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New build of Killzone Shadow Fall shows improvements

Building innovative games at launch has to be extremely tough. You are building a new engine, learning the capabilities of the system, you have harsh timelines. I think the biggest innovative launch game was Halo and I don't know how Bungie did it. Not only was the game awesome and innovative it also looked great back in the day!


Real innovation comes after launch though.

edit: The engine near launch is also in flux, old dev kits going out, newer hardware coming in, your engine is incomplete. You remove post processing, the game starts looking like crap and people scream downgrades PS3.5 etc. This same level looked bad at e3, the thread nib created was filled with drive by trolling...
 
Can someone explain to me what screen tearing is? how does it affect the performance of a game, and if someone can show me an example of it in that KZSF video?
 
nib95 said:
BF4 is on current gen consoles....unless you think upping the player count is the next gen feature. Reading posts like yours criticising games for not having "next gen" gameplay always make me laugh, especially when the games you're buying at launch are Forza 5, Killer Instinct and BF4 lol. There's like nothing next gen gameplay wise about any one of those. In-fact, I'd argue Killzone SF was far more ambitious (with the open world, open ended missions, use of the OWL, free map traversal using the zip line etc).
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Killer instinct is one of the only western developed fighters in existence, so yes, I'm interested. BF4 is a pc game...acting like the 360 and ps3 are getting the same experience is dishonest. I've always liked Forza...it isn't next gen though. It's a little creepy that you know what I'm buying.

KZ is a sci-fi shooter and not a particularly great one. There are a ton of those released each year that look and play similar to what we've seen from all the KZ footage. Calling it current gen gameplay was a fact, sorry if that gets you all worked up. What's the buzzword that Gaf has for this...persecution something??

I admitted to it looking amazing anyway.
 
TUROK said:
I love how you look at his icon, and based on that, insult a game you think he'd like.

So insecure.
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I was just kidding, I am not insecure, but you can boil down any game like that. I am buying a Wii U mainly because I missed Super Mario Galaxy on Wii (and also Xenoblade).

btw I never harp on games for innovation. As long as the game is good...that's all I care about. IMO innovation is overrated
 
haZethew0rld said:
Can someone explain to me what screen tearing is? how does it affect the performance of a game, and if someone can show me an example of it in that KZSF video?
Click to expand...
Count your blessings bro. Screen tearing is one of those things that can't be unseen once you see it. Don't tempt the devil, just enjoy the games! For what it's worth though, I usually barely notice it and it NEVER affects my enjoyment of games.
 
SniperHunter said:
just saw the video on a big screen, the lod issues are still there but the popups have been greatly reduced since the e3 build. It would be impossible to eliminate them entirely I guess, but we will see
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I made the same mistake when I first saw the TGS build as well. The large scale pop in is gone but the LOD pop is still present. Hopefully that'll be improved before launch. Game is looking damn good though. Seems like is be a newer build than the TGS one. I notice some effects are different and the mist adds a lot.
 
REV 09 said:
Killer instinct is one of the only western developed fighters in existence, so yes, I'm interested. BF4 is a pc game...acting like the 360 and ps3 are getting the same experience is dishonest. I've always liked Forza...it isn't next gen though. It's a little creepy that you know what I'm buying.

KZ is a sci-fi shooter and not a particularly great one. There are a ton of those released each year that look and play similar to what we've seen from all the KZ footage. Calling it current gen gameplay was a fact, sorry if that gets you all worked up. What's the buzzword that Gaf has for this...persecution something??

I admitted to it looking amazing anyway.
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Firstly...you buy games based off of where they're made? How patriotic of you....

Secondly, define "next-gen" and "current-gen" gameplay? What the hell does that even mean?
 
Whoa...why the hell is there screen tearing now? I came in here looking for improvements and the first thing I notice is there's screen tearing everywhere. You better believe I'll cancel my KZ pre-order if it's like that in the final build.
 
Majanew said:
Whoa...why the hell is there screen tearing now? I came in here looking for improvements and the first thing I notice is there's screen tearing everywhere. You better believe I'll cancel my KZ pre-order if it's like that in the final build.
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not a bid deal, it will be fixed for sure.
 
Majanew said:
Whoa...why the hell is there screen tearing now? I came in here looking for improvements and the first thing I notice is there's screen tearing everywhere. You better believe I'll cancel my KZ pre-order if it's like that in the final build.
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Like I said before, tearing is a quick fix that often happens late in development. These demos are patchwork builds and it's been years since any Sony first party game has had tearing.
 
Game looks fucking excellent, but I've never been a fan of Killzone from a gameplay point of view. I'm super excited for the team's next game though. Hopefully the rumors about it being an RPG are true.
 
harSon said:
Game looks fucking excellent, but I've never been a fan of Killzone from a gameplay point of view. I'm super excited for the team's next game though. Hopefully the rumors about it being an RPG are true.
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Honestly which Killzone does this remind you of? If you removed the red glowing eyes it would be a new IP....

It doesn't look anything like KZ2 or KZ3.
 
REV 09 said:
Killer instinct is one of the only western developed fighters in existence, so yes, I'm interested. BF4 is a pc game...acting like the 360 and ps3 are getting the same experience is dishonest. I've always liked Forza...it isn't next gen though. It's a little creepy that you know what I'm buying.

KZ is a sci-fi shooter and not a particularly great one. There are a ton of those released each year that look and play similar to what we've seen from all the KZ footage. Calling it current gen gameplay was a fact, sorry if that gets you all worked up. What's the buzzword that Gaf has for this...persecution something??

I admitted to it looking amazing anyway.
Click to expand...

These arguments are ridiculous. We know what side of the fence you swing for, but seriously? Your arguments can be boiled down to this:

BF4 = current gen gameplay, MAG did 256 players last gen.

Killer Instinct = 1990s gameplay that could have been done on the SNES. It's your standard western fighting game, oh, and not a particularly great one.

Forza 5 = gameplay Gran Turismo did back in the PS1 era, and not nearly as popular.

What is "next-gen" gameplay anyway? Everything we're going to see next-gen has been done last gen in some capacity, and was fully capable of being done last gen if only developers didn't place such a high importance on graphics.

This gen we will see more open environments and diversity of gameplay tools at your disposal that expands upon concepts that were already highly established this gen. That's exactly what Killzone is doing -- far more open environments, gameplay that harkens back to the Goldeneye era and is sorely missing, and beautiful graphics. Sorry, but I don't see ANY GAME released in the past few years that is doing what KZ:SF is doing at the same level of polish and production.

How in the world does it at all look stale?
 
RoboPlato said:
Like I said before, tearing is a quick fix that often happens late in development. These demos are patchwork builds and it's been years since any Sony first party game has had tearing.
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Fixed late in dev? It hasn't been there before, in any build shown. So what happened that caused the game to have tearing now? How old is this build that's in the video? It's Oct 13, the game has to go gold before too long.
 
B.O.O.M said:
We are close to a new gen of console launches aren't we :D The amount of stupid buzzwords are already at an all time high..."suspicious" "sniff test" and "Next gen Gameplay" are some of the new ones I saw within the last 24 hours

Game looks incredible. Owl looks fun! I love how this and KZ Merc went with different new elements. Merc has the VAN-guard system and this has the OWL. Should be a lot of fun
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I honestly have no clue what the big deal about "next-gen gameplay" is ... gameplay will evolve naturally, no?

Another buzzword I want to die is "dynamic destruction" because half the time, there's nothing dynamic about it... (I'm looking at you BF4!). At least use the word dynamic as it's meant to be by definition...
 
Watching this playthrough is really nice. It's good to see someone who really knows how FPS are played going through this demo for once. I just wish it wasn't on Conference Floor Easy Mode so we could get a good look at the AI.
 
REV 09 said:
Killer instinct is one of the only western developed fighters in existence, so yes, I'm interested. BF4 is a pc game...acting like the 360 and ps3 are getting the same experience is dishonest. I've always liked Forza...it isn't next gen though. It's a little creepy that you know what I'm buying.
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I think that's the point. Everyone just buys the games they're interested in, regardless of whether they have "next-gen gameplay" or not. That's aside from the fact that nobody can even define what "next-gen gameplay" actually is.
 
Majanew said:
Fixed late in dev? It hasn't been there before, in any build shown. So what happened that caused the game to have tearing now? How old is this build that's in the video? It's Oct 13, the game has to go gold before too long.
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Shouldn't you wait to see videos of the final build in action before getting your knickers in a twist?
 
Majanew said:
Fixed late in dev? It hasn't been there before, in any build shown. So what happened that caused the game to have tearing now? How old is this build that's in the video? It's Oct 13, the game has to go gold before too long.
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It was there at E3 and in the offscreen footage that Shu played at Gamescom. They might not even fix it before gold and it could be one of the things in a day one patch.
 
Jeez guys calm down, game is still in development... screen tearing and stuff like that are typically fixed near the end of developmemt where everything is more nailed down to final form. I wouldn't worry, just keep an eye out for it in reviews if you're concerned
 
nib95 said:
Firstly...you buy games based off of where they're made? How patriotic of you....

Secondly, define "next-gen" and "current-gen" gameplay? What the hell does that even mean?
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Come on dude. I live in the US, I enjoy stuff that is developed with a similar background. It has nothing to do with patriotism. Other than MK and I guess Injustice, there aren't many western developed fighters around anymore. In essence, I want to play KI because it's somewhat new and isn't done 10 times a year.

I'm not going to define next-gen gameplay. I honestly don't care about the discussion. It was a throw-away comment that apparently set some of you off. The bottom line is that I feel like I've already played KZ multiple times this year...I'm still going to play KZ btw, I just can't get hyped for it.
 
James Sawyer Ford said:
These arguments are ridiculous. We know what side of the fence you swing for, but seriously? Your arguments can be boiled down to this:

BF4 = current gen gameplay, MAG did 256 players last gen.

Killer Instinct = 1990s gameplay that could have been done on the SNES. It's your standard western fighting game, oh, and not a particularly great one.

Forza 5 = gameplay Gran Turismo did back in the PS1 era, and not nearly as popular.

What is "next-gen" gameplay anyway? Everything we're going to see next-gen has been done last gen in some capacity, and was fully capable of being done last gen if only developers didn't place such a high importance on graphics.

This gen we will see more open environments and diversity of gameplay tools at your disposal that expands upon concepts that were already highly established this gen. That's exactly what Killzone is doing -- far more open environments, gameplay that harkens back to the Goldeneye era and is sorely missing, and beautiful graphics. Sorry, but I don't see ANY GAME released in the past few years that is doing KZ:SF is doing at the same level of polish.

How in the world does it at all look stale?
Click to expand...

That's just it. I had to look but a few posts in to his post history to immediately notice the contradiction and difference in perception. It's always the same. People will complain and criticise one game on a particular platform for not being "innovative" or not having "next-gen gameplay" (whatever that means), but then champion another game on another platform despite it having exactly the same draw backs and loosely worded flaws, in this instance, maybe even worse given his particular choice of innovation lacking gaming picks for November.

Honestly, as I've said countless times across all platforms (not something reserved only for one or another), innovation is nice, but not necessary. A game does not have to be innovative to be brilliant. In-fact, the vast majority of my favourite games of all time are not even particularly, if at all innovative.
 
a916 said:
I honestly have no clue what the big deal about "next-gen gameplay" is ... gameplay will evolve naturally, no?

Another buzzword I want to die is "dynamic destruction" because half the time, there's nothing dynamic about it... (I'm looking at you BF4!). At least use the word dynamic as it's meant to be by definition...
Click to expand...

yep I have no idea what it means either. Looks like kZ SF are trying new things. New gameplay elements, more open structure and a new setting for the story. Sounds good to me

But yea so many of such terms flying around haha
 
I'd rather have screen tearing and no input lag over v-sync and input lag.

I'm mostly a PC gamer and when I always disable v-sync because I want the most responsive controls.
 
nib95 said:
That's just it. I had to look but a few posts in to his post history to immediately notice the contradiction and difference in perception. It's always the same. People will complain and criticise one game on a particular platform for not being "innovative" or not having "next-gen gameplay" (whatever that means), but then champion another game on another platform despite it having exactly the same draw backs and loosely worded flaws, in this instance, maybe even worse given his particular choice of innovation lacking gaming picks for November.

Honestly, as I've said countless times across all platforms (not something reserved only for one or another), innovation is nice, but not necessary. A game does not have to be innovative to be brilliant. In-fact, the vast majority of my favourite games of all time are not even particularly, if at all innovative.
Click to expand...
well said. Watch and how nobody will bring up innovation when Halo 5 is shown next year.
 
SniperHunter said:
well said. Watch and how nobody will bring up innovation wen Halo 5 is shown next year.
Click to expand...

It really annoys me how this game keeps getting targeted for the "nothing new" comments when it's pushing the series forward a lot. It may not be doing new stuff for the genre, but's it's doing a lot new for Killzone. I was not expecting this game to be as open as it seems to be since it's coming at launch. I was expecting just a refined Killzone experience but this seems like a real evolution.
 
This game looks so beautiful. The off screen footage doesn't do it justice. The colors are so vibrant when you watch a direct feed high quality video.
 
nib95 said:
That's just it. I had to look but a few posts in to his post history to immediately notice the contradiction and difference in perception. It's always the same. People will complain and criticise one game on a particular platform for not being "innovative" or not having "next-gen gameplay" (whatever that means), but then champion another game on another platform despite it having exactly the same draw backs and loosely worded flaws, in this instance, maybe even worse given his particular choice of innovation lacking gaming picks for November.

Honestly, as I've said countless times across all platforms (not something reserved only for one or another), innovation is nice, but not necessary. A game does not have to be innovative to be brilliant. In-fact, the vast majority of my favourite games of all time are not even particularly, if at all innovative.
Click to expand...

He's extremely excited about Ryse as well.

Unlike Killzone, which is done repeatedly a few times every year...Ryse is a western styled game developed by Crytek Frankfurt and they don't make Roman hack and slash games developed for US interests by a German gaming studio anymore! It's extremely new and fresh.
 
harSon said:
Game looks fucking excellent, but I've never been a fan of Killzone from a gameplay point of view. I'm super excited for the team's next game though. Hopefully the rumors about it being an RPG are true.
Click to expand...

Better be true...
Also heard it had an steam punkish theme but yeah that could be my brain fucking with me :(
 
RoboPlato said:
It really annoys me how this game keeps getting targeted for the "nothing new" comments when it's pushing the series forward a lot. It may not be doing new stuff for the genre, but's it's doing a lot new for Killzone. I was not expecting this game to be as open as it seems to be since it's coming at launch. I was expecting just a refined Killzone experience but this seems like a real evolution.
Click to expand...

Yea, this game looks anti Killzone. It looks nothing like the previous KZ games. GG has pretty much addressed everything that was wrong with KZ on PS3. Yet people are whining about innovation. Just the usual group of fanboys I guess..can't expect them to praise a PS4 exclusive title
 
Yes, unlike most other launch titles this game screams next gen. It is far above shoddy cross gen titles like BF4 and Watch Dogs and also looks better to me than all other 1st party titles on either console. Pretty excited to play this, I hope the gameplay holds up!
 
RoboPlato said:
It really annoys me how this game keeps getting targeted for the "nothing new" comments when it's pushing the series forward a lot. It may not be doing new stuff for the genre, but's it's doing a lot new for Killzone. I was not expecting this game to be as open as it seems to be since it's coming at launch. I was expecting just a refined Killzone experience but this seems like a real evolution.
Click to expand...

Killzone Shadow Fall is a bigger departure and change to the franchise than any other sequel being released this next gen. At least that I can think of anyway.

I have to give kudos' to GG for attempting such an ambitious sequel, and as a launch title of all things as well. They didn't have to do the whole semi open, OWL assisted, open ended mission objective, revamped multiplayer, all weapons unlocked from the beginning stuff, whole new art direction and level design etc, but the fact that they did deserves credit. Stuff like free DLC competitive maps is just icing on the cake.

Oh, and the maps look awesome too.

Killzone Shadow Fall | A glimpse of the 10 included MP maps, plus 6 free DLC maps?

ibojGaIrNZA50h.png
 
Ok. So after seeing this I'm getting the vibes like I did with the Super Nintendo or Sega Genesis release. Or maybe it's just that next generation feel that's getting to me.
 
nib95 said:
Killzone Shadow Fall is a bigger departure and change to the franchise than any other sequel being released this next gen. At least that I can think of anyway.

I have to give kudos' to GG for attempting such an ambitious sequel, and as a launch title of all things as well. They didn't have to do the whole semi open, OWL assisted, open ended mission objective, revamped multiplayer, all weapons unlocked from the beginning stuff, whole new art direction and level design etc, but the fact that they did deserves credit. Stuff like free DLC competitive maps is just icing on the cake.

Oh, and the maps look awesome too.

Killzone Shadow Fall | A glimpse of the 10 included MP maps, plus 6 free DLC maps?

ibojGaIrNZA50h.png
Click to expand...

That jungle map seems interesting.
 
This game looks amazing, first gameplay I've seen since E3. I gotta start watching more next gen footage. All I've really seen is E3 footage and I'm on GAF everyday.
 
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