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Lunatic_Gamer
Gold Member
Why Cross-Gen Games Will Hold Back The PS5 And Xbox Series X
Thanks to cross-gen games, it will be a while before developers utilize the full potential of new consoles.
gamingbolt.com
Thanks to cross-gen games, it will be a while before developers utilize the full potential of new consoles.
Why Cross-Gen Games Will Hold Back The PS5 And Xbox Series X
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
and thats why you need first party there at launch to take full advantage of next gen consoles.Why Cross-Gen Games Will Hold Back The PS5 And Xbox Series X
Thanks to cross-gen games, it will be a while before developers utilize the full potential of new consoles.
Why Cross-Gen Games Will Hold Back The PS5 And Xbox Series X
this happened last gen as no third party released a multiplatform for the first year. AC unity was the first and only next gen exclusive with advanced warfare seeing a current gen port. So 2 in the first year.
it wasnt until 2015 did we start getting next gen only games like Witcher 3 and Batman arkham knight.
same thing is going to happen next gen.
good thing is that sony will have several games out in the first year unlike this gen because this time around they arent fucking around.
FranXico
Member
In the coming consoles, you have to code the games to use the new file system and pack the assets according to what the decompression blocks expect, otherwise the decompression is done by the CPU anyway. This probably is why SoD2 took just over 6 seconds to load, instead of a fraction of a second.
I'm guessing BC PS4 games are also not going to load and run as potentially fast as they would if they were "coded" to take advantage of the new IO subsytem. But they will still load noticeably faster than on the PS4, due to the massive CPU upgrade (decompression runs much, much faster).
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
I could see cross-gen lasting a little longer this time if anything.
FranXico
Member
Oh, it won't be much longer. Then we will be able to move to each console's respective OT.
BurnCoalMeltPole
Member
The PS4 already has a HW decompressor for zlib, and Kraken apparently uses a quarter of the computing resources, so optimization here may be less important.
I wonder if anyone ran a profiler to see if the loading of SoD2 on PC was CPU bound. It is notable that examples showing slower SSDs took longer to load.
whoever81
Member
Let me guess...Soon?
FranXico
Member
Very good point. It won't be so much of an issue either way then.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I will call that, BS/FAKE
Here is where this "friend" of blue negroho really stands
Fudding hilarious.
FranXico
Member
I guess that like me, you are hoping that the long hiatus without any new announcements is because they are focusing on next gen games.
Thirty7ven
Banned
Why? Will be hard to port down to Jaguar and 5400 RPM drives. If PS5 takes off, cross gen won't last long, but if adoption is slow, sure.
Straight out of infowars. Greenberg "sponsoring" the guy doesn't shock me though, sleezy as fuck community management. Never gonna get your brand to be seen as classy premium that way. Never.
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TLZ
Banned
But..... But how? What a weird thing that happened. Anyway.....
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
You’re only as good as the company you keep.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
World economy is pretty doomed right now. Not to mention further potential interruptions to supply chains and whatnot. Also MS and their damn XSS.
We'll see; either way not every gen goes the same way as the last. We won't know how long cross-gen will last until the dust settles.
(don't get me wrong, I hope Xbox Series S is cancelled, and cross gen barely lasts.. just not holding my breath.)
Dr Strange
Member
saintjules
Member
Thirty7ven
Banned
I’m optimistic and supply chain doesn’t seem to be a problem. Actually home entertainment is and will keep getting a boost from the “new normal”. Theaters and other entertainment that drives crowds might be the ones getting seriously hit.
XSS is also something I see as a positive and not a negative, it’s MS’s best chance at increasing their install base and also a boost to early adoption rate. I’m honestly of the mind that if XSS doesn’t come out, Xbox might be in trouble. And trust me, if MS decides to go ahead with XSS, it’s because the data tells them they have too. If they don’t then they are pretty confident with what the data tells them about XSX.
PaintTinJr
Member
I downloaded the paper (linked in the tweet) and gave it a look over.
From my quick read, this technique seems at odds with UE5's objective to remove baking from the creation pipeline. The time for the algorithm to find the right places to cut edges to unfold and encode was listed as an hour for a complex model - but I'm pretty sure the models are all PS3/360 gen polygon counts or less - so millions and billions in the UE5 demo scene is a lot of pre-processing time that would seem impractical with this technique, unless I've misundertood something.
I think it works by them taking a big model split it in to two manifold - like two halves of an easter egg - then take each manifold (in turn) and sample them and map each perimeter to the outer edge of a circle/disk, they then look to cut seams/edges into a manifold perimeter, then remap the mesh to the circle, so the mesh looks more uniform within the circle. After the mesh is mapped to the circle, they then map the circle to a square, the geometry image (so 2x GI, one for each manifold), and then sample the mesh at each position in the square to get uniform samples across the geometry. they also need to resample to another texture for the normal map values, and colour values, resulting in 2x geometry maps, 2x normal maps, 2x colour maps/2xtexture maps that all live in the same square domain (with also some extra uncompressed data for the square's edges, so manifolds definitely align when reconstructed.
Tripolygon
Banned
Random Tuesday™ is upon us. I wonder what we will get tomorrow.
Great Hair
Banned
Xiung Wang Wei
Neo Member
Why Cross-Gen Games Will Hold Back The PS5 And Xbox Series X
Thanks to cross-gen games, it will be a while before developers utilize the full potential of new consoles.
Why Cross-Gen Games Will Hold Back The PS5 And Xbox Series X
The PS5 & Series X open worlds can't run at 60fps but "both these platforms are capable of so much more in terms of in-game AI, worldbuilding, gameplay interactions, physics, and so much more."
---> Marketing control/BS
"These consoles (...) have the capability to do things, in terms of visuals and gameplay that are objectively not possible on last gen.
Leading with true next-gen experiences, games not possible on the PS4 or Xbox One, would’ve been a great way to convince prospective Xbox Series X buyers about the value of the upcoming console. "
---> No shjt? in that case ok keep the same versions but set the framerate to 60fps for next gen versions. Oh wait...
HW decompression will help to reduce work load on CPU while in game, but it's not a wonder like some people try to suggest.
Just tested SoD2 with a 3,5 Gb/s NVMe. Game took 12-13 seconds to load (tried several times). CPU is usage is around 20% (3700x), with 2 cores under heavy load and several cores under lower load. So, despite the guy on Twitter having a clear bias, his loading times are right.
In next step I moved the game so the SATA SSD. Guess what happened
Yes, same loading times on an SSD with 1/7 Performance.
People who think that a unoptimized loading demo of a 2 year last gen title is reference for XsX or even an indicator for max performance are simply naive. You can't extrapolate anything from the Microsoft loading time tech demo.
Okay, sorry, one thing: The game loads from an SSD.
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MasterCornholio
Member
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MasterCornholio
Member
Either this or wait a few years for next-gen games. I'll take cross-gen games.Why Cross-Gen Games Will Hold Back The PS5 And Xbox Series X
Thanks to cross-gen games, it will be a while before developers utilize the full potential of new consoles.
Why Cross-Gen Games Will Hold Back The PS5 And Xbox Series X
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
If XSS has an SSD then yeah I'll agree with you.
Having trouble reconciling how the rumored XSS that's basically an XSX with a gimped GPU is actually cheap enough to make any sense.
MasterCornholio
Member
It could be a really small SSD coupled with a cheap mechanical HDD. But the experience would really suck on the console.
Omega Supreme Holopsicon
Member
HW decompression is probably significantly faster than cpu decompression, as asics can run circles around cpus and even gpus.
Also might be highly useful if there is heavy streaming of assets that could tax the cpu.
If the ps4 has a HW decompressor likely so too does the xbox one. And state of decay 2 was likely designed to use that decompressor.
The question is if the series x has a faster decompressor that went unused in the demonstration, not the same decompressor as xbox one, or if it has other additional hw optimizations that might help.
It is likely the xbox one has a hw decompressor too.
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azertydu91
Hard to Kill
Then MS made a stupid decision showing it.I mean it's either their ssd are shitty or they chose really badly how to demonstrate it.
According to your number it seems to be the latter but then why show it...Especially for people that already have the game and a SSD it makes a really bad impression.
I'm sure they can do like sony did with spiderman in one of their IP that would've shown their speed way better.
bitbydeath
Gold Member
That’s because MS are banking on software to speed things up as opposed to Sony who tackled a lot of the various bottlenecks through hardware. Mark addressed that very topic in the road to PS5.
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Thirty7ven
Banned
Smaller gpu and lower clocked, less ram, smaller ssd, cheaper cooling, smaller box.
I can see it. On top of that if the XSS comes out that’s where MS will eat the loss to keep the price down.
BadBreathOfTheWild
Banned
Just for fun don't take it seriously
Just did some reading up on AMD's Asynchronous Compute (and realised I understood it incorrectly before) and what do you know, it was started as a collaboration between Sony and AMD in 2009 ready for PS4 and GCN, and in an interview prior to PS4's release, Mark Cerny was saying we should really start to see it be put to good use in 2015-2017. Sony and AMD seem to have been working together on GPU technology for a while now, and Cerny keeps showing up everywhere I look lately. I was reading about Sonic Team the other week and there he is again, buying a Ferrari for someone that quit Sega in Japan after feeling undervalued for creating Sonic, as a means of convincing him to fly to the US and create Sonic 2 with Cerny, which if it failed would have lead to Sonic CD being the sequel. This guy has been around, and regardless of which colour you prefer, he's to be respected for what he's achieved and helped bring about.
MasterCornholio
Member
It could be that they have some bottlenecks that they need to fix so they can fully utilize the SSD. What I don't know is if the bottlenecks are hardware based or software based. If it's software they will definitely fix them on the future.
BadBreathOfTheWild
Banned
If the SSD component was large enough to support an expect game package size (150GB?) with a mechanical 1TB drive to store the games, then they could just have a long load time initially but then have the game itself work fast enough from an IO perspective? Especially if it's not streaming in the same quality of textures and meshes.
azertydu91
Hard to Kill
Let's hope it's just a software problem.
BurnCoalMeltPole
Member
Thanks for checking!
I agree with you that it is very hard to extrapolate because the loading algorithm would be designed around an entirely different system where some bottlenecks would be hidden by the slow HDD transfer. Perhaps the algorithm is only optimized around two cores, and so the CPU is still slowing things down despite only being used at 20% capacity.
We will just have to be patient.
farmerboy
Member
Yeah, definitely a bonafide giant of the industry. I think Sony is very lucky to have him.
MasterCornholio
Member
I guess the worry comes from constantly shifting data from the slow drive to the faster one.
vpance
Member
XSX is basically a Windows PC so those video load times make sense.
BadBreathOfTheWild
Banned
I just wish Sega didn't fuck things up and kept him or had someone like him so we have 3 dogs in this fight still. I'd preorder a new Sega console in an instant if they were to announce a comeback. Nostalgia is a powerful drug.
FranXico
Member
We do still have 3 dogs in this fight. But I agree with the sentiment, I wish SEGA's place hadn't been taken by Microsoft, they never should have left.
SEGA were the greatest innovators the gaming industry has ever seen.
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Killer Sakoman
Member
Tempest Engine tech demo
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Vimeo is kinda fucked up to be honest, starts then crashes, I think it has to do with its bandwidth compared to the gigantic Youtube. Of course you need to choose the quality, and if you're using a 4K screen then you'll see it, if not it'll down-sample it to 1440-1080p. The gameplay is an SDR, would love to see an HDR version later on.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Especially since the APU is one of the cheapest parts in the system's BOM. It doesn't change price that much in a fab process. Neither does 4GB less RAM. And if they are going with 8GB, lord have mercy for that lowest common denominator in world design.
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zubairali2
Member
KentoMaiku
Member
Where can you get that and how much is it
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