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My mom is "scared" by Obama. Could this be a common problem come November?

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eznark said:
Bloomberg would be dumb considering how tight this election is likely to be.

What I can't figure out is who the hell McCain should pick to help a victory. Giuliani would lock up Florida, but he probably already has it. There are some young Republican stars in the midwest, but he probably needs some name recognition.
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Giuliani would be a bigger albatross on McCain than Clinton to Obama.

i have money on Bobby Jindal
 
scorcho said:
Giuliani would be a bigger albatross on McCain than Clinton to Obama.

i have money on Bobby Jindal
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I think he is a star but would upstage McCain...is that good?

Obama needs to keep playing the delegate game though, so his choices are more limited than McCain, at least that's how I see it right now.
 
eznark said:
see, that is the type of thing that would sway me to vote FOR a candidate, instead of internet lolllin
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me, i'm awaiting Obama to shift us to a command economy
 
omg rite said:
Couple facts first, to set it up: I live in Mass (fairly liberal state!) and my parents have always been pretty anti-republican. In all honesty, my mom has really never shown any signs of racism or anything like that.

She told me how disappointed she was that Obama got the nomination over Hillary, her reasoning being that she just really doesn't like Obama. I asked why and the first reason she gave was that he "scares" her.

For a while, I tried to get a reason why but none of it made sense at all. She brought up the typical "lack of experience", saying some babble about him having 2 years of experience (which uh.. isn't true). The only other real reason she gave was that she wanted Hillary because of how "good the economy was" during Bill's time in office. (Which still doesn't give me an answer as to why he "scares" her, leading me to believe it's simply because he's black.)

But after a long conversation, I was left with literally nothing. No reasoning or anything.

Obama obviously has most of the youth vote locked up and I'm sure it will be an insane record turnout for him there, but is this going to be a very big problem for him? Adults who honestly don't know what they're talking about going out and voting for McCain (or not voting at all, in my mom's case) because, for whatever reason, they're "scared" Obama?

It just makes zero sense to me and I'm wondering if this may be the mindset of a lot of adults come November.
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A friend's mom still wonders if Obama is a Muslim and it's conflicting with her decision on how she will vote.

I think these kind of perceptions are indeed very scary. I can only hope they don't hold much weight.
 
eznark said:
and you yelled at me for saying socialist. tsk tsk
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i hoped you'd realize i was tweaking you on your quick and dirty (euphanism for blatantly wrong) terminology. tsk tsk ;)

i <3 me some market economy, but not completely in the neoliberal sense.
 
scorcho said:
i hoped you'd realize i was tweaking you on your quick and dirty (euphanism for blatantly wrong) terminology. tsk tsk ;)

i <3 me some market economy, but not completely in the neoliberal sense.
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i figured as much, I was hoping you weren't a semantics warrior.

Not to belabor the point, but I do see an Obama presidency attempting to direct certain markets.

He strikes me as an "equality of outcome" guy, although the general campaign will flush that out if true.
 
Barack Obama's historic quest for the White House is creating a mix of hope and concern among fellow African-Americans, raising expectations that the presumptive Democratic nominee will be able to improve race relations — and anxiety over whether his success will ignite a racially divisive fall campaign.

Interviews from Los Angeles to New York and a new USA TODAY/Gallup Poll find that many blacks are still getting used to the idea that Obama — who would be the first person of color to be nominated for president by a major party — could win the White House five months from now.

"This is up there with the Emancipation Proclamation. Not quite at that level, but not far behind it," says Constance Rice, 52, a civil rights lawyer in Los Angeles. She says Obama's rise is especially poignant to her father's generation: African-Americans who grew up under the heel of racist Jim Crow policies. "If (Obama) can give a vision of how to keep America safe and prosperous, he'll win."

In the USA TODAY/Gallup Poll, taken May 30-June 2, 75% of blacks believe Obama as president would improve race relations like no other candidate. In 1995, when Colin Powell was flirting with a presidential bid, only four in 10 blacks felt the first African-American chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff could transform black-white relations in the same way.

Brenda Butler, a 61-year-old store owner in Brooklyn, sees Obama's desire to work across racial divides as one of his strengths. "Now we have a candidate who can be objective and still be black," she says, "still represent us as a people but represent everyone, too."

Mingled with such pride, however, are concerns, particularly among African-Americans that the fall campaign inevitably will be clouded by racially charged rhetoric that could damage race relations in this country — and that Obama's race could put his safety at risk.

Several polls have shown that a declining number of Americans believe Obama's race will hurt his chances of becoming president, but among many blacks concerns are rising about how Obama's foes will use race to try to divide the electorate.

The Rev. J. Leon Thorn, pastor of St. James African Methodist Episcopal Church on Chicago's South Side, predicts "an unleashing of furor toward Obama. … There are some die-hard racists and there are some very mean-spirited people."

In the USA TODAY/Gallup Poll, seven of 10 blacks predicted that Republicans were likely to make race an issue, while less than one-half of non-Hispanic whites thought so.

Indeed, many blacks said subtle references to Obama's race during the primaries may have foreshadowed what is to come in Obama's battle with John McCain, the presumptive GOP nominee.

Former president Bill Clinton, for example, seemed to minimize Obama's landslide victory in January's South Carolina primary by noting that Jesse Jackson also had won the Palmetto State on the strength of its large black electorate during his unsuccessful bids for president in 1984 and 1988.

Hillary Clinton told USA TODAY that she believed she would be a stronger nominee because Obama had trouble appealing to "hard-working Americans, white Americans."

Clinton saw her support among black voters in USA TODAY/Gallup Polls plummet from more than 50% late last year to 15% this month.

Obama, a Christian, has had to address false assertions that he is Muslim and explain why he doesn't always wear a flag pin on his lapel. His wife, Michelle, was criticized for saying in February that "for the first time in my adult life, I am really proud of my country."

For his part, McCain has vowed to run a respectful campaign against Obama. Last month, he denounced an ad that ran during North Carolina's gubernatorial primary questioning Obama's patriotism as "unacceptable."

Race in the campaign is "inescapable," says Ronald Walters, professor of government and politics at the University of Maryland, who is African-American. Given the broad dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq, the subprime mortgage crisis and the faltering economy, race is "one of the few things they have. … You use something that's tried and proven to frighten people."

Safety a concern

African-Americans also worry that Obama's personal safety is more at risk than other recent presidential candidates, and nearly one-half say a key reason is the color of his skin. In contrast, 25% of non-Hispanic whites believe that Obama's race puts him in greater danger.

Charmona Whitfield, a 34-year-old teacher in Centreville, Va., says Obama's safety is "in the back of my mind every day."

"We're not ignorant of the fact that there are some crazy people out there," she says.

Carl Bell, president of the Community Mental Health Council in Chicago, is more blunt: "The biggest hope I have is that he doesn't get killed."

Such fears are rooted in the nation's long history of racially motivated violence against African-Americans, particularly those in positions of leadership such as the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. and NAACP field secretary Medgar Evers, who were slain in the 1960s.

In a sensitive topic, there are also comparison to the Kennedys.

"Consciously or not, (Obama) has fashioned himself and he comes across to a lot of people like the Kennedys," says David Bositis, senior political analyst for the Joint Center for Political and Economic Studies in Washington. "For some people it's Bobby Kennedy, for some people it's Jack Kennedy. And what happened to the Kennedys?"

Obama received Secret Service protection in May 2007 — the earliest date ever for a presidential candidate — because of the huge crowds he was attracting. Sen. Dick Durbin, D-Ill., a close friend, told the Associated Press that he approached congressional leaders to discuss Obama's safety with the Secret Service after Durbin received information of a racial bent that caused him concern.

Michelle Obama has said that older African-Americans in particular tell her they worry about her family's safety, but that she believes this is a much different time than the era in which King rose to prominence. Last week, she told a supporter at a Phoenix fundraiser that "fear is a useless emotion."

Marianna Jackson, 22, is not focusing on such an awful scenario. "I'd like to think we've learned from past mistakes," says Jackson, who graduated last month from New York University. "I'm not overly afraid."

'New face of America'

Despite such concerns, the overarching emotion among many African-Americans is overwhelming joy at Obama's success.

"It's just phenomenal," says T. Marie Odom, 23, a housing authority accident manager from Chicago. "I think we're definitely tearing down a racial boundary that has existed for years. He's really the new face of America."

Rosiland Martin, 36, a small business owner in Richton Park, Ill., says that when Obama declared Tuesday that he had won enough delegates to be the Democratic nominee, she called her three sons to come watch him on TV.

"They said 'He's going to be the president mom? We're going to have a black president?' That made me feel really good," says Martin, whose sons are 11, 14 and 16. The boys have pictures of every man who has led the nation in their bedroom, she says, and her oldest son pulled a magazine cover bearing Obama's picture and added it to the wall.

For those who have debated Obama's chances, contributed to his campaign and voted in droves during the primaries, Obama's rise has been extraordinary.

At the start of his presidential campaign last year, some African-Americans wondered whether Obama — who went to Harvard Law School and was a child during the height of the civil rights movement — was "black enough." Last December, he split support among black voters with Clinton, who with her husband had long enjoyed enormous popularity among African-Americans.

In the 2004 presidential race, blacks made up 11% of the electorate, according to surveys of voters as they left polling places. Democrat John Kerry got 88% of the black vote and President Bush got 11%.

Now, more than 80% of blacks say they would vote for Obama, according to the USA TODAY/Gallup Poll, compared with only 9% for McCain.

Obama's unexpected caucus victory in Iowa, where more than 94% of the population is white, was a turning point.

"He needed to prove to African-Americans he could win," says Walakewon Blegay, 23, a volunteer for Obama's campaign in Prince George's County, Md., who initially had a difficult time convincing local political insiders that Obama had a chance. "It was harder than I thought it would be."

As Obama won more popular votes and convention delegates, some blacks say they found themselves becoming immersed in politics for the first time.

"They say he's attracted all these people who were never involved in politics before. Well, I'm one of them," says Cassandra Brown, a 53-year-old insurance agent in Chesapeake, Va., who has an "Obama for President" bumper sticker on her Acura.

Brown had never voted in a presidential primary, but after seeing Obama speak and mesmerize a diverse crowd, she not only cast her ballot for the Illinois senator but volunteered to get others to do the same. "We're all standing by this man," she says.

Looking beyond color

In the USA TODAY/Gallup Poll, more than 60% of African Americans say Obama's policies would improve the standard of living for blacks, compared with 11% who say the same for McCain.

Caprina Jefferson, 28, a restaurant manager in Edmond, Okla., believes Obama would help blacks. "He's lived as a person of color all of is life, so … those issues have affected him. I think he's bound to give something back."

In Obama's political success, Jackson and others see an opportunity for the nation to reflect more on biracial Americans, which they say is an often-overlooked — but growing — segment of the population.

"It will really educate people about multiculturalism in America," says Jackson, who like Obama has a black father and a white mother.

A broader conversation about race also is likely, she says, but will come only if Obama wins the presidency. "I think there's a sort of numbness to race right now for some people and a hypersensitivity for others," she says. But an Obama presidency "will necessitate that we address it."

John Moore, 26, says he got a glimpse of Obama's ability to make people focus on their common struggles in March when the senator gave a speech on race in response to incendiary comments made by his one-time pastor, Jeremiah Wright. Wright had suggested that U.S. actions had invited the 9/11 attacks and the federal government was responsible for spreading AIDS.

"Jeremiah Wright's focus was on our differences and Obama's focus was more on gas prices and how these issues make us the same as Americans," says Moore, a pharmacist in Philadelphia. "He is focused on bringing people together."

After a political campaign built around conciliation, college professor Anthony Browne, who is black, doubts that Obama will be able to focus on racial inequities if he is elected president.

An Obama presidency would be a symbolic victory but "what does that mean in terms of housing, policing, education and health care?" asks Browne, who teaches at Hunter College in New York. "How are you going to bring up race if you ran a campaign that said we're above race and now let's move beyond it?"

The USA TODAY/Gallup Poll showed that an overwhelming percentage of blacks compared with whites — 71% to 52% — believe they are worse off now financially than a year ago. Some say a black man in the White House may not improve their personal situations.

"I don't care about Barack Obama," says Jack Daniels II, a 20-year-old construction worker in New York City. "I would like an African-American president, but just because he's African-American, that doesn't mean he's going to put money in my pocket or help me pay bills."

Danica Hederson, 18, a high school student in Compton, Calif., wants to know if Obama can end the Iraq war so her two cousins and best friends who are serving overseas can come home. "For me, it's not about the color … it's the ideas," she says.

Chris Dorm, 43, of Brooklyn, has been a registered Republican since he went into the military at age 18. But he says he'll vote for Obama, not because of the skin color that they share, but because of the candidate's ability to coalesce a diverse nation.

"When you look at who's standing behind Barack Obama, you really see our country," Dorm says. "When you have someone that can touch a rainbow of people. .. you have to see that here's someone who is really making sense to everybody collectively. I'm looking forward to where our country is going to be headed with him at the helm."
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This is a good article. I think what worries White people is that they think that the policies that Obama will enact will improve things for Blacks at their expense. The idea that Obama's polices will improve everyone is alien because for the last 40 years they have been told when Black people improve you lose. The only way for us (Whites) to be successful is to keep blacks down.
 
Tommie Hu$tle said:
This is a good article. I think what worries White people is that they think that the policies that Obama will enact will improve things for Blacks at their expense. The idea that Obama's polices will improve everyone is alien because for the last 40 years they have been told when Black people improve you lose. The only way for us (Whites) to be successful is to keep blacks down.
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I've never heard that in my entire life.
 
eznark said:
I've never heard that in my entire life.
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Me neither. I'm against hiring a minority over a more qualified white person to meet a quota, but that's about it. Haven't heard of a plan to keep the black man down at the water cooler, maybe the plan's only discussed at Klan meeting centers?

My biggest gripe with this whole racism thing is the desire to break it down into race. It's really all economic not race. If you tell me you want to spend X amount of dollars to fix just black neighborhoods I'm gonna get pissed. If you tell me however that you want to spend that money to fix neighborhoods of a certain socioeconomic status I won't get mad. It's sometimes just the wording but I don't like the idea of black politicians having to look out for poor blacks and hispanic politicians having to look after poor hispanics and so on. The main problem is poverty, and any attempt to combat poverty should be aimed at and available for all races.
 
mAcOdIn said:
Me neither. I'm against hiring a minority over a more qualified white person to meet a quota, but that's about it. Haven't heard of a plan to keep the black man down at the water cooler, maybe the plan's only discussed at Klan meeting centers?

My biggest gripe with this whole racism thing is the desire to break it down into race. It's really all economic not race. If you tell me you want to spend X amount of dollars to fix just black neighborhoods I'm gonna get pissed. If you tell me however that you want to spend that money to fix neighborhoods of a certain socioeconomic status I won't get mad. It's sometimes just the wording but I don't like the idea of black politicians having to look out for poor blacks and hispanic politicians having to look after poor hispanics and so on. The main problem is poverty, and any attempt to combat poverty should be aimed at and available for all races.
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Piece of advice, GAF doesn't want to hear your thoughts on racial relations. Go along to get along, friend, and always leave race to the real world, where inflection and tone will get you everywhere is such discussions.

Look no further than the Gaborn skewering a few pages back.
 
eznark said:
I've never heard that in my entire life.
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It's shifted. Complaining about people who live in the same country as you causes problems because those people can vote against you.
Instead, the same sorts of people complain about job losses to Chinese, Indians and Mexicans.
 
Tommie Hu$tle said:
This is a good article. I think what worries White people is that they think that the policies that Obama will enact will improve things for Blacks at their expense. The idea that Obama's polices will improve everyone is alien because for the last 40 years they have been told when Black people improve you lose. The only way for us (Whites) to be successful is to keep blacks down.
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Obama doesn't worry me but some of the people in that article do. People need to start realizing that Obama is about more than race and that they shouldn't be expecting him to magically turn things around (In regards to the issues that specifically affect many black people). The changes they're looking for have to happen from the bottom-up, not from the top-down. The "give something back" line hit a nerve to me; Obama doesn't owe anything to black people, or any other race for that matter. He owes America what he has promised; a better country for everyone.

Supporting a man because of his skin color is just as obnoxious as criticizing him for it.
 
Slavik81 said:
It's shifted. Complaining about people who live in the same country as you causes problems because those people can vote against you.
Instead, the same sorts of people complain about job losses to Chinese, Indians and Mexicans.
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but unions vote democrat

Obama is about more than race and that they shouldn't be expecting him to magically turn things around
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completely agree there. Obama may be able to shackle the country with a new New Deal and other Keynsian clap trap but racial issues won't change an iota.
 
Gamer @ Heart said:
She doesnt know why she doesnt like obama just like how many obama supporters dont know why they like obama. At least in my experience.
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it comes off as glib, but it's a sound statement (probably not applicable to many engaged in the OT political discussions, but the gen pop)
 
Guys, just start showing your parents some of those "the real mccain" videos from youtube to start casting doubts into their minds about Mccain, they certainly won't think he's a "straight talker" anymore.
 
SA-X said:
Guys, just start showing your parents some of those "the real mccain" videos from youtube to start casting doubts into their minds about Mccain, they certainly won't think he's a "straight talker" anymore.
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make sure to show em Loose Change as well, and the Obama Girl videos
 
Out of curiosity, what are the precedents for an ethnic minority becoming an elected leader for a first world nation (or any nation I suppose)?
 
SonicMegaDrive said:
You'll find out just how 'racist' America really is, come November.

A lot of people are going to be surprised and disappointed. Many bitterly disappointed.
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So anybody who doesn't vote for Obama, you're going to label them "racists"? Not everybody shares the same views as Obama does in terms of healthcare, national defense, taxation and the economy and various other social issues.
 
beelzebozo said:
Because Neogaf is the premier political battlefield, where our every word sends ripples throughout the campaign (or: the internet is serious business.) That is a more annoying argument than Mercury Fred telling us "you should be nice to us Hillary supporters quit making fun of her eeeeeeee." Don't pretend you are actually offended.
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beelzebozo said:
odrion kicks ass. just consistently cleaning up in here.
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I am aware that the internet isn't a venue that we need to treat with painstaking seriousness. However, I do kind of find it important to not carry on with a sense of irony. How many primary topics did we have where we would quote and laugh at the extremist circle-jerk that was HillaryIs44.com? Now, I'm aware that what I'm criticizing doesn't necessarily border on those levels, but I don't think we do well to counter the "Obama fans have bought into the cult of personality" attacks when we sit around insulting the opposing viewpoints by calling them retards.

Disagreeing is fine. Tongue-in-cheek insulting is fine to a degree. But smug "because they are" responses to a question of "so all McCain supporters are retards?" isn't really all that funny, and certainly isn't clever at all. The only reason why it elicits any positive response whatsoever is because pro-Obama people are in good company here. It works on the pandering level of "yeah, way to stick it to the other guy! High five!"

Either way, it may be idealistic, but when you have so many different people willing to discuss an important topic, even in an unimportant venue, I do think there is a chance for productive discourse. It's always going to be tertiary to wanting to kill time and waxing philosophical just for the sake of doing so, but maybe, just maybe, one of us can make an articulate point that might have some persuasion to get a vote or two out of someone who otherwise might have voted McCain.

But no, it's much better to cheerlead our guy in a juvenile fashion. Obama rules! Suck it other people! I can't wait to taste your bitter tears when Obama is in the White House! Can I get a virtual high-five (or maybe I should ask for some fist bumps now)!?
 
omg rite said:
Couple facts first, to set it up: I live in Mass (fairly liberal state!) and my parents have always been pretty anti-republican. In all honesty, my mom has really never shown any signs of racism or anything like that.

She told me how disappointed she was that Obama got the nomination over Hillary, her reasoning being that she just really doesn't like Obama. I asked why and the first reason she gave was that he "scares" her.

For a while, I tried to get a reason why but none of it made sense at all. She brought up the typical "lack of experience", saying some babble about him having 2 years of experience (which uh.. isn't true). The only other real reason she gave was that she wanted Hillary because of how "good the economy was" during Bill's time in office. (Which still doesn't give me an answer as to why he "scares" her, leading me to believe it's simply because he's black.)

But after a long conversation, I was left with literally nothing. No reasoning or anything.

Obama obviously has most of the youth vote locked up and I'm sure it will be an insane record turnout for him there, but is this going to be a very big problem for him? Adults who honestly don't know what they're talking about going out and voting for McCain (or not voting at all, in my mom's case) because, for whatever reason, they're "scared" Obama?

It just makes zero sense to me and I'm wondering if this may be the mindset of a lot of adults come November.
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Do you truly believe your mother is a racist? Or that she really just doesn't know Obama as a candidate enough to vote for him? Why does it matter to you whom she votes for? You can vote for Obama and she can vote for whomever she wants to.

It seems to be easy for Obama to lock up the youth votes, maybe because younger people are more idealistic, maybe some of the older people have more reservations about a candidate like Obama.
 
Kittonwy said:
Do you truly believe your mother is a racist? Or that she really just doesn't know Obama as a candidate enough to vote for him? Why does it matter to you whom she votes for? You can vote for Obama and she can vote for whomever she wants to.

It seems to be easy for Obama to lock up the youth votes, maybe because younger people are more idealistic, maybe some of the older people have more reservations about a candidate like Obama.
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rawr
16x16smileysadgi9.gif
 
Tommie Hu$tle said:
This is a good article. I think what worries White people is that they think that the policies that Obama will enact will improve things for Blacks at their expense. The idea that Obama's polices will improve everyone is alien because for the last 40 years they have been told when Black people improve you lose. The only way for us (Whites) to be successful is to keep blacks down.
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The people at your local klan meeting are not a very good representation of white America.

No matter how much GAF wants that to be so.
 
avatar299 said:
The people at your local klan meeting are not a very good representation of white America.

No matter how much GAF wants that to be so.
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sadly, it seems GAF assumes every community actually has a local clan meeting (they're all probably blue-collar teamsters who'll vote for the dem like their Boss tells em though).
 
Steve Youngblood said:
It's always going to be tertiary to wanting to kill time and waxing philosophical just for the sake of doing so, but maybe, just maybe, one of us can make an articulate point that might have some persuasion to get a vote or two out of someone who otherwise might have voted McCain.
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Except this never, ever happens. You can have pages with of guys spending their time pointing out facts and digging up real sources to someone with the opposite opinion, and in the end it'll just be "I don't have the energy to argue anymore" and they'll reappear in the future spouting the same retarded bullshit. Heck, even if you do invest the effort into making a lengthy informative post the user will just cherry pick any group of words and use them out of context.

So fuck it, let's continue our ten word posts of cynicism and sarcasm.

and yes we ask for fistbumps now
 
Odrion said:
Except this never, ever happens. You can have pages with of guys spending their time pointing out facts and digging up real sources to someone with the opposite opinion, and in the end it'll just be "I don't have the energy to argue anymore" and they'll reappear in the future spouting the same retarded bullshit. Heck, even if you do invest the effort into making a lengthy informative post the user will just cherry pick any words and use them out of context.

So fuck it, let's continue our ten word posts of cynicism and sarcasm.

and yes we ask for fistbumps now
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Fair enough. Carry on, then.
 
My mothers words when asked about her opinion of Obama was... "I dont trust anyone who was sworn in on the Quran". She honestly feels that electing a "muslim" into office will usher in the attack suggested by Al Qaida as "an attack from within". She has a gas mask that her father gave to her once Bill Clinton was elected. Yes, my grandfather is a staunch Republican and believes Democrats will spell our demise. But any rate, I'm having a hard time coming up with a decent argument with my mother as to why Obama is a good choice. I know why I like him, but she wanted Hillary. She always shoots down my arguments with her own fear.
 
Davedough said:
My mothers words when asked about her opinion of Obama was... "I dont trust anyone who was sworn in on the Quran". She honestly feels that electing a "muslim" into office will usher in the attack suggested by Al Qaida as "an attack from within". She has a gas mask that her father gave to her once Bill Clinton was elected. Yes, my grandfather is a staunch Republican and believes Democrats will spell our demise. But any rate, I'm having a hard time coming up with a decent argument with my mother as to why Obama is a good choice. I know why I like him, but she wanted Hillary. She always shoots down my arguments with her own fear.
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Um, how about "He's not a muslim."
 
Odrion said:
Except this never, ever happens. You can have pages with of guys spending their time pointing out facts and digging up real sources to someone with the opposite opinion, and in the end it'll just be "I don't have the energy to argue anymore" and they'll reappear in the future spouting the same retarded bullshit. Heck, even if you do invest the effort into making a lengthy informative post the user will just cherry pick any group of words and use them out of context.
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So true.
 
Star Power said:
Um, how about "He's not a muslim."
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Someone who is foolish enough to believe it is too foolish to be educated. Some people are just a lost cause and a lot of them happen to be our parents, unfortunately.
 
I'm not an Obama fan but what exactly could an evil Muslim President even do? Really? Such an absurd fear. If he tried to let Iran roll over or whatever weird doomsday plan some people have, no-one would listen. I'd love to see an evil Muslim President just cause it'd be hilarious to see the bills and executive orders he tries to get passed an overwhelmingly basically completely Christian senate and house, not to mention the military. just what branch of government would allow something so stupid?

It'd be pure comedy gold until he was killed.

If we were going to be attacked from within by radical Muslims the Presidency's the last place I'd look.

(note) I'm not saying of course all Muslims are evil or anything, this is just for the sake of argument.

Edit: It's almost a shame Saddam died I could just imagine the news over President Obama choosing Saddam Hussein as his Secretary of Defense. "Look, he convinced the world his country had WoMD when they had none! He's perfect for the position, with this America can once again lead the world with strength."
 
I'm not sure if you guys are still on this subject (I couldn't make it past page 5), but I feel I should point out that in the Democratic Primary, Obama was disadvantaged both by his race and by his sex, according to exit polls. Whether you believe those exit polls (damn facts) is an entirely other matter, but it is disingenuous to state that racism has worked both ways in the primary and then turn a blind eye to the issue. There are, or least have been, varying degrees.

Okay, back to reading.
 
people who vote for McCain or don't like Obama aren't automatically racist. But those who claim to be anti Iraq War, in support of (closer to) universal health care, women's rights, etc...and vote for McCain over Obama (or vote for McCain over some other third party candidate), then um...

Racist (and sexist for that matter) are kind of interesting and loaded terms though. In general, Hardly anyone (especially members of historically dominant groups) actually thinks they are racist or sexist, even if that viewpoint may ironically be a result of racial or gender privilege
 
Lemme get this stright from what I gather from this thread.


Obama = Boogieman
McCain = Snidely
Hillary = Wicked Witch of the West


Do I have this right?
 
eznark said:
who is the closest thing to Evan Bayh in Minnesota? (there ain't one in Wisconsin, or I would suggest that). A moderate with executive experience in a swing state. White, black, woman...doesn't matter. Moderate governor/ex-governor from a state in play. Iowa or Minnesota, since Jim Doyle (as much as I'd love to see him go) would be an awful choice.
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That's a losing ticket as history has shown us.
 
scorcho said:
someone who doesn't carry excess baggage stemming from decades in the public life and party dominance. Barack can't trust them (and it's a two-fer-one package deal) to follow his path, nor their collective ability to suppress their ego in what was once the Clintons' party.

i don't need to think of a co-presidency of sorts, nor worry when Bill's explosive gaffes leak and drag as an anchor on the entire campaign or presidency.
yep, though my dream ticket would see a Bloomberg (though i concede that is a pipedream)
Click to expand...


All of you guys are going into this philosophical position of who you think would be a great pair for him - I'm talking about who is best to help him WIN the election. You can't pick a virtual unknown at this point (and the Republicans are dealing with the same issue), you can't pick someone who has the same philosphy as Obama because they will NOT capture those voters who are on the fence or opposed to the Obama roadmap. You have to pick someone who will capture the other side of the democratic party and make sure they come out and vote while at the same time will encourage Republican voters who are on the fence that the Democratic ticket is good enough to not bother with getting out the vote.

Pick somebody that is "like Obama in mindset and ideals" and that ticket loses - plain and simple.
 
Slavik81 said:
While some good points were made... That article is frighteningly paranoid.
He also seems to ignore all other segments of the population besides blacks and whites.
Click to expand...

because this election largely revolved around a black candidate and a largely white electorate...?

I don't think it's that surprising that an article about this election would focus on that, and also considering the uh, unique history between whites and blacks in this country.

Not sure what was so paranoid about it. What he describes seems like a very common occurrence in our society...obviously it isn't talked about too often though. Another benefit of the aforementioned privilege I suppose.
 
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