. I didn't see the light, but now I understand. This game would be so much better with those changes, why didn't I think of it before.

PS. After playing Wii Sports, I realized every Tennis game sucks because I had to fight my player's legs because it didn't move on it's own.
 
ShadyMilkman said:
At first, I hated it. Then, I just kept playing and realized that I had about 70 hours of MHF2.

I love the game, but I can totally see how it isn't for everyone. The controls kind of suck, the camera is a pain in the ass, it is really difficult, and there is no plot whatsoever.

But, alas, it still is my favorite PSP game of all time.

And this kind of post makes me want to pick up the game again--because, at first, I hated it, but I put it down instead of keeping on. I love games with that "je ne sais quoi" that keeps you addicted for hours despite obvious shortcomings. It's more persuasive than, "You just suck and shouldn't play anyway."

Soneet said:
Sorry, I was wrong. Let's put in lock-on. Let's add a full body stun counter as well, so it's possible to combo-stun without aim on different body parts. Let's make all moves cancelable into rolls as well. I didn't see the light, but now I understand. This game would be so much better with those changes, why didn't I think of it before.

PS. After playing Wii Sports, I realized every Tennis game sucks because I had to fight my player's legs because it didn't move on it's own.

Such a slippery slope drama queen. :lol Do you have to get this defensive because people want more intuitive controls and a camera you don't have to "learn to master"? Does it really make you feel that much better about yourself that you have "omg l337 camera skills" that no "weaksauce gamer" can compare to? Camera is something in a game that shouldn't be thought about--especially in a PSP game where your inputs are limited.

Whatever though, you're a fanatic.
 
Soneet said:
Sorry, I was wrong. Let's put in lock-on. Let's add a full body stun counter as well, so it's possible to combo-stun without aim on different body parts. Let's make all moves cancelable into rolls as well. I didn't see the light, but now I understand. This game would be so much better with those changes, why didn't I think of it before.

PS. After playing Wii Sports, I realized every Tennis game sucks because I had to fight my player's legs because it didn't move on it's own.

What about centering the camera towards the wyvern? Is that so bad, without a second analog on the PSP? Why not make the game harder to compensate? Are you this bitter all the time?
 
God's Beard said:
That's a pretty disingenuous answer. Ninja Gaiden has a poor camera, but it's an incredibly fun game so most people don't care, they keep playing. Same with Shinobi. In fact, action games are notorious for bad cameras, because the pacing of the movement and inconsistentcy of what the player is tracking. Apparently, yes, this is hard to program. If adding a better way to adjust the camera broke the game, I think it'd say more about the game than anything. As someone that has put several thousand hours into the Monster Hunter series, I'd say they're extremely fun, regardless of the camera system. I want more people to enjoy it, and "fixing" the camera is one way to make it more accessible.
:lol
Except that has nothing at all to do with the MH camera, automatic action game cameras are generally shitty because what they automatically track and what you want them to track can greatly differ, MH's system gives you a completely manual camera that can and will track whatever you want if you use it to do so. The "issue" people are confusing is the awkward placement of the controls for it due to the PSP's physical limitations. Index clawing solves that problem but can be uncomfortable depending on the size/shape of your hands, the original also didn't have that problem since even though the camera wasn't mapped to the second analogue stick you could still reach the d-pad with your right hand (something that isn't feasible on PSP since the screen would be obscured.)
 
I've tried to get into it but the cliff like learning curve necessitates large unweildy tutorials which put me off the game a bit (though I did complete most of them). I can certainly imagine why someone with a group of friends that played would be into it, but for anyone who isn't hardcore it seems like a real rough game.

I might try it again when the newest version hits.
 
God's Beard said:
What about centering the camera towards the wyvern? Is that so bad, without a second analog on the PSP? Why not make the game harder to compensate? Are you this bitter all the time?
I actually think it will make the game harder for no reason (as in frustating). In the latter half of the game most monsters are twice the size (G-rank) and up close you either have to pan your camera to the head or the tail, depending on what you want to strike. If I imagine the default targeting would always pan the camera to the center of the (huge) body, it will be really annoying. I personally think it would break the game. That's why while you mark me as the one being bitter, I mark the ones complaining about the camera are being bitter. Because I'm not the one whining about the game.

As a response to everyone still marking me as being elite: I do not, cannot and want not use "the claw". I have always played with my thumb on the d-pad / nub and my index finger on the L button. To call me a master of the camera is way out of reach. It's just not that hard.
 
Grampasso said:
I think I would sound stupid telling you that what broke MH2 for me was that mark flying away from you as soon as you went in the room it was stalking? You had to explore all the areas again before meeting it again, only to see it flying away again as soon as it saw you. I went so angry with this hide & seek game that I put down the game and never touched it again (it was MH:F2).

That's what paintballs are for... so you always can track your prey on the map.
 
Soneet said:
What would you say if someone gives ridiculous suggestions to "improve" your favorite game when it's obviously not a game improvement but a game-changing suggestion (as in: fit to my weak sauce taste).

If it's difficulty-related, design an easy mode and put it in there. Even though that guy who used to do Ninja Gaiden seemed to get off on insulting his customers, the re-release still had an easy mode. And a new camera system.


Soneet said:
I don't mind if people suggest it while admitting they are too weak to handle the camera. I do mind if people say it's a way to improve the game.

If someone's suggesting that the camera in a game should be changed, it's likely because he or she feels that the current system causes unnecessary frustration and doesn't provide a meaningful challenge, and therefore feels that his or her suggestion would be a way to improve the game. A desire to see something improve is the usual motivation for making suggestions. Demanding that anyone who disagrees should first denigrate their own abilities is just an underhanded tactic to make them look bad preemptively.
 
Coop games are big in Japan I guess? I personally find the game tedious and boring unless you have a full team to play with the whole time. Singleplayer is shit and becomes extremely difficult to gain access to some of the better weapons/armor.
 
Soneet said:
I actually think it will make the game harder for no reason (as in frustating). In the latter half of the game most monsters are twice the size (G-rank) and up close you either have to pan your camera to the head or the tail, depending on what you want to strike. If I imagine the default targeting would always pan the camera to the center of the (huge) body, it will be really annoying. I personally think it would break the game. That's why while you mark me as the one being bitter, I mark the ones complaining about the camera are being bitter. Because I'm not the one whining about the game.
Hey, I have no problem controlling the camera, but a lot of people do. I'm not saying lock the camera onto the center of mass, but point you in their general direction if you get turned around, which would be easier than spinning the camera around. Against Lao Shan or other large creatures, this isn't such a problem. Personally, i think the camera centering behind you does this job well enough considering you already know where the monster is with your map, but i can see people getting confused and clothesined by a fireball or something.

The only time I even mess with the camera is when I'm trying to stay out of the way, which would be the one time an actual lock on would be helpful, because the claw starts to hurt after a few hours :-P Just put a second analog on the PSP2 and there's no problems here.
 
Man, the MH hardcore really are just fucking crazy. Completely puts me off the game's community really, knowing theres a fair chunk of them this fanatical. I guess youve got to justify 100's of hours of your life somehow! I mean there are people talking about forming their hands into a weird claw to reach both nub and d-pad at the same time. What the fuck :lol :lol

I'll hopefully find some moderate players to have some fun with, but good god, actually accusing people of being "weak sauce gamers" because when I'm playing a game I want a fluid experience and not having to fight it's controls? GameFAQs is thatta way pal.

I agree Lock-on would make the games combat lack that tactical feel, but the "let me see whats fucking trying to kill me button" in the form of quick snap 90 degree camera wouldn't break shit. Unless you consider all console iterations of Monster Hunter completely broken now.
 
SecretBonusPoint said:
Man, the MH hardcore really are just fucking crazy. Completely puts me off the game's community really, knowing theres a fair chunk of them this fanatical. I guess youve got to justify 100's of hours of your life somehow! I mean there are people talking about forming their hands into a weird claw to reach both nub and d-pad at the same time. What the fuck :lol :lol

I'll hopefully find some moderate players to have some fun with, but good god, actually accusing people of being "weak sauce gamers"? GameFAQs is thatta way pal.

I agree Lock-on would make the games combat lack that tactical feel, but the "let me see whats fucking trying to kill me button" in the form of quick snap 90 degree camera wouldn't break shit. Unless you consider all console iterations of Monster Hunter completely broken now.
It really is more obnoxious than when Ninja Gaiden fans call people pussies for complaining about the camera.
 
Basically its one of the most fun games when played co-op...With my two friends, we had stayed in same room for 3 days and played this on psp with co-op lol. And we couldnt beat the first boss i think..Its frustrating but very fun when played together.

I tried singleplayer and got bored of it in few hours.
 
I forgot the name but there was one dungeonish PSP game that allowed a free camera + had 90 degree turning as well. However, I ended up doing a lot of 90 degree turns and then turning back a little. Which is in the end isn't any faster at all and I just had to manage one more camera (more camera managing, yuck).

The "turning back a little" bit is really ugly. Would happen to a center-to-wyvern-bump as well.

Currently there's no help with the camera at all, it's completely manual. If it tries to help in some way there's always some negative edge that comes with it.
 
All I'll add is that, I'll buy a Wii and Monster Hunter Tri IF Capcom can get the fucking game over to the US in a timely manner. I believe I'll dig the game much more on the console where a community will be easier to play with. A little easier anyway...
 
It can sure take a while to click, but when it does and you realize you're 500 hours into a game that is simply fun to play even with no goal in mind (remember how some games used to be like this?) you will have a hard time putting it down.

"Ohhhh! Just one more Tigrex fight... even if I have all his gear!"

Two parts Phantasy Star Online with Zelda's range of weapons to master + All SotC bossfight rush for hours at a time in huge environments + a pinch of Street Fighter anticipation of controls/frustration

It's easy to make the game out to be an RPG when in fact it's a brawler. The game world is ooozing with personality, charm, and an epic sense of the universe. It has plenty of its problems, and it's not for everyone but there sure as hell ain't nothing like it anywhere.

And what isn't rewarding about beating this guy's face in, and cutting his tail off with 3 other hunters who's armors aren't anywhere as cool as yours?

tigrex.jpg
 
sammy said:
(remember how some games used to be like this?)
Sorry if I seemed to come over as a dick, but that quote is what I meant by 'real gamer'. Not like I'm better or anything, I'm just bad at wording things ._.
 
sammy said:
It can sure take a while to click, but when it does and you realize you're 500 hours into a game that is simply fun to play even with no goal in mind (remember how some games used to be like this?) you will have a hard time putting it down.

Which games were like that again?
 
SecretBonusPoint said:
Man, the MH hardcore really are just fucking crazy. Completely puts me off the game's community really, knowing theres a fair chunk of them this fanatical. I guess youve got to justify 100's of hours of your life somehow! I mean there are people talking about forming their hands into a weird claw to reach both nub and d-pad at the same time. What the fuck :lol :lol

I'll hopefully find some moderate players to have some fun with, but good god, actually accusing people of being "weak sauce gamers" because when I'm playing a game I want a fluid experience and not having to fight it's controls? GameFAQs is thatta way pal.

I agree Lock-on would make the games combat lack that tactical feel, but the "let me see whats fucking trying to kill me button" in the form of quick snap 90 degree camera wouldn't break shit. Unless you consider all console iterations of Monster Hunter completely broken now.

What button/buttons would you map it to? Also while I don't like having to use "the claw" what other control scheme could they use?

Honestly, I belive that with the PSP any other control scheme (not to mention new actions) would make the controls even more of a nuisance.

I'm sure they could add an option like that to the Wii version, but the game barely fits on the PSP.
 
RoboGeorgeForeman said:
What button/buttons would you map it to? Also while I don't like having to use "the claw" what other control scheme could they use?

Honestly, I belive that with the PSP any other control scheme (not to mention new actions) would make the controls even more of a nuisance.

I'm sure they could add an option like that to the Wii version, but the game barely fits on the PSP.

Thread is only 2 pages, wouldnt be hard to read through. Also no-one is mentioning lock-on at all, so congratulations to Elite Monster Hunters / Not-So-Elite Thread Readers.

Basically, I would map the D-pad to 90 degree angle snap points of your character. Press right, you see directly whats to the right of you. Perfect for when a fast enemy jumps over your head and goes to hit you with a fast projectile or charge at you. I think Lost Planet employed the same concept (intriguing to me that LP2 is setting itself up to be a bit Monster Hunter). For those desperate to retain precise 360 degree, you could hold down one of the shoulder buttons making the D-pad like it is currently.

I'd also like there to be an option to invert Nub and D-pad duties. I really don't like controlling many games on the PSP with the nub, and I imagine it would please PSP Go owners of the future as well.

So there you go, nothing game breaking or revolutionary. Just a faster more responsive way of being able to point the camera in the direction of your choosing.
 
This patroinizing of MH fans is getting really old

I like MH. I've dumped over 200 hours into it so far and I think it's a lot of fun. It always irritates me when people make broad condecending statements about a fanbase.

I like manually controlling the camera. Like I said earlier in this thread I was very frustrated with the controls and camera when I started playing. But eventually I got the hang of it and now given the choice I wouldn't have it any other way.

I want that full control over the camera to look at what I want when I want. Harder to master? Of course, thats a given for any non-automatic gameplay element the player is expected to manage. But to throw away the added control and freedom the manual camera gives you once you learn it? And to slam and imply that anyone who likes this full control as "fanatical" or "fucking crazy"? As a big MH fan those kind of statements are just outright rude.
 
SecretBonusPoint said:
Thread is only 2 pages, wouldnt be hard to read through. Also no-one is mentioning lock-on at all, so congratulations to Elite Monster Hunters / Not-So-Elite Thread Readers.

Basically, I would map the D-pad to 90 degree angle snap points of your character. Press right, you see directly whats to the right of you. Perfect for when a fast enemy jumps over your head and goes to hit you with a fast projectile or charge at you. I think Lost Planet employed the same concept (intriguing to me that LP2 is setting itself up to be a bit Monster Hunter). For those desperate to retain precise 360 degree, you could hold down one of the shoulder buttons making the D-pad like it is currently.

I'd also like there to be an option to invert Nub and D-pad duties. I really don't like controlling many games on the PSP with the nub, and I imagine it would please PSP Go owners of the future as well.

So there you go, nothing game breaking or revolutionary. Just a faster more responsive way of being able to point the camera in the direction of your choosing.
L + d-pad already controls manual aim for gunners and holding it longer controls the inventory.
 
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